The Time Has Come: Why the Red Sox Must Trade from Their Outfield Depth This Offseason

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

1 hour ago, UtahSox said:

Did you watch the playoff series? 0 RBI’s ZERO out of 3 OF and 1b……. 3 hits out of 42 AB out of Rafaela, Abreu, Lowe, Romy and Duran just need some home run threats SOMEWHERE. Too hard to score striking out like we did, this offense needs a power boost.

Absolutely -- and it wasn't just the dumb Bronx series where the longball could've changed everything. ALL the other playoff rounds had games decided by HRs.

It got to the point that even an ex-pitcher like Breslow finally admitted that in order to go deep in October, teams have to hit big flies deep into the night.

[moonslav59]

Can we trade Masa and Hicks for Devers? Maybe throw in Harrison?

[Duran Is The Man]

17 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Can we trade Masa and Hicks for Devers? Maybe throw in Harrison?

yeah, and Yofree Rodrigueaz, whatshisname Grissom, and the rest of the garbage we've got in the last dozen trades.

[moonslav59]

34 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

yeah, and Yofree Rodrigueaz, whatshisname Grissom, and the rest of the garbage we've got in the last dozen trades.

Except Crochet...and oh yea...Narvaez...

[Duran Is The Man]

9 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Except Crochet...and oh yea...Narvaez...

c'mon moon....put down the bong for a minute. yeah, we gave up a shitload for Crochet but holyf*** have the Sox been fleeced in nearly every trade they've made since DD was canned.

[JoeBrady]

3 hours ago, UtahSox said:

Yikes….. Okamoto, Polanco, Story, Mayer, Anthony, Rafaela, Abreu, W/ Romy/ Yoshida @DH……. Bottom 10 offense with high strikeout rates here we come!

We were #7 in scoring last year and had an OPS of .745.  Ignoring Okamoto, since I can't find good projections for him, a team of Casas, Polanco, Story, Mayer, Anthony, Rafaela, Abreu, Yoshida, and Narvaez, projects to an OPS of .752, according to Steamer.

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Absolutely -- and it wasn't just the dumb Bronx series where the longball could've changed everything. ALL the other playoff rounds had games decided by HRs.

It got to the point that even an ex-pitcher like Breslow finally admitted that in order to go deep in October, teams have to hit big flies deep into the night.

We absolutely did not hit in the playoffs, but if Duran doesn't drop a fly ball, or if the runner was sent, etc.

[moonslav59]

21 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

c'mon moon....put down the bong for a minute. yeah, we gave up a shitload for Crochet but holyf*** have the Sox been fleeced in nearly every trade they've made since DD was canned.

Pick up a bong, dude! Pack a big bowl and light er up. My stoney memory is better than yours!

I'm looking at Brez and seeing more good than average or bad.

Good: Crochet, Narvaez, Slaten, Fitts & Weissert for Dugo, scraps for O'Neill, Yorke for Priester

OK or TBD:, Sonny Gray, minor deals- Steve Matz, Sandlin

Bad: Sale, Devers (so far) Priester (so far), minor deals-L Garcia, L Sims, Paxton, D May

[Larry Cook]

4 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

c'mon moon....put down the bong for a minute. yeah, we gave up a shitload for Crochet but holyf*** have the Sox been fleeced in nearly every trade they've made since DD was canned.

Nobody bats 1.000 in trades. I love the job bres-slow has done thus far 

[moonslav59]

1 minute ago, Larry Cook said:

Nobody bats 1.000 in trades. I love the job bres-slow has done thus far 

He's done very well with trades. It's his FAs that have a not paid off.

I still don't blame him for Sale, but it's the nature of the job to be blamed for a 35 year old injured pitcher to find a second life.

The Priester trade was also understandable, and maybe Holobetz steals the limelight.

The Devers trade was a situation caused before the need for the trade. Blame Brez for that, if you want, but a few people have to share in that blame, along with Devers and Cora.

Crochet, Narvaez, Slaten, O'Neill and the Dugo dump tip the balance to plus. I also think the Gray trade will be a good one, despite the fact that he might not be a #2. Maybe Oviedo surprises us. There is also Fajardo, Sandlin & Holobetz TBD.

[notin]

7 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

Nobody bats 1.000 in trades. I love the job bres-slow has done thus far 

Especially since a lot of dust hasn’t settled yet.

Did we already lose Priester for 17yo Yophery Rodriguez, John Holobetz, and the pick that was Marcus Phillips?

I think when it comes to bad Sox trades, the focus is Sale, Betts and Devers, probably exclusively in many eyes.  The problem is, none of these deals were done for the sole purpose of collecting talent…

[Duran Is The Man]

8 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

Nobody bats 1.000 in trades. I love the job bres-slow has done thus far 

notice that i said AFTER DD was canned. this includes Bloom.

[Hugh2]

10 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

Nobody bats 1.000 in trades. I love the job bres-slow has done thus far 

Every trade is good, or every trade is a bust when you ignore 1/2 of them

[Hugh2]

I think we’re about to see either Duran or Abreu get delt in the next 6-7 days.  We got the meetings coming up and it’s highly likely to happen when the action takes place.  

[Old Red]

10 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

He's done very well with trades. It's his FAs that have a not paid off.

I still don't blame him for Sale, but it's the nature of the job to be blamed for a 35 year old injured pitcher to find a second life.

The Priester trade was also understandable, and maybe Holobetz steals the limelight.

The Devers trade was a situation caused before the need for the trade. Blame Brez for that, if you want, but a few people have to share in that blame, along with Devers and Cora.

Crochet, Narvaez, Slaten, O'Neill and the Dugo dump tip the balance to plus. I also think the Gray trade will be a good one, despite the fact that he might not be a #2. Maybe Oviedo surprises us. There is also Fajardo, Sandlin & Holobetz TBD.

I agree with most except for the Devers part. I blame Brez 100% for the way the fiasco was handled, and what was handled, and if the Red Sox don’t grossly overpay like the Red Sox already did for 1 year of Bregman, and Bring Bregman back it will all be for a 1, and done, and will be worse than the Mookie fiasco.

[moonslav59]

53 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Every trade is good, or every trade is a bust when you ignore 1/2 of them

First of all, are you counting every single trade since DD, including no names for no names or just the significant ones? Who determines which ones are significant, as in if a non name for no name trade yields a good player on either side, does the trade then become a good or bad trade? For example, had we traded Priester and he amounted to nothing, it would have never been mentioned, unless Holobetz shines, later.

No doubt the Betts trade sucks in every way. Go ahead and blame Bloom, despite the fact that DD was close to trading him, too.

No doubt the Devers trade sucked, and it will suck more if we don't use the money saved to add more talent.

No doubt the Sale trade ended up sucking and the frail Sale suddenly found health for the first 3/4 of two seasons with ATL, and the hope of Grissom fixing out 2nd base issue fizzled out quickly.

What other major trades were clear failures?

Hembree and Workman for Pivetta?

Did Beni do so well that his trade for Wink and others was some horrible trade?

Aldo Ramirez for Kyle Schwarber?

Vazquez for Abreu and E Valdez?

2 scrub pitchers for T O'Neill?

Ammons for Slaten?

A bunch of prospects for Crochet

Are these major trades?

Cash for Ottavino? Cash for Y Rios?

Scherff for H Robles?

Dugo for Weissert & Fitts?

Renfroe for JBJ & DHam was a bad one, but Renfroe was no big loss.

Springs for Ro Hernandez was pretty bad.

Barnes for Blier?

3 scrubs for Danny Jansen?

Yorke for Priester? Then Priester for Holobetz & others.

Some minor ones I thought of: (Do they count?)

Chavis for Austin Davis

Diekman for McGuire

Blalock for Luis Urias/ Urias for I Campbell

Bolivar for Paxton

Schreiber for Sandlin

Gaspar for Moran

Booser for Fajardo

Recents: Fitts & Clarke for Gray/ JGarcia for Oviedo +

I probably forgot a few, so please list them out.

Show me more bad trades than good.

Now, on FA signings, I'll drive the "We Have Sucked Bandwagon."

 

 

[moonslav59]

13 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I agree with most except for the Devers part. I blame Brez 100% for the way the fiasco was handled, and what was handled, and if the Red Sox don’t grossly overpay like the Red Sox already did for 1 year of Bregman, and Bring Bregman back it will all be for a 1, and done, and will be worse than the Mookie fiasco.

100%?

A player won't play where he is needed and he gets 0% of the blame?

A manager is too chicken to ask the player to play a new position: 0% blame?

Not sure how Bregman factors into discussions about trades, but if you go down that rabbit hole, then the trade is TBD.

[Old Red]

11 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

100%?

A player won't play where he is needed and he gets 0% of the blame?

A manager is too chicken to ask the player to play a new position: 0% blame?

Not sure how Bregman factors into discussions about trades, but if you go down that rabbit hole, then the trade is TBD.

This has already been gone over 1000 times on here. A player won’t play where he is needed? Did Cora say Raffy was needed at 1B? NO! Cora is too chicken to ask Raffy to play a new position. I know that’s what you believe to fit your constant bad narrative on Raffy after you preached Devers Forevers for years many times over. I don’t think Cora was chicken at all, but didn’t think Raffy would be a good 1B, and didn’t see it benefiting the team. Why to put a lesser bat at DH? Also was 100% behind Raffy telling Brez to do his job. The Red Sox wouldn’t be in such a need of big bats in the lineup if Raffy was still there now would there? That’s all on Brez 100%.👋

[JoeBrady]

51 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

then the trade is TBD.

The trade is TBD.  Devers had a .807 OPS with SF.  If we sign Schwarber or Alonso, and they give us only an .807, there will be rioting in the streets.

[UtahSox]

1 hour ago, Hugh2 said:

I think we’re about to see either Duran or Abreu get delt in the next 6-7 days.  We got the meetings coming up and it’s highly likely to happen when the action takes place.  

The only reason I want Duran traded instead of Abreu is the ~$8M it saves. That’s it. And the fact we’re even talking about nickel-and-diming like this tells you everything — we’re fully in the “budget team” era now.  It’s wild: ownership disappears, management goes silent, and then their media echo chamber tries to convince us they just “don’t have the money”. COME ON!!

Red Sox fans aren’t begging the team to keep pace with the Yankees or Dodgers. Ownership has successfully lowered our expectations away from that. We’re literally just saying: don’t get outspent by the Mets, Phillies, AND Blue Jays. When your revenue is firmly top 3–4 in MLB, and 100m + more than Mets, Phils, and BJ’s………. RS fans expecting top-5 spending isn’t greedy — it’s basic.

That’s the standard this franchise HAS, Red Sox fans are everywhere. There’s a reason that when the Sox roll into a visiting ballpark, it can feel like a home game — the brand is that powerful, that deep, that generational. A franchise with this reach, this history, and this revenue shouldn’t be acting like it’s scraping coins out of the couch cushions. The brand is elite — now it needs ownership to act like it once again. 

Spending up to the next tax threshold could literally be the difference between a nice season and a legit World Series run. And the front office knows exactly how much revenue a deep October run generates — it pays for itself ten times over. The last few years, whatever… we weren’t that close, so the penny-pinching didn’t sting as much. But this year? This year we’re actually close.

This is the window where a real organization pushes in, not pulls back. If Sox fall short because they were afraid to cross tax line, that’s on JH — not the roster, not the coaches, not the Front office. 

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

3 minutes ago, UtahSox said:

This is the window where a real organization pushes in, not pulls back. If Sox fall short because they were afraid to cross tax line, that’s on JH — not the roster, not the coaches, not the Front office. 

I like this. The Yankees are always all in, but they're also desperate to win in the Judge Era. So they sign Cole, Rodon, Fried -- top of the rotation guys at the top of the free agent market every year.

They also trade a boatload of prospects for Soto, another generational talent. Sucks for them that he left for the Mets, but it was worth it to make the World Series.

And no regrets dealing those prospects, because the Yankees will just fill those positions when necessary by signing other guys. If there's a bad signing, cut your losses and move on. 

Boston can also afford to do all of the above, especially now in the Roman Empire.

[Larry Cook]

12 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

 

The Devers trade was a situation caused before the need for the trade. Blame Brez for that, if you want, but a few people have to share in that blame, along with Devers

I believe cora and bres-slow handled the Devers situation badly, no doubt!

but Devers and his agent caused too much of a distraction to the team and organization for Bres-slow to allow Devers to stay. 

San Fran graciously rescued us!!   this trade was a win for the Red Sox organization!! 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Old Red said:

This has already been gone over 1000 times on here. A player won’t play where he is needed? Did Cora say Raffy was needed at 1B? NO! Cora is too chicken to ask Raffy to play a new position. I know that’s what you believe to fit your constant bad narrative on Raffy after you preached Devers Forevers for years many times over. I don’t think Cora was chicken at all, but didn’t think Raffy would be a good 1B, and didn’t see it benefiting the team. Why to put a lesser bat at DH? Also was 100% behind Raffy telling Brez to do his job. The Red Sox wouldn’t be in such a need of big bats in the lineup if Raffy was still there now would there? That’s all on Brez 100%.👋

You've said this a 1000 times, too.

I guess you remember Devers playing 1B, where we needed him. I don't. It's all Brez's fault,,, LOL!

[moonslav59]

11 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

I believe cora and bres-slow handled the Devers situation badly, no doubt!

but Devers and his agent caused too much of a distraction to the team and organization for Bres-slow to allow Devers to stay. 

San Fran graciously rescued us!!   this trade was a win for the Red Sox organization!! 

All three had some blame. I could see going 33-33-33 or 50-25-25 or whatever, but in no way is it 100% on anyone. That's my opinion. I can't see how Devers and Cora are 100% blameless.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

All three had some blame. I could see going 33-33-33 or 50-25-25 or whatever, but in no way is it 100% on anyone. That's my opinion. I can't see how Devers and Cora are 100% blameless.

It was 10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10 -- that's 10 Asst. VPs who have been entrenched in the front office since at least when Raffy came up as a 20-year-old. 

They all knew all about him: his personality, and how he'd react when they intentionally wouldn't prepare him for the Bregman acquisition. And poor Devers, by pouting and refusing to bend -- and better yet, calling them out in public -- "forced" the org to wipe that albatross contract clean off the books!

Devious, for sure. Unbelievable? What's more hard to fathom: that out of an entire overloaded office of the best Ivy League brains a billionaire can collect, not one of these Einsteins could forsee this scenario?

Not one genius Red Sox Exec felt the need to reach out to the team's sensitive best hitter and highest paid player with the longest tenure BEFORE signing his asterisking replacement?

Put it another way: if they were all suddenly that dumb, how did  they keep their jobs after losing their one star home run hitter?

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

3 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

It was 10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10 -- that's 10 Asst. VPs who have been entrenched in the front office since at least when Raffy came up as a 20-year-old. 

They all knew all about him: his personality, and how he'd react when they intentionally wouldn't prepare him for the Bregman acquisition. And poor Devers, by pouting and refusing to bend -- and better yet, calling them out in public -- "forced" the org to wipe that albatross contract clean off the books!

Devious, for sure. Unbelievable? What's more hard to fathom: that out of an entire overloaded office of the best Ivy League brains a billionaire can collect, not one of these Einsteins could forsee this scenario?

Not one genius Red Sox Exec felt the need to reach out to the team's sensitive best hitter and highest paid player with the longest tenure BEFORE signing his asterisking replacement?

Put it another way: if they were all suddenly that dumb, how did  they keep their jobs after losing their one star home run hitter?

They could be happy he's gone, toasting with champagne and cashing in their Xmas bonus checks with the Devers money saved.

[moonslav59]

These guys are likely high-fiving the fact that they got two TOTR starters for $23M total (21 Gray + 2 Oviedo.)

They convinced themselves Casas will get 650 PAs and hit 35 bombs.

They see Anthony as a top 3 MVP vote getter in 2025 and expect Mayer to bust out and hit over .800.

They think 14 Sp'ers equals 5 great ones.

They think 2B is not worthy of any sense of decency.
They have some serious holes to fill. The good thing is there are only 2-3 major holes. The problem is, they just see one or two minor tweaks needed.

 

[Old Red]

53 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

It was 10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10 -- that's 10 Asst. VPs who have been entrenched in the front office since at least when Raffy came up as a 20-year-old. 

They all knew all about him: his personality, and how he'd react when they intentionally wouldn't prepare him for the Bregman acquisition. And poor Devers, by pouting and refusing to bend -- and better yet, calling them out in public -- "forced" the org to wipe that albatross contract clean off the books!

Devious, for sure. Unbelievable? What's more hard to fathom: that out of an entire overloaded office of the best Ivy League brains a billionaire can collect, not one of these Einsteins could forsee this scenario?

Not one genius Red Sox Exec felt the need to reach out to the team's sensitive best hitter and highest paid player with the longest tenure BEFORE signing his asterisking replacement?

Put it another way: if they were all suddenly that dumb, how did  they keep their jobs after losing their one star home run hitter?

 

 

 

Of course we had some on here with one in particular, who went around doing his Paul Revere impression shouting Devers Forevers, Devers Forevers, Devers Forevers to all, and any who would listen year after year.🤔🤫

[Duran Is The Man]

52 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

It was 10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10-10 -- that's 10 Asst. VPs who have been entrenched in the front office since at least when Raffy came up as a 20-year-old. 

They all knew all about him: his personality, and how he'd react when they intentionally wouldn't prepare him for the Bregman acquisition. And poor Devers, by pouting and refusing to bend -- and better yet, calling them out in public -- "forced" the org to wipe that albatross contract clean off the books!

Devious, for sure. Unbelievable? What's more hard to fathom: that out of an entire overloaded office of the best Ivy League brains a billionaire can collect, not one of these Einsteins could forsee this scenario?

Not one genius Red Sox Exec felt the need to reach out to the team's sensitive best hitter and highest paid player with the longest tenure BEFORE signing his asterisking replacement?

Put it another way: if they were all suddenly that dumb, how did  they keep their jobs after losing their one star home run hitter?

 

 

 

don't forget Ryan Otero, hired just a few days ago as a "Special Assistant to the CBO". or, maybe, he's just a "special" assistant to the CBO. and Theo....what the f*** happened to him? do we need to put his face on a milk carton?

[Larry Cook]

3 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

These guys are likely high-fiving the fact that they got two TOTR starters for $23M total (21 Gray + 2 Oviedo.)

They convinced themselves Casas will get 650 PAs and hit 35 bombs.

They see Anthony as a top 3 MVP vote getter in 2025 and expect Mayer to bust out and hit over .800.

They think 14 Sp'ers equals 5 great ones.

They think 2B is not worthy of any sense of decency.
They have some serious holes to fill. The good thing is there are only 2-3 major holes. The problem is, they just see one or two minor tweaks needed.

 

We have an offer out therefor 4 years to Alonso. The market for Alonso is soft! 
 
if I were Alonso, I would leverage that offer to get an offer from the Mets!!