The 2021-2022 Offseason Thread

[a700hitter]

In the infield, I would pencil in Dalbec at 1B full time. I’d get a LHH backup. I would look to upgrade at 2B. Arroyo is not the full time answer, but I like him coming off the bench. Kike is the best fielding CFer, so leave him there. Dugo can’t handle CF full time.

 

Schwarber should be signed to play LF and DH with JD. Dugo slides to RF and I would keep Renfroe to play against lefties and as the 4 th OFer.

 

Pitching:

 

1. Sale

2. Eovaldi

3. Houck (hopefully he can handle the workload for at least 160 innings)

4. ERod (no QO but I would look to sign him for 4 years for reasonable money)

5. Pivetta

 

 

Bullpen:

 

Whitlock

Barnes

And a lot of work for Bloom to do. He needs to do a much better job than he has done in this regard. I agree with the notion that bullpen pitchers are not a crapshoot. Crapshoot pitchers are in the bullpen. There are solid consistent bullpen guys. Bloom needs to get some. Robles is not the answer, not is Brasier.

[notin]

So, 2 SP'ers (FA, QO or trade), Schwarber and a trade for RP'er, maybe involving Duran and DHern. Sounds plausible.

 

Duran for Civale.

 

DHernandez for Trivino

 

Bring back ERod and Schwarber and maybe even Robles.

 

And finally, purchase new paint for the duck boats!!!

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I suppose it also depends how particular he is. I remember an old SI story about how Jerry Rice would try in multiple jerseys before every game to find one that just felt right. Maybe that plastic fixture in his glove just threw Barnes off his game somewhat. A lot of athletes are very particular...

 

I played with a pitcher who dislocated the index finger on his pitching hand. He had to wear a metal splint and doctors told him to give it three weeks to heal. He couldn't wait that long... but man, did that splint make his pitches move. After he removed it, his stuff was never as good.

[notin]

In the infield, I would pencil in Dalbec at 1B full time. I’d get a LHH backup. I would look to upgrade at 2B. Arroyo is not the full time answer, but I like him coming off the bench. Kike is the best fielding CFer, so leave him there. Dugo can’t handle CF full time.

 

Schwarber should be signed to play LF and DH with JD. Dugo slides to RF and I would keep Renfroe to play against lefties and as the 4 th OFer.

 

Pitching:

 

1. Sale

2. Eovaldi

3. Houck (hopefully he can handle the workload for at least 160 innings)

4. ERod (no QO but I would look to sign him for 4 years for reasonable money)

5. Pivetta

 

 

Bullpen:

 

Whitlock

Barnes

And a lot of work for Bloom to do. He needs to do a much better job than he has done in this regard. I agree with the notion that bullpen pitchers are not a crapshoot. Crapshoot pitchers are in the bullpen. There are solid consistent bullpen guys. Bloom needs to get some. Robles is not the answer, not is Brasier.

 

Did a700 just quote me?

[notin]

I played with a pitcher who dislocated the index finger on his pitching hand. He had to wear a metal splint and doctors told him to give it three weeks to heal. He couldn't wait that long... but man, did that splint make his pitches move. After he removed it, his stuff was never as good.

 

That's because he coated the splint with vaseline. Oldest trick in the book..

[mvp 78]

The Notin Plan

 

1B: Dalbec. And eventually Casas is he makes a case for himself, which he is very capable of doing.

2B: Kike Hernandez. CF defense will suffer, but 2B defense will improve

3B: Devers

SS: Bogaerts. Opt out is a concern, but after the Great Shortstop Re-Shuffling of 2021, Boston might still be his ideal landing spot anyway.

LF: Schwarber: He won't exercise his part of the mutual option, but he can still come back

CF: Verdugo: Not my favorite for CF, but if Kike plays 2B, he is the Last Man Standing for the job

RF: Renfroe

DH: Martinez. I know there is a chance he opts out, but for now I will assume he doesn't.

 

BN: Plawecki, Arroyo, OF capable of CF (Jeisson Rosario? FA?)

 

SP: Sale, Eovaldi, Pivetta, and 2 acquistions that can include ERod either via QO or extension.

 

BP: Houck, Whitlock, Barnes, Brasier, Taylor, Sawamura, Valdez, Davis, DHernandez

 

Darwinzon and Duran might be adequate trade bait to fill a pitching role or two. I know Oakland will be trying to move a bunch of arbitration eligibles, although Sean Manaea and Chris Bassitt each have one year. Montas has two, but Duran probably isn't an attractive enough piece to get him. Pitchers with roughly the same BTV value as Duran include Sonny Gray (Cincinnati), Casey Mize (Detroit), Kyle Muller (Atlanta), Chris Flexen (Seattle), Joe Musgrove (San Diego), and Cal Quantrill and Aaron Civale (Cleveland).

 

I don't see Detroit moving Casey Mize here. Atlanta, San Diego and Seattle are both largely all set with young outfield talent either in MLB already or beating down the door. That leaves Cincinnati (30th in fWAR for CF last year, but is Duran the solution?) and Cleveland. Per Roster Resource, the Cleveland 2022 OF features Harold Ramirez, Myles Straw and a Bradley Zimmer/Oscar Mercado platoon. Very, very weak. Now they are far more likely to move around the middle infield depth problem to solve the OF as opposed to dealing Civale or McKenzie, but it's not the most ridiculous solution, either. And clearly BTV would call it fair, not that theyare the end-all of trade value. But they do better than I could on my own.

 

And at the very least, arbitration eligible closer Lou Trivino (Oakland) needs to be on the radar in another potential deal. His BTV trade value is actually very low, at a surplus of $1.1 million. So either he is undervalued or is expected to get a substantial raise from last years's $912,000 salary...

 

Rosario is nowhere close to being MLB ready. He's more likely to be DFA'd this offseason.

 

I would trade Duran for Quantril.

[mvp 78]

Nope. I don't have to. He's really good anywhere.

 

Anyway, that only matters if they bring back Schwarber...

 

He was a -4 Outs Above Average at 2b. Arroyo was a 1.

[a700hitter]

Did a700 just quote me?

Yes. It is a very profound thought.

[notin]

Rosario is nowhere close to being MLB ready. He's more likely to be DFA'd this offseason.

 

I would trade Duran for Quantril.

 

I figure Rosario's ceiling is 4th outfielder anyway. He's here. He's cheap. He can field.

 

Duran (surplus value 23.5) for Quantrill (surplus value 25.1) also works out per the model at BTV. But if I was Cleveland, Quantrill would be my least available of the three. I would suspect McKenzie is the most available, assuming in reality any of them are available at all...

[moonslav59]

I've always wanted Kike in CF. It's too bad he dropped that fly ball the day I called him the best defensive CF I've seen for the Sox.

 

He's also very good at 2B, and counting on Arroyo to play just 81 games might be too much to ask, so I guess Kike at 2B is a consideration.

 

I'm not sure Verdugo and Renfroe would be happy about a RF platoon, but if Schwarber plays some 1B (vs maybe half the RHPs), and Verdugo plays some CF when Kike plays 2B, maybe the two would get enough playing time to keep everyone happy.

Out of every 10 games

LF: 7 Schwarber/ 3 Verdugo

CF: 6 Kike/ 4 Verdugo

RF: 8-9 Renfroe/ 1-2 Verdugo

1B: 7 Dalbec/ 3 Schwarber

2B: 6 Arroyo/ 4 Kike

If Schwarber DHs 1 out of 10 games, then Renfroe & Verdugo can each play 9 of 10.

 

[notin]

Yes. It is a very profound thought.

 

I do that once in a while. Usually by accident...

[moonslav59]

I figure Rosario's ceiling is 4th outfielder anyway. He's here. He's cheap. He can field.

 

Duran (surplus value 23.5) for Quantrill (surplus value 25.1) also works out per the model at BTV. But if I was Cleveland, Quantrill would be my least available of the three. I would suspect McKenzie is the most available, assuming in reality any of them are available at all...

 

I doubt other GMs value Duran that highly, but who knows?

 

I hope we don't make a trade for a 1 year pitcher. I know Montas has 2, but I'm not sure about the others you mentioned.

[moonslav59]

Rosario is nowhere close to being MLB ready. He's more likely to be DFA'd this offseason.

 

I would trade Duran for Quantril.

 

I could see Rosario and Potts being DFA'd to make room for Rule 5 protectees and FAs, but Rosario could make a nice defensive 4th OF'er. Something we need more than an offensive one.

[mvp 78]

I could see Rosario and Potts being DFA'd to make room for Rule 5 protectees and FAs, but Rosario could make a nice defensive 4th OF'er. Something we need more than an offensive one.

 

A 4th OFer with a 642 OPS in AA... I think Bloom could do better than that.

[mvp 78]

I figure Rosario's ceiling is 4th outfielder anyway. He's here. He's cheap. He can field.

 

Duran (surplus value 23.5) for Quantrill (surplus value 25.1) also works out per the model at BTV. But if I was Cleveland, Quantrill would be my least available of the three. I would suspect McKenzie is the most available, assuming in reality any of them are available at all...

 

But I like Quantril tho.

[moonslav59]

A 4th OFer with a 642 OPS in AA... I think Bloom could do better than that.

 

Meh. Our 4th OF'er should only be used on defense.

 

Look what Cordero, Santana and Duran did for us in the OF- not to mention Marwin.

 

Keep Bloom away from signing our 4th OF'er.

[mvp 78]

Meh. Our 4th OF'er should only be used on defense.

 

Look what Cordero, Santana and Duran did for us in the OF- not to mention Marwin.

 

Keep Bloom away from signing our 4th OF'er.

 

Don't believe in platoon splits or off days?

[notin]

Don't believe in platoon splits or off days?

 

Nope. Next question...

[moonslav59]

Don't believe in platoon splits or off days?

 

I was going on the assumption we bring Schwarber back and JD plays some OF at NL parks. Our 4th OF'er should never start a game.

[mvp 78]

I was going on the assumption we bring Schwarber back and JD plays some OF at NL parks. Our 4th OF'er should never start a game.

 

Wouldn't JD/Schwarber be the 4th OFer then?

[moonslav59]

Wouldn't JD/Schwarber be the 4th OFer then?

 

...and that's why we need a defensive 4B Of'er.

 

JD plays DH, except in NL parks.

Schwarber plays some 1B and DH, when JD rests.

When either is in the OF, we could use a late inning defensive replacement.

 

I admit, a roster spot might be better used elsewhere, but I'd rather have a defensive 4/5th OF'er than an offensive one. That's my point.

[Nick]

I've always wanted Kike in CF. It's too bad he dropped that fly ball the day I called him the best defensive CF I've seen for the Sox.

 

He's also very good at 2B, and counting on Arroyo to play just 81 games might be too much to ask, so I guess Kike at 2B is a consideration.

 

I'm not sure Verdugo and Renfroe would be happy about a RF platoon, but if Schwarber plays some 1B (vs maybe half the RHPs), and Verdugo plays some CF when Kike plays 2B, maybe the two would get enough playing time to keep everyone happy.

Out of every 10 games

LF: 7 Schwarber/ 3 Verdugo

CF: 6 Kike/ 4 Verdugo

RF: 8-9 Renfroe/ 1-2 Verdugo

1B: 7 Dalbec/ 3 Schwarber

2B: 6 Arroyo/ 4 Kike

If Schwarber DHs 1 out of 10 games, then Renfroe & Verdugo can each play 9 of 10.

 

 

Games Played

 

148 JD

146 Verdugo

144 Renfroe

134 Kike

133 Dalbec

 

Assuming 10% is 16 games, basically they all played 9 out of 10 games. Distributing playing time is not a problem.

[notin]

Wouldn't JD/Schwarber be the 4th OFer then?

 

If Kike plays 2B, then Arroyo effectively becomes the 4th OF...

[mvp 78]

If Kike plays 2B, then Arroyo effectively becomes the 4th OF...

 

Put him at 1b in ST and we won't have to worry about where he plays all year.

[mvp 78]

@alexspeier

Red Sox won't bring back 1B coach Tom Goodwin, says Bloom. Sox intend to bring back rest of the staff.

 

Goodwin was notably not able to coach first base for Boston during the playoffs as he was not vaccinated. Quality control coach Ramón Vázquez took over those duties for the postseason. Bloom made sure to clarify in the press conference that Goodwin’s vaccination status did not play into the decision.

[Nick]

@alexspeier

Red Sox won't bring back 1B coach Tom Goodwin, says Bloom. Sox intend to bring back rest of the staff.

 

Goodwin was notably not able to coach first base for Boston during the playoffs as he was not vaccinated. Quality control coach Ramón Vázquez took over those duties for the postseason. Bloom made sure to clarify in the press conference that Goodwin’s vaccination status did not play into the decision.

 

sure it didn't...probably fired for letting Vaz steal 2B all the time...

[mvp 78]

sure it didn't...probably fired for letting Vaz steal 2B all the time...

 

He was saying "NO" not "GO."

[Nick]

Will they move the World Series games out of Atlanta?

[Old Red]

I've always wanted Kike in CF. It's too bad he dropped that fly ball the day I called him the best defensive CF I've seen for the Sox.

 

He's also very good at 2B, and counting on Arroyo to play just 81 games might be too much to ask, so I guess Kike at 2B is a consideration.

 

I'm not sure Verdugo and Renfroe would be happy about a RF platoon, but if Schwarber plays some 1B (vs maybe half the RHPs), and Verdugo plays some CF when Kike plays 2B, maybe the two would get enough playing time to keep everyone happy.

Out of every 10 games

LF: 7 Schwarber/ 3 Verdugo

CF: 6 Kike/ 4 Verdugo

RF: 8-9 Renfroe/ 1-2 Verdugo

1B: 7 Dalbec/ 3 Schwarber

2B: 6 Arroyo/ 4 Kike

If Schwarber DHs 1 out of 10 games, then Renfroe & Verdugo can each play 9 of 10.

 

 

Kike did a good job in CF, but I don’t think I would call him the best CF the Sox have ever had. Piersall,and Lynne were pretty good not to mention JBJ.

Edited October 25, 2021 by Old Red

[mvp 78]

@alexspeier

Bloom on catching situation and Vazquez: "You don't take it for granted when you have someone who's shown he can do it."

 

Huh?

 

I guess I need access to the stats Bloom has. This could also just be media speak.