Orioles (Sugano) vs Red Sox (Buehler): 8/19/25, 7:10pm

[drewski6]

2 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

It's best if you consider Cora's strengths. He may not always be a great in-game manager, but he always has the backs of everyone in uniform. Have you ever heard him call out a coach or a player in a postgame press conference?

Cora may not be shy about indirect criticisms of the CBO after trade deadlines -- "the roster is the roster" -- but he always covers for his guys.

We all see how aggressive AC wants to be sending runners on steals, so does it make any sense he wouldn't want his fastest player trying to score on a fly ball, after intentionally bunting him over to 3rd? Eaton or Hudson or both blew it, but Cora immediately blamed it on series planning -- which is either his own fault, or  an opportunity to take a shot at 17 of the 87 Assistant VPs in the Analytics Department.

It didnt feel like AC to me, to hold there.

[drewski6]

19 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Baseball players aren’t always known for their athleticism. There are many overweight out of shape players in the league. If the guy can play well he can be on my team.

Fair, but most unathletic dudes are either pitchers , catchers or homerun hitters.  Maybe a couple quick twitch 3b athletes.  Like chubby but great reaction speed.  But casas isnt my guy.  Hes , to me, none of those things.  

There may be some power that we havent seen, but Im going to want to aggressively make the team better this offseason and so hes going to get competition for reps.  I prob bring in 2 big bats if its me and let the chips fall where they may.  One is prob a middle infielder, so there should be a spot open (either DH or 1b).

But I am NOT using a bunch of in house guys to justify a boring off season.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

I have not given up on Casas like others here. His career OPS is .800 and his OPS+ is 118. He certainly got off to a bad start but he has proven that he can hit. If he can manage to keep healthy he would almost certainly be a big asset.

I agree, but I don't think he will ever get to be even okay on defense.

I do wonder why his last month .580 doesn't carry as much weight as others you seem to think will repeat what they've done the last month over the next month.

I doubt Casas will be the next Dalbec, but I guess it's possible.

Casas

.830 in first 840 PAs in MLB (ages 22-24)

Dalbec

.819 in first 545 PAs in MLB (ages 25-26)

Both are horrible defenders.

My worry is counting on Casas for 2026, but if we keep Lowe (1 more arb), I guess we might end up being okay.

[moonslav59]

39 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

But casas isnt my guy.  Hes , to me, none of those things.  There may be some power that we havent seen...

Casas has averaged over 30 Hrs per 650.

We haven't seen it?

[FredLynn]

18 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I agree, but I don't think he will ever get to be even okay on defense.

I do wonder why his last month .580 doesn't carry as much weight as others you seem to think will repeat what they've done the last month over the next month.

I doubt Casas will be the next Dalbec, but I guess it's possible.

Casas

.830 in first 840 PAs in MLB (ages 22-24)

Dalbec

.819 in first 545 PAs in MLB (ages 25-26)

Both are horrible defenders.

My worry is counting on Casas for 2026, but if we keep Lowe (1 more arb), I guess we might end up being okay.

Small sample size for 2025. If he could become even adequate on defense and maintain his .800 OPS and stay on the field that’s fine with me. Lowe won a GG and is a bit less potent on offense. Either way is fine with me.

[FredLynn]

56 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

Fair, but most unathletic dudes are either pitchers , catchers or homerun hitters.  Maybe a couple quick twitch 3b athletes.  Like chubby but great reaction speed.  But casas isnt my guy.  Hes , to me, none of those things.  

There may be some power that we havent seen, but Im going to want to aggressively make the team better this offseason and so hes going to get competition for reps.  I prob bring in 2 big bats if its me and let the chips fall where they may.  One is prob a middle infielder, so there should be a spot open (either DH or 1b).

But I am NOT using a bunch of in house guys to justify a boring off season.

You wanna bet that Henry is pulling the strings on Breslow and that another cheapskate offseason is in store? I’d put money down on that.

[moonslav59]

12 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Small sample size for 2025. If he could become even adequate on defense and maintain his .800 OPS and stay on the field that’s fine with me. Lowe won a GG and is a bit less potent on offense. Either way is fine with me.

It is a 112 PA sample size, which is small, yes, but why is the last month's Sox sample sizes more telling and predictive?

[notin]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Casas has averaged over 30 Hrs per 650.

We haven't seen it?

Well

 

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

You wanna bet that Henry is pulling the strings on Breslow and that another cheapskate offseason is in store? I’d put money down on that.

The Sox have extended Crochet, Campbell, Bello, Rafaela and Roman Anthony, all recently.  Plus signed Bregman and Chapman.  Just because they are not going stupid in the free agent market does not mean they are not spending…

[FredLynn]

2 hours ago, drewski6 said:

Fair, but most unathletic dudes are either pitchers , catchers or homerun hitters.  Maybe a couple quick twitch 3b athletes.  Like chubby but great reaction speed.  But casas isnt my guy.  Hes , to me, none of those things.  

There may be some power that we havent seen, but Im going to want to aggressively make the team better this offseason and so hes going to get competition for reps.  I prob bring in 2 big bats if its me and let the chips fall where they may.  One is prob a middle infielder, so there should be a spot open (either DH or 1b).

But I am NOT using a bunch of in house guys to justify a boring off season.

Mayer may work out at 2B. You gotta use him somewhere-or trade him. 1B could still be a problem but Lowe might work out. 
I agree that we need a couple of reliable bats and a solid #2 SP. We also need a catcher. I don’t trust either guy we have with a bat. We don’t need an offensive minded catcher if we don’t have other black holes.

I’m sure youre as tired as I am at waiting till next year. Too many bad or mediocre teams for 7 years running.

[moonslav59]

I think the Sox will look at all these options and think it's likely we end up with a capable 1Bman and 2Bman...

1B: Casas, Lowe, Campbell, Jh Garcia & Romy

2B: Mayer, Romy, Campbell, DHam/Grissom & Arias getting closer to pushing Story to 2B

This does look better, to me, than how these two slots looked last winter, but back then, I had dreams of Devers at 1B and Casas at DH or traded for Castillo.

We have the top priorities of keeping Bregman and Chapman or replacing one or both, in kind. I still put SP'er as the next highest priority- above 1B & 2B, and maybe even pen depth is more important, too.

Maybe signing Luis Arraez could help 1B & 2B, but I'm not sure he's really a 2B option, despite being just 28 years old. He also has no power, and we need more of that.

[Maxbialystock]

6 hours ago, drewski6 said:

Im open to the possibility that I am holding bloom against breslow and have gotten what i want (turnover and churn) but am having trouble seeing it due to fighting with friends for years that we need more than to just bring back the same players from last years team because youve grown to like them (joey)

but this deadline felt like more of the same. And your offseason plan doesnt have enough churn.

One more time.  Name another Sox CBO since 2002 who brought in a better haul for one season than Bregman, Crochet, Chapman, Narvaez.   Plus he brought in May last 3 weeks ago and May has had 2 quality starts and an ERA of 2.87.  Am I the only one on Talksox who noticed that?  

The Sox also got better after losing Devers.  

Nevertheless, I'm plenty worried after those 2 losses to Baltimore and the hot Yankees coming up.  I see the postseason in jeopardy.  

[FredLynn]

1 hour ago, notin said:

Well

 

The Sox have extended Crochet, Campbell, Bello, Rafaela and Roman Anthony, all recently.  Plus signed Bregman and Chapman.  Just because they are not going stupid in the free agent market does not mean they are not spending…

The bottom line is that we have been mediocre or worse since 2018 except for one year. They’re doing something wrong obviously. 

[FredLynn]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

It is a 112 PA sample size, which is small, yes, but why is the last month's Sox sample sizes more telling and predictive?

Couple reasons: first players are returning to their career averages-which have a much larger sample size-and second, because so many players are stinking that it doesn’t bode well for the entire team.

[Bellhorn04]

10 hours ago, FredLynn said:

The bottom line is that we have been mediocre or worse since 2018 except for one year. They’re doing something wrong obviously. 

A lot of screwed pooches starting in 2019 for sure, starting with the decision not to pay Betts what he was looking for.

Things are looking up some now, but they still need to do better.

[drewski6]

12 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

I think the Sox will look at all these options and think it's likely we end up with a capable 1Bman and 2Bman...

1B: Casas, Lowe, Campbell, Jh Garcia & Romy

2B: Mayer, Romy, Campbell, DHam/Grissom & Arias getting closer to pushing Story to 2B

This does look better, to me, than how these two slots looked last winter, but back then, I had dreams of Devers at 1B and Casas at DH or traded for Castillo.

We have the top priorities of keeping Bregman and Chapman or replacing one or both, in kind. I still put SP'er as the next highest priority- above 1B & 2B, and maybe even pen depth is more important, too.

Maybe signing Luis Arraez could help 1B & 2B, but I'm not sure he's really a 2B option, despite being just 28 years old. He also has no power, and we need more of that.

Being okay with capable is how you get stuck in mediocre land.  I can see them doing this, but I hope they dont.  I wanna trade for Brent Rooker but Oakland isnt Oakland anymore. They are Vegas now and prob not giving him up.

[mvp 78]

Casas has maxed out at 500 PA's. Who cares what his 650 is? 

[drewski6]

11 hours ago, Maxbialystock said:

One more time.  Name another Sox CBO since 2002 who brought in a better haul for one season than Bregman, Crochet, Chapman, Narvaez.   Plus he brought in May last 3 weeks ago and May has had 2 quality starts and an ERA of 2.87.  Am I the only one on Talksox who noticed that?  

The Sox also got better after losing Devers.  

Nevertheless, I'm plenty worried after those 2 losses to Baltimore and the hot Yankees coming up.  I see the postseason in jeopardy.  

WHy you keep trying to give me homework? Who are you, my third grade teacher? Well, let me tell you something, mrs burnett.....

I would assume the answer to your trivia question is Dombrowski.  

Listen bro, Im on a campaign.  And that campaign is justice for the dude who Bresbot fired for saying "what a stiff" about Bres when he thought he was on mute.  Maybe a little reflection on why people think that.  Maybe a little less thin-skinned , shoot the messenger.  Unless he fired the guy for not knowing how to mute on a call , which is more justifiable to me

I want Alex as President of Baseball operations.  It will be up to AC whether Bres stays.  But I want AC to be Bres boss, not reverse.

 

[mvp 78]

11 hours ago, Maxbialystock said:

One more time.  Name another Sox CBO since 2002 who brought in a better haul for one season than Bregman, Crochet, Chapman, Narvaez.   Plus he brought in May last 3 weeks ago and May has had 2 quality starts and an ERA of 2.87.  Am I the only one on Talksox who noticed that?  

The Sox also got better after losing Devers.  

Nevertheless, I'm plenty worried after those 2 losses to Baltimore and the hot Yankees coming up.  I see the postseason in jeopardy.  

Ben the Boob actually created a functional team in 2013:

Napoli 3.7 bWAR

Drew 2.7 bWAR

Gomes 1.6 bWAR

Victorino 6.0 bWAR

Carp 1.5 bWAR

Ross 0.7 bWAR 

Koji 3.5 bWAR

Peavy 0.6 bWAR (partial year)

 

[drewski6]

4 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Casas has maxed out at 500 PA's. Who cares what his 650 is? 

Casas only recently decided to start hustling. Of course he doesnt know how to step on a bag at full speed.

At the very least, homeboy needs a peloton

[drewski6]

Just now, mvp 78 said:

Ben the Boob actually created a functional team in 2013:

Napoli 3.7 bWAR

Drew 2.7 bWAR

Gomes 1.6 bWAR

Victorino 6.0 bWAR

Carp 1.5 bWAR

Ross 0.7 bWAR 

Koji 3.5 bWAR

Peavy 0.6 bWAR (partial year)

 

I liked Ben the bot

[mvp 78]

Theo 2003:

Millar

Walker

Mueller

Papi

Timlin

Williamson

Arroyo

 

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

5 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Theo 2003:

Millar

Walker

Mueller

Papi

Timlin

Williamson

Arroyo

 

Millar was the most coveted that offseason, with international relations at stake to turn his plane around on the way to Japan.

Theo and his staff really set the bar high for front office sleuthing, nabbing guys about to break out, like Mueller hitting 9th in the order to win the batting title, or their '03 postseason HR leader with 5... Todd Walker. 

They also picked up a good closer who the manager wouldn't let close out the pennant the last day.

[moonslav59]

16 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

Being okay with capable is how you get stuck in mediocre land.  I can see them doing this, but I hope they dont.  I wanna trade for Brent Rooker but Oakland isnt Oakland anymore. They are Vegas now and prob not giving him up.

I do think it's okay to strive for "just capable" at a few positions, as long as a few other factors are in place:

1. You have depth at that position.

2. You are plus at almost all other 26 slots.

3. You are plus-plus at enough positions to make up for any unforeseeable or seeable pitfalls.

One thing about this team is its balance, but we tend to lack enough top players to make us a top contender.

Just about every team has positions where they are actually not capable and even bad or horrible. Here are just a few I found on the top 4 teams in MLB. (BTW, CHC is #5, LAD is #6 & SDP is #7. Those teams were once thought to be top 4.)

MIL: SS position bats .608 & 2B .637. Out of their top 10 batters by PAs, only 2 are over .786 and none are over .830.

DET has a pretty balanced offense, but 5 positions are below the league .719 OPS: .649 at 3B, .652 CF, .707 SS, .713 C and ,714 DH. Is 5 less than capable positions enough to have the best AL record? YES! They also have 2 of their top 4 IP guys over 4.50.

PHI has 4 of their top 10 batters under .710. Luzardo is at 4.21 and Nola at 6.92.

TOR has 3 of their top 10 batters under .669 and some sketchy pitchers.

[drewski6]

2 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I do think it's okay to strive for "just capable" at a few positions, as long as a few other factors are in place:

1. You have depth at that position.

2. You are plus at almost all other 26 slots.

3. You are plus-plus at enough positions to make up for any unforeseeable or seeable pitfalls.

One thing about this team is its balance, but we tend to lack enough top players to make us a top contender.

Just about every team has positions where they are actually not capable and even bad or horrible. Here are just a few I found on the top 4 teams in MLB. (BTW, CHC is #5, LAD is #6 & SDP is #7. Those teams were once thought to be top 4.)

MIL: SS position bats .608 & 2B .637. Out of their top 10 batters by PAs, only 2 are over .786 and none are over .830.

DET has a pretty balanced offense, but 5 positions are below the league .719 OPS: .649 at 3B, .652 CF, .707 SS, .713 C and ,714 DH. Is 5 less than capable positions enough to have the best AL record? YES! They also have 2 of their top 4 IP guys over 4.50.

PHI has 4 of their top 10 batters under .710. Luzardo is at 4.21 and Nola at 6.92.

TOR has 3 of their top 10 batters under .669 and some sketchy pitchers.

Im okay with being capable at either 1b or dh.  But not both. I want one of those positions to push a .850 OPS to complete the top half of the lineup=.  Feels like 1b or DH is the easiest route to getting a slugger.  And I dont want hope at both positions. I want an Alonso or a Brent Rooker at one of them, take a chance with inhouse candidates at the other

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

1 hour ago, drewski6 said:

WHy you keep trying to give me homework? Who are you, my third grade teacher? Well, let me tell you something, mrs burnett.....

I would assume the answer to your trivia question is Dombrowski.  

Listen bro, Im on a campaign.  And that campaign is justice for the dude who Bresbot fired for saying "what a stiff" about Bres when he thought he was on mute.  Maybe a little reflection on why people think that.  Maybe a little less thin-skinned , shoot the messenger.  Unless he fired the guy for not knowing how to mute on a call , which is more justifiable to me

I want Alex as President of Baseball operations.  It will be up to AC whether Bres stays.  But I want AC to be Bres boss, not reverse.

 

Whatever gets Cora removed as manager of the SOX I'm all for it.

[notin]

15 hours ago, drewski6 said:

Fair, but most unathletic dudes are either pitchers , catchers or homerun hitters.  Maybe a couple quick twitch 3b athletes.  Like chubby but great reaction speed.  But casas isnt my guy.  Hes , to me, none of those things.  

There may be some power that we havent seen, but Im going to want to aggressively make the team better this offseason and so hes going to get competition for reps.  I prob bring in 2 big bats if its me and let the chips fall where they may.  One is prob a middle infielder, so there should be a spot open (either DH or 1b).

But I am NOT using a bunch of in house guys to justify a boring off season.

If the in-house players fill the voids, why not?

I do agree Casas has more questions than answers.  While talent might not be his issue, durability most definitely is.  His injuries always occur during the most mundane baseball activities.  Even Sale at least had the occasional “that would have taken anyone out” moment amidst his exposed frailties…

[notin]

1 minute ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

Whatever gets Cora removed as manager of the SOX I'm all for it.

I am no Cora fan.  Hes better than, say, Kevin “the wins are on me, the losses are on them” Kennedy or Bobby Valentine.  But I think he leaves room for improvement.

Not anyone would be an improvement over Cora.  Hes far from the worst we’ve seen.  If they ever did replace him, who makes sense to take over?  Because much like with the very unpopular John Henry, I think we would find it’s easier to step down than step up…

[mvp 78]

5 minutes ago, SPLENDIDSPLINTER said:

Whatever gets Cora removed as manager of the SOX I'm all for it.

I think you need someone to take a hit out on John Henry. 

[mvp 78]

3 minutes ago, notin said:

I am no Cora fan.  Hes better than, say, Kevin “the wins are on me, the losses are on them” Kennedy or Bobby Valentine.  But I think he leaves room for improvement.

Not anyone would be an improvement over Cora.  Hes far from the worst we’ve seen.  If they ever did replace him, who makes sense to take over?  Because much like with the very unpopular John Henry, I think we would find it’s easier to step down than step up…

Cora .536 win %

Grady .552 win %

Time for a redemption arc. Right everybody?!?!?

[drewski6]

11 minutes ago, notin said:

If the in-house players fill the voids, why not?

I do agree Casas has more questions than answers.  While talent might not be his issue, durability most definitely is.  His injuries always occur during the most mundane baseball activities.  Even Sale at least had the occasional “that would have taken anyone out” moment amidst his exposed frailties…

Because there is an expectation that they should be trying to get better. Not crossing items off the shopping list because they have a body there.  And if you are trying to compete, you shouldnt be going into the season with 3 "if"s at your positional player mix. Its too many.  And sometimes adequate isnt good enough.

Gotta stick your neck out.