Fire Bloom .

[redsoxrules]

What are the hopes that the Red Sox in the second half will break any of those themes? Defense - no; old pitchers suddenly healthy - no; consistent hitters - this has the most potential...

 

Raffy can rebound with a better second half... his best career month with the lumber is July: .304, .963. However, his worst career month is August: .238, .756 (Aug is usually when Devers is dealing with some nagging injury; hopefully his limbs will heat up and stay loose with the weather this summer).

 

If one or both of Casas and/or Duran continues to adjust to league adjustments to their adjustments... if Yoshida doesn't wear down... if -- after Duvall is dealt at the deadline -- Story can comeback and contribute, more on the bases as a new-rules weapon, than the all-or-nothing swinging he'll be replacing...

 

Obviously, the young pitching has to remain consistent, and Houck has to prove he's doesn't turn into Herb Score... then the Sox just might hang in there around .500 and stave off wild card elimination until October...

 

So what you're saying is that Devers can't make it through a full season without being injured. Makes me laugh when I see this. Another reason why not to give him that big contract. Injuries don't get better with age.

[Randy Red Sox]

In fairness to Bloom the Sox have been hit by significant injuries in the rotation. Not really all that surprising though given the rotation Bloom constructed.

I don't have a big problem with 6-game win streaks followed by disturbing 2-game losing streaks. That happens to the best teams.

 

But it does feel like this team is hovering on the brink between playoff contention and total sub-.500 irrelevance. So are a bunch of other teams, but that's small consolation for Sox fans who had bigger expectations from Bloom's 4th season.

[Randy Red Sox]

. This will give Bloom an excuse to hang on to all our starters at the deadline. better to just let them walk for nothing just like 2023 CY Young candidate Nate Eovaldi and Michael Wacha did.

What are the hopes that the Red Sox in the second half will break any of those themes? Defense - no; old pitchers suddenly healthy - no; consistent hitters - this has the most potential...

 

Raffy can rebound with a better second half... his best career month with the lumber is July: .304, .963. However, his worst career month is August: .238, .756 (Aug is usually when Devers is dealing with some nagging injury; hopefully his limbs will heat up and stay loose with the weather this summer).

 

If one or both of Casas and/or Duran continues to adjust to league adjustments to their adjustments... if Yoshida doesn't wear down... if -- after Duvall is dealt at the deadline -- Story can comeback and contribute, more on the bases as a new-rules weapon, than the all-or-nothing swinging he'll be replacing...

 

Obviously, the young pitching has to remain consistent, and Houck has to prove he's doesn't turn into Herb Score... then the Sox just might hang in there around .500 and stave off wild card elimination until October...

Edited June 25, 2023 by Randy Red Sox

[notin]

. This will give Bloom an excuse to hang on to all our starters at the deadline. better to just let them walk for nothing just like 2023 CY Young candidate Nate Eovaldi and Michael Wacha did.

 

 

Eovaldi just finished a 4 year contract with Boston during which time he threw all of 407 IP. (Roughly 102 IP per year). He was good at times. He was excellent in 2021, a year in which he threw nearly half of those innings. The other 3 years, including 2022, he was a part time pitcher.

 

So please tell me which of these qualifications made Eovaldi an obvious candidate for a multiyear extension?

 

Ditto Wacha. Wacha hasn’t topped 130 IP in a season since 2018.

 

Now given that folks are complaining about Bloom signing too many injury prone players, like McGuire and Chang (two players with no real injury history), why should the Sox have gone out and given multiple years to two players with annual injury problems?

 

The Sox only missed the playoffs last year by 8 games. How much could they have knocked off of that if they weren’t limited to 236 IP combined from Eovaldi and Wacha?

[dannycater]

I don't have a big problem with 6-game win streaks followed by disturbing 2-game losing streaks. That happens to the best teams.

 

But it does feel like this team is hovering on the brink between playoff contention and total sub-.500 irrelevance. So are a bunch of other teams, but that's small consolation for Sox fans who had bigger expectations from Bloom's 4th season.

 

This is it entirely, Bellhorn. *bigger expectations* and a feeling that the Sox should be up there with the big boys battling for a playoff spot. Not just a cheapie 1-game wild card.

[redsoxrules]

Eovaldi just finished a 4 year contract with Boston during which time he threw all of 407 IP. (Roughly 102 IP per year). He was good at times. He was excellent in 2021, a year in which he threw nearly half of those innings. The other 3 years, including 2022, he was a part time pitcher.

 

So please tell me which of these qualifications made Eovaldi an obvious candidate for a multiyear extension?

 

Ditto Wacha. Wacha hasn’t topped 130 IP in a season since 2018.

 

Now given that folks are complaining about Bloom signing too many injury prone players, like McGuire and Chang (two players with no real injury history), why should the Sox have gone out and given multiple years to two players with annual injury problems?

 

The Sox only missed the playoffs last year by 8 games. How much could they have knocked off of that if they weren’t limited to 236 IP combined from Eovaldi and Wacha?

 

Only 8 games? 8 games is a lot to miss the playoffs considering how many teams now making the playoffs.

[dannycater]

FROM GLOBE: Twenty of the 26 players in uniform Sunday were acquired by Bloom, as are 11 of the 13 players on the injured list. This is his team, something made clear by watching Andrew Benintendi go 7 for 12 with three doubles over the weekend for the White Sox.

[Randy Red Sox]

EXACTLY but one can never convince the Bloom fan club

Only 8 games? 8 games is a lot to miss the playoffs considering how many teams now making the playoffs.

[Randy Red Sox]

you better do more research if you think this were the only 2 injury risk players that Bloom has signed. still waiting to see the shortstop who was to fill the gap till Story returned even make it to rehab. And please tell me which of Eovaldi and Wacha that Kluber replaced in the rotation ?

Eovaldi just finished a 4 year contract with Boston during which time he threw all of 407 IP. (Roughly 102 IP per year). He was good at times. He was excellent in 2021, a year in which he threw nearly half of those innings. The other 3 years, including 2022, he was a part time pitcher.

 

So please tell me which of these qualifications made Eovaldi an obvious candidate for a multiyear extension?

 

Ditto Wacha. Wacha hasn’t topped 130 IP in a season since 2018.

 

Now given that folks are complaining about Bloom signing too many injury prone players, like McGuire and Chang (two players with no real injury history), why should the Sox have gone out and given multiple years to two players with annual injury problems?

 

The Sox only missed the playoffs last year by 8 games. How much could they have knocked off of that if they weren’t limited to 236 IP combined from Eovaldi and Wacha?

[notin]

you better do more research if you think this were the only 2 injury risk players that Bloom has signed. still waiting to see the shortstop who was to fill the gap till Story returned even make it to rehab. And please tell me which of Eovaldi and Wacha that Kluber replaced in the rotation ?

 

You avoided the question and just named other injured players Bloom signed, none of whom received multiyear deals.

 

Three parter:

 

1. Are Wacha and Eovaldi injury-prone pitchers throughout their careers?

2. Will this situation get better or worse as they age?

3. So what did either do recently to merit a multiyear deal? Kluber getting a one year deal over them was a case of guessing wrong, but not a reason to sign either for multiple years.

 

(Apparently FYI the buzz is the Sox offered Eovaldi more money than Texas, but Eovaldi chose Texas anyway. I assume the Sox offer was for more guaranteed money, but and Rivaldi bet on himself reaching the bonuses, but this is just a theory.)

[notin]

Only 8 games? 8 games is a lot to miss the playoffs considering how many teams now making the playoffs.

 

So you’re saying Eovaldi and Wacha only making 43 of their 64 starts had no impact last year?

[Duran Is The Man]

Eovaldi just finished a 4 year contract with Boston during which time he threw all of 407 IP. (Roughly 102 IP per year). He was good at times. He was excellent in 2021, a year in which he threw nearly half of those innings. The other 3 years, including 2022, he was a part time pitcher.

 

So please tell me which of these qualifications made Eovaldi an obvious candidate for a multiyear extension?

 

Ditto Wacha. Wacha hasn’t topped 130 IP in a season since 2018.

 

Now given that folks are complaining about Bloom signing too many injury prone players, like McGuire and Chang (two players with no real injury history), why should the Sox have gone out and given multiple years to two players with annual injury problems?

 

The Sox only missed the playoffs last year by 8 games. How much could they have knocked off of that if they weren’t limited to 236 IP combined from Eovaldi and Wacha?

 

you make good points about Nate and Wacha but this is inconsistent with his signing of Paxton. who he paid $6 million to pitch 0 innings last year.

[notin]

you make good points about Nate and Wacha but this is inconsistent with his signing of Paxton. who he paid $6 million to pitch 0 innings last year.

 

Exactly.

 

And frankly, I would like less of these types of signings…

[Randy Red Sox]

ok so I will answer directly. first off I never said we should have signed either of those guys but I was 100 % against the signing of Kluber from day 1 and given hindsight I would have resigned either of those 2 over Kluber. it is obvious you are a Bloom fan but I ask you how many more last place AL East finishes do we need to endure before the Bloom PLAN actually comes to fruition? How many more 1-2 year contracts does he need to bring in before this team can TRULY contend for a WS--NOT JUST A PLAYOFF SPOT??

You avoided the question and just named other injured players Bloom signed, none of whom received multiyear deals.

 

Three parter:

 

1. Are Wacha and Eovaldi injury-prone pitchers throughout their careers?

2. Will this situation get better or worse as they age?

3. So what did either do recently to merit a multiyear deal? Kluber getting a one year deal over them was a case of guessing wrong, but not a reason to sign either for multiple years.

 

(Apparently FYI the buzz is the Sox offered Eovaldi more money than Texas, but Eovaldi chose Texas anyway. I assume the Sox offer was for more guaranteed money, but and Rivaldi bet on himself reaching the bonuses, but this is just a theory.)

[moonslav59]

ok so I will answer directly. first off I never said we should have signed either of those guys but I was 100 % against the signing of Kluber from day 1 and given hindsight I would have resigned either of those 2 over Kluber. it is obvious you are a Bloom fan but I ask you how many more last place AL East finishes do we need to endure before the Bloom PLAN actually comes to fruition? How many more 1-2 year contracts does he need to bring in before this team can TRULY contend for a WS--NOT JUST A PLAYOFF SPOT??

 

As many as the budget set by JH allows, IMO.

 

If you need to add a ton of depth, there is not many other options on a fixed budget.

[Bellhorn04]

As many as the budget set by JH allows, IMO.

 

If you need to add a ton of depth, there is not many other options on a fixed budget.

 

Even if true, Bloom could have signed pitchers instead of Story and Yoshida.

[notin]

ok so I will answer directly. first off I never said we should have signed either of those guys but I was 100 % against the signing of Kluber from day 1 and given hindsight I would have resigned either of those 2 over Kluber. it is obvious you are a Bloom fan but I ask you how many more last place AL East finishes do we need to endure before the Bloom PLAN actually comes to fruition? How many more 1-2 year contracts does he need to bring in before this team can TRULY contend for a WS--NOT JUST A PLAYOFF SPOT??

 

I didn’t mind Kluber. He was a 3.0 fWAR pitcher last year; in that respect, or outpitched both Eovaldi and Wacha combined.

 

And I hope the Sox NEVER sign a free agent pitcher to a deal longer than three years…

[Bellhorn04]

I didn’t mind Kluber. He was a 3.0 fWAR pitcher last year; in that respect, or outpitched both Eovaldi and Wacha combined.

 

Only if you think fWAR is the true measure of performance, which is highly debatable.

 

Kluber's bWAR was 0.8.

[Bellhorn04]

The Kluber signing wouldn't piss me off as much if Bloom didn't say he was going to acquire a pitcher with "upside". Makes him look like a flat-out liar/politician.

 

I think he whiffed on his real targets such as Eflin, and ended up settling for Kluber.

 

It didn't work out.

[Old Red]

Wow what a road trip! The Red Sox could only split with a watered down Twins team, and only took 1 of 3 from a watered down White Sox team. Maybe, because the Red Sox are just a watered down team themselves, and in a watered down league are in their regular claimed spot of last place in the Div, and out of the post season AGAIN. Year 4 of the Bloom, GLOOM, and DOOM regime, and last week in a game against the Twins the Red Sox couldn’t even beat the Felger, and Mass show going head to head in the 25-54 male TV audience. As a matter of fact not only did F&M double their audience, but 6 other shows beat the Red Sox as well. This team has become a second rate organization from the way they are shown on NESN to the production on the field. To some like me the sky has been falling since the day Bloom was hired, but to the old small contingent of Bloom supporters on here, and nowhere else Bloom has the team going in the right direction. Sad, but true. Playoffs? Did someone say playoffs??

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The Kluber signing wouldn't piss me off as much if Bloom didn't say he was going to acquire a pitcher with "upside". Makes him look like a flat-out liar/politician.

 

I think he whiffed on his real targets such as Eflin, and ended up settling for Kluber.

 

It didn't work out.

 

The pattern hasn't changed with Bloom's rotation acquisitions: old, rehabbing, past-their-prime, liable-to-breakdown at-any-time starting pitchers.

 

It was no surprise when Hill and Wacha spent time on the IL last year, or when Kluber and now Paxton are having issues this year. And not one single Red Sox fan expected Sale to stay healthy all season (ya, I know he was signed by DD, but Bloom chose to pretend he'd front the staff this year).

 

We've beaten this path aplenty here, but this is the Fire Bloom thread - and I have no problem reposting and rehashing until we can mercifully close this thread once and for all...

 

... because it turns my stomach envisioning the next over-30 veteran starters that Bloom will sign next winter -- for just one year -- to slog through one more season in suckitude. Ya, Chaim, we "know what's coming."

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

And any team that was sincerely "all-in, trying to win the World Series absolutely" Sam Kennedy -- would look to use a few vaunted prospects to swing a trade or two for young, up-and-coming pitchers with actual upside.

 

That's what clubs do when trying to legitimately contend and build for the future at the same time. You have to give up something of actual value to get something of actual value...

 

You can't just keep putting bandaids on wounds that need stitches, because when bandaids inevitably get wet, they're going to just keep falling off.

[Old Red]

The pattern hasn't changed with Bloom's rotation acquisitions: old, rehabbing, past-their-prime, liable-to-breakdown at-any-time starting pitchers.

 

It was no surprise when Hill and Wacha spent time on the IL last year, or when Kluber and now Paxton are having issues this year. And not one single Red Sox fan expected Sale to stay healthy all season (ya, I know he was signed by DD, but Bloom chose to pretend he'd front the staff this year).

 

We've beaten this path aplenty here, but this is the Fire Bloom thread - and I have no problem reposting and rehashing until we can mercifully close this thread once and for all...

 

... because it turns my stomach envisioning the next over-30 veteran starters that Bloom will sign next winter -- for just one year -- to slog through one more season in suckitude. Ya, Chaim, we "know what's coming."

Just the sight of seeing Bloom’s face turns my stomach, and him trying to talk over the crowd at the meet, and greet last offseason shows what an ass clown he really is. He is good at picking up trash in the stands though, so at least that’s one good thing about him, because he’s definitely not Awesome, and neither is the team.

[notin]

Only if you think fWAR is the true measure of performance, which is highly debatable.

 

Kluber's bWAR was 0.8.

 

Are we revisiting which one works better in hindsight?

[notin]

The Kluber signing wouldn't piss me off as much if Bloom didn't say he was going to acquire a pitcher with "upside". Makes him look like a flat-out liar/politician.

 

I think he whiffed on his real targets such as Eflin, and ended up settling for Kluber.

 

It didn't work out.

 

The whole “upside” thing is bothering you? Seriously?

 

I think every free agent ever was signed based on “upside”. Did you expect him (or any GM ever) to suggest they were going to sign a pitcher based on “downside”?

[Bellhorn04]

Are we revisiting which one works better in hindsight?

 

Not me. I've commented on the discrepancies between the two many times. I've pointed out the classic example of Rick Porcello's nice-looking 2020 fWAR many times.

[Bellhorn04]

The whole “upside” thing is bothering you? Seriously?

 

I think every free agent ever was signed based on “upside”. Did you expect him (or any GM ever) to suggest they were going to sign a pitcher based on “downside”?

 

Bloom is actually the only one I've heard say it. No idea why he said it, really, but it did sound very promising at the time. It didn't sound like Corey Kluber.

 

Also, you keep bringing up Eovaldi's 407 innings over the last 4 seasons (actually 3.4 seasons because of COVID), but for some reason you leave out that Kluber pitched only 280 innings over the same time.

[notin]

Bloom is actually the only one I've heard say it. No idea why he said it, really, but it did sound very promising at the time. It didn't sound like Corey Kluber.

 

Also, you keep bringing up Eovaldi's 407 innings over the last 4 seasons (actually 3.4 seasons because of COVID), but for some reason you leave out that Kluber pitched only 280 innings over the same time.

 

I’ve often mentioned his low total is influenced by 2020. But I also have REPEATEDLY emphasized the multiple years. Kluber signed a one year deal; if he sucks or gets hurt, he isn’t dragging this team down even next season. Did Eovaldi carry that same mitigation of risk?

[notin]

Not me. I've commented on the discrepancies between the two many times. I've pointed out the classic example of Rick Porcello's nice-looking 2020 fWAR many times.

 

If you like bWAR as an evaluation tool, you probably shouldn’t be so wild about Wacha, who totaled 1.9 bWAR from 2016 through 2021. 2022 was a clear outlier…

[Bellhorn04]

If you like bWAR as an evaluation tool, you probably shouldn’t be so wild about Wacha, who totaled 1.9 bWAR from 2016 through 2021. 2022 was a clear outlier…

 

Well, Bloom must have liked something in how Wacha pitched in 2021...