Chris Sale traded to Braves

[cp176]

Reasons the Sox traded him:

 

1) Chris's health is always in jeopardy.

2) They got a cheap second baseman with some potential in return.

3) They saved $10 million.

 

If Sale pitches something like the old Sale in 2024 this will indeed look questionable, so you could say Breslow rolled the dice.

 

hmmm - that's all I got. Either the Red Sox regard this young prospect very very highly or the franchise has decided that 10 million dollars in savings was just worth it to move on from Sale. So - if Sales health continues to be an issue, we might have made a good trade, depending upon how Grissom develops. If Sale is healthy and pitches well, we better hope that the Sox use that 10 million and more to bolster a pitching staff that needs a great deal of help or this trade is going to likely not look very good.

[Hugh2]

Very simple, and I have said right along that I believe if the Braves would have paid all his contract the Red Sox could have put the $27M to better use like maybe sign a good reliable starting pitcher. All of this was said when the trade happened, so you’re just late to the party. Once again, I said in the beginning I didn’t care if the Red Sox got anything back as long as the Braves paid the whole contract, and I explained why. It’s not an insult. Once again the return was fine if there was going to be a return

That doesn’t meet your standards, but WC.

 

Lol

 

That’s 100% conjecture.

 

You have zero evidence of that, teams throw in money all the time. Breslow, and the Sox are connected to the inside world more than me and you. They have a very good ideal what these teams are willing to spend and what their budgets are.

 

Why do you care so much that the Braves paid more than they did? What advantage is that to the Sox?

 

This is exactly what I’m talking about. You’re making things up to hate the trade, because you’re a cynic.

[Hugh2]

Very simple, and I have said right along that I believe if the Braves would have paid all his contract the Red Sox could have put the $27M to better use like maybe sign a good reliable starting pitcher. All of this was said when the trade happened, so you’re just late to the party. Once again, I said in the beginning I didn’t care if the Red Sox got anything back as long as the Braves paid the whole contract, and I explained why. It’s not an insult. Once again the return was fine if there was going to be a return

That doesn’t meet your standards, but WC.

 

Also, let me add, that $17 million for ONE YEAR is not stopping the Sox from signing Montgomery, Snell, Stroman, or whoever. Whatever dollar amount they figure to offer them is not going to be affected by this trade in any way.

 

The Chris Sale money and bringing in another pitcher are mutually exclusive. This is pretty obvious

[moonslav59]

Lol

 

That’s 100% conjecture.

 

You have zero evidence of that, teams throw in money all the time. Breslow, and the Sox are connected to the inside world more than me and you. They have a very good ideal what these teams are willing to spend and what their budgets are.

 

Why do you care so much that the Braves paid more than they did? What advantage is that to the Sox?

 

This is exactly what I’m talking about. You’re making things up to hate the trade, because you’re a cynic.

 

I thought this poster was against big FA pitcher signings, in the first place. Now, that's what we should have used 1 year of Sale's money to do.

[Hugh2]

“Hey Jordan, we can’t offer you 160/8. Yeah I know, it’s unfortunate but we only got the Braves to eat $10 million so we just aren’t willing to go above 145”

 

That’s stupid logic

 

2024: Sox probably have enough money to sign one of Snell/Montgomery (if they wanted to) and still stay under the cap. And even if they had to get under they could easily move Jensen/Martin/Pivetta one of those three to get under. Also, they’ve specifically stated in the past they would be willing to go over if the circumstances were right. In the end, the Sox will either be willing to spend the money on a Snell type or they will not. Not intelligent baseball fan actually thinks the Braves not eating his contract changes that.

 

2025. Sales Money is off the books does not have any bearing on a Snell/Montgomery AAV

2026. Sales Money is off the books does not have any bearing on a Snell/Montgomery AAV

2027. Sales Money is off the books does not have any bearing on a Snell/Montgomery AAV

2028. Sales Money is off the books does not have any bearing on a Snell/Montgomery AAV

2029 Sales Money is off the books does not have any bearing on a Snell/Montgomery AAV

2030 Sales Money is off the books does not have any bearing on a Snell/Montgomery AAV

 

 

 

But don’t worry. I see you. If the Sox don’t make any other major starting pitching additions you will be the one screaming it was because they kicked in too much money for one year on the Chris Sale trade

 

If you don’t like the trade that’s fine, if you don’t like Grissom that’s your opinion, I can respect that. But this trade doesn’t prevent them from signing a pitcher. Not even close.

[moonslav59]

Also, let me add, that $17 million for ONE YEAR is not stopping the Sox from signing Montgomery, Snell, Stroman, or whoever. Whatever dollar amount they figure to offer them is not going to be affected by this trade in any way.

 

The Chris Sale money and bringing in another pitcher are mutually exclusive. This is pretty obvious

 

I agree, but if we were looking at the 2024 budget plus the next few years, I could imagine a thought process like this, with any team, except BOS:

 

1. X is the limit for this winter's budget. For argument's sake, say we had $20M to spend. Trading Sale made it $30M for 2024, only.

2. X is the budget for 2025 and beyond, and the Sale contract comes off the books, allowing us to afford that higher level pitcher we ended up signing, instead of Paxton.

[Old Red]

Lol

 

That’s 100% conjecture.

 

You have zero evidence of that, teams throw in money all the time. Breslow, and the Sox are connected to the inside world more than me and you. They have a very good ideal what these teams are willing to spend and what their budgets are.

 

Why do you care so much that the Braves paid more than they did? What advantage is that to the Sox?

 

This is exactly what I’m talking about. You’re making things up to hate the trade, because you’re a cynic.

 

So if you don’t think the Red Sox couldn’t do something useful with $17M more then I can’t help you. 100% conjecture? Zero evidence? That would be that they wouldn’t do anything with the $17M extra. That goes both ways. Bottom line I’ll judge they trade how I’ll want to, and you can judge it how you want to insults, and all.i know you think you can, but you can’t tell me how I can judge a trade. $17M is not making anything up, and it may be you who’s the cynic coming out of hibernation, or not.

[Old Red]

Also, let me add, that $17 million for ONE YEAR is not stopping the Sox from signing Montgomery, Snell, Stroman, or whoever. Whatever dollar amount they figure to offer them is not going to be affected by this trade in any way.

 

The Chris Sale money and bringing in another pitcher are mutually exclusive. This is pretty obvious

 

Pure conjecture, and speculation that $17M isn’t stopping the Red Sox from signing anyone now. What’s obvious to most on here especially is that the Rd Sox have a set budget to work with. I say most, but obviously not you.

[Hugh2]

Pure conjecture, and speculation that $17M isn’t stopping the Red Sox from signing anyone now. What’s obvious to most on here especially is that the Rd Sox have a set budget to work with. I say most, but obviously not you.

 

You seriously think they wouldn’t go over the cap for one year? Pay a few extra million for one year? To not sign Montgomery?

 

What makes more sense.

 

A.) Sox won’t sign Montgomery because they are unwilling to commit the contract he will command, and because they’re weary of long term contracts to aging pitchers? (Spoiler alert. Huge precedent here)

 

Or

 

B.) they have a set budget and will not go over it because the Red Sox do not go past the luxury tax limit.

 

Sox have said they would go over. (Spoiler alert. Also precedent for this)

 

Before you continue reading take note there’s zero precedent for B. Because they have a history of going over the luxury tax and setting themselves up to reset, which they’re in. They had a budget all those years too, every team has a budget, you think those budgets are 100% set in stone? That’s absurd. They’re in the same financial boat in 2025 even if the Braves took 100% of the contract. Also worth nothing, there’s IS clear precedent for A. In action and in statement. They haven’t signed big pitchers and still gone past the cap.

 

The budget isn’t just about one year, it’s about year over year. That’s why they sign guys to short term contracts and shy away from long term. It’s why team look to reset, going over the cap is 100% inconsequential to a team like Boston when they have the ability to reset the next year. Even the freaking Dodgers are setting themselves up to get below thresholds. Yes, even they care about AAV. It’s not just total money, it’s the years. Sox literally blew past the cap just two years ago, and had the highest payroll in baseball a few before that.

 

Of course they have a budget, but $17 million for one year isn’t stopping them from offering whatever they think is fair to Snell or Montgomery. That’s literally got to be one of the most irrational I’ve heard on here all year.

 

 

I don’t believe the Sox will make those moves, because in a vacuum they don’t want to spend the money on those guys. If 200/8 gets you Snell, the Sox aren’t offering that WITH OR WITHOUT Sales $17 million. They’re cheap with long term deals, they don’t give a rats ass about going over the cap for one years. Why can’t you see that? I feel like this is obvious to 99.99% of the baseball world.

 

If the Sox don’t sign another starting pitcher it’s 100% because they’re cheap *******s and 100% nothing to do with how much money they got Atlanta to eat. If you can’t understand that then just give up. Don’t pass go. Don’t collect $200

 

No team has a budget that is 100% set in stone. Some are more flexible than others, if according to you I’m the only one in here then I’ll be proud to have good financial prowess compared to others. Teams will go under/over their budgets for the right circumstances. If the Boston Red Sox for example COULD Snell for 200/8, they would do it. They wouldn’t walk away from that deal because they have to pay Chris Sale $17 for ONE YEAR. That’s just ridiculous

[notin]

So if you don’t think the Red Sox couldn’t do something useful with $17M more then I can’t help you. 100% conjecture? Zero evidence? That would be that they wouldn’t do anything with the $17M extra. That goes both ways. Bottom line I’ll judge they trade how I’ll want to, and you can judge it how you want to insults, and all.i know you think you can, but you can’t tell me how I can judge a trade. $17M is not making anything up, and it may be you who’s the cynic coming out of hibernation, or not.

 

The Red Sox would also have more to do if they kept that $17mill. Assuming Atlanta still took Sale, the Sox would have to get a starting 2b for less than $17mill to come out ahead. Given IKF went for $15mill, it’s a safe bet Whitfield isn’t going for less…

[Bellhorn04]

I would say that if we don't add more than Giolito to our rotation, this deal becomes questionable, in terms of whether the team is actually trying to win or not.

[notin]

I would say that if we don't add more than Giolito to our rotation, this deal becomes questionable, in terms of whether the team is actually trying to win or not.

 

… unless Sale only pitches 50IP or so…

[Bellhorn04]

… unless Sale only pitches 50IP or so…

 

Obviously that part is a dice roll. But I'll call this a questionable move on Opening Day if there are no further upgrades.

[Hugh2]

If no additional moves come I’d be dissatisfied, and I’d surely grab my pitchforks and join the ranks. But to me in that scenario this deal doesn’t get better or worse, but I’d I had to chose I’d say it’s even better then.

 

 

Think about it. If we make no other moves we probably won’t be very good this year. If we keep sale and suck again we just pay him the full salary and lose him for nothing.

 

At least this way we have a young cost controlled talent with upside. Regardless of what happens in 2024, we have him thru the 2029 season. He could very well play a role in future winning teams.

 

Sale never will no matter what

[Bellhorn04]

If no additional moves come I’d be dissatisfied, and I’d surely grab my pitchforks and join the ranks. But to me in that scenario this deal doesn’t get better or worse, but I’d I had to chose I’d say it’s even better then.

 

Think about it. If we make no other moves we probably won’t be very good this year. If we keep sale and suck again we just pay him the full salary and lose him for nothing.

 

That's kind of like a self-fulfilling prophecy, isn't it? We'll make sure we suck so we won't have to even worry about the potential impact of a move like this.

[dgalehouse]

So, a team with a glaring need for starting pitching trades their best starting pitcher, their only proven winner, for a so-so infield prospect and throws in 17 million dollars to sweeten the deal. No problem. It's all good.

[Bellhorn04]

So, a team with a glaring need for starting pitching trades their best starting pitcher, their only proven winner, for a so-so infield prospect and throws in 17 million dollars to sweeten the deal. No problem. It's all good.

 

Yeah, like I say, as far as 2024 is concerned, this trade can only make sense if they acquire a good starter.

[Hugh2]

Yeah, like I say, as far as 2024 is concerned, this trade can only make sense if they acquire a good starter.

 

If they make no other pitching additions, then maybe they’re blatantly punting on 2024.

 

If that’s the case, there’s no way they are making a major addition to the pitching staff with or without Sales money.

 

At least they got a young 23 year old with a lot of upside.

 

Still, they need pitching. If they’re not buying pitching they better start drafting and developing it.

 

If that’s there plan. Our only path to success is either waiting another 4 years, or having a season where everything breaks right.

 

Don’t shoot the messenger.

[Hugh2]

Their* ughhh

[Bellhorn04]

If they make no other pitching additions, then maybe they’re blatantly punting on 2024.

 

If that’s the case, there’s no way they are making a major addition to the pitching staff with or without Sales money.

 

At least they got a young 23 year old with a lot of upside.

 

Still, they need pitching. If they’re not buying pitching they better start drafting and developing it.

 

If that’s there plan. Our only path to success is either waiting another 4 years, or having a season where everything breaks right.

 

Don’t shoot the messenger.

 

Don't worry, I'm not shooting any messengers. I'm storming the Bastille in person.

[Duran Is The Man]

Don't worry, I'm not shooting any messengers. I'm storming the Bastille in person.

 

 

 

i'm right behind ya', Bell.

[moonslav59]

You seriously think they wouldn’t go over the cap for one year? Pay a few extra million for one year? To not sign Montgomery?

 

What makes more sense.

 

A.) Sox won’t sign Montgomery because they are unwilling to commit the contract he will command, and because they’re weary of long term contracts to aging pitchers? (Spoiler alert. Huge precedent here)

 

Or

 

B.) they have a set budget and will not go over it because the Red Sox do not go past the luxury tax limit.

 

Sox have said they would go over. (Spoiler alert. Also precedent for this)

 

Before you continue reading take note there’s zero precedent for B. Because they have a history of going over the luxury tax and setting themselves up to reset, which they’re in. They had a budget all those years too, every team has a budget, you think those budgets are 100% set in stone? That’s absurd. They’re in the same financial boat in 2025 even if the Braves took 100% of the contract. Also worth nothing, there’s IS clear precedent for A. In action and in statement. They haven’t signed big pitchers and still gone past the cap.

 

The budget isn’t just about one year, it’s about year over year. That’s why they sign guys to short term contracts and shy away from long term. It’s why team look to reset, going over the cap is 100% inconsequential to a team like Boston when they have the ability to reset the next year. Even the freaking Dodgers are setting themselves up to get below thresholds. Yes, even they care about AAV. It’s not just total money, it’s the years. Sox literally blew past the cap just two years ago, and had the highest payroll in baseball a few before that.

 

Of course they have a budget, but $17 million for one year isn’t stopping them from offering whatever they think is fair to Snell or Montgomery. That’s literally got to be one of the most irrational I’ve heard on here all year.

 

 

I don’t believe the Sox will make those moves, because in a vacuum they don’t want to spend the money on those guys. If 200/8 gets you Snell, the Sox aren’t offering that WITH OR WITHOUT Sales $17 million. They’re cheap with long term deals, they don’t give a rats ass about going over the cap for one years. Why can’t you see that? I feel like this is obvious to 99.99% of the baseball world.

 

If the Sox don’t sign another starting pitcher it’s 100% because they’re cheap *******s and 100% nothing to do with how much money they got Atlanta to eat. If you can’t understand that then just give up. Don’t pass go. Don’t collect $200

 

No team has a budget that is 100% set in stone. Some are more flexible than others, if according to you I’m the only one in here then I’ll be proud to have good financial prowess compared to others. Teams will go under/over their budgets for the right circumstances. If the Boston Red Sox for example COULD Snell for 200/8, they would do it. They wouldn’t walk away from that deal because they have to pay Chris Sale $17 for ONE YEAR. That’s just ridiculous

 

You are not alone.

[moonslav59]

If they make no other pitching additions, then maybe they’re blatantly punting on 2024.

 

If that’s the case, there’s no way they are making a major addition to the pitching staff with or without Sales money.

 

At least they got a young 23 year old with a lot of upside.

 

Still, they need pitching. If they’re not buying pitching they better start drafting and developing it.

 

If that’s there plan. Our only path to success is either waiting another 4 years, or having a season where everything breaks right.

 

Don’t shoot the messenger.

 

Another option is trading from our everyday unbalanced farm for a young pitcher, but again, if we are not going to try to win in 2024, why waste a year of said pitcher? Just punt, and do something splashy, next winter.

[moonslav59]

Yeah, like I say, as far as 2024 is concerned, this trade can only make sense if they acquire a good starter.

 

Agreed, but I'm feeling more and more like this is all about 2025 or 2026, and fattening JH's wallet, along the way.

[moonslav59]

Don't worry, I'm not shooting any messengers. I'm storming the Bastille in person.

 

There should be a sizable mob with you, unless the Kool-Aid has kicked in.

[notin]

Don't worry, I'm not shooting any messengers. I'm storming the Bastille in person.

 

You’re over 230 years late on that mission…

[Duran Is The Man]

Another option is trading from our everyday unbalanced farm for a young pitcher, but again, if we are not going to try to win in 2024, why waste a year of said pitcher? Just punt, and do something splashy, next winter.

 

LOL....i hear this every year. i'd rather go for it. i'm sure tightass Henry agrees with you. but as long as gullible rubes keep buying the ******** he's selling, i'm afraid the Sox will be "punting" every year.

[Old Red]

So, a team with a glaring need for starting pitching trades their best starting pitcher, their only proven winner, for a so-so infield prospect and throws in 17 million dollars to sweeten the deal. No problem. It's all good.

 

And if you say anything negative on it about the trade 1 poster will come out of hibernation, and say you’re insulting the team.🙈Never mind all the real insults that posters have thrown the last few weeks from the so called super fan calling his favorite term lately of sham, sham, sham to all the other comments, because of all the non conceived notions of what full throttle meant. Those were INSULTS. The Red Sox don’t need an extra $17M-$27M, because JH has plenty of money, and he will spare no expense to make this team better.🤮 Still looking at 2035, or 2036, but everything is good.

[Old Red]

Don't worry, I'm not shooting any messengers. I'm storming the Bastille in person.

 

Don’t worry Winter Weekend is only two weeks away, and JH will be there to answer all your questions. Then again maybe he won’t.

[Old Red]

You seriously think they wouldn’t go over the cap for one year? Pay a few extra million for one year? To not sign Montgomery?

 

What makes more sense.

 

A.) Sox won’t sign Montgomery because they are unwilling to commit the contract he will command, and because they’re weary of long term contracts to aging pitchers? (Spoiler alert. Huge precedent here)

 

Or

 

B.) they have a set budget and will not go over it because the Red Sox do not go past the luxury tax limit.

 

Sox have said they would go over. (Spoiler alert. Also precedent for this)

 

Before you continue reading take note there’s zero precedent for B. Because they have a history of going over the luxury tax and setting themselves up to reset, which they’re in. They had a budget all those years too, every team has a budget, you think those budgets are 100% set in stone? That’s absurd. They’re in the same financial boat in 2025 even if the Braves took 100% of the contract. Also worth nothing, there’s IS clear precedent for A. In action and in statement. They haven’t signed big pitchers and still gone past the cap.

 

The budget isn’t just about one year, it’s about year over year. That’s why they sign guys to short term contracts and shy away from long term. It’s why team look to reset, going over the cap is 100% inconsequential to a team like Boston when they have the ability to reset the next year. Even the freaking Dodgers are setting themselves up to get below thresholds. Yes, even they care about AAV. It’s not just total money, it’s the years. Sox literally blew past the cap just two years ago, and had the highest payroll in baseball a few before that.

 

Of course they have a budget, but $17 million for one year isn’t stopping them from offering whatever they think is fair to Snell or Montgomery. That’s literally got to be one of the most irrational I’ve heard on here all year.

 

 

I don’t believe the Sox will make those moves, because in a vacuum they don’t want to spend the money on those guys. If 200/8 gets you Snell, the Sox aren’t offering that WITH OR WITHOUT Sales $17 million. They’re cheap with long term deals, they don’t give a rats ass about going over the cap for one years. Why can’t you see that? I feel like this is obvious to 99.99% of the baseball world.

 

If the Sox don’t sign another starting pitcher it’s 100% because they’re cheap *******s and 100% nothing to do with how much money they got Atlanta to eat. If you can’t understand that then just give up. Don’t pass go. Don’t collect $200

 

No team has a budget that is 100% set in stone. Some are more flexible than others, if according to you I’m the only one in here then I’ll be proud to have good financial prowess compared to others. Teams will go under/over their budgets for the right circumstances. If the Boston Red Sox for example COULD Snell for 200/8, they would do it. They wouldn’t walk away from that deal because they have to pay Chris Sale $17 for ONE YEAR. That’s just ridiculous

They would only go over the cap for the likes of Tommy Pham.