Fire alex cora

[moonslav59]

If you want to do a straight-up comparison between Ben and DD, you have to include a comp of the team's record for their 4 years.

 

Ben - 1 title + 3 last place

DD - 1 title + 2 divisions + 1 3rd place

 

Oh, I agree.

 

I find myself defending Ben often, but I try to always point out that he made some major blunders. (I try to avoid blaming those on LL, except the Bobby V choice.)

 

I also think the way Ben left the farm is a major reason for DD's better record, and had Ben stayed, he'd have traded several prospects and had better success than those 4 years. A ring? Who knows? 3 division titles? Who knows?

 

I think they both did a good job. Ben did not inherit the greatest farm, but he had a solid core of young studs at relatively low costs. I think his budget was tighter, too. DD was given more of a free reign until summer 2019.

[notin]

For a long time, I expected Devers to end up at 1B. I'm not so sure anymore. If I was thinking of moving him, I'd feel him out, first. If it looks like it might bother him (and nothing seems to bother this kid) I might keep him at 3B. I wouldn't mess with the Devers Mojo.

 

notin's point about trading Dalbec makes sense, even though I really like the kid and think his bat will turn out better than Chavis (not saying much).

 

1Bmen are a dime a dozen, and hopefully we'll stop overpaying for mediocre 1Bmen FAs.

 

Dalbec at 2B doesn't excite me, either.

 

I do wonder what his trade value is. If we can't get much for him, I'd hold on and see what shakes out.

 

I remember Bogey looking better at SS his 3rd year, then taking a step back, so maybe the Devers to 1B idea is not decided, yet.

 

If Devers does move to 1b, one has to wonder what becomes of Chavis. Does he take over 2b? Move to LF or RF? Or CF, if he can handle it? Does he become a super sub, spelling others at 1b, 2b, 3b and corner OF? Or go to the minors?

 

Or does he become trade bait?

[notin]

In DD's defense, I think he actually tried. He didn't trade any major prospects in 2018 or 2019 (not that there was much left).

 

Was that because he was trying to rebuild the farm or because nobody would give up the player(s) DD was targeting for anyone in the Sox system?

[moonslav59]

If Devers does move to 1b, one has to wonder what becomes of Chavis. Does he take over 2b? Move to LF or RF? Or CF, if he can handle it? Does he become a super sub, spelling others at 1b, 2b, 3b and corner OF? Or go to the minors?

 

Or does he become trade bait?

 

I've never been high on Chavis. I don't think his bat is good enough for 1B or OF, and his defense has always been his weak spot (that and Ks).

 

I think his best shot is 2B and back up corner IF. Don't mess him up by making him learn OF.

 

I could see 1B: Devers, 2B: Chavis, 3B: Dalbec, SS: Bogey.

 

Maybe Devers plays 1B vs LHPs and 3B vs RHPs.

Edited October 9, 2019 by moonslav59

[moonslav59]

Was that because he was trying to rebuild the farm or because nobody would give up the player(s) DD was targeting for anyone in the Sox system?

 

Plus, many of our top farm prospects were injured or too far away from the bigs.

[notin]

I've never been high on Chavis. I don't think his bat is good enough for 1B or OF, and his defense has always been his weak spot (that and Ks).

 

I think his best shot is 2B and back up corner IF. Don't mess him up by making him learn OF.

 

I could see 1B: Devers, 2B: Chavis, 3B: Dalbec, SS: Bogey.

 

Maybe Devers plays 1B vs RHPs and 3B vs LHPs.

 

Please no platoons where players swap positions.

 

I could see Dalbec at 3b, Bogaerts at SS, and Devers at 1b, with Lin or Hernandez playing 2b and Chavis as the supersub at 1b, 2b and 3b. And he might even see time in LF or RF. The Sox are definitely going to need some minimum wage players on the 25 man roster, and hopefully none of them are named Ockimey or Travis...

[moonslav59]

Please no platoons where players swap positions.

 

I could see Dalbec at 3b, Bogaerts at SS, and Devers at 1b, with Lin or Hernandez playing 2b and Chavis as the supersub at 1b, 2b and 3b. And he might even see time in LF or RF. The Sox are definitely going to need some minimum wage players on the 25 man roster, and hopefully none of them are named Ockimey or Travis...

 

I'm not sure moving Devers is even being discussed, but the idea does have some merit.

 

It's probably more likely we trade Dalbec, keep Devers at 3B and just sign a super cheap 1Bman to bridge us to the next serious ring attempt.

 

I know Ockimey is a long shot, but he hits righties really well, and I'm done with Travis hopes.

[cp176]

You don't think Dalbec is blocked?

 

The Sox absoutly need to see what they can get for Dalbec. A big part of his value is the defensive play he brings to 3B. Unless the Sox are going to slide Devers over to 1B, what are they going to do with Dalbec? Put him at first base? It's a waste of his defense, a waste of his outstanding arm, and getting his bat into the lineup means the Sox are only trying to capitalize on the most questionable part of his game. The could try him at an entirely new position like RF or 2B, and maybe RF is a good idea, but only if they trade Betts.

 

Or they could let him rot in the minors while Devers puts up MVP numbers in Boston. It might be different if Devers was arb-eligible or 1 year from free agency, but the Sox are apparently looking to extend him, which puts Dalbec further into the hole.

 

Unless the Sox move Devers to 1b, which is possible, although I have no idea how likely it is...

 

I did not say that. he is absolutely blocked. If he is traded though, wait for the s*** storm. Another prospect traded away - my oh my.

[moonslav59]

I did not say that. he is absolutely blocked. If he is traded though, wait for the s*** storm. Another prospect traded away - my oh my.

 

LOL. Dalbec is not good enough for anyone to start a shitstorm over.

 

Also, two guys critical of trading too many prospects are suggesting trading Dalbec might be best.

 

[notin]

I did not say that. he is absolutely blocked. If he is traded though, wait for the s*** storm. Another prospect traded away - my oh my.

 

Well, if Dalbec is traded for a full price overpaid veteran, yes. That would be dumb (depending on who it is). But if he is dealt for an equally talented minimum wage player who happens to play a position the Sox need, it’s not a bad idea at all....

[notin]

LOL. Dalbec is not good enough for anyone to start a shitstorm over.

 

Also, two guys critical of trading too many prospects are suggesting trading Dalbec might be best.

 

 

Really one of two options.

 

1. Move Devers to 1b.

2. Trade Dalbec, preferably for a SP or outfielder.

 

Either work for me.

 

Much better than the “don’t trade him because he is a prospect. Make him waste away in Pawtucket instead” mentality.

 

It seems simple to me. Accommodate him or move him...

[moonslav59]

Really one of two options.

 

1. Move Devers to 1b.

2. Trade Dalbec, preferably for a SP or outfielder.

 

Either work for me.

 

Much better than the “don’t trade him because he is a prospect. Make him waste away in Pawtucket instead” mentality.

 

It seems simple to me. Accommodate him or move him...

 

They could play him at 1B, but you are right, his value is more at 3B.

[notin]

I did not say that. he is absolutely blocked. If he is traded though, wait for the s*** storm. Another prospect traded away - my oh my.

 

This isn’t like unloading 4 prospects for the highest paid closer in the game and paying all the freight. It’s one blocked prospect. Look at the Kimbrel deal. Arguably only Margot was blocked, since he was almost in MLB and Bradley had 4 years left. Guerra really wasn’t, since he could have potentially arrived in MLB this year, which, before the extension, was due to be Bogaerts’ last. And Logan Allen, as a pitcher, was never blocked. Pitchers just never are.

[cp176]

LOL. Dalbec is not good enough for anyone to start a shitstorm over.

 

Also, two guys critical of trading too many prospects are suggesting trading Dalbec might be best.

 

 

seriously - you don't think dalbec is worth hanging on to? who did dd trade away that looked any better? i know that you will have an answer for this but i guess it is doubtful that i will understand your logic. i hope that our incoming gm doesn't trade a couple of our solid prospects and decimate our extremely weak farm system

[cp176]

This isn’t like unloading 4 prospects for the highest paid closer in the game and paying all the freight. It’s one blocked prospect. Look at the Kimbrel deal. Arguably only Margot was blocked, since he was almost in MLB and Bradley had 4 years left. Guerra really wasn’t, since he could have potentially arrived in MLB this year, which, before the extension, was due to be Bogaerts’ last. And Logan Allen, as a pitcher, was never blocked. Pitchers just never are.

 

bringing in kimbrel for those guys was a great deal. margot certainly was blocked. i liked guerra a great deal but i think the plan all along was for bogaerts to be our ss going forward.

[notin]

seriously - you don't think dalbec is worth hanging on to? who did dd trade away that looked any better? i know that you will have an answer for this but i guess it is doubtful that i will understand your logic. i hope that our incoming gm doesn't trade a couple of our solid prospects and decimate our extremely weak farm system

 

So... the entire time the farm system was ranked last, you insisted it was fine. Niw it’s improving and you call it “extremely weak.”

 

The real issue with the Sox farm system right now is it looks like the most MLB-ready player is a 3b, and the most likely openings for a rookie will be in 1b, 2b, CF, or RF, along with SP and RP.

 

So unless Dalbec can handle RF, or Devers moves to 1b, are you saying the Sox should just hold on to Dalbec and leave him in Pawtucket just for the sake of having one better prospect?

[Bellhorn04]

Can't Dalbec play first?

[jad]

Great time to finally get rid of the guy who is only .500 in World Championships. I understand Dave Roberts might be available. ... And don't the RS need a closer? LA might have one available.

[Bellhorn04]

Great time to finally get rid of the guy who is only .500 in World Championships. I understand Dave Roberts might be available.

 

Well said jad.

[notin]

Can't Dalbec play first?

 

Yes, but it’s not necessarily the best use of a player whose best asset is his defense. His arm would play well in RF, but I don’t know how well his overall defense would be out there.

 

His biggest question mark will be his bat, and by putting him at 1b - the easiest defensive position - aren’t the Sox counting on him to be a hitter?

[Slasher9]

i say we get Who's to play first.

[illinoisredsox]

i say we get Who's to play first.

 

What? I Don’t Know about that.

 

Maybe I’ll think about it later Today, or perhaps Tomorrow, Because I Don’t Give a Darn right now.

 

OTOH, Why not?

[vegasbob]

It is no longer Fire WTF Cora, it's his long lost cousin Dave Roberts who inexplicably let Smokin Joe Kelly give up the bomb that sunk LA. Dave will remain a Red Sox favorite for starting the ultimate comeback rally, but relying on Joe Kelly after a leadoff walk in the 10th, followed by a hit is too much to overlook. Fire Dave Robert, Mr. Friedman

[Jack Flap]

If JDM leaves, could we see a situation where Devers and Dalbec split playing time at 3B/DH between them (thus buying some time for the organization to determine who it likes better long-term at third and/or what sort of position changes might be called for in the future)?

 

Dalbec should hardly be untouchable if the right deal materializes, but given that he's a possible minimum-wage contributor on a club trying to reset the tax, I wouldn't do it lightly, either.

[notin]

If JDM leaves, could we see a situation where Devers and Dalbec split playing time at 3B/DH between them (thus buying some time for the organization to determine who it likes better long-term at third and/or what sort of position changes might be called for in the future)?

 

Dalbec should hardly be untouchable if the right deal materializes, but given that he's a possible minimum-wage contributor on a club trying to reset the tax, I wouldn't do it lightly, either.

 

I'm living in a world where JDM doesn't leave. Even if he opts out, I still think the Red Sox will be his best fit and most aggressive suitor.

 

And if the Sox lose both Betts and JDM, then maybe it is tie for a fire sale.

 

As for Dalbec, my attitude is simple - make room for him or deal him. and I think 3B is the best position to make room, and slide Devers over to 1B. It's not like Chavis has a lock on that position...

[S5Dewey]

If JDM leaves, could we see a situation where Devers and Dalbec split playing time at 3B/DH between them (thus buying some time for the organization to determine who it likes better long-term at third and/or what sort of position changes might be called for in the future)?

 

Dalbec should hardly be untouchable if the right deal materializes, but given that he's a possible minimum-wage contributor on a club trying to reset the tax, I wouldn't do it lightly, either.

 

I've always like Dalbec both as a hitter and defensively. He's a big guy, 6'4", 225 with big shoulders and long arms with an OPS that's always around .800. Lots of leverage there.

Defensively I've always believed that anyone who can play 3B can also play 1B - better. They're both corner positions and the ball comes off the bat the same way albiet from the opposite side, and their range is more necessay at 3B than at 1B.

 

Dalbec is 25, hasn't yet reached his prime and will play for the minimum. He's also a known quantity within the organization.

 

Under the current circumstances, what's not to like?

[notin]

I've always like Dalbec both as a hitter and defensively. He's a big guy, 6'4", 225 with big shoulders and long arms with an OPS that's always around .800. Lots of leverage there.

Defensively I've always believed that anyone who can play 3B can also play 1B - better. They're both corner positions and the ball comes off the bat the same way albiet from the opposite side, and their range is more necessay at 3B than at 1B.

 

Dalbec is 25, hasn't yet reached his prime and will play for the minimum. He's also a known quantity within the organization.

 

Under the current circumstances, what's not to like?

 

I think his glove, range, and arm play better at 3B, and I think he can handle the position better than Devers (even with the leaps and bounds Raffy made this year). Dalbec has some overall good minor lrague numbers, but at the plate, his swing and miss tendencies might become a major issue. However, if he hit at 3b, at least he is contributing defensively.

 

As for playing 1b, certainly. The overwhelming majority of the chances for a 1b are balls thrown to him i.e. meant to be caught. Outside of catcher, this is the only position that can make this claim. That's why most questionable fielders are moved to 1b. If you look around MLB, most first baseman fall into at least one of three categories - (1) left-handed, (2) very tall or (3) moved there because they were lousy defensive players somewhere else.

 

But if Dalbec struggles at the plate, why put him at the easiest position to field?

[Bellhorn04]

Yes, but it’s not necessarily the best use of a player whose best asset is his defense. His arm would play well in RF, but I don’t know how well his overall defense would be out there.

 

His biggest question mark will be his bat, and by putting him at 1b - the easiest defensive position - aren’t the Sox counting on him to be a hitter?

 

I dunno. I'm definitely out of my depth when we start talking about prospects.

[Slasher9]

Gabe Kapler just got his throat slit in Phila.....

[notin]

Gabe Kapler just got his throat slit in Phila.....

 

It would have been much more legal to just fire him...