Clay Buchholz - Is he worth the 2016 option?

[Spudboy]

i think this show is about to start now so i am trying....

 

Let us know what you think of them.

 

Holly was / is a good writer and both are educated and articulate.

 

Dale Arnold knows a ton about hockey so don't be surprised if they talk about the Bruins a bunch.

[mvp 78]

It's not the name or profile. It's the info in the post. LMAO.

Are you like this all the time. I'm WB but if you want to call me stinky- man that's fine, that was my name on BDC and bruins boards. I try to walk and chew gum at the same time. I love all the Boston teams. Not just 1. ( Red Sox, Pats, and Bruins a little more though.

 

Remember this, Margo Adams was a pain in the arsh in Bogg's side and he still won batting titles. I'll embrace it as well. Call me 'stinky' Boggs . IDC. LOL-ING.

If your looking for people to hate and tell people you don't even know, I'd go watch your local news or out of market news. CNN AND FOX NEWS!!

 

It was a joke that referred to other people on Talksox that had a tendency to "make stuff up."

 

I don't pay attention to other message boards. One is enough for me.

[mvp 78]

Let us know what you think of them.

 

Holly was / is a good writer and both are educated and articulate.

 

Dale Arnold knows a ton about hockey so don't be surprised if they talk about the Bruins a bunch.

 

Holley and Dale are good as a combo. I'm not a big fan of what Jerry Thornton brings to the table. I generally only tune in to sports radio if something major is going down.

[SoxnCycles]

Odds are he went through whatever day before start running/routines he has and it tightened up during or right after he did them. Given that he's going to do those drills in the couple hours before game time, 5:30-5:45 is entirely plausible.

 

I do love it when internet tough guys call players soft with no real knowledge whatsoever.

 

 

I thought the Red sox screwed up with his knee diagnosis.

Now, I'm not so sure. I'm begining to think it took him an extra two months to get mentally prepared, after his knee healed.

 

E-Rod strikes me as the type that not going to pitch unless he feels "100%".

Is that better Miss Manners?

 

If he's not back on the DL by the time the playoffs roll around, I'll be amazed.

[SoxnCycles]

In all fairness, posters have no problem calling Clay "soft" and no one cares but now we are going to be hypocritical and call out a poster for calling another player soft? ok. noted.

 

If Clay lays an egg in his next start, he'll be called all sorts of names.

I'm betting Miss Manners doesn't bat an eye.

Eveyone's got their favorites, i guess.

[Kimmi]

In all fairness, posters have no problem calling Clay "soft" and no one cares but now we are going to be hypocritical and call out a poster for calling another player soft? ok. noted.

 

Thank you. People are on Clay all the time about how he won't pitch if he has a hangnail.

 

All players are beat up and playing with some type of injury at this point of the season. It's a fine line, IMO. On the one hand, you want them to tough it out and help their team in the middle of a pennant race. OTOH, you don't want them causing further injury.

[mvp 78]

I don't think ANY guys should be called soft. People were inferring it with Papi earlier in the year because "why can't he just play 5 more years because it's not really that taxing to be a dh when you only swing the bat a few times a day and literally do nothing else with your life blah blah blah blah."

 

Is that ok?

 

Also, before some people throw stones, I know that a certain poster was saying that Hanley was mentally fragile and would be unable to field his position this year...

[illinoisredsox]

Thank you. People are on Clay all the time about how he won't pitch if he has a hangnail.

 

All players are beat up and playing with some type of injury at this point of the season. It's a fine line, IMO. On the one hand, you want them to tough it out and help their team in the middle of a pennant race. OTOH, you don't want them causing further injury.

 

 

The difference is Buchholz has a history of doing that. Does ERod?

 

And while ERod said something to the effect of he wanted to be 100%, were those the words of a guy for whom English is a second language and for whom what he meant and the words he used didn't exactly jive. I don't know.

 

There is a difference between playing hurt and playing injured. The former is something pro athletes have to learn to do. The latter is stupid. Pedroia tried to come back and play injured a few years ago and ended up missing the rest of the season. If that hammie affects ERod's delivery and he injures his arm, will people be glad "he toughed it out"?

[Kimmi]

I don't think ANY guys should be called soft. People were inferring it with Papi earlier in the year because "why can't he just play 5 more years because it's not really that taxing to be a dh when you only swing the bat a few times a day and literally do nothing else with your life blah blah blah blah."

 

Is that ok?

 

Also, before some people throw stones, I know that a certain poster was saying that Hanley was mentally fragile and would be unable to field his position this year...

 

First off, that's not the same thing because a certain poster never once called out Hanley for not playing in a game or questioned his desire to play. In fact, said poster was Hanley's biggest defender when everyone questioned his character last year.

 

But whatever the case, a certain poster is not calling out any other posters for calling someone soft. A certain poster was calling out other posters for calling out posters for calling someone soft, when they, themselves have done it.

[Kimmi]

The difference is Buchholz has a history of doing that. Does ERod?

 

And while ERod said something to the effect of he wanted to be 100%, were those the words of a guy for whom English is a second language and for whom what he meant and the words he used didn't exactly jive. I don't know.

 

There is a difference between playing hurt and playing injured. The former is something pro athletes have to learn to do. The latter is stupid. Pedroia tried to come back and play injured a few years ago and ended up missing the rest of the season. If that hammie affects ERod's delivery and he injures his arm, will people be glad "he toughed it out"?

 

Buchholz may have a history of injuries, but does that mean that he should come back and pitch before he is fully ready? How does it make Buchholz soft if he wants to be 100% before returning, but it's perfectly okay for ERod to be 100% before returning?

 

FTR, I give ERod the benefit of the doubt. I don't think he should return if he doesn't feel ready to return. But IMO, the same should be true for Buchholz.

[a700hitter]

Buchholz isn't soft. That implies that he isn't trying hard enough. He is frail. He breaks easily.

[bowman]

If he finishes the season strong I'd sign him and at least have the option to package him. Starting pitching will be in demand this off season. If he goes south then probably best to let him go. If he can pitch anywhere close to the way he is now, he is valuable to us. He goes on good runs, and then something happens. If you think about it, he is the only guy we have that can go long or short. That has true value. If he goes back to the pen, which he should, my bet someone will get a hangnail and back into the rotation he goes. "If" he stays right, he can be a big weapon for us wether we like him or not.

[User Name]

Buchholz isn't soft. That implies that he isn't trying hard enough. He is frail. He breaks easily.

 

^Correct.

 

Remember the arguments about JD Drew? It was never for lack of wanting to play, but his body was just frail and took a long time to heal, to the point where he went for some pretty extravagant treatments to try and get his body to respond.

 

Anyways, it's easy to call players "pussies" or "soft" from the comfort of one's couch.

[mvp 78]

^Correct.

 

Remember the arguments about JD Drew? It was never for lack of wanting to play, but his body was just frail and took a long time to heal, to the point where he went for some pretty extravagant treatments to try and get his body to respond.

 

Anyways, it's easy to call players "pussies" or "soft" from the comfort of one's couch.

 

I'll have you know that I watch most games sitting on my fireplace thank you very much...

[User Name]

^High roller

[Kimmi]

I have no problem giving him time.

What I don't like is the spot he put the team in last Sunday.

If you feel you can't pitch, say so!

Hopefully, someone like Price had a little talk with him.

 

Farrell on @WEEI said E-Rod learned a lesson from scratch Sat/Sun: 'In hindsight, he waited to long (letting Red Sox know)'

 

It seems that you were right Cycles.

[Kimmi]

Buchholz isn't soft. That implies that he isn't trying hard enough. He is frail. He breaks easily.

 

I don't disagree with that.

 

That said, many people have called him soft, and much worse, because of the length of time that he spends on the DL. Those names have also been attributed to the likes of Ellsbury and Drew. Pablo is another one who has been called various names because of his 'weakness'. A slightly different situation but the point remains.

 

Personally, I don't agree with calling ERod soft. That said, my point is that singling out a poster for calling ERod soft was not necessary.

[Kimmi]

If he finishes the season strong I'd sign him and at least have the option to package him. Starting pitching will be in demand this off season. If he goes south then probably best to let him go. If he can pitch anywhere close to the way he is now, he is valuable to us. He goes on good runs, and then something happens. If you think about it, he is the only guy we have that can go long or short. That has true value. If he goes back to the pen, which he should, my bet someone will get a hangnail and back into the rotation he goes. "If" he stays right, he can be a big weapon for us wether we like him or not.

 

Agreed.

[Nick]

Agreed.

 

Based on what happened this year, one can never have enough SP's. Possibly we have Johnson to provide depth in 2017. In the end, $13M will look cheap. As I've said in another thread, if our starting five stays healthy and pitches well, then Clay B can be a trade bait at mid season. Trade for younger pitching talent or add depth to the bullpen.

[a700hitter]

I don't disagree with that.

 

That said, many people have called him soft, and much worse, because of the length of time that he spends on the DL. Those names have also been attributed to the likes of Ellsbury and Drew. Pablo is another one who has been called various names because of his 'weakness'. A slightly different situation but the point remains.

 

Personally, I don't agree with calling ERod soft. That said, my point is that singling out a poster for calling ERod soft was not necessary.

Buch, Ellsbury and Drew were/are all frail. Pablo is just a lazy fat slob.

[S5Dewey]

Buch, Ellsbury and Drew were/are all frail. Pablo is just a lazy fat slob.

 

I think we can agree that even on his best day Pablo fills the definition of "soft".

[Dojji]

What worries me about bringing Buchholz back again is that someone might get silly and relegate E-Rod in order to make Buchholz happy, especially if he shows one of his ephemeral hot streaks going down the stretch. I see that as a problem because I am firmly convinced E-Rod is the better pitcher and don't want to see the team get penny wise and pound foolish over Buchholz yet AGAIN, after seeing them do it so often before.

[User Name]

We get it. You don't like Buchholz.

[Dojji]

I actually like him OK. I don't TRUST him though.

[Kimmi]

Based on what happened this year, one can never have enough SP's. Possibly we have Johnson to provide depth in 2017. In the end, $13M will look cheap. As I've said in another thread, if our starting five stays healthy and pitches well, then Clay B can be a trade bait at mid season. Trade for younger pitching talent or add depth to the bullpen.

 

When Clay was going really bad this year, I thought there was very little chance the Sox would pick up his option. With the way that he has been pitching lately, I think there is a very real chance that the option is picked up. $13 mil for one year is a very appealing contract for most teams. Clay would not only provide depth but also some flexibility.

 

If he continues to pitch well, it makes sense to pick up the option.

[a700hitter]

When Clay was going really bad this year, I thought there was very little chance the Sox would pick up his option. With the way that he has been pitching lately, I think there is a very real chance that the option is picked up. $13 mil for one year is a very appealing contract for most teams. Clay would not only provide depth but also some flexibility.

 

If he continues to pitch well, it makes sense to pick up the option.

His ERA is still comfortably above 5

[S5Dewey]

His ERA is still comfortably above 5

 

Ya, but that ERA is a reflection of the entire year and he's pitched better than that ERA in his last several outings.

 

If he doesn't implode on us again I'm fairly certain that they'll pick up his option for $13M, but what they do with him after that remains to be seen. It's very possible that some GM might see more than $13M of upside there and Buch could be a part of a trade.

[a700hitter]

Ya, but that ERA is a reflection of the entire year and he's pitched better than that ERA in his last several outings.

 

And that is what I would take into consideration when deciding to exercise his option. His entire body of work this season and not his last 2 months.

[Dojji]

If he doesn't implode on us again

 

[a700hitter]

http://www.talksox.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=407&stc=1

I like that