Red Sox Sign Marwin Gonzalez

[notin]

To me, they should have spent no matter what in regards to keeping Mookie. That means resetting in 2022/23, huge lux tax payments prior to resetting, and possibly losing Xander and Devers. Though moving those two could bring back the prospects to restock the farm.

 

I would have liked that, and I have always maintained (correct or not) that it was more possible without some of the other spending...

[notin]

I think Bloom would have known virtually from the moment he was hired that trading Price and/or Eovaldi wasn't going to be the answer to the payroll issues.

 

The timing is immaterial. Right after he was hired, doubtful he had any sort of executable plan...

[notin]

By the same token, baseball-wise it might not have been smart for Bloom to fill in season ticket holders on exactly what was going on with Mookie. And maybe at that point he didn't know himself.

 

Per a700, he was answering a question. Unless I misunderstood that part and refuse to go back and look it up. He can correct me if need be...

[mvp 78]

I would have liked that, and I have always maintained (correct or not) that it was more possible without some of the other spending...

 

If they don't extend Sale or re-sign Eovaldi, they could have re-signed Mookie. They just didn't have the willingness to put money aside for him.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

If they don't extend Sale or re-sign Eovaldi, they could have re-signed Mookie. They just didn't have the willingness to put money aside for him.

 

By the fall of '19, it seemed more like they were really hoping JD would opt out. Writers seemed to be making either/or claims about JD and Mookie, and then we had Kennedy's quote: "There is a way to keep them both." Of course, he never told us or showed us that way, or if it had a sound-effect like "Cha-ching!"

[notin]

By the fall of '19, it seemed more like they were really hoping JD would opt out. Writers seemed to be making either/or claims about JD and Mookie, and then we had Kennedy's quote: "There is a way to keep them both." Of course, he never told us or showed us that way, or if it had a sound-effect like "Cha-ching!"

 

Who was it who said the Sox would not be able to keep two $30million players?

[a700hitter]

That are known to YOU.

 

Blows my mind how often sports fans take rock solid positions on something (in this case Bloom is now a confirmed lying sack of s*** apparently) while having less than a fraction of the information at hand to make such certain statements.

 

Idiotic.

No, there are no publicly known or disclosed developments via club statement or Mookie statement after that meeting. I have said that I would like to ask Bloom the question, but with nothing on the public record after the date of the meeting, I conclude that he lied. But feel free to keep going in this absurd circle.

[a700hitter]

By the same token, baseball-wise it might not have been smart for Bloom to fill in season ticket holders on exactly what was going on with Mookie. And maybe at that point he didn't know himself.

I have been at these meetings before where similar questions have been asked of Red Sox and Mets GMs. This is the first time that I have had a GM answer so unequivocally about the importance of keeping a player and then actively market him for trade and trade him before the start of the season.

[moonslav59]

By the fall of '19, it seemed more like they were really hoping JD would opt out. Writers seemed to be making either/or claims about JD and Mookie, and then we had Kennedy's quote: "There is a way to keep them both." Of course, he never told us or showed us that way, or if it had a sound-effect like "Cha-ching!"

 

The "way" was to pay Betts, Price, JD, Sale & Bogey and have 21 replacement level players fill out the rest of the roster. (Sarcasm alert but with kernal of truth.)

[Bellhorn04]

If they don't extend Sale or re-sign Eovaldi, they could have re-signed Mookie. They just didn't have the willingness to put money aside for him.

 

The timeline suggests they went to Mookie first with the $300 million offer. When the negotiations failed, they went to Sale and Bogaerts. Sale and Bogaerts didn't sign their extensions until right before the 2019 season.

 

That's why it doesn't really make sense to say Sale's or Bogey's money prevented them from keeping Betts. If they had worked out a deal with Mookie, they wouldn't have kept Sale or Bogey.

 

They told everyone this after the 2018 season, in fact. They said they'd love to be able to keep those three but probably wouldn't be keep all of them.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The timeline suggests they went to Mookie first with the $300 million offer. When the negotiations failed, they went to Sale and Bogaerts. Sale and Bogaerts didn't sign their extensions until right before the 2019 season.

 

That's why it doesn't really make sense to say Sale's or Bogey's money prevented them from keeping Betts. If they had worked out a deal with Mookie, they wouldn't have kept Sale or Bogey.

 

They told everyone this after the 2018 season, in fact. They said they'd love to be able to keep those three but probably wouldn't be keep all of them.

 

Grumplestiltskin, I acknowledge this timeline and agree with your side of the story.

[mvp 78]

The timeline suggests they went to Mookie first with the $300 million offer. When the negotiations failed, they went to Sale and Bogaerts. Sale and Bogaerts didn't sign their extensions until right before the 2019 season.

 

That's why it doesn't really make sense to say Sale's or Bogey's money prevented them from keeping Betts. If they had worked out a deal with Mookie, they wouldn't have kept Sale or Bogey.

 

They told everyone this after the 2018 season, in fact. They said they'd love to be able to keep those three but probably wouldn't be keep all of them.

 

Saying "we'll give you 300M" and then ending after the other side counters IS NOT A NEGOTIATION.

[vegasbob]

Does no one think that at some point in the negotiation discussions Betts told Bloom or JH that despite anything you offer I am walking ? He would never say this publicly and alienate the RS fan base, but it wouldn't be a big surprise to me that he informed them that he wasn't going to extend in Boston. Whether he had the Dodgers in mind as a landing spot is open for speculation .

 

I think the Red Sox got what they could for a guy who was moving on no matter what. If you knew Mookie personally and asked him, would he have signed an extension with Boston for $350MM or even 4400MM, it would be useful to know his true answer.

[jad]

Saying "we'll give you 300M" and then ending after the other side counters IS NOT A NEGOTIATION.

 

Correct.

[a700hitter]

The timeline suggests they went to Mookie first with the $300 million offer. When the negotiations failed, they went to Sale and Bogaerts. Sale and Bogaerts didn't sign their extensions until right before the 2019 season.

 

That's why it doesn't really make sense to say Sale's or Bogey's money prevented them from keeping Betts. If they had worked out a deal with Mookie, they wouldn't have kept Sale or Bogey.

 

They told everyone this after the 2018 season, in fact. They said they'd love to be able to keep those three but probably wouldn't be keep all of them.

Keeping vs Trading is a different issue. Making a statement that Mookie was a priority to keep and then trading him only a month after the renewal date for tickets without an explanation of anything changing since his statement leads me to doubt his veracity.

[Bellhorn04]

Does no one think that at some point in the negotiation discussions Betts told Bloom or JH that despite anything you offer I am walking ? He would never say this publicly and alienate the RS fan base, but it wouldn't be a big surprise to me that he informed them that he wasn't going to extend in Boston. Whether he had the Dodgers in mind as a landing spot is open for speculation .

 

I think the Red Sox got what they could for a guy who was moving on no matter what. If you knew Mookie personally and asked him, would he have signed an extension with Boston for $350MM or even 4400MM, it would be useful to know his true answer.

 

It's been reported that when the Red Sox offered the $300 million, Mookie's side countered at $420 million. And that was apparently the end of it.

[a700hitter]

Does no one think that at some point in the negotiation discussions Betts told Bloom or JH that despite anything you offer I am walking ? He would never say this publicly and alienate the RS fan base, but it wouldn't be a big surprise to me that he informed them that he wasn't going to extend in Boston. Whether he had the Dodgers in mind as a landing spot is open for speculation .

 

I think the Red Sox got what they could for a guy who was moving on no matter what. If you knew Mookie personally and asked him, would he have signed an extension with Boston for $350MM or even 4400MM, it would be useful to know his true answer.

I don’t think that happened for 2 reasons:

 

1. Mookie is very smart and he would not eliminate one of the biggest checkbooks in baseball that he could use as bargaining power to drive up his price.

 

2. The Red Sox love to cover their asses with the fans so I have no doubt that after the fact that they would have disclosed that information that Mookie told them he wouldn’t be coming back.

[Bellhorn04]

The timing is immaterial. Right after he was hired, doubtful he had any sort of executable plan...

 

OK, to rephrase, no one in their right mind would think Price and Eovaldi's contracts could be moved that offseason without eating a huge chunk of the money.

[Bellhorn04]

I don’t think that happened for 2 reasons:

 

1. Mookie is very smart and he would not eliminate one of the biggest checkbooks in baseball that he could use as bargaining power to drive up his price.

 

2. The Red Sox love to cover their asses with the fans so I have no doubt that after the fact that they would have disclosed that information that Mookie told them he wouldn’t be coming back.

 

Leaking the $420 million ask by Mookie was as close as they could come to covering their asses.

[moonslav59]

Leaking the $420 million ask by Mookie was as close as they could come to covering their asses.

 

I still think they should have made a counter offer, even if they knew it would be turned down... something like $340M/11. It would have showed more effort and desire to keep him, even if just for "show."

 

Betts would not have accepted even $350M/11, and that's probably what Bloom realized.

[mvp 78]

It's been reported that when the Red Sox offered the $300 million, Mookie's side countered at $420 million. And that was apparently the end of it.

 

So NOT a negotiation then.

[Bellhorn04]

So NOT a negotiation then.

 

A futile exchange of offers then?

[jacksonianmarch]

Two things:

 

1. Mookie Betts saw the writing on the wall with the sox. You don't hire Chaim Bloom from TB to be a big spender. He knew the team was heading for a rebuild and veterans have little interest in rebuilds

 

2. Bloom saw a team with no farm and tons of dead weight on their lux tax ledger. Adding in a player, even a generational talent, like Mookie at his cost would have limited the sox in upgrading some other positions that were in dire need long term.

 

The divorce was needed for both sides. To rehash is unnecessary at this point as I do think there is a chance you fill your SS position post Bogaerts (after he opts out) and you'll have an all star caliber RFer in his stead

[mvp 78]

On Marwin:

 

@ChrisCotillo

For now, this is the last outstanding signing for the Red Sox. If the timing works out, the 40-man move can be moving Sale to the 60-day IL.

[moonslav59]

Two things:

 

1. Mookie Betts saw the writing on the wall with the sox. You don't hire Chaim Bloom from TB to be a big spender. He knew the team was heading for a rebuild and veterans have little interest in rebuilds

 

2. Bloom saw a team with no farm and tons of dead weight on their lux tax ledger. Adding in a player, even a generational talent, like Mookie at his cost would have limited the sox in upgrading some other positions that were in dire need long term.

 

The divorce was needed for both sides. To rehash is unnecessary at this point as I do think there is a chance you fill your SS position post Bogaerts (after he opts out) and you'll have an all star caliber RFer in his stead

 

How did extending Sale and Bogey fit into this neat analysis?

[moonslav59]

On Marwin:

 

@ChrisCotillo

For now, this is the last outstanding signing for the Red Sox. If the timing works out, the 40-man move can be moving Sale to the 60-day IL.

 

Doesn't moving him to the 60 Day IL have to happen after the season starts?

 

Does that mean our last roster addition will happen opening day or the day after?

 

I still thing we can easily DFA Springs, Walden,Wilson or even Brice before the Sale move is made, and we could add 1-2 players at low costs.

[mvp 78]

Doesn't moving him to the 60 Day IL have to happen after the season starts?

 

Does that mean our last roster addition will happen opening day or the day after?

 

I still thing we can easily DFA Springs, Walden,Wilson or even Brice before the Sale move is made, and we could add 1-2 players at low costs.

 

Can move players in Spring Training.

 

During Spring Training and during the MLB regular season up through August 31st, an injured or ill player can be placed on or transferred to the MLB 60-day Injured List only if his club's reserve list is full

 

A player cannot be placed on the MLB 60-day Injured List after the conclusion of the MLB regular season, and during the post-season and off-season, up until the start of Spring Training (beginning on the date that pitchers & catchers are scheduled to report).

 

Thursday is pitchers & catchers.

[moonslav59]

Can move players in Spring Training.

 

During Spring Training and during the MLB regular season up through August 31st, an injured or ill player can be placed on or transferred to the MLB 60-day Injured List only if his club's reserve list is full

 

A player cannot be placed on the MLB 60-day Injured List after the conclusion of the MLB regular season, and during the post-season and off-season, up until the start of Spring Training (beginning on the date that pitchers & catchers are scheduled to report).

 

Thursday is pitchers & catchers.

 

Thanks.

 

That does mean we can use his roster slot for one more signing or addition.

 

Again, it's not like DFA'ing Springs or some others would be a tough thing to do.

[mvp 78]

Thanks.

 

That does mean we can use his roster slot for one more signing or addition.

 

Again, it's not like DFA'ing Springs or some others would be a tough thing to do.

 

We'd use his slot for Marwin. Would need to dump someone else to sign another MLB guy.

[Bellhorn04]

Two things:

 

1. Mookie Betts saw the writing on the wall with the sox. You don't hire Chaim Bloom from TB to be a big spender. He knew the team was heading for a rebuild and veterans have little interest in rebuilds

 

Your timeline is wrong. The $300 million offer to Mookie was made after the 2018 championship season.