Red Sox's Trade Deadline Wishlist Following Curtis Mead Blockbuster

[moonslav59]

1 minute ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Maybe not as much as we expect.

They're both very large strong humans: 6 foot 6, between 230-250 pounds. There is a chance "smaller" pitchers like Suarez and Early pull muscles because they have to generate more force from their bodies in their own deliveries.

I have no evidence to prove the notion, but there is at least a possibility that dimensions -- however inflated in PR guides -- could affect longevity. 

I'm not one to suggest  we experiment on these two big guys.

[Hugh2]

40 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

So we trade for an SP, and keep him in the BP until someone goes down?  Like Moon said, maybe demote Tolle for 15 days and maybe do two 3-inning stints just to keep sharp, and then do the same with Bennett.

Maybe I'm just being superstitious and hate to mess with what's working.

Maybe? or you roll with a 6 man rotation.  Not for the whole season but teams employ that over a 1-2 month stretch much much more often than I realized until I looked into it.  It makes sense. 

I mean if you're superstitious, wouldn't you be concerned with another Sox pitcher going down? pitchers go down like flies nowadays and we've ran through all our depth. 

We could also (or in addition to a starter) pick up another guy who has options who can go up/down. 

[mvp 78]

15 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Maybe not as much as we expect.

They're both very large strong humans: 6 foot 6, between 230-250 pounds. There is a chance "smaller" pitchers like Suarez and Early pull muscles because they have to generate more force from their bodies in their own deliveries.

I have no evidence to prove the notion, but there is at least a possibility that dimensions -- however inflated in PR guides -- could affect longevity. 

How'd that work for 6'6" 245 lb Garrett Crochet? 

[mvp 78]

RP is always on the wish list, but the backend of the bullpen has been doing their part lately.

 

[Hugh2]

8 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Maybe not as much as we expect.

They're both very large strong humans: 6 foot 6, between 230-250 pounds. There is a chance "smaller" pitchers like Suarez and Early pull muscles because they have to generate more force from their bodies in their own deliveries.

I have no evidence to prove the notion, but there is at least a possibility that dimensions -- however inflated in PR guides -- could affect longevity. 

I mean, we've been witnessing this for a few years now, especially in the modern game where pitchers pitch harder than they ever have. 

It's not just the risk of fatigue but how will that effect them the following season? Is Crochetts injury related to such? He went from 24 innings to 146 innings to 200 innings and now he's going to miss most of this year. 

Actually the more I research this the more confusing it becomes.  There actually isn't any real hard evidence to support this.  However, teams obviously really care about workload, I think there is more evidence that guys get fatigued.  I still, even with lack of evidence of the correlation of injury and increased workload, believe starting pitching should be a priority.  Because all our depth is gone.  It's just gone.  Right now our next starters up are. 

Bello/Wehunt and that's it.  The next two guys in WOO are Raymond Burgos and Michael Sansone who would need to be added to the 40 man.  

[Hugh2]

6 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

RP is always on the wish list, but the backend of the bullpen has been doing their part lately.

 

The whole bullpen has been much better than I thought they were ealier this year. 

With Slaten stepping it up the Slaten/Whitlock/CHapman back end has been nails. 

Tyron Guerrero has been good, Weissert and Watson have looked better recently as well. Not great but fine for 6th inning guys and Jovani Moran has been really good lately. 

I'm sure they could still use a depth arm, or some talent with options.  

[moonslav59]

5 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

I mean, we've been witnessing this for a few years now, especially in the modern game where pitchers pitch harder than they ever have. 

It's not just the risk of fatigue but how will that effect them the following season? Is Crochetts injury related to such? He went from 24 innings to 146 innings to 200 innings and now he's going to miss most of this year. 

Actually the more I research this the more confusing it becomes.  There actually isn't any real hard evidence to support this.  However, teams obviously really care about workload, I think there is more evidence that guys get fatigued.  I still, even with lack of evidence of the correlation of injury and increased workload, believe starting pitching should be a priority.  Because all our depth is gone.  It's just gone.  Right now our next starters up are. 

Bello/Wehunt and that's it.  The next two guys in WOO are Raymond Burgos and Michael Sansone who would need to be added to the 40 man.  

Great post.

Our real SP'er depth is the IL. No way we hand the ball to Wehunt, Burgos or Sansone for a big game.

No SP'er on the IL looks close to a return. None are even rehabbing in actual games. While our 4 man rotation on the 60 Day IL might be a top 10 rotation in MLB, what good is it, if none return?

60 Day: Crochet, Houck, Crawford & Oviedo

Ideally, we could count on Bello as the 6th starter, and using an opener followed by 5 IP from Bello essentially eats the same IP as a starter, but I'm not comfortable entering the final two months with nothing beyond Bello and Sandoval as the #5.

Add to that the IP limits on Tolle & Bennett, and adding a pitcher seems like a no-brainer.

[moonslav59]

On the pen being better than expected. This seems to have happened for 3-4 years in a row. Maybe we need to give some credit to Sox management for achieving this so often. It can't be a fluke.

I remember when we signed Chapman: many felt he was a good back-up closer or good set-up man. Many worried about Whitlock being ruined by the starter experiment. Slaten was rather unknown. Weissert was ridiculed. We patched the rest of the pen with guys like Bernardino, Wilson, Murphy and Kelly.

Brez was grateful to Bloom for handing him Jansen and Martin, but both slipped a little in 2024. Guys like Weissert & Slaten led the team in RP IP and did well. Bernardino & Booser did well, but others like Wink, Chase Anderson, Keller and Horn not so well.

fWAR pen rankings:

3rd 2026

2nd 2025

16th 2024

13th 2023 (Bloom)

4th since Brez took over ('24-'26)

From '25-'26:

2nd in fWAR

1st in ERA-

1st in ERA, WHIP & FIP

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

24 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

I mean, we've been witnessing this for a few years now, especially in the modern game where pitchers pitch harder than they ever have. 

It's not just the risk of fatigue but how will that effect them the following season? Is Crochetts injury related to such? He went from 24 innings to 146 innings to 200 innings and now he's going to miss most of this year. 

Actually the more I research this the more confusing it becomes.  There actually isn't any real hard evidence to support this.   

... to support anything. Nobody knows anything because everyone is different. Oviedo's been out all year with a sore elbow. He's a giant but didn't throw a million pitches last year because he was returning from missing his first entire season in 2024.

Derek Lowe, a big guy, and Pedro Martinez, not so big, left Boston via free agency after '04. DLowe wound up throwing three times as many more innings the rest of his career than Pedro.

Dwight Gooden was tall and slim for his day when he was an instant star at 19 and pitched over 200 innings while leading the league in strikeouts. The Mets protected him so much the next season they let him lead the NL in IP with 276 and win the Cy Young. 

Gooden would average over 200 IP through the first decade of his career and miss more time because of drug addiction than overuse.

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Giving them a 2-3 start total rest may work better, but they could get rusty.

That's my concern.  I kind of think pitchers are more creatures of habit and routine than most, and don't want them to lose their rhythm.  I can defer to Breslow and Baily on the psychology.

[moonslav59]

Just now, JoeBrady said:

That's my concern.  I kind of think pitchers are more creatures of habit and routine than most, and don't want them to lose their rhythm.  I can defer to Breslow and Baily on the psychology.

I'm more worried about these two young pitchers running out of steam just as we make the playoffs than needing a start or two to get over rustiness.

Of course, making the playoffs is no given, so resting these guys hurt those chances, but adding a capable innings eater helps mitigate that loss (on paper.)

[Hugh2]

22 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

... to support anything. Nobody knows anything because everyone is different. Oviedo's been out all year with a sore elbow. He's a giant but didn't throw a million pitches last year because he was returning from missing his first entire season in 2024.

Derek Lowe, a big guy, and Pedro Martinez, not so big, left Boston via free agency after '04. DLowe wound up throwing three times as many more innings the rest of his career than Pedro.

Dwight Gooden was tall and slim for his day when he was an instant star at 19 and pitched over 200 innings while leading the league in strikeouts. The Mets protected him so much the next season they let him lead the NL in IP with 276 and win the Cy Young. 

Gooden would average over 200 IP through the first decade of his career and miss more time because of drug addiction than overuse.

I still want to buy pitching.  Also, even if there was a strong correlation between workload increase and injuries that wouldn't mean that injuries wouldn't exist in the absence.  Theres' more than one way to skin a cat, it's also true that there are more ways for something to go wrong. 

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

I still want to buy pitching.  Also, even if there was a strong correlation between workload increase and injuries that wouldn't mean that injuries wouldn't exist in the absence.  Theres' more than one way to skin a cat, it's also true that there are more ways for something to go wrong. 

If the worst thing that happens is we have to demote Moran, Guerrero or give Watson back, it would  be because someone else is better.

What's the chance we finish 2026 with no more pitchers going on the IL?

While I really like our current 13, number 14, 15 and 16 scare me.

14 Rivera

15 Gamboa

16 Samaniego

17 Uberstine

IL pitcher La Sorsa is the only one not on the 60 IL

Non 40: Wehunt, Burgos, Sansone, Bastardo, Holobetz, Paez, Mullins, Eyanson

[JoeBrady]

12 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

If the worst thing that happens is we have to demote Moran, Guerrero or give Watson back, it would  be because someone else is better.

How many available RPs are pitching better than those 3 right now (over the past 28 days, 1.74, 0.96, and 2.70)?  I know these are small samples for guys with limited experience, but in a world of limited resources, I am not inclined to improve our BP.

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

How many available RPs are pitching better than those 3 right now (over the past 28 days, 1.74, 0.96, and 2.70)?  I know these are small samples for guys with limited experience, but in a world of limited resources, I am not inclined to improve our BP.

Id rather we add a SP to force a demotion of one of those 3, and I really dont think any of them deserve a emotion, but someone will get hurt, and if we have to do it, it would only be because the guy we added is better, equal or can pitch more IP as a starter.

To me, having a solid 13 is great, but #14-16 scare me bigtime. We've already used 25 pitchers, which is nearly double 13. We've used 21 pitchers for 9 or more IP. 18 pitchers have 14+ IP and Sandoval is the guy with 14. He's projected to reach 50+. Guerrero is at 24 and could reach 40-50.

Add a SP'er and find a way to make it work. If a really good pitcher has to be demoted for a few days, so be it.

[Hugh2]

36 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

If the worst thing that happens is we have to demote Moran, Guerrero or give Watson back, it would  be because someone else is better.

What's the chance we finish 2026 with no more pitchers going on the IL?

While I really like our current 13, number 14, 15 and 16 scare me.

14 Rivera

15 Gamboa

16 Samaniego

17 Uberstine

IL pitcher La Sorsa is the only one not on the 60 IL

Non 40: Wehunt, Burgos, Sansone, Bastardo, Holobetz, Paez, Mullins, Eyanson

Anyone who is willing to bet we have zero injuries on the pitching side thru seasons end has some serious balls. 

[mvp 78]

10 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Anyone who is willing to bet we have zero injuries on the pitching side thru seasons end has some serious balls. 

There were a lot of injuries in the first half. Maybe the bad luck is just out of the way? 

[Hugh2]

15 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

There were a lot of injuries in the first half. Maybe the bad luck is just out of the way? 

Oh, I'm certain it is, but that doesn't mean an injury can't strike.  

Regardless, there's a difference between being hopeful about a clean bill of health than not being prepared for it.  The pitching could use help, doesn't have to be high end it can be more depth but at the very least we need depth.

[notin]

1 hour ago, Hugh2 said:

I still want to buy pitching.  Also, even if there was a strong correlation between workload increase and injuries that wouldn't mean that injuries wouldn't exist in the absence.  Theres' more than one way to skin a cat, it's also true that there are more ways for something to go wrong. 

How many ways do we need to skin a cat? And why is anyone doing this at all?

[mvp 78]

12 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Oh, I'm certain it is, but that doesn't mean an injury can't strike.  

Regardless, there's a difference between being hopeful about a clean bill of health than not being prepared for it.  The pitching could use help, doesn't have to be high end it can be more depth but at the very least we need depth.

Yeah, I don't think they want to call upon Uberstine as he's not stretched out. Wehunt really shouldn't be called up yet. Any help has to come from outside the org once you get beyond plugging Bello back into the rotation. 

I wonder what is going on with Mullins this year? I thought he would be in line to help out by the end of this season at least for bulk relief innings. 

[mvp 78]

10 minutes ago, notin said:

How many ways do we need to skin a cat? And why is anyone doing this at all?

Please, don't skin cats. It's gross enough when the leopard gecko starts molting...

[Hugh2]

24 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Yeah, I don't think they want to call upon Uberstine as he's not stretched out. Wehunt really shouldn't be called up yet. Any help has to come from outside the org once you get beyond plugging Bello back into the rotation. 

I wonder what is going on with Mullins this year? I thought he would be in line to help out by the end of this season at least for bulk relief innings. 

I don't think his 5.21 ERA in Portland is inspiring too many folks about him performing any better up two levels in the bigs.  He also walks a lot of guys.  Love the K rate though, he could be more in a relief role.  But like.......they're still starting him. 

[moonslav59]

3 hours ago, Hugh2 said:

Anyone who is willing to bet we have zero injuries on the pitching side thru seasons end has some serious balls. 

Exactly, and looking at our #14-16 pitchers left on the already depleted depth chart should be enough to scare anyone into putting pitching as a high need on the deadline add list.

[southpaw777]

Nationals get

Franklin Arias

Jake Bennett

Justin Gonzalez

Marcus Phillips

2x lower level players

 

RED SOX get

CJ Abram’s

Foster Griffin

it’s at least a good starting point

Washington gets a haul (including Bennett back, looking much better at the MLb level) and the Sox get a rental for the stretch and their SS for the next few years and hopefully lock up long term.

 

 

[SoxPhan]

3 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Id rather we add a SP to force a demotion of one of those 3, and I really dont think any of them deserve a emotion, but someone will get hurt, and if we have to do it, it would only be because the guy we added is better, equal or can pitch more IP as a starter.

 

I'd second that demotion.. 

[notin]

5 minutes ago, southpaw777 said:

Nationals get

Franklin Arias

Jake Bennett

Justin Gonzalez

Marcus Phillips

2x lower level players

 

RED SOX get

CJ Abram’s

Foster Griffin

it’s at least a good starting point

Washington gets a haul and the Sox get a rental for the stretch and their SS for the next few years and hopefully lock up long term.

 

 

Swapping out Bennett for Griffin?  Hard pass…

[southpaw777]

14 minutes ago, notin said:

Swapping out Bennett for Griffin?  Hard pass…

Hard pass? Why?

Bennet will not be available for the playoffs and probably September anyways with his IP limits. We get a rental who’s as good this year as Bennett is, for down the stretch that doesn’t have an IP limit…I’m sure we can get another starter this offseason. 
if you want Abram’s we’re going to have to get uncomfortable. But he’s a proven stud at SS for the long term. If they’ll take Eyanson instead or Eyanson and say Valera, I’d do that too…

like I said…it’s a good starting point. I want to win this year. If Bennett or any other pitcher not named Tolle will make it happen, then I’d do it.

id extend the kid for 10/350 to start…

[JoeBrady]

3 hours ago, notin said:

How many ways do we need to skin a cat? And why is anyone doing this at all?

You can only plan for so many contingencies.  We can argue in favor of a RH RF, SS, another RP, or another SP.  But we're lucky if we get one.

[moonslav59]

25 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

You can only plan for so many contingencies.  We can argue in favor of a RH RF, SS, another RP, or another SP.  But we're lucky if we get one.

RH'd RF'er?

Abreu is killing lefties.