2022 Starting Rotation Thread

[notin]

A lot of fans are too quick to use the " choke" label. For the most part , these guys ( Barnes included) are pros who have dealt with high stress situations many , many times.

 

Exactly.

 

And fans think pitching in Boston is tough because of the media (despite many of these chokers speaking little to no English).

 

MLB is tough anywhere, but the real pressure IMO is in the minors. Because if you fail there, you stay there. In MLB, sure someone labels you a choker (or chocker), but you still get to keep your paycheck. Outside of some negative press, what exactly do these players lose?

[dgalehouse]

Thanks -- and I don't want you to research this -- but we also know that the "type" of pitches has to make a difference, as well. Barnes coming in to face the heart of the order with baserunners aboard in the 7th or 8th has to present different stress than Kimbrel starting the 9th with the lead and throwing to the 7-8-9 hitters.

 

Now, certain guys who just aren't as effective coming into the 8th or in a tie game -- instead of a clean 9th inning save situation -- are candidates with what we might call a mental issue.

 

In many respects, baseball is no different than any other business or industry. You want everyone to do their job well , but some people are better suited to certain assignments than they are to others. It is the job of management to assign employees to jobs where they are most likely to succeed. Of course, this does rely on having enough talent in your workforce ( pitching staff) to begin with.

Edited April 2, 2022 by dgalehouse

[moonslav59]

We could have brought Martin Perez back!!! Or Vince Velasquez!! Or Danny Duffy!!

 

I’m guessing you haven’t seen what $5mill buys these days.

 

(Also, younger doesn’t always mean better. Do you think 29yo Chad Kuhl is better than 38yo Max Scherzer?)

 

If we had some young studs waiting in the wings, I could see a point being made, and I guess nobody saw Houck as a "stud," but I like the Hill signing more than the last 2 Perez signings.

[notin]

If we had some young studs waiting in the wings, I could see a point being made, and I guess nobody saw Houck as a "stud," but I like the Hill signing more than the last 2 Perez signings.

 

Even if we had three young stud arms all in BAs top 25 prospects, pitching depth is a good thing…

[moonslav59]

Even if we had three young stud arms all in BAs top 25 prospects, pitching depth is a good thing…

 

True, but if they were allML ready, we'd probably have signed just one from Wacha & Hill.

 

BTW, speaking of Perez, he was in last place on the ERA list from 2017-2021 (500+ IP).

[jacksonianmarch]

A lot of fans are too quick to use the " choke" label. For the most part , these guys ( Barnes included) are pros who have dealt with high stress situations many , many times.

 

How many times does he need to fade late before you get the label?

[notin]

How many times does he need to fade late before you get the label?

 

One before anyone gets the label.

 

But even a dozen late season fades can still be fatigue

[Old Red]

One before anyone gets the label.

 

But even a dozen late season fades can still be fatigue

 

Wasn’t Chris Sale like that? Fade late in the season.

[Swiharts Ghost]

How many times does he need to fade late before you get the label?

See this is when I’m convinced Jax actually likes the Redsox .Very True man .MB is an absolute disaster Waiting to happen .

[notin]

Wasn’t Chris Sale like that? Fade late in the season.

 

After over 200 IP, lots of pitchers fade…

[Swiharts Ghost]

Chris Sale should be thought of as a 4 inning pitcher ...people tend to call those relievers .Just saying

[a700hitter]

After over 200 IP, lots of pitchers fade…

That’s normal. Let’s hope that Sale hasn’t developed Buchholz Disease.

[moonslav59]

That’s normal. Let’s hope that Sale hasn’t developed Buchholz Disease.

 

Incurable.

[a700hitter]

Manaea to the Padres. But we have Rich Hill, Mr. 5+ ERA Wacha, and Paxton who is in the running for the Mark Prior Award. Good job, Bloomie.

[moonslav59]

Manaea to the Padres. But we have Rich Hill, Mr. 5+ ERA Wacha, and Paxton who is in the running for the Mark Prior Award. Good job, Bloomie.

 

So, you quit bashing Pivetta, for now. Good to see.

[notin]

That’s normal. Let’s hope that Sale hasn’t developed Buchholz Disease.

 

Clay Buchholz should have been called "The Cable Company." Because he will get that next pitch out to you any time between 5 minutes from now and the following August...

[notin]

Manaea to the Padres. But we have Rich Hill, Mr. 5+ ERA Wacha, and Paxton who is in the running for the Mark Prior Award. Good job, Bloomie.

 

To me, it depends on the cost of Manaea. The Padres have a deep, deep farm even after some of their trading binges. If we had to give up, say, Nick Yorke, I'd have passed, too. Jarren Duran? I pack his bags myself. But Oakland so far has appeared to want quantity over quality...

[Old Red]

You stated we know nothing about baseball for supporting a 42 year old with a strong record of pitching extremely well at an advanced age.

 

If we had chose to spend that $5M on someone else, it still should have been a pitcher- not a hitter. Anyone who knows anything about baseball would know that!

 

He did not state that anybody on here knows nothing about the game for supporting Hill. As usual you put your twist on things to fit your narrative, so you can jump on someone, who you think you know more than they do.

[moonslav59]

To me, it depends on the cost of Manaea. The Padres have a deep, deep farm even after some of their trading binges. If we had to give up, say, Nick Yorke, I'd have passed, too. Jarren Duran? I pack his bags myself. But Oakland so far has appeared to want quantity over quality...

 

We could have given them 3 guys worth what the guys they got are worth. Even 4 or 5

[Bellhorn04]

FWIW Keith Law had the 2 Padres prospects ranked #8 and #18 in their system.

[notin]

FWIW Keith Law had the 2 Padres prospects ranked #8 and #18 in their system.

 

I was looking for a way to somewhat compare them to some of the Sox prospects.

 

Fangraphs hasn’t done a Padres’ system review and their Future Value system is as close as I can find, but even that is a little vague sometimes…

[moonslav59]

I was looking for a way to somewhat compare them to some of the Sox prospects.

 

Fangraphs hasn’t done a Padres’ system review and their Future Value system is as close as I can find, but even that is a little vague sometimes…

 

Maybe the A's see something hardly anyone else sees, but I can't help but think we could have bettered that offer and hardly noticed our farm weakening.

[vegasbob]

Rich Hill cannot be a GM's proposed solution to helping a contending team repeat above 90 wins , contributing 150+ innings . I'll be impressed if Rich is still pitching by July 31 . Hoping for the best but expecting no more than we did from Perez or Weber last year.

[Bellhorn04]

Rich Hill cannot be a GM's proposed solution to helping a contending team repeat above 90 wins , contributing 150+ innings . I'll be impressed if Rich is still pitching by July 31 . Hoping for the best but expecting no more than we did from Perez or Weber last year.

 

2021 Perez = 2022 Hill

2021 Richards = 2022 Wacha

[notin]

Rich Hill cannot be a GM's proposed solution to helping a contending team repeat above 90 wins , contributing 150+ innings . I'll be impressed if Rich is still pitching by July 31 . Hoping for the best but expecting no more than we did from Perez or Weber last year.

 

Rich Hill threw more IP last year than ERod did...

[moonslav59]

2021 Perez = 2022 Hill

2021 Richards = 2022 Wacha

 

I like Hill more than I liked Richards or Perez, at this time, last year.

 

I like Wacha about the same as Richards and more than Perez.

 

Neither is by a lot.

 

Having Houck for a full season will help, and maybe more innings from Whitlock can make up the difference.

 

As of now, I'm expecting more innings fro Sale, but maybe Eovaldi gives us less.

 

I think our starters look about the same as they did, last March. (Remember, ERod was a huge question mark.)

Edited April 3, 2022 by moonslav59

[Larry Cook]

I like Hill more than I liked Richards or Perez, at this time, last year.

 

I like Wacha about the same as Richards and more than Perez.

 

Neither is by a lot.

 

Having Houck for a full season will help, and maybe more innings from Whitlock can make up the difference.

 

As of now, I'm expecting more innings fro Sale, but maybe Eovaldi gives us less.

 

I think our starters look about the same as they did, last March. (Remember, ERod was a huge question mark.)

 

What about innings from some youngsters in our system? Do you see any of them being able to contribute this year for a limited number of starts if need be?

[moonslav59]

What about innings from some youngsters in our system? Do you see any of them being able to contribute this year for a limited number of starts if need be?

 

I see Houck and Whitlock getting more innings.

 

I had originally thought Seabold was ready for the bigs, but MVP talked me out of that hope.

 

Maybe Crawford or Winckowski. Bello might impress enough to come up later in the season. I see Groome as a dark horse.

 

Soxprospects has DHern, Brian Keller, Thomas Pannone and Kyle Hart as other AAA syarters and Belloe and Groome starting in AA.

[notin]

 

I had originally thought Seabold was ready for the bigs, but MVP talked me out of that hope.

 

He is a dream killer…

[Larry Cook]

I see Houck and Whitlock getting more innings.

 

I had originally thought Seabold was ready for the bigs, but MVP talked me out of that hope.

 

Maybe Crawford or Winckowski. Bello might impress enough to come up later in the season. I see Groome as a dark horse.

 

Soxprospects has DHern, Brian Keller, Thomas Pannone and Kyle Hart as other AAA syarters and Belloe and Groome starting in AA.

 

Crawford’s velocity has been outstanding this spring, I would like to see him in the bullpen this year, ala Whitlock.

 

Interestingly enough, groome’s velocity, after Tommy John, has not come back.