Giving up 28 today = We are sellers

[Kimmi]

If the city of Boston could be moved to the West Coast, the Red Sox would be a 110 win team.

 

Boston's record against >.500 teams

 

NYY: 4-6

TOR: 3-10

TB: 2-8

BAL: 3-5

CLE: 4-1

MIN: 2-2

CHW: 2-4

HOU: 2-1

SEA: 2-1

ATL: 1-1

STL: 2-1

 

12-29 against the East, 27-40 against >.500 teams. I guess a surge is possible - and the team deserves credit for feasting on the dregs of its schedule ... but woof

 

I get it sk. I know what the team's records are against the stronger teams as opposed to the weaker teams. With as bad as the Sox are currently playing, they are only 3.5 games out. That gives reason for hope to make the postseason. In the postseason, anything can happen.

[Kimmi]

Jacko only acknowledges two strategies for non-Yankee teams. “All in” where you empty the farm for a grandiose postseason run, and “complete tear down” where you deal away any and every marketable asset in order to build for the long term future.

 

Teams rarely if ever do either one…

 

And those two strategies are the exact opposite of the reason why Bloom was brought on board.

[mvp 78]

I think it is clear the rainbow is the Dodgers where they have a rich farm system but can use their financial hammer too. The Dodgers and the Red Sox indeed are both using Tampa Bay organizational best practices.

 

Really, ownership probably gets the lion's share of the blame - not because Henry did not spend money, but because his organizational priorities have fluctuated wildly and at times seems way way too responsive to what talk shows say about the team. After all, the team greenlighted David Price, a deal which went poorly (even acknowleding Price's yeoman work in the 2018 postseason) in some somewhat difficult to anticipate ways (his arm). Ownership greenlighted the Sale extension, a deal which looked shaky as it was happening. At the same time, the team gets weak kneed about paying a superstar for the superstar's superstar years - and then moves him to help get rid of Price.

 

I largely don't blame any of the GMs - they have all done jobs that ownership asked of them. Dombrowski drafted well and did a good job - and he did exactly what ownership wanted him to do. Bloom has done a nice job making some good value signings and bringing in more quality arms than the org has had in a while.

 

Cora is one of the league's best managers - but when you have to negotiate "Eovaldi, a Pavetta hot streak and hope" as your starting pitching, you can only conjure up so much magic.

 

But still, his era will come down to ownership priorities. If the team is not willing to pay Devers superstar prices for his superstar years - a team with Boston's $$ heft - then what are we doing here.

 

This is a very good post.

[cp176]

I think it is clear the rainbow is the Dodgers where they have a rich farm system but can use their financial hammer too. The Dodgers and the Red Sox indeed are both using Tampa Bay organizational best practices.

 

Really, ownership probably gets the lion's share of the blame - not because Henry did not spend money, but because his organizational priorities have fluctuated wildly and at times seems way way too responsive to what talk shows say about the team. After all, the team greenlighted David Price, a deal which went poorly (even acknowleding Price's yeoman work in the 2018 postseason) in some somewhat difficult to anticipate ways (his arm). Ownership greenlighted the Sale extension, a deal which looked shaky as it was happening. At the same time, the team gets weak kneed about paying a superstar for the superstar's superstar years - and then moves him to help get rid of Price.

 

I largely don't blame any of the GMs - they have all done jobs that ownership asked of them. Dombrowski drafted well and did a good job - and he did exactly what ownership wanted him to do. Bloom has done a nice job making some good value signings and bringing in more quality arms than the org has had in a while.

 

Cora is one of the league's best managers - but when you have to negotiate "Eovaldi, a Pavetta hot streak and hope" as your starting pitching, you can only conjure up so much magic.

 

But still, his era will come down to ownership priorities. If the team is not willing to pay Devers superstar prices for his superstar years - a team with Boston's $$ heft - then what are we doing here.

 

i think that you are absolutely right on here.

[JDavis76]

I think it is clear the rainbow is the Dodgers where they have a rich farm system but can use their financial hammer too. The Dodgers and the Red Sox indeed are both using Tampa Bay organizational best practices.

 

Really, ownership probably gets the lion's share of the blame - not because Henry did not spend money, but because his organizational priorities have fluctuated wildly and at times seems way way too responsive to what talk shows say about the team. After all, the team greenlighted David Price, a deal which went poorly (even acknowleding Price's yeoman work in the 2018 postseason) in some somewhat difficult to anticipate ways (his arm). Ownership greenlighted the Sale extension, a deal which looked shaky as it was happening. At the same time, the team gets weak kneed about paying a superstar for the superstar's superstar years - and then moves him to help get rid of Price.

 

I largely don't blame any of the GMs - they have all done jobs that ownership asked of them. Dombrowski drafted well and did a good job - and he did exactly what ownership wanted him to do. Bloom has done a nice job making some good value signings and bringing in more quality arms than the org has had in a while.

 

Cora is one of the league's best managers - but when you have to negotiate "Eovaldi, a Pavetta hot streak and hope" as your starting pitching, you can only conjure up so much magic.

 

But still, his era will come down to ownership priorities. If the team is not willing to pay Devers superstar prices for his superstar years - a team with Boston's $$ heft - then what are we doing here.

 

He's disguised that pretty well this season.....

[moonslav59]

I think it is clear the rainbow is the Dodgers where they have a rich farm system but can use their financial hammer too. The Dodgers and the Red Sox indeed are both using Tampa Bay organizational best practices.

 

Don't forget the Astros, whose model may be closer to what Henry is striving for. 5 straight trips to the ALCS. They let many of their top stars walk.

[mvp 78]

I think it is clear the rainbow is the Dodgers where they have a rich farm system but can use their financial hammer too. The Dodgers and the Red Sox indeed are both using Tampa Bay organizational best practices.

 

Don't forget the Astros, whose model may be closer to what Henry is striving for. 5 straight trips to the ALCS. They let many of their top stars walk.

 

What is the Astros philosophy? Aside from tanking for high draft picks and stealing signals?

[moonslav59]

 

But still, his era will come down to ownership priorities. If the team is not willing to pay Devers superstar prices for his superstar years - a team with Boston's $$ heft - then what are we doing here.

 

No fan is a bigger cheerleader for bringing Devers back than me, but if they create a longer, more consistent method of building a winner without mega deals, and it works, I won't complain.

 

It does seem like a more sustainable plan, but yes, Henry should not keep jumping ship on methods, although it has always ended up turning into a ring.

 

[moonslav59]

 

What is the Astros philosophy? Aside from tanking for high draft picks and stealing signals?

 

They are run by a Tampa Bay dude, too. They have quietly pulled tqo within 2 games of the mighty Yanks.

 

They haven't had a high pick in a long time.

 

They traded Josh Fields for Yordan Alvarez. Framber Valdez was signed as an amateur FA- kinda like we hoped Bloom would do. I could go on.

 

The two guys they locked up longer term, Altuve & Bregman have not done great after signing, yet here they are.

 

[moonslav59]

It didn't look good. I'm sure Cora spoke with him privately about it. Young players make mistakes. He's not the first player to not run out a play.

 

No doubt. I said it wasn't all about one play.

 

Plus, we have 2 LF only OF'ers, and that hurts the team, if one plays somewhere else or wastes a bench slot. One should be gone by next year.

[moonslav59]

I don't see the Sox trading Bogaerts before the end of the season. But as I posted elsewhere, if they are going to trade JD and Eovaldi, they should trade Bogaerts as well.

 

They will trade JD & Nate, so...

[moonslav59]

Jacko only acknowledges two strategies for non-Yankee teams. “All in” where you empty the farm for a grandiose postseason run, and “complete tear down” where you deal away any and every marketable asset in order to build for the long term future.

 

Teams rarely if ever do either one…

 

The Yanks did a piece-meal rebuild themselves, yet he denies it works.

[sk7326]

No fan is a bigger cheerleader for bringing Devers back than me, but if they create a longer, more consistent method of building a winner without mega deals, and it works, I won't complain.

 

It does seem like a more sustainable plan, but yes, Henry should not keep jumping ship on methods, although it has always ended up turning into a ring.

 

 

They have made some decisions - not to pay Springer or not to pay for Correa. But they paid top dollar for Altuve's prime. The Red Sox with Betts and (fingers crossed this is not true) Devers would be walking away from paying regular prices for the years that you want the star player on your team. For a team with Boston's means, that is not great.

 

The Red Sox have won a lot - honestly it has been because their baseball people HAVE done a great job, sometimes in spite of some of the whiplash at the ownership level.

[moonslav59]

They have made some decisions - not to pay Springer or not to pay for Correa. But they paid top dollar for Altuve's prime. The Red Sox with Betts and (fingers crossed this is not true) Devers would be walking away from paying regular prices for the years that you want the star player on your team. For a team with Boston's means, that is not great.

 

The Red Sox have won a lot - honestly it has been because their baseball people HAVE done a great job, sometimes in spite of some of the whiplash at the ownership level.

 

The Astros did pay large and long for Altuve, but $163M/7 is less of a tax hit than Sale or Story and is about what we paid JD per year.

 

The Bregman extension ate some arb years, I think, so it's hard to judge $100M/5).

 

They have short deals like Verlander and many mid range deals.

 

I think they are the model we are striving towards, not LAD. Henry will not spend like them.

[mvp 78]

The Yanks did a piece-meal rebuild themselves, yet he denies it works.

 

IDK, how many rings since 2000 for the world's greatest team?

[notin]

The Yanks did a piece-meal rebuild themselves, yet he denies it works.

 

And they haven’t won a title since…

[moonslav59]

IDK, how many rings since 2000 for the world's greatest team?

 

He thinks it worked.

Edited July 28, 2022 by moonslav59

[Larry Cook]

July 27 and we have not started selling yet.

[moonslav59]

July 27 and we have not started selling yet.

 

The deadline in August 2nd. Many Gms wait until the end, in hopes desperate GMs will up their offers at the last moment.

[moonslav59]

The Astros did pay large and long for Altuve, but $163M/7 is less of a tax hit than Sale or Story and is about what we paid JD per year.

 

The Bregman extension ate some arb years, I think, so it's hard to judge $100M/5).

 

They have short deals like Verlander and many mid range deals.

 

I think they are the model we are striving towards, not LAD. Henry will not spend like them.

 

What other team has built their rotation up so well, they are in reach of the best record in the AL, and they can still offer to trade a controllable SP'er at the deadline, like they are reportedly doing, now?

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/07/astros-willing-to-listen-to-offers-on-controllable-starting-pitching.html

[illinoisredsox]

July 27 and we have not started selling yet.

 

Maybe nobody wants what we’re selling. That is a possibility you know.

[harmony]

Maybe nobody wants what we’re selling. That is a possibility you know.

We're at the stage where buyers are making low-ball offers and sellers are holding out for better offers as the deadline approaches.

 

Except the Yankees and Royals apparently.

[illinoisredsox]

We're at the stage where buyers are making low-ball offers and sellers are holding out for better offers as the deadline approaches.

 

Except the Yankees and Royals apparently.

 

The Benintendi deal looks like something the 1950’s era Yankees and KC Athletics would have cooked up.

[moonslav59]

The Benintendi deal looks like something the 1950’s era Yankees and KC Athletics would have cooked up.

 

Maybe Sox fans are over-valuing Beni.

 

It wouldn't be the first time.

[moonslav59]

BTV

 

Yanks: 8.1 Beni (2+ month rental)

 

KCR: 7.4 (Beck Way 4.6, TJ Sikkema 2.0 & C Champlain 0.8)

[mvp 78]

BTV

 

Yanks: 8.1 Beni (2+ month rental)

 

KCR: 7.4 (Beck Way 4.6, TJ Sikkema 2.0 & C Champlain 0.8)

 

.078 ISO

.366 BABIP (career high)

3 HR

 

I think Beni is a little overvalued this year. We'll see what he looks like in a different park.

[oldtimer]

The deadline in August 2nd. Many Gms wait until the end, in hopes desperate GMs will up their offers at the last moment.

 

Straightforward trades will be made earlier but where there is significant bidding it will go to the last day and moment.

[oldtimer]

.078 ISO

.366 BABIP (career high)

3 HR

 

I think Beni is a little overvalued this year. We'll see what he looks like in a different park.

 

Maybe Yankee stadium will be his cup of tea. I don't think he was vaccinated though.

[Old Red]

.078 ISO

.366 BABIP (career high)

3 HR

 

I think Beni is a little overvalued this year. We'll see what he looks like in a different park.

 

Beni may be over valued, but would you rather have Beni,or any of the other OF the Sox have playing right now like the great Franchy C who some on here have raved about the great trade that Bloom had made to acquire him?

[moonslav59]

Beni may be over valued, but would you rather have Beni,or any of the other OF the Sox have playing right now like the great Franchy C who some on here have raved about the great trade that Bloom had made to acquire him?

 

I’d rather have Refsnyder.

 

I’d rather the longer control of Dugo and Duran, and it’s about even on those two counting just the last 2 months of 2022.