Article: BREAKING: Red Sox Trade For White Sox Ace Garrett Crochet

[drewski6]

2 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

We are weak at catcher and catcher depth, but he is a high risk prospect.

I kinda dislike losing Montgomery more.

Agreed. Im sadder for montgomery.

[drewski6]

1 minute ago, Caleb K said:

Kind of what I mean, he needed time to develop

Most catchers dont. 

[notin]

21 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

But then gave up their #4 and #5 prospect guys ranked #25 and 54 in all of baseball.  That's a lot of systems #1 and #2 guy, plus another top 10 guy in your system. 

 

All for a guy who has pitched more than 54 innings once in his career.  Sandy Alcantara has a Cy Young.  

In the end, they got a good sp.    If Alcantara becomes available, maybe they were premature.  But keeping the top 3 was huge.

And on the Alcantara thread, you said he cost Campbell plus. Now he’s Teel and Montgomery plus?

Meidroth is a top ten, but he’s replaceable.  He’s a utility infielder on a good team at best.  Maybe a starter on a bad team.

[moonslav59]

We've signed so many injury-prone pitchers over the years, this worries me.

His poor second half makes me wonder, if he was about to go on the IL.

[Hugh2]

32 minutes ago, sk7326 said:

Yes - and the Red Sox had the depth to make a significant move for the big league club.  It's a gamble - but so is everything else.  Hell, Alcantara is coming off of TJS.  

the goal is for the Red Sox to be able to keep drafting, signing and developing guys so there IS this sort of inventory to make moves for the big league club.  

That's fine, overall I don't disagree.  But you just traded your last two 1st round picks who were #`12 and #14

Ideally, you're not picking there but rather you're picking in the 26-30 range.  Gets a little tougher to do that consistently.

Teams without money pop, but teams who can draft, develop, and spend stay on top.  Sox used to do all 3 very well. 

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Crochet is a much better acquisition than Fried -- for the current Red Sox' starting defense.

I'll take a swing-and-miss lefty over a pitch-to-contact lefty any day, especially on a club with below-average defenders at C, 3B, 1B, and who knows what at 2B (hey, kinda like the Yankees' D)...

... not to mention Crochet's a lot younger, with a lot less mileage on his arm, making a little less than the most money in the history of MLB southpaws.

[FredLynn]

2 hours ago, Hitch said:

That is incredibly steep.

 

But as we've seen, it's costing big bucks or big prospects to get highly rated pitching.

 

It wouldn’t have costed us any prospects if they had bit the bullet and paid Fried.

[Jasonbay44]

14 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Crochet is a much better acquisition than Fried -- for the current Red Sox' starting defense.

I'll take a swing-and-miss lefty over a pitch-to-contact lefty any day, especially on a club with below-average defenders at C, 3B, 1B, and who knows what at 2B (hey, kinda like the Yankees' D)...

... not to mention Crochet's a lot younger, with a lot less mileage on his arm, making a little less than the most money in the history of MLB southpaws.

Yeah but the difference is Crotchet costs prospects and is going to demand a lot of money. Fried just costs money. Fried is older, yes, but also a lot more proven. 

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, Jasonbay44 said:

Yeah but the difference is Crotchet costs prospects and is going to demand a lot of money. Fried just costs money. Fried is older, yes, but also a lot more proven. 

For two years, Crochet will cost way less than Fried, and by the third year, Fried might be fried.

[mvp 78]

47 minutes ago, Caleb K said:

Keep in mind, its not like Teel was our starting catcher. Yes he played well at AAA so far, but there is a decent chance that he wasnt going to make an impact on the roster in 2025 anyway 

 

I guess only 2025 matters now.

[mvp 78]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Pivetta vs Flaherty vs Buehler?

I'd like manaea over any of these. (Does he cost a comp pick?)

I’d take any of them over Manaea.

[notin]

23 minutes ago, Jasonbay44 said:

Yeah but the difference is Crotchet costs prospects and is going to demand a lot of money. Fried just costs money. Fried is older, yes, but also a lot more proven. 

“Just money” could hinder extending existing players like Houck, Duran, Anthony, etc.  The prospects might turn out to be average players or worse.  (Maybe only 40 players off any too 100 prospect list go on to become MLB starters or starting pitchers)…

[Randy Red Sox]

2 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

too much for an over-hyped, overrated pitcher. and they're still going to have pay Crochet a shitload of money in couple years. 

no they won't.  he will sign elsewhere

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

5 minutes ago, notin said:

“Just money” could hinder extending existing players like Houck, Duran, Anthony, etc.  The prospects might turn out to be average players or worse.  (Maybe only 40 players off any too 100 prospect list go on to become MlB starters or starting pitchers….

I'm on board with this. Even the top-ranked prospects in the world... remember, both Benintendi and Moncada were #1 overall on at least one reputable MLB prospects list back when the Red Sox paid the cost acquiring their last lights-out lefty from Chicago.

[Jasonbay44]

19 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

For two years, Crochet will cost way less than Fried, and by the third year, Fried might be fried.

And in 3 years Montgomery and Teel could be multi time all stars. 
 

I just worry about Crotchet’s 2nd half and liked Fried more due to his proven track record and no prospects attached. 

[Duran Is The Man]

2 hours ago, Old Red said:

Is everyone happy for 2 years of this guy?🤫

2 year rental.

[Bellhorn04]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

We've signed so many injury-prone pitchers over the years, this worries me.

His poor second half makes me wonder, if he was about to go on the IL.

No, they were just micro-managing his innings.  He had a couple of rough outings that made his second-half ERA look like crap.  When you take a closer look at it I don't think it's that concerning.  He was still registering high K numbers.

[Bellhorn04]

In September/24 Crochet only pitched 17.1 innings, but he had 29 Ks and only 2 walks!

[Bellhorn04]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

They could have resigned him, even at his age.

Now, that he's even older, let's get him for just the last year of an overpaid contract. NOT!

If they take Yoshida and $35M out of $54M owed for Vaz, okay.

moon, I get the CERA thing, but consider this.  I'm posting this before I even re-check the numbers.  I'll come back and add them.

Numbers are regular season only.

1) Houck and Whitlock have their best CERAs with him.

Houck 99 IP 1.64 ERA .528 OPSa

Whitlock 116.1 IP 2.40 ERA .623 OPSa

2) The guy he caught in Houston had a great CERA with him.

Cristian Javier 34.1 IP 1.31 ERA .388 OPSa

3) Maybe he works really well with certain pitchers.  The sample size of pitchers you're using for his CERA comparisons is actually pretty small.    

[notin]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

We are weak at catcher and catcher depth, but he is a high risk prospect.

I kinda dislike losing Montgomery more.

With Rafaela signed long term and Anthony ahead of him, his opportunities were getting limited.  And of course, Duran.  (Remember the speculation about trading Duran for an ace?  Well, so far we’re keeping him, too.)

 

But Montgomery certainly might have been fun to watch in another universe…

[Tedballgame]

Montgomery is a power hitting switch hitter. All American. Can throw 95+. I hate the fact that they put him in the deal. They didn't even see what he could do as a professional due to his ankle injury. Dumb move.

[mvp 78]

1 minute ago, Tedballgame said:

Montgomery is a power hitting switch hitter. All American. Can throw 95+. I hate the fact that they put him in the deal. They didn't even see what he could do as a professional due to his ankle injury. Dumb move.

IDK, I’d rather Mayer/Monty than Teel/Monty in the trade.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Bellhorn04 said:

No, they were just micro-managing his innings.  He had a couple of rough outings that made his second-half ERA look like crap.  When you take a closer look at it I don't think it's that concerning.  He was still registering high K numbers.

His K numbers got a little better, but...

OPS Against:

.569 first 20 games (10 HRs in 107 IP)

.823 last 12. (8 Hrs in 39 IP)

He was not the same.

[notin]

1 hour ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

I'm on board with this. Even the top-ranked prospects in the world... remember, both Benintendi and Moncada were #1 overall on at least one reputable MLB prospects list back when the Red Sox paid the cost acquiring their last lights-out lefty from Chicago.

Not to mention, I’ve long postulated the Sox reluctance to sign Betts was directly tied to David Price’s contract (plus results).  This was maybe partially confirmed by Zack Short.

If Anthony or Campbell or Mayer really is the next superstar, I don’t want to see them hit free agency at 28 so we can keep paying 37yo Max Fried…

[notin]

28 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

IDK, I’d rather Mayer/Monty than Teel/Monty in the trade.

Chicago didn’t..

[notin]

2 hours ago, Jasonbay44 said:

And in 3 years Montgomery and Teel could be multi time all stars. 
 

I just worry about Crotchet’s 2nd half and liked Fried more due to his proven track record and no prospects attached. 

Odds are well against that happening.  
 

Even with their topflight farm,, the chances are the Sox don’t have multiple future All Stars.

Remember when KC had 8 players in the BA top 100, including a few in the top 20?  Looking back, those were a wide range of performers, with the best of the bunch coming from your choice of Alcides Escobar, Eric Hosmer, Mike Moustakas or Wil Myers.  Some, like Christian Colon, topped out at the utility infielder level.  I think their best arm in that bunch was Jake Odorizzi.  Of course the only other one I recall was Chris Haney, who I think never even made MLB.  Or if he did, it was fleeting…

[moonslav59]

One encouraging thing about Crochet's second half numbers: his last 3 starts- 4 IP each:

0.75 ERA (0.42 FIP)

.460 OPS Against

18 Ks and 1 BB

This should show he did not end the season with some sort of undisclosed injury.

 

[moonslav59]

27 minutes ago, notin said:

Chicago didn’t..

You know this?

[moonslav59]

Would you or the CWS have substituted Cespedes and Bleis for Montgomery?

How about Mayer, Bleis, Meidroth, Wikelman vs Teel, Montgomery, Meidroth, Cespedes?

Mayer, Bleis, Cespedes & Meidroth (no Monty & Wikelman?)

[bkzwhitestrican]

This is a good trade for the Sox IMO. They just landed a guy who has arguably the best stuff in baseball. Sure it's risky, but so is paying any pitcher these days.