Bloom fired

[Bellhorn04]

They could keep the budget low and hire a guy who actually does something in July/August and it would be not maintaining the status quo…

 

Since we ended up with 78 wins this year, was adding a pitcher for 2 months really going to be enough?

[Old Red]

Since we ended up with 78 wins this year, was adding a pitcher for 2 months really going to be enough?

 

To look at it now the answer would be no, but how did things look back on Aug 1?

[Bellhorn04]

To look at it now the answer would be no, but how did things look back on Aug 1?

 

notin seems to think the biggest problem with the 2022 and 2023 teams was not doing enough at the deadline.

 

I think when you win 78 games each year it's clear that wasn't the only problem.

[Old Red]

notin seems to think the biggest problem with the 2022 and 2023 teams was not doing enough at the deadline.

 

I think when you win 78 games each year it's clear that wasn't the only problem.

 

There were a lot more problems then just adding pitching this year at the deadline, but by not adding any pitching when 3 starters were on the IL, and then just waiting for them to not only come back, but to ramp up in the process certainly didn’t help.

[moonslav59]

There was plenty of blame to go around from JH down to the players themselves, but i don’t see Bloom as being any kind of scapegoat. He is far from blameless.🙈

 

Being the team's scapegoat does not imply no faults.

 

Bloom was responsible for a lot of what went wrong, but his hands were tied for much of his time, here.

[Hugh2]

Think of how strong the farm would be had Bloom just traded.

 

Dalbec (back in the beginning of 2022)

Bogaerts (2022 deadline knowing you wouldn’t extend him).

 

JDM (2022 deadline)

Eovaldi (2022 deadline)

Turner (2023 deadline)

Duvall (2023 deadline)

Paxton (2023 deadline)

 

How much worse off would the major league team be 2024 onward if they had? Now one bit, but how much stronger is the future.

 

Sox would have enough assets to go out and get a TOTR a big RH bat and have the exact same farm strength and payroll they have now.

 

This is why you sell when it’s apparent you’re not buyers. People love talk in hindsight and in the moment fans never want to give up on a season. But when you’re GM/CBO you’re not a fan, it’s not your job to act like one.

 

If you ask me, this is the leading cause of Blooms departure. He really messed up the trade deadlines.

[moonslav59]

LOL what?

 

What? Sham?

 

This whole we plan on "being competitive" was a sham for 3 years. We heard it every winter.

 

The 2021 season saved their asses and made them think they could get away with 2022 and 2023. Maybe nobody would notice the lack of commitment by providing the resources needed to compete.

 

[mvp 78]

Why? Wasn't Ben scapegoated too?

 

Statements made after the firing could have been scapegoated. I'll stick to the stories I hear prior to the firing.

[Old Red]

Being the team's scapegoat does not imply no faults.

 

Bloom was responsible for a lot of what went wrong, but his hands were tied for much of his time, here.

 

Oh the poor, poor Bloom saga again. I blame JH more than anybody especially for hiring Bloom in the first place, and for not even interviewing anyone else.

[mvp 78]

They could keep the budget low and hire a guy who actually does something in July/August and it would be not maintaining the status quo…

 

I mean, the budget was still within spitting distance of the CBT. It's not like the Sox are in the poorhouse. The money just wasn't spent wisely.

[mvp 78]

That’s true. I think somewhere you already called for a fire sale on the 2026 team…

 

Year by year. I try not to forecast things years into the future like some prognosticators on here. As far as I know, 2025 could like like 2018 redux. Not likely though.

[Old Red]

What? Sham?

 

This whole we plan on "being competitive" was a sham for 3 years. We heard it every winter.

 

The 2021 season saved their asses and made them think they could get away with 2022 and 2023. Maybe nobody would notice the lack of commitment by providing the resources needed to compete.

 

I agree that 2021 made them think they could do business as usual, which is what Sam said after the 2021 season going into 2022, but then they went out, and signed Story Land.

[moonslav59]

They could keep the budget low and hire a guy who actually does something in July/August and it would be not maintaining the status quo…

 

I do wish Bloom would have done something- one way or the other, over the past two deadlines, but in hindsight, buying wouldn't have helped enough in both seasons. Selling would have caused an uproar on Red's Corner and much of Sox Nation.

 

To me, the budgets and lack of farm help Bloom got for his first 2.5 to 3 seasons was the main culprit to the situation. Yes, Bloom coulda/shoulda done better, but the circumstances were in many ways handed to him or forced upon him by the upper brass who takes very little responsibility for what has been going on.

[mvp 78]

Since we ended up with 78 wins this year, was adding a pitcher for 2 months really going to be enough?

 

It could have been if multiple pitchers were added. I think the Sox were playing decently enough, but the wind was taken out of their sails. The absolutely turtled down the stretch to fall below .500.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

notin seems to think the biggest problem with the 2022 and 2023 teams was not doing enough at the deadline.

 

I think when you win 78 games each year it's clear that wasn't the only problem.

 

Not doing enough at the deadline had a lot to do with the team only winning 78 by the end of those years...

 

... on the field, in the dugout, in the bullpen, in the clubhouse.

 

Red Sox W-L '22/23

March-July 107-102

August-Oct: 49-66

[Old Red]

I do wish Bloom would have done something- one way or the other, over the past two deadlines, but in hindsight, buying wouldn't have helped enough in both seasons. Selling would have caused an uproar on Red's Corner and much of Sox Nation.

 

To me, the budgets and lack of farm help Bloom got for his first 2.5 to 3 seasons was the main culprit to the situation. Yes, Bloom coulda/shoulda done better, but the circumstances were in many ways handed to him or forced upon him by the upper brass who takes very little responsibility for what has been going on.

Bloom was in over his head, and the 3rd option in the fork in the road at the past two deadlines was his calling card. That’s right that selling the last two years would have caused a bigger uproar then how things turned. If you didn’t want to play to win then don’t play at all.

[moonslav59]

Oh the poor, poor Bloom saga again. I blame JH more than anybody especially for hiring Bloom in the first place, and for not even interviewing anyone else.

 

It's not poor poor Bloom. It's poor poor budgets and farm infusions.

 

Bloom did not do what he was supposed to do. he deserved to be fired.

 

You can believe some other GM would have or could have worked wonders with what was he was handed and what was demanded, but I'm not so sure. This is not about defending Bloom. He sucked at building an immediate winner.

 

Would it really have made you feel better, had they interviewed 10 guys and took the guy they wanted all along, anyway? Bloom.

 

They thought the guy who literally wrote the book on building winners on the cheap was what they needed, because going cheap was their plan. It made perfect sense, to them. The problem was, the guy who wrote the book was not the guy that made it all happen in TB, and the circumstances handed him were much different from the one established in TB.

[Old Red]

Not doing enough at the deadline had a lot to do with the team only winning 78 by the end of those years...

 

... on the field, in the dugout, in the bullpen, in the clubhouse.

 

Red Sox W-L '22/23

March-July 107-102

August-Oct: 49-66

100% agree. The underdog pep talk certainly didn’t help either especially when the players were voicing that they needed pitching help.

[mvp 78]

It's not poor poor Bloom. It's poor poor budgets and farm infusions.

 

Bloom did not do what he was supposed to do. he deserved to be fired.

 

You can believe some other GM would have or could have worked wonders with what was he was handed and what was demanded, but I'm not so sure. This is not about defending Bloom. He sucked at building an immediate winner.

 

Would it really have made you feel better, had they interviewed 10 guys and took the guy they wanted all along, anyway? Bloom.

 

They thought the guy who literally wrote the book on building winners on the cheap was what they needed, because going cheap was their plan. It made perfect sense, to them. The problem was, the guy who wrote the book was not the guy that made it all happen in TB, and the circumstances handed him were much different from the one established in TB.

 

The budget sizes were fine. The issues with the budgets were how Bloom managed them.

[Old Red]

It's not poor poor Bloom. It's poor poor budgets and farm infusions.

 

Bloom did not do what he was supposed to do. he deserved to be fired.

 

You can believe some other GM would have or could have worked wonders with what was he was handed and what was demanded, but I'm not so sure. This is not about defending Bloom. He sucked at building an immediate winner.

 

Would it really have made you feel better, had they interviewed 10 guys and took the guy they wanted all along, anyway? Bloom.

 

They thought the guy who literally wrote the book on building winners on the cheap was what they needed, because going cheap was their plan. It made perfect sense, to them. The problem was, the guy who wrote the book was not the guy that made it all happen in TB, and the circumstances handed him were much different from the one established in TB.

I do believe ABB could have done a better job, but you don’t like Bloom is some kind of Gold standard.

[Old Red]

The budget sizes were fine. The issues with the budgets were how Bloom managed them.

He even went over the CBT in 2022.

[mvp 78]

He even went over the CBT in 2022.

 

Chaim's s***ing the bathtub moment.

[Bellhorn04]

What? Sham?

 

This whole we plan on "being competitive" was a sham for 3 years. We heard it every winter.

 

The 2021 season saved their asses and made them think they could get away with 2022 and 2023. Maybe nobody would notice the lack of commitment by providing the resources needed to compete.

 

 

I wasn't happy with this year's payroll budget, but calling 2022 and 2023 a sham seems a little excessive.

[moonslav59]

I agree that 2021 made them think they could do business as usual, which is what Sam said after the 2021 season going into 2022, but then they went out, and signed Story Land.

 

I still think signing Story was an afterthought or knee-jerk reaction to the growing hostility of the fan base, namely season ticket holders and paying NESN viewers. Even the 2022 budget was not enough to create a serious contending team.

 

Sure, in hindsight we can pick and choose what FAs did well in 2022, mix and match and say, :We coulda won with the right GM," but not many GM get that kind of results on a limited budget.

 

Story has been a big letdown. GMs have been fired for smaller "mistakes" than that. (I put that in quotes, because he may still earn part of most of his keep.)

 

The rest of the budget spent on 2022 was better than what he spent before 2021. Bloom did well with the limited funds for Wacha, Hill and Strahm. He made up for the Diekman signing by dumping his salary and getting McGuire for the efforts. The Vaz for Abreu and EValdez trade may make up for some the 2022 mistakes.

 

Ultimately, Bloom made too many blunders on his biggest moves. Although spending $10 for 1 year should never be called a major blunder, he did choose to spend more money elsewhere than on SP'ers.

 

Biggest Blunders (some have time redeem some value)

1. Story (his biggest signing until the Devers extension)

2. Yoshida (early returns)

3. JBJ-Renfroe

4. Kluber

5. Richards

6. Acts of ommision (SS in '23, SP in '21 and .23 and more)

[moonslav59]

I wasn't happy with this year's payroll budget, but calling 2022 and 2023 a sham seems a little excessive.

 

Do you really think that was a serios effort?

 

Whether by Bloom's choice or not, the refusal to part with any top prospects is a sign about not being serious about winning, now. It's okay, every now and again, but we went from the deadline in 2018, which was not really major prospects traded away) until now, with no major prospects or young players traded. That is evidence that the "serious about winning now" was a sham statement.

 

The winter spending budget for 2022 and 2023 was a big step up from 2020 and 2021, but it was still woefully short of hat was needed and of 2019 numbers, even without inflation being figured in (opening day roster was $30M less than 2019, which was not a playoff team to begin with.)

 

Also, factor in that many other teams started spending more and passing us in the budget rankings, and yes, it was a sham.

 

The big winter budget before the 2023 season was partially a mirage, as we had to replace Bogey, JD, Nate, Wacha, Vaz and Hill, while still dealing with an unproductive mega contract for Sale.

 

They did mess up on the spending, and even if Yoshida earns or nearly earned his keep, we still focused too much on the wrong areas and don't have much to look forward to with the signings, except one more year from the aged Jansen and Martin.

 

I get the point that we could have been competitive had we spent the money very wisely, so it should not be called a "sham" for that reason. Your position has merit.

 

I still think the upper brass has known all along, we were not building for a championship contending team. It's been all about the long term, while trying to give the fans an impression we can win now. It was a planned illusion. A sham.

 

[dgalehouse]

When a team fails to meet expectations and the fans are getting restless, ownership needs to make a splash to quiet the unrest. Firing people is one way to make that splash. And it is a lot cheaper than spending more money to upgrade the roster.

[mvp 78]

I wasn't happy with this year's payroll budget, but calling 2022 and 2023 a sham seems a little excessive.

 

I mean, I've seen some shams in my day, I don't think this was one of them.

 

 

 

[mvp 78]

I still think signing Story was an afterthought or knee-jerk reaction to the growing hostility of the fan base

 

People have been saying this lately, but the Sox just came off an ALCS trip. I don't buy it.

[oldtimer]

Do you really think that was a serios effort?

 

Whether by Bloom's choice or not, the refusal to part with any top prospects is a sign about not being serious about winning, now. It's okay, every now and again, but we went from the deadline in 2018, which was not really major prospects traded away) until now, with no major prospects or young players traded. That is evidence that the "serious about winning now" was a sham statement.

 

The winter spending budget for 2022 and 2023 was a big step up from 2020 and 2021, but it was still woefully short of hat was needed and of 2019 numbers, even without inflation being figured in (opening day roster was $30M less than 2019, which was not a playoff team to begin with.)

 

Also, factor in that many other teams started spending more and passing us in the budget rankings, and yes, it was a sham.

 

The big winter budget before the 2023 season was partially a mirage, as we had to replace Bogey, JD, Nate, Wacha, Vaz and Hill, while still dealing with an unproductive mega contract for Sale.

 

They did mess up on the spending, and even if Yoshida earns or nearly earned his keep, we still focused too much on the wrong areas and don't have much to look forward to with the signings, except one more year from the aged Jansen and Martin.

 

I get the point that we could have been competitive had we spent the money very wisely, so it should not be called a "sham" for that reason. Your position has merit.

 

I still think the upper brass has known all along, we were not building for a championship contending team. It's been all about the long term, while trying to give the fans an impression we can win now. It was a planned illusion. A sham.

 

 

One omission we heard about is the failure trade Sale when we are told a team was lined up to accept his full contract. That would have freed up $27 mil or enough to sign a durable ace. Bloom supposedly held out for more and instead got zero. Sale did pitch better toward the end of the year but not in comparison to his contract and now he is likely to remain with the club in 2024. Nothing against Sale, but his durability remains in question. To me, this situation just added to his display of indecisiveness. Taken together, his approach was not adding competitiveness to the club and he was let go.

[Maxbialystock]

Do you really think that was a serios effort?

 

Whether by Bloom's choice or not, the refusal to part with any top prospects is a sign about not being serious about winning, now. It's okay, every now and again, but we went from the deadline in 2018, which was not really major prospects traded away) until now, with no major prospects or young players traded. That is evidence that the "serious about winning now" was a sham statement.

 

The winter spending budget for 2022 and 2023 was a big step up from 2020 and 2021, but it was still woefully short of hat was needed and of 2019 numbers, even without inflation being figured in (opening day roster was $30M less than 2019, which was not a playoff team to begin with.)

 

Also, factor in that many other teams started spending more and passing us in the budget rankings, and yes, it was a sham.

 

The big winter budget before the 2023 season was partially a mirage, as we had to replace Bogey, JD, Nate, Wacha, Vaz and Hill, while still dealing with an unproductive mega contract for Sale.

 

They did mess up on the spending, and even if Yoshida earns or nearly earned his keep, we still focused too much on the wrong areas and don't have much to look forward to with the signings, except one more year from the aged Jansen and Martin.

 

I get the point that we could have been competitive had we spent the money very wisely, so it should not be called a "sham" for that reason. Your position has merit.

 

I still think the upper brass has known all along, we were not building for a championship contending team. It's been all about the long term, while trying to give the fans an impression we can win now. It was a planned illusion. A sham.

 

 

Sham, spam. Please name just one MLB team over the past 100 years who stated publicly that they were not much interested in winning, but just wanted to kind of get through the next season.

 

To be honest, maybe the Pirates have said that or even the Orioles. But a wealthy team like the Sox? Never. Bloom had absolutely no choice but to say his intent was to keep the Sox competitive.

 

As for his utter failure to fix the pitching, I blame almost all of that on JH who decided during the 2019 season that never again would he invest heavily in starters--not even enough to keep Eovaldi and Wacha after last season.

 

Along the same line, I believe JH is the one who decided to cut the payroll to an unprecedented 15th in MLB. Thus too the departures of Mookie and Bogey for greener pastures.

 

On the other hand, I agree that so far Bloom's two priciest acquisitions, Story and Yoshida, have come nowhere near earning their pay. Plus a whole bunch of pitchers.