A Realistic View at 2023: Part I

[moonslav59]

Why would Henry care one way, or the other what the payroll would be if he was going to sell, because I can’t see why it would bother someone wanting to buy the team.

 

Ask why other owners skimped before selling.

 

Maybe, it's easier to sell a team with less long term commitments. New owners may want to put a stamp on the team- their own.

 

I don't know. Like I said, I might be wrong about the history of deals made before team's being sold.

[Old Red]

@redsoxstats

Another couple of new numbers showed up today, so far

7 Yoshida

12 Wong

16 Duran

22 Whitlock

25 Winckowski

55 Martin

57 Rodriguez

 

Have no fear, all of you old farts can reuse your Trot Nixon jerseys again.

I’m not even counting on Yoshida being another Gary Geiger.

[moonslav59]

That could go both ways like someone wishing for a Bloom.

 

I don't recall anyone wishing for Bloom, maybe Mr. Strawman.

 

I'd be fine with Henry selling, but I'd like to know the buyer before I wish for it to happen.

 

I seriously doubt we have any rings without Henry. Maybe 1- possibly two. I'm not convinced he is the problem, or that this is just a long term cycle or 5 year plan that requires patience- something you and most Sox fans don't have.

[Old Red]

Ask why other owners skimped before selling.

 

Maybe, it's easier to sell a team with less long term commitments. New owners may want to put a stamp on the team- their own.

 

I don't know. Like I said, I might be wrong about the history of deals made before team's being sold.

 

It wouldn’t be the first time, but like I say if you can afford to buy the team you can afford to pay the payroll, and I’m not so sure a prospective owner is going over a 40 man roster.

[Old Red]

I don't recall anyone wishing for Bloom, maybe Mr. Strawman.

 

I'd be fine with Henry selling, but I'd like to know the buyer before I wish for it to happen.

 

I seriously doubt we have any rings without Henry. Maybe 1- possibly two. I'm not convinced he is the problem, or that this is just a long term cycle or 5 year plan that requires patience- something you and most Sox fans don't have.

 

I’ve already said Henry has been a good owner, and I Don think anyone is disputing that, but to me I think Henry has outlived his usefulness, and yes you got something right that most fans want any part of any kind of a rebuild let alone 5 years.

[moonslav59]

It wouldn’t be the first time, but like I say if you can afford to buy the team you can afford to pay the payroll, and I’m not so sure a prospective owner is going over a 40 man roster.

 

I don't think it would ever prevent an owner from buying, unless there were hundreds of millions of deadwood salaries.

 

It may lower the price, some.

 

I just seem to recall owners about to sell getting stingy with spending. Maybe just a trend- not a locked in rule.

[mvp 78]

Maybe- maybe not. Teams that have sold in the past have tended to not spend big beforehand or trade away big salary commitments. At least that's how I see it. Maybe, I'm wrong.

 

Manny Ramirez?

 

These "big salary commitments" are a more recent thing and there haven't been very many teams sold recently.

 

Did Lindor's contract come before the new ownership or after?

[moonslav59]

I’ve already said Henry has been a good owner, and I Don think anyone is disputing that, but to me I think Henry has outlived his usefulness, and yes you got something right that most fans want any part of any kind of a rebuild let alone 5 years.

 

Yes, we know your position, and having a large legion of fans thinking the same way, I'm sure enforces your feeling of being right. I've never doubted the majority of fans are not liking any notion of even a 3 year plan- let alone 5.

 

"Outlived his usefulness" is your position. Until I know who the new owner might be, I'm not going just blindly say he should sell the team. You are free to want what you want, but I'll say it again, be careful what you wish for.

[Old Red]

I don't think it would ever prevent an owner from buying, unless there were hundreds of millions of deadwood salaries.

 

It may lower the price, some.

 

I just seem to recall owners about to sell getting stingy with spending. Maybe just a trend- not a locked in rule.

 

You mean like not making a trade in May, or June? I don’t believe deadwood salaries would have any effect either.

[moonslav59]

Manny Ramirez?

 

These "big salary commitments" are a more recent thing and there haven't been very many teams sold recently.

 

Did Lindor's contract come before the new ownership or after?

 

Not sure, and like I said, maybe my impression of what owners do before selling is not accurate.

 

I might be thinking of the Dodger sale about 10 years ago. Didn't they avoid big deals before the sale, and fans got pissed?

[Old Red]

Yes, we know your position, and having a large legion of fans thinking the same way, I'm sure enforces your feeling of being right. I've never doubted the majority of fans are not liking any notion of even a 3 year plan- let alone 5.

 

"Outlived his usefulness" is your position. Until I know who the new owner might be, I'm not going just blindly say he should sell the team. You are free to want what you want, but I'll say it again, be careful what you wish for.

 

Give me any owner who’s willing to spend, and get a real BB guy to run the organization.

[moonslav59]

You mean like not making a trade in May, or June? I don’t believe deadwood salaries would have any effect either.

 

No. I think an owner might lower his offer, if a team has $500M in deadwood salary on the books going forward vs none.

[moonslav59]

Give me any owner who’s willing to spend, and get a real BB guy to run the organization.

 

Why are you so sure that is who JH will sell to?

[Old Red]

Why are you so sure that is who JH will sell to?

 

We know he’s going to have money, because the Red Sox won’t come cheap.

[Old Red]

No. I think an owner might lower his offer, if a team has $500M in deadwood salary on the books going forward vs none.

 

$500M in deadwood salary? Quite a number you pulled out of a hat.

[moonslav59]

$500M in deadwood salary? Quite a number you pulled out of a hat.

 

That is too high, yes.

[mvp 78]

Not sure, and like I said, maybe my impression of what owners do before selling is not accurate.

 

I might be thinking of the Dodger sale about 10 years ago. Didn't they avoid big deals before the sale, and fans got pissed?

 

No, fans weren't happy with McCourt for a while before the sale. Aside from trading for Manny, that ownership hadn't done much except collect past their prime players like Nomar, Luis Gonzales, Jeff Kent, Maddux, Lofton and sign guys from Japan/Taiwan. They let Adrian Beltre go. JD Drew opted out and bolted for Boston. McCourt had to raise ticket prices and concessions every year to afford the team. He went through a VERY public and costly divorce that lasted a year and a half during which MLB appointed a representative to oversee day to day operations of the ballclub after MLB found out that McCourt received a loan from Fox to cover payroll. The Dodgers filed for Chapter 11. 9 months later, McCourt sold to the group that included Magic Johnson.

[Bellhorn04]

Did Lindor's contract come before the new ownership or after?

 

After. Cohen became owner late in 2020. Lindor's deal was signed just before the 2021 season.

[enlightened]

I don't see it. He sold a portion of Liverpool because of the riskiness of ownership in that league (regulation).

 

The chances of Liverpool getting relegated from the Premiership are very very slim. It's more about finishing high enough in the Premiership to qualify for the highly lucrative European Champions League.

[mvp 78]

The chances of Liverpool getting relegated from the Premiership are very very slim. It's more about finishing high enough in the Premiership to qualify for the highly lucrative European Champions League.

 

Thank you. I honestly don't know enough about soccer/football and only retain very little when I hear about it.

[Bobe2]

Thank you. I honestly don't know enough about soccer/football and only retain very little when I hear about it.

 

I don’t know much about it either but I remember Henry tried to change the process so it would benefit him and he ended up having to apologize to the league

[mvp 78]

I don’t know much about it either but I remember Henry tried to change the process so it would benefit him and he ended up having to apologize to the league

 

John Henry now starring as "The Ugly American."

[mvp 78]

@PeteAbe

Sox still have Christian Arroyo, Ryan Brasier, Reese McGuire, Nick Pivetta, Josh Taylor, and Alex Verdugo as unsigned arb-eligible players.

 

Only Pivetta and Verdugo are projected over $2.3M. The sides exchange figures on Jan. 13 if no deal is made.

[Tedballgame]

John Henry booed at Bruins game. Rightfully so. What have you done for us lately. The Sox can't rest on 2004, 2007, 2013 and 2018 forever. (Although Skanks have won only once during that time). They need to spend the money to be competitive again. And spend it wisely (Sandoval, Crawford, Cameron, Smoltz, etc).

As they stand now, a last place finish is a big possibility. I don't think they will finish last but right now my excitement level for this team and this season is a 1 on a scale of 10.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

@PeteAbe

Sox still have Christian Arroyo, Ryan Brasier, Reese McGuire, Nick Pivetta, Josh Taylor, and Alex Verdugo as unsigned arb-eligible players.

 

Only Pivetta and Verdugo are projected over $2.3M. The sides exchange figures on Jan. 13 if no deal is made.

 

That's when Arroyo transforms into a tall, skinny CBOish bod, and Bloom gets short and stocky with a rugged redbeard visage...

[mvp 78]

John Henry booed at Bruins game. Rightfully so. What have you done for us lately. The Sox can't rest on 2004, 2007, 2013 and 2018 forever. (Although Skanks have won only once during that time). They need to spend the money to be competitive again. And spend it wisely (Sandoval, Crawford, Cameron, Smoltz, etc).

As they stand now, a last place finish is a big possibility. I don't think they will finish last but right now my excitement level for this team and this season is a 1 on a scale of 10.

 

I think I'm at a solid 4.5 out of 10 on the excitement level.

[Bellhorn04]

To me the real excitement for 2023 is to find out exactly how much balls this front office has.

[mvp 78]

That's when Arroyo transforms into a tall, skinny CBOish bod, and Bloom gets short and stocky with a rugged redbeard visage...

 

Arroyo is 6'1"

 

Bloom is about the same or maybe an inch or two taller from what I've seen online.

[mvp 78]

To me the real excitement for 2023 is to find out exactly how much balls this front office has.

 

Balls in sticking with their long term plan or balls in paying money to a guy long term?

[Bellhorn04]

Balls in sticking with their long term plan or balls in paying money to a guy long term?

 

The former.