A Realistic View of 2023: Part II

[Bellhorn04]

I brought up the DD- Bloom comp a couple days ago to show how similar the teams have been, but how wildly differently they are viewed due to a situation totally out of anybody on the Sox control. It's not excuse making. It's not proclaiming Bloom is a success. On 26 man roster construction, he has not been that. I have yet to hear one person say that, but there is a legion of posters who pretend there is a posse of posters who think Bloom shits gold bars.

 

As I've said, everyone knew the AL East was going to be tough this year. It wasn't a surprise. Which means the front office was supposed to take that into account. That is most definitely part of their job.

[Bellhorn04]

Pre-season projections said the Sox would be around .500 and miss the playoffs.

 

Pre-season projections said Bloom had done a half-ass job.

 

Pre-season projections are looking accurate.

[notin]

Nonsense, I didn't say any of this. You don't read other people's posts carefully at all. I have HIGHLIGHTED the luck factor.

 

But if we're going to fall back on the "tough division" excuse for not making playoffs and we're going to use that to pronounce Bloom's work a success, I'd say that's pretty pathetic.

 

So… the crybaby stuff (while I get was an inside joke on moonslav) took this into account?

 

No one has proclaimed Bloom a success. Even his staunchest supporters have piled numerous gripes, not enough of which contain the words “Mauricio Llovera”, a man who is making many of us miss Kaleb Ort.

 

But the reality of tjs situation is both teams have performed the same, and one is getting rewarded while the other condemned.

 

Look at it this way. The Sox have played horrible defense. Their baserunning numerous times has been beyond questionable. They play in a division where it took a long losing streak to put only one team under .500. Yet somehow, they’re still as good as Philly. How bad is that Philly team that they aren’t doing much, much better than a team that can’t field, can’t run the bases, and went far too long with half a rotation?

[moonslav59]

Did I not hear right when Bloom was doing his Awesome speech during the booing at the meet, and greet this past offseason. Did Bloom say when he took over the club the club the club was getting older, and would be going over a cliff, or did he say since I took over I’m going to take the Red Sox over a cliff?

 

Does it matter what you heard?

 

You'd just misrepresent what was said, anyway.

[moonslav59]

As I've said, everyone knew the AL East was going to be tough this year. It wasn't a surprise. Which means the front office was supposed to take that into account. That is most definitely part of their job.

 

They did take it into account, and that's why they chose not to go all in, last winter, sadly.

[notin]

As I've said, everyone knew the AL East was going to be tough this year. It wasn't a surprise. Which means the front office was supposed to take that into account. That is most definitely part of their job.

 

Are they or are they not competing with the AL East teams?

 

They’re 4 games behind Toronto with 36 to play. Not exactly insurmountable. And they can’t stop Baltimore, Tampa and Toronto from making moves.

 

They didn’t build an Oakland roster…

[notin]

Did I not hear right when Bloom was doing his Awesome speech during the booing at the meet, and greet this past offseason. Did Bloom say when he took over the club the club the club was getting older, and would be going over a cliff, or did he say since I took over I’m going to take the Red Sox over a cliff?

 

That stuff was only in the press conference highlights

[Bellhorn04]

They did take it into account, and that's why they chose not to go all in, last winter, sadly.

 

But they signed Yoshida to a 5 year deal and Jansen and Martin to 2 year deals. How does it make sense to do that if you're only half-ass-in?

[Old Red]

Does it matter what you heard?

 

You'd just misrepresent what was said, anyway.

 

That’s why I was trying to get some clarification. Don’t you have something important to do like the Wildcard Standings update that you do so well?

[Old Red]

That stuff was only in the press conference highlights

 

No! They showed the whole act over, and over, and over again.

[moonslav59]

But they signed Yoshida to a 5 year deal and Jansen and Martin to 2 year deals. How does it make sense to do that if you're only half-ass-in?

 

You answered your own question- it's because they are choosing to be half-ass in, until they think the moment it right-- not when we think it is.

 

They may have signed Yoshida and Story thinking the fans would be under the impression we were trying to win it all, but also that both would still be productive when the time actually came to "go all in"( 2024? 2025?)

 

It is clear they did not think we had a chance for a ring, or they would have signed more or better than Kluber.

 

They played it half-ass at the deadline, too- same as 2022.

 

The only meaningful dals they made at both deadline had to do with the longrun outlook (Abreu, EValdez, Rosier, McGuire and Urias.)

 

Personally, not that it matters what I think, we could have been close enough to compete, this year, with just one or two more moves or two better moves. I also think the system is moving in the right direction, so I don't get upset as most seem to, but I'm still pissed.

[moonslav59]

That’s why I was trying to get some clarification.

 

Clarification does not work with you.

[Old Red]

Clarification does not work with you.

 

It totally depends on who is doing the clarifying.

[harmony]

Wonder what the odds would be, if we switched divisions and or schedules.

FWIW the Red Sox are 19-24 against National League teams, 19-14 against AL East teams, 12-12 against AL West teams and 32-33 against teams with a record above .500:

 

2024 MLB Standings and Records: Wild Card | MLB.com

WWW.MLB.COM

---

The official standings for Major League Baseball including division and league standings for regular season, wild card, and playoffs.

Edited August 23, 2023 by harmony

[mvp 78]

Is complaining about unequal divisions kind of like being a...crybaby?

 

No, it's simple game theory. The new money ball for owners. If you can't win in a certain division, just swap for an easier division!

[mvp 78]

Pre-season projections said the Sox would be around .500 and miss the playoffs.

 

Pre-season projections said Bloom had done a half-ass job.

 

Pre-season projections are looking accurate.

 

Disagree. 2/3's of TalkSox voters had the Sox under .500. They seem to be wrong.

[Maxbialystock]

Disagree. 2/3's of TalkSox voters had the Sox under .500. They seem to be wrong.

 

Very good point. I was one of the 2/3's, which means the Sox exceeded my expectations, and here I am griping to beat the band. I'm mad at the weak hitting and weak pitching--especially against the Astros, who seem to be good at both--and irritated by the defense and baserunning. Plus Dugo last night going ape--from the dugout, yet--over the balls and strikes--and Duran foolishly climbing a wall at Yankee Stadium when the ball was clearly out of his reach. He's now on the 10 day IL.

[Old Red]

No, it's simple game theory. The new money ball for owners. If you can't win in a certain division, just swap for an easier division!

 

Like I keep saying to be the best you have to beat the best, and the Red Sox certainly haven’t been anywhere near that the last two years.

[Maxbialystock]

Are they or are they not competing with the AL East teams?

 

They’re 4 games behind Toronto with 36 to play. Not exactly insurmountable. And they can’t stop Baltimore, Tampa and Toronto from making moves.

 

They didn’t build an Oakland roster…

 

Oh, stop it. Just stop it. You are bombarding us with sensible observations and I for one am getting sick and tired of it.

 

I'm tired of it because I prefer to be an irrational over-reactor. I've liked Cora a ton for 5 years, but now I want him fired because, now that Story, Sale, Houck, and Whitlock are back, the Sox look worse than before, not better--especially against the Astros.

 

I don't think Bloom has been all that good, but until now have defended him because I know JH put some restrictions on him. I think Henry expected Bloom to get the Sox doing things the "Rays way," which is to be really smart about acquiring and developing players, especially pitchers. And of course it should only take a year or two to achieve that.

[Old Red]

Moon appears to be a little under the weather today, so I’ll try, and fill in, and do the Wildcard Standings update.

 

9 games back of the ist wildcard spot.

 

5 games back of the 2nd, and 3rd wildcard spot

 

4 games back of the number 4 team trying to get into the top 3.

 

If the Red Sox win tonight Moon might feel better, and resume his WC publication tomorrow , but another loss might cause him to bail like he did last year. Stay tuned.

[Maxbialystock]

Moon appears to be a little under the weather today, so I’ll try, and fill in, and do the Wildcard Standings update.

 

9 games back of the ist wildcard spot.

 

5 games back of the 2nd, and 3rd wildcard spot

 

4 games back of the number 4 team trying to get into the top 3.

 

If the Red Sox win tonight Moon might feel better, and resume his WC publication tomorrow , but another loss might cause him to bail like he did last year. Stay tuned.

 

I think moonslav does just fine speaking for himself. As for the WC discussion, why the heck not? 36 games to go, which should be enough games to get back into the hunt.

 

His dilemma--and mine--is that the Astros are one of the Sox competitors for the wild card and in these first two games they have looked overwhelmingly better in every aspect of those two games--hitting, pitching, defense, and baserunning.

 

I hasten to add, however, this should not be surprising because the Astros are one of the best teams in MLB year after year and in the past two seasons were in the WS, losing to Atlanta in 2021 and beating the Phillies last year. In 2019 they lost to the Nats in the WS and in 2018 they lost to the best Sox team ever in the ALCS.

[mvp 78]

I think moonslav does just fine speaking for himself. As for the WC discussion, why the heck not? 36 games to go, which should be enough games to get back into the hunt.

 

If you are just chasing one team down, it's doable. The problem is that the Sox have to pass 2 teams and haven't shown the ability all year to do so. It's very unlikely. Less than 10% chance.

[moonslav59]

FWIW the Red Sox are 19-24 against National League teams, 19-14 against AL East teams, 12-12 against AL West teams and 32-33 against teams with a record above .500:

 

2024 MLB Standings and Records: Wild Card | MLB.com

WWW.MLB.COM

---

The official standings for Major League Baseball including division and league standings for regular season, wild card, and playoffs.

 

...and?

[moonslav59]

Moon appears to be a little under the weather today, so I’ll try, and fill in, and do the Wildcard Standings update.

 

9 games back of the ist wildcard spot.

 

5 games back of the 2nd, and 3rd wildcard spot

 

4 games back of the number 4 team trying to get into the top 3.

 

If the Red Sox win tonight Moon might feel better, and resume his WC publication tomorrow , but another loss might cause him to bail like he did last year. Stay tuned.

 

I'm not sure why you take issue over when and when I do not give WC standing updates.

 

I'm not under the weather. I'm busy with something else.

 

Our odds are longer, now, and that seems to make you happier.

 

We all have noticed who disappears when things are going well and then posts 50 times a day after a big loss or a losing streak. It's your time to gloat, so enjoy yourself.

[moonslav59]

If you are just chasing one team down, it's doable. The problem is that the Sox have to pass 2 teams and haven't shown the ability all year to do so. It's very unlikely. Less than 10% chance.

 

We have passed some teams during the year, just not often enough, and not at the right time.

[mvp 78]

We have passed some teams during the year, just not often enough, and not at the right time.

 

And now there's just over a month left. It's less and less likely at this point.

[moonslav59]

And now there's just over a month left. It's less and less likely at this point.

 

4 games is a lot of ground to make up, especially when we don't play SEA and only have 3 vs TOR, remaining.

 

It looks like the hopes on passing HOU by playing them 7 times in 10 games is looking like a pipe dream.

 

I'm not giving up, but I can see why many are, or are close to it.

[Old Red]

I'm not sure why you take issue over when and when I do not give WC standing updates.

 

I'm not under the weather. I'm busy with something else.

 

Our odds are longer, now, and that seems to make you happier.

 

We all have noticed who disappears when things are going well and then posts 50 times a day after a big loss or a losing streak. It's your time to gloat, so enjoy yourself.

 

I’ve already said I’m not a cheerleader waving Pom poms when things are going well. It’s just like someone has said that the game threads are longer when things aren’t going well than they are when things are going good. I’m sure posting the WC standings update was on your to do list today. Not! You being under the weather could have been in green. It just amazes me that the fans can turn with what way the wind is blowing like blowing all out against the hapless Yankees, and thinking the Red Sox are on their way now when in the reality they are the same team that lost 2 of 3 in Washington. It’s noticed to how you were so quick to bail last year, and probably will do it again this year if the wind stays blowing in.

[moonslav59]

I’ve already said I’m not a cheerleader waving Pom poms when things are going well. It’s just like someone has said that the game threads are longer when things aren’t going well than they are when things are going good. I’m sure posting the WC standings update was on your to do list today. Not! You being under the weather could have been in green. It just amazes me that the fans can turn with what way the wind is blowing like blowing all out against the hapless Yankees, and thinking the Red Sox are on their way now when in the reality they are the same team that lost 2 of 3 in Washington. It’s noticed to how you were so quick to bail last year, and probably will do it again this year if the wind stays blowing in.

 

Our friend and close neighbor died, last night. I've been busy helping his wife get through the day. We had planned on seeing the Sox-Astros game, tonight on TV.

 

Yes, I gave up early on the Sox, last year. It was a team way more flawed than this one. I still watched every game and posted nearly everyday- win or lose. I did not come here and gloat about "being right."

 

I projected we'd be over .500 and maybe compete with for a playoff slot, and aren't coming here throwing that in your face.

 

I'm not asking you to waive pom-poms. I merely pointed out how you wait in the shadows like the Stork and do your drive-by attacks, then back-pedal trying to "clarify" that your continued bashing is not bashing at all.

 

We all know better. It's so obvious.

[Maxbialystock]

If you are just chasing one team down, it's doable. The problem is that the Sox have to pass 2 teams and haven't shown the ability all year to do so. It's very unlikely. Less than 10% chance.

 

Excellent point and one which I overlooked.