Chris Sale traded to Braves

[mvp 78]

Last game: .667/.800/1.000

 

What did he do last night?

 

Unsustainable BABIP!

[Dipre]

Unsustainable BABIP!

 

His hard hit and line drive rate last night says otherwise!

[mvp 78]

His hard hit and line drive rate last night says otherwise!

 

95.7 mph, 91', xBA 370

98.8 mph, 339', xBA 470

87.0 mph, 314', xBA 060

 

Total xBA of 300 vs 667 BABIP. Unstainable BABIP!

[moonslav59]

Yes, as mvp put it, he's an OK prospect. We have a number of those for middle infield. We also have Story and Mayer.

 

Almost every ranking system had Grissom way ahead of DHam, Romy, Valdez, Yorke and Mayer was not ML ready to start 2024. Mayer is also going to play SS, not 2B.

 

Grissom has sucked in a small sample size. He was not good in a larger one last year, but let’s not say we had better looking 2Bmen in February 2024.

[Old Red]

Almost every ranking system had Grissom way ahead of DHam, Romy, Valdez, Yorke and Mayer was not ML ready to start 2024. Mayer is also going to play SS, not 2B.

 

Grissom has sucked in a small sample size. He was not good in a larger one last year, but let’s not say we had better looking 2Bmen in February 2024.

 

What looks good on paper doesn’t always transfer to the field.

[moonslav59]

if he's such a middle of the road prospect then Breslow got f***ed on this deal even worse than i thought.

 

If he doesn’t work out, yes the deal sucked. Since we did not spend the $10M saved on Sale, it is even worse. I suppose we can do mental gymnastics and say we got O’Neill and Hendriks for $10M, but we cut salary from 2023, so I don’t see it that way. Okay, maybe it allowed Brez to sign Gio, but that is no feather in the cap either.

 

That being said, I think the general consensus of baseball people thought Grissom was better than a middle of the road prospect or young MLB player. It’s okay to bash the trade without changing this fact.

[moonslav59]

Last 5 games: 211/286/421

 

What has he done lately?

 

Tge biggest HR of the season?

[Old Red]

If he doesn’t work out, yes the deal sucked. Since we did not spend the $10M saved on Sale, it is even worse. I suppose we can do mental gymnastics and say we got O’Neill and Hendriks for $10M, but we cut salary from 2023, so I don’t see it that way. Okay, maybe it allowed Brez to sign Gio, but that is no feather in the cap either.

 

That being said, I think the general consensus of baseball people thought Grissom was better than a middle of the road prospect or young MLB player. It’s okay to bash the trade without changing this fact.

You keep being hooked on the $10M saved from trading Sale that went to Gio whom I don’t believe would have been signed without the Sale deal happening.

[Bellhorn04]

If he doesn’t work out, yes the deal sucked. Since we did not spend the $10M saved on Sale, it is even worse. I suppose we can do mental gymnastics and say we got O’Neill and Hendriks for $10M, but we cut salary from 2023, so I don’t see it that way. Okay, maybe it allowed Brez to sign Gio, but that is no feather in the cap either.

 

That being said, I think the general consensus of baseball people thought Grissom was better than a middle of the road prospect or young MLB player. It’s okay to bash the trade without changing this fact.

 

Yeah, it's unfortunate, there's definitely some piling on going on with Grissom. It's a trifecta of bad stuff-the guy he got traded for is having a great season, he can't stay healthy and his numbers are horrific. He's so far behind the eight-ball now that you wonder if he has much future with the Sox, especially with them having multiple other 2B possibilities for 2025 and beyond.

[notin]

Yeah, it's unfortunate, there's definitely some piling on going on with Grissom. It's a trifecta of bad stuff-the guy he got traded for is having a great season, he can't stay healthy and his numbers are horrific. He's so far behind the eight-ball now that you wonder if he has much future with the Sox, especially with them having multiple other 2B possibilities for 2025 and beyond.

 

In the end, I think you’ll find we might not be as deep up the middle as we think right now.

 

I’m sure most rank Mayer well ahead of Grissom, but in 6 days, Mayer will be the same age Grissom was on his MLB debut…

Edited July 10, 2024 by notin

[Old Red]

In the end, I think you’ll find we might not be as deep up the middle as we think right now.

 

I’m sure most rank Mayer well ahead of Grissom, but in 6 days, Mayer will be the same age Grissom was on his MLB debut…

How deep they are depends on Mayer, and Story.

[mvp 78]

In the end, I think you’ll find we might not be as deep up the middle as we think right now.

 

I’m sure most rank Mayer well ahead of Grissom, but in 6 days, Mayer will be the same age Grissom was on his MLB debut…

 

Mayer

Story

Hamilton

Valdez

Grissom

Campbell

Yorke

Meidroth

Paulino

 

I've seen much worse depth in recent years from the Sox up the middle. They are getting there and two of these bums should work out.

[notin]

Mayer

Story

Hamilton

Valdez

Grissom

Campbell

Yorke

Meidroth

Paulino

 

I've seen much worse depth in recent years from the Sox up the middle. They are getting there and two of these bums should work out.

 

You’re assuming they all stay at 2b/SS or stay in the organization. And as I mentioned earlier, when Grissom was Mayer’s age (minus 6 days), he was already in MLB…

[moonslav59]

Yeah, it's unfortunate, there's definitely some piling on going on with Grissom. It's a trifecta of bad stuff-the guy he got traded for is having a great season, he can't stay healthy and his numbers are horrific. He's so far behind the eight-ball now that you wonder if he has much future with the Sox, especially with them having multiple other 2B possibilities for 2025 and beyond.

 

We do have many options in 2025 and beyond, but 2024 looked pretty bad, pre-trade and not great after the trade, either. 2B was a need for 2024.

 

Grissom looked to be the best chance of respectability at 2B as of February 2024. It hasn’t worked out but it was what it was.

[mvp 78]

You’re assuming they all stay at 2b/SS or stay in the organization. And as I mentioned earlier, when Grissom was Mayer’s age (minus 6 days), he was already in MLB…

 

What I'm saying is that this depth today for the near future is better than they have had in recent memory.

[Old Red]

We do have many options in 2025 and beyond, but 2024 looked pretty bad, pre-trade and not great after the trade, either. 2B was a need for 2024.

 

Grissom looked to be the best chance of respectability at 2B as of February 2024. It hasn’t worked out but it was what it was.

 

Grissom looked to be the best chance of respectability? Was that, because of his bat, because he hadn’t proved anything with the glove.

[moonslav59]

What I'm saying is that this depth today for the near future is better than they have had in recent memory.

 

Agreed, and this includes Grissom.

 

I also think the recent play we have seen by DHam, Romy, Rafaela and even Valdez, post call up, has been better than what we’ve seen at 2B in 3-4 years. Looking at SS and 2B, of course when Bogey was here, the MI was better, but we’ve had some damn good numbers from our MI on O the last5-6 weeks or so. The D has not been good, but when was the last time it was?

 

Story for brief moments with who at2B?

[Old Red]

Agreed, and this includes Grissom.

 

I also think the recent play we have seen by DHam, Romy, Rafaela and even Valdez, post call up, has been better than what we’ve seen at 2B in 3-4 years. Looking at SS and 2B, of course when Bogey was here, the MI was better, but we’ve had some damn good numbers from our MI on O the last5-6 weeks or so. The D has not been good, but when was the last time it was?

 

Story for brief moments with who at2B?

The best 2B the last 3-4 years was Story in 2022.

[Duran Is The Man]

Tge biggest HR of the season?

 

yep.

[moonslav59]

Sox 2B from 2019 to 2023:

27th in fWAR at 4.7 (0.9 per season)

.697 OPS

 

It’s worse, this year, but the last 6 weeks seem to be better than what we have seen for much of the last5 years or the last 5 as a whole.

 

[Maxbialystock]

The best 2B the last 3-4 years was Story in 2022.

 

Good point! His WAR for 94 games was 2.5. That was the last year of bold shifts, and Story seemed especially adept on the right side of the infield (and sometimes almost in the outfield). Nevertheless, his OPS of .737 was well below his lifetime .834.

 

The other problem is that in 3 full seasons with the Sox he has played 94, than 43, and this year 8 games. That's a nasty trend which can't be blamed on falling off a bicycle or needing TJ surgery. In 2016 at age 33 (in August), Pedroia played 154 games with an OPS of .825 and a WAR of 5.6--an excellent season. The next year Machado slid into him hard with a clear intent to take him out, and Pedey never came back from that.

[notin]

The best 2B the last 3-4 years was Story in 2022.

 

Shockingly, I agree with Moldy Red here. In fact, I think you can take that statement back a full 6 seasons and it’s still true, with Brock Holt in 2019 being the only other name deserving any sort of mention…

[notin]

Mayer

Story

Hamilton

Valdez

Grissom

Campbell

Yorke

Meidroth

Paulino

 

I've seen much worse depth in recent years from the Sox up the middle. They are getting there and two of these bums should work out.

 

For a while during the Cherington years, the Sox had Moncada, Javier Guerra, Jose Iglesias, and a few others who eventually didn’t pan out. Is this new lot really better?

[moonslav59]

Shockingly, I agree with Moldy Red here. In fact, I think you can take that statement back a full 6 seasons and it’s still true, with Brock Holt in 2019 being the only other name deserving any sort of mention…

 

True, but for 90 games or so, and Story’s OPS was not as good as Romy+ DHam + Valdez.

 

The point made was about the last 6 weeks. Have we had a 2Bman better on O and D than we’ve seen the last6 weeks?

[mvp 78]

For a while during the Cherington years, the Sox had Moncada, Javier Guerra, Jose Iglesias, and a few others who eventually didn’t pan out. Is this new lot really better?

 

Are we considering Jose Iglesias prospect era to be recent???????????????????????

[moonslav59]

For a while during the Cherington years, the Sox had Moncada, Javier Guerra, Jose Iglesias, and a few others who eventually didn’t pan out. Is this new lot really better?

 

The list is longer, but so was the one with the three you named.

Holt

Marco Hernandez

Dubon

Marrero

Lin

Chavis (3B).

[notin]

Are we considering Jose Iglesias prospect era to be recent???????????????????????

 

Team has been around since 1903. Is 2014 really too far back?

 

I mean, Iglesias is still playing. Not like I went for guys already in Cooperstown…

[mvp 78]

The list is longer, but so was the one with the three you named.

Holt

Marco Hernandez

Dubon

Marrero

Lin

Chavis (3B).

 

Iglesias - traded 2013

Moncada - signed 2015, traded 2016

Chavis - wasn't even out of A ball at the end of 2016

 

I'd take the list I put in as I only included guys in AA and above and they are actually close to being ready at the same time and in the organization at the same time. Tzu-Wei Lin wasn't even a realistic prospect until 2017 when Ben was long gone.

[mvp 78]

Team has been around since 1903. Is 2014 really too far back?

 

I mean, Iglesias is still playing. Not like I went for guys already in Cooperstown…

 

Regardless, Iggy was never in the org with Moncada and Guerra was still in the DSL at the time. Calling them "depth" together is awkward as hell.

[mvp 78]

And what will certainly please the olds:

 

@ChrisCotillo

It has not been a smooth first impression for Vaughn Grissom in Boston so far.

 

“I just want to play my game. If they like it, they like it. If they don’t, f*** it,” he said. “I’m here for a reason. I’m sure there’s a next guy up if they don’t like it."

 

Grissom on his season: “It’s tough. But it could be worse. You have to trust the process. Everybody has their (bad) year. This is mine. In a way, it’s nice to get it out of the way, but it sucks. Not a lot of guys go through this game and don’t get hurt."