Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[moonslav59]

I was more referring to SPing, but you are right: those relievers are certainly decent. That said, RPs are a dime a dozen out there. We have Bello as a good SP. Beyond that there is basically no one dependable. And I don't see us getting anyone this year=we will suck again and finish in LAST PLACE AGAIN. Henry needs to sell the team. Its obvious that his commitment to winning is gone.

 

They are a dime a dozen, but before these guys, we've been paying a quarter for a half dozen.

[moonslav59]

And I disagree with posters who convince themselves any certain offseason is devoid of talent, and the Sox must be waiting for a better crop to choose from, next winter.

 

This Boston roster is so bad -- and has been on the pitching staff since Bloom took over -- that every offseason has players available that can help improve the Red Sox. They just choose not to invest.

 

As far as pretending a window for contention will open as soon as the mighty prospects arrive in '25 or '26... is it really reasonable to expect Teel to instantly become a Rutschman-type leader behind the plate? Mayer to morph into Corey Seager his first year? Anthony to duplicate Bellinger's rookie stardom?

 

All three may become or surpass such comps, but it may take half a decade for any of them to mature into stars (by then, maybe for other teams).

 

Of course. Chances are at least one of the top three might give close to nothing, at least by 2015 or 2026. Two is possible, as well.

 

We do have a bunch of mid-levels all likely to be graduating from 2022 to 2025.

 

Those who just did (Casas, Bello, Crawford, Duran, Wink, Wong and more) plus Rafaela, Abreu, Yorke, Fitts, Wikelman, Perales and others might produce a few pluses.

 

Plenty of longer shots might produce 1-2 surprises and or role players.

 

Meidroth, Castro, Hickey, Jordan, Monegro, Slaten, Guerrero, Mata, DHam, Dobbins

Hoppe, Troye, Rogers, Penrod, Gambrell, ICoffey, Brannon and others.

 

There is nothing wrong with getting optimistic about a farm most experts rank rather highly, but yes, we can't pencil in any single one, by name, right now.

 

BTW, being optimistic about the foundation and future prospects is not "expecting" them to do so.

 

I do "expect" some will do well. Maybe not the ones we think will, but some should. (More than we've seen from the Devers call-up in 2017 to the Bello-Casas promotions, recently.

Edited January 13, 2024 by moonslav59

[vjcsmoke]

The story on the Red Sox offer to Imanaga has leaked:

 

https://www.si.com/fannation/mlb/fastball/news/boston-red-sox-insider-alex-speier-details-the-offer-shota-imanaga-rejected-before-joining-the-chicago-cubs

 

Predictably they fell well short of the mark again by offering a 2 year deal that 'could' vest into 4 years.

 

Seriously is anybody surprised they keep getting rejected with these types of lowball offers to free agents?

 

Pretty shameful stuff and it seems to reinforce the 'free agents' are shocked by how bad the Red Sox offers have been.

 

Business as usual at Yawkey Way - cheap your way to a lower salary spend. Who needs talent unless it's dirt cheap?!

Edited January 13, 2024 by vjcsmoke

[vjcsmoke]

Even if they do mature into stars we STILL don't have the SPing nor, apparently, the will and the wallet to correct that. The only language Henry will understand is EMPTY SEATS at the park. When Fenway starts to look like the Trop as far as attendance goes he will get it.

 

Bingo! It's time to boycotty Fenway! The only thing FSG understands is empty seats.

 

They even decided to intentionally AVOID attending Winter Weekend because they knew they were going to get BOOED again.

 

That shows they've already decided to IGNORE the fans!

 

Affecting their cashflow negatively is the only thing these corporate moneybag types will understand.

 

I sincerely wonder what percentage of empty seats they consider acceptable as long as the tv/advertising money keeps flowing in? How little do they really care?

[Duran Is The Man]

Bingo! It's time to boycotty Fenway! The only thing FSG understands is empty seats.

 

They even decided to intentionally AVOID attending Winter Weekend because they knew they were going to get BOOED again.

 

That shows they've already decided to IGNORE the fans!

 

Affecting their cashflow negatively is the only thing these corporate moneybag types will understand.

 

I sincerely wonder what percentage of empty seats they consider acceptable as long as the tv/advertising money keeps flowing in? How little do they really care?

 

exactly. and, honestly, there is absolutely nothing about this team worth watching anyway.

[Randy Red Sox]

I like the foundation for 2025 and 2026, but I agree.

 

We suck for 2024, unless near 30 out of about 32 things go right, this year. (I'll name those 32, at some point.)

 

 

What makes u think 2025 and 2026 will be better?? Who is going to pitch for us?

[notin]

Bingo! It's time to boycotty Fenway! The only thing FSG understands is empty seats.

 

They even decided to intentionally AVOID attending Winter Weekend because they knew they were going to get BOOED again.

 

That shows they've already decided to IGNORE the fans!

 

Affecting their cashflow negatively is the only thing these corporate moneybag types will understand.

 

I sincerely wonder what percentage of empty seats they consider acceptable as long as the tv/advertising money keeps flowing in? How little do they really care?

 

There is no “waiting until the team is worth investing in.” That’s not what’s going on.

 

It’s become very obvious Henry wants to run this team like Tampa is run. No one ever looks at Tampa’s rotation and thinks “that looks unbeatable.” Lately it’s been McLanahan and/or Glashow. Rarely both. And rarely anyone else. Unless you were high on Zack Eflin and his 99 ERA+ over 7 years in Philly. (If so, maybe you can get equally excited if the Sox sign Eric Lauer.). Tampa also doesn’t churn out star pitcher after star pitcher from their farm; they live off scrap heaps. Guys like Jeffrey Springs, Jason Adam, and Andrew Kittredge that they poach from other teams…

 

It’s obvious the Sox really do want to be Tampa North. If it works, that’s a good thing. Tampa has made the postseason 5 straight years, something Boston has never done in team history…

[moonslav59]

What makes u think 2025 and 2026 will be better?? Who is going to pitch for us?

 

1. I doubt it can be worse.

2. It is possible to compete without great SP'ers, if the rest of the team improves, greatly. (Emphasis in "if.")

3. If we look like we are closer to winning than now, maybe, and I'm not saying for sure, we might spend more or make a big trade for pitching.

 

I'm not projecting it, expecting it or saying it is even likely to happen, but I do think our team will be better if and when some of our prospects are called up and mature. Maybe 2025 or 2026 is wishful thinking, but I'm trying to find a shred of something to be optimistic about.

[moonslav59]

There is no “waiting until the team is worth investing in.” That’s not what’s going on.

 

It’s become very obvious Henry wants to run this team like Tampa is run. No one ever looks at Tampa’s rotation and thinks “that looks unbeatable.” Lately it’s been McLanahan and/or Glashow. Rarely both. And rarely anyone else. Unless you were high on Zack Eflin and his 99 ERA+ over 7 years in Philly. (If so, maybe you can get equally excited if the Sox sign Eric Lauer.). Tampa also doesn’t churn out star pitcher after star pitcher from their farm; they live off scrap heaps. Guys like Jeffrey Springs, Jason Adam, and Andrew Kittredge that they poach from other teams…

 

It’s obvious the Sox really do want to be Tampa North. If it works, that’s a good thing. Tampa has made the postseason 5 straight years, something Boston has never done in team history…

 

This could easily be "the plan," but why not just say so?

[Duran Is The Man]

There is no “waiting until the team is worth investing in.” That’s not what’s going on.

 

It’s become very obvious Henry wants to run this team like Tampa is run. No one ever looks at Tampa’s rotation and thinks “that looks unbeatable.” Lately it’s been McLanahan and/or Glashow. Rarely both. And rarely anyone else. Unless you were high on Zack Eflin and his 99 ERA+ over 7 years in Philly. (If so, maybe you can get equally excited if the Sox sign Eric Lauer.). Tampa also doesn’t churn out star pitcher after star pitcher from their farm; they live off scrap heaps. Guys like Jeffrey Springs, Jason Adam, and Andrew Kittredge that they poach from other teams…

 

It’s obvious the Sox really do want to be Tampa North. If it works, that’s a good thing. Tampa has made the postseason 5 straight years, something Boston has never done in team history…

 

yeah, but no WS championship to go with that playoff run either.

[moonslav59]

yeah, but no WS championship to go with that playoff run either.

 

At this point, that's a dream for us.

[Duran Is The Man]

At this point, that's a dream for us.

 

i think it's fair to say that anything but last place is a dream.

[moonslav59]

i think it's fair to say that anything but last place is a dream.

 

4th place looks tough.

3rd place real tough.

2nd place, nope

 

Be like the Rays for the next 5 years: a pipe dream.

[cp176]

There is no “waiting until the team is worth investing in.” That’s not what’s going on.

 

It’s become very obvious Henry wants to run this team like Tampa is run. No one ever looks at Tampa’s rotation and thinks “that looks unbeatable.” Lately it’s been McLanahan and/or Glashow. Rarely both. And rarely anyone else. Unless you were high on Zack Eflin and his 99 ERA+ over 7 years in Philly. (If so, maybe you can get equally excited if the Sox sign Eric Lauer.). Tampa also doesn’t churn out star pitcher after star pitcher from their farm; they live off scrap heaps. Guys like Jeffrey Springs, Jason Adam, and Andrew Kittredge that they poach from other teams…

 

It’s obvious the Sox really do want to be Tampa North. If it works, that’s a good thing. Tampa has made the postseason 5 straight years, something Boston has never done in team history…

 

Why fire Bloom?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Why fire Bloom?

 

Ignore what we all know he did or didn't do the past four years, and see how his firing may be perceived by owners as the best PR move going forward.

 

For three months, it raised expectations across Red Sox Nation that big changes were actually in store.

 

But by now we know: it was just cheaper than signing better players at fair market value.

 

Don't worry, they'll allow Breslow to make a splish soon to restore a glimmer of hope... something like one of the Three Stooges shooting a hole in the canoe to let the water leak out.

[Elktonnick]

Ignore what we all know he did or didn't do the past four years, and see how his firing may be perceived by owners as the best PR move going forward.

 

For three months, it raised expectations across Red Sox Nation that big changes were actually in store.

 

But by now we know: it was just cheaper than signing better players at fair market value.

 

Don't worry, they'll allow Breslow to make a splish soon to restore a glimmer of hope... something like one of the Three Stooges shooting a hole in the canoe to let the water leak out.

Bloom was always a scapegoat. He was hired to trade Betts. They actually thought Bloom could make some deals that could make lemonade out of the sour lemons he signed. When they realized he was too indecisive and couldn't they fired him.

Everyone knows Boston's entire approach towards pitching sucks. So they have hired Breslow to fix that but with no budget to sign high end free agents.

Breslow may have som success at realigning their approach towards pitching but in the end he will be fired too. Because that is what Henry does.

[notin]

yeah, but no WS championship to go with that playoff run either.

 

Is this a serious criticism?

[FredLynn]

There is no “waiting until the team is worth investing in.” That’s not what’s going on.

 

It’s become very obvious Henry wants to run this team like Tampa is run. No one ever looks at Tampa’s rotation and thinks “that looks unbeatable.” Lately it’s been McLanahan and/or Glashow. Rarely both. And rarely anyone else. Unless you were high on Zack Eflin and his 99 ERA+ over 7 years in Philly. (If so, maybe you can get equally excited if the Sox sign Eric Lauer.). Tampa also doesn’t churn out star pitcher after star pitcher from their farm; they live off scrap heaps. Guys like Jeffrey Springs, Jason Adam, and Andrew Kittredge that they poach from other teams…

 

It’s obvious the Sox really do want to be Tampa North. If it works, that’s a good thing. Tampa has made the postseason 5 straight years, something Boston has never done in team history…

 

Sure seems that way (running the team like Tampa north). Remember: the Rays finished in the cellar for years and years. They were a joke. Meanwhile the developed their farm system and produced some top tier talent for whom they paid very little. They are also a well run organization, unlike the Red Sox. I am expecting another unwatchable team this year and for many years to come until Henry either sells the team or opens up his purse.

[FredLynn]

This could easily be "the plan," but why not just say so?

 

They are saying so.....with their actions. They aren't going to say so in words for the media to digest-ever.

[Hugh2]

Reported that the Red Sox and the Mets have been in contact with Blake Snell since yesterday. LHP is seeking a contract worth $200 million.

 

I think I everyone here, despite our vast differences, would be shocked if we sign Snell for $200 million, and even more shocked if we were to outbid the Mets.

[Bellhorn04]

Reported that the Red Sox and the Mets have been in contact with Blake Snell since yesterday. LHP is seeking a contract worth $200 million.

 

I think I everyone here, despite our vast differences, would be shocked if we sign Snell for $200 million, and even more shocked if we were to outbid the Mets.

 

Can't rule out the last minute panic move.

[Hugh2]

Can't rule out the last minute panic move.

 

No you can’t. And it will probably be judged as such no matter what. Can’t blame people giving recent results

 

Unfortunately for ownership they’ve painted themselves into this corner. There’s no words or moves that will ever restore the fan bases faith in their commitment to this team.

 

Only results will. They have to go out and win games to shut people up.

[Duran Is The Man]

Is this a serious criticism?

 

just stating a fact.

[notin]

just stating a fact.

 

Another fact, only the Dodgers and Astros have longer postseason streaks. And the spend-happy Dodgers have only one WS title in their 11 year postseason run…

[notin]

Reported that the Red Sox and the Mets have been in contact with Blake Snell since yesterday. LHP is seeking a contract worth $200 million.

 

I think I everyone here, despite our vast differences, would be shocked if we sign Snell for $200 million, and even more shocked if we were to outbid the Mets.

 

 

1. I’d be annoyed that we signed the up-and-down Snell for SEVEN YEARS.

2. I’d be happy with the improved SP.

3. I’d be shocked and elated that the Sox were spending again.

4. I’d be in disbelief that the Sox outbid the Mets.

 

 

So … mixed emotions?

[Larry Cook]

Reported that the Red Sox and the Mets have been in contact with Blake Snell since yesterday. LHP is seeking a contract worth $200 million.

 

I think I everyone here, despite our vast differences, would be shocked if we sign Snell for $200 million, and even more shocked if we were to outbid the Mets.

 

I have been hearing the Red Sox are hot after snell, but need find buyers for yoshida and Jansen

[Randy Red Sox]

Can't rule out the last minute panic move.

 

Snell is a good pitcher but i'm sure we won't be signing him either. O's interested in Paxton now

[Hugh2]

1. I’d be annoyed that we signed the up-and-down Snell for SEVEN YEARS.

2. I’d be happy with the improved SP.

3. I’d be shocked and elated that the Sox were spending again.

4. I’d be in disbelief that the Sox outbid the Mets.

 

 

So … mixed emotions?

 

Hammer meet nail

[harmony]

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2024/01/latest-on-red-sox-pitching-trade-discussions.html

[jad]

Another fact, only the Dodgers and Astros have longer postseason streaks. And the spend-happy Dodgers have only one WS title in their 11 year postseason run…

 

And who do you think is a better team: LAD or RS? Which one has players you would rather see: LAD or RS? And as a customer, who would you rather follow: LAD or the RS? Or: how many last place finishes has LAD had in the post-McCourt era? How many fan-favorite, HOF quality players has LAD traded away or let go?