Red Sox (Dobbins) vs Yankees (Rodon): 6/8/25, 7:10pm

[jdc69]

2 hours ago, Maxbialystock said:

Someone else wrote a neat article about why neither Cora nor Breslow is expendable.  

I agree managers are hired to be fired and that a lousy team is a good excuse for doing so.

On the other hand, I also think Cora is a terrific manager and perfect for this season.  Does anyone on here know where the Sox team ERA is ranked?  Anyone?  It's 23d out of 30 teams.  And the blame for that rests entirely with Breslow and somewhat with CB before him and of course with JH the owner.    Plus 15 games ago Cora lost his best player and hitter for maybe 2 months.   The Sox were 26-26 after Bregman's last game on May 23d.  Since then they are 6-9 without him.  But they are now 3-3 in their last 6 and took 2/3 against the AL East leading Yankees.  

Right now the Sox are winning primarily with their hitting, and it's not just 1 or 2.  Practically the entire lineup has contributed.   What strikes me about the lineups these days is Cora's willingness to change lineups and to use the bench, which we saw yet again tonight.   Subs Gonzalez and Toro are now regulars because they are hitting.  Same goes for Narvaez, who has displaced Wong.  Cora likes Abreu in RF, but lately Ref is starting against lefty starters (and pinch-hitting against lefty relievers).  With the lead tonight, Abreu pinch hit for Ref and stayed in RF.  

I also think the defense is under-rated, especially on Talksox.  The outfield is definitely above average, and so are 3b and catcher.  Story is actually pretty reliable at SS even if he has less range.  Tonight he took that pop fly away from Toro because he saw Toro was having trouble seeing the ball.  He's very good on double plays--and the Sox are ranked 4th in MLB in double plays per game.  So the only two real trouble spots are 2b and 1b.  My guess is that 1b would be a lot worse if Raffy had taken it over.  Toro and Gonzalez have both made good plays there.   

 

 

 

Why is Cora not responsible for the pitching? I personally think he is by pulling them too fast all the time. He did it today to Dobbins today but the offense scored 11 so it didn't matter. He had 3 ER in 5 innings, 2 of them early. So basically he was in a groove. He also only had a 64 pitch count. Bernardino then comes in and gives up 2 in .02 innings. 

I think Cora has screwed up Buehler and Houck with his pulling them and resting them too. 

[cp176]

4 hours ago, jdc69 said:

Why is Cora not responsible for the pitching? I personally think he is by pulling them too fast all the time. He did it today to Dobbins today but the offense scored 11 so it didn't matter. He had 3 ER in 5 innings, 2 of them early. So basically he was in a groove. He also only had a 64 pitch count. Bernardino then comes in and gives up 2 in .02 innings. 

I think Cora has screwed up Buehler and Houck with his pulling them and resting them too. 

Hunter Dobbins is good right now and he has the potential to be much better.  If they choose to never let this kid could pitch to a lineup that third time through, we never get to see whether he can or not.  60 and a few pitches just wasn’t enough.  I’d also like to see him throw that fastball a little more often.   

[Nick]

1 hour ago, cp176 said:

Hunter Dobbins is good right now and he has the potential to be much better.  If they choose to never let this kid could pitch to a lineup that third time through, we never get to see whether he can or not.  60 and a few pitches just wasn’t enough.  I’d also like to see him throw that fastball a little more often.   

He has the lowest walk rate per 9 innings on our staff. He challenges the hitters. He'll give up home runs because he will make mistakes in the strike zone.

Just think about his pitch count of 64 over 5 innings. I rather watch him pitch over Bello any time. So sick and tired of major leaguers that can't throw strikes.

Nothing irks me more than watching Bello get ahead in the count 0-2 then go to 3-2 count. No wonder he has trouble getting through the fourth inning. It's a miracle when he's not over 80 pitches after 5 innings.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

1 hour ago, cp176 said:

Hunter Dobbins is good right now and he has the potential to be much better.  If they choose to never let this kid could pitch to a lineup that third time through, we never get to see whether he can or not.  60 and a few pitches just wasn’t enough.  I’d also like to see him throw that fastball a little more often.   

I think ESPN should interview a few more hundred Yankee players about Dobbins vocal hate for pinstripes...

... but make sure in every interview they plug in shots from the Judge Cam -- Judge is sitting on the bench, Judge is smiling, Judge is changing his baby's diapers, Judge is walking his dogs, he - he's putting on his batting gloves... Judge is on deck!

[moonslav59]

Cora did not choose the pitchers on the 26, 40 and beyond.

He has made some questionable moves, in game, but so does every manager, especially in hindsight.

[mvp 78]

7 hours ago, jdc69 said:

Why is Cora not responsible for the pitching? I personally think he is by pulling them too fast all the time. He did it today to Dobbins today but the offense scored 11 so it didn't matter. He had 3 ER in 5 innings, 2 of them early. So basically he was in a groove. He also only had a 64 pitch count. Bernardino then comes in and gives up 2 in .02 innings. 

I think Cora has screwed up Buehler and Houck with his pulling them and resting them too. 

Houck's issues have nothing to do with Cora. He was a bulk innings guy who nobody on here could agree if he belonged in the pen or rotation prior to last season. Bailey got him to fake it for half a year and he earned and AS appearance for it. This year, it fell apart and he's been trash. Also, there's an apparent injury issue which a lot of people speculated about. 

Buehler was coming of TJS last season and was BRUTAL. He had a little bit of success in the post season, but was horrible otherwise for the whole year. Breslow took a chance and brought him in. He's been up and down and I think it was to be expected. He had a 5.38 ERA last season, 4.49 xFIP. His numbers are slightly better this year and that includes the blow up last time out which is certainly not on Cora. 

[mvp 78]

21 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Cora did not choose the pitchers on the 26, 40 and beyond.

He has made some questionable moves, in game, but so does every manager, especially in hindsight.

The only guy he chose was Breggie.

[Bellhorn04]

13 hours ago, FredLynn said:

2-0

Game over

What a disgusting awful team. Just unwatchable 

You're in peak form Fred.

[mvp 78]

10 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

You're in peak form Fred.

I don't know why some people even bother watch the Red Sox any more. It sounds horrible for them! 

[FredLynn]

9 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

The manager is not asking him to play 1B.

Of course not. Devers made it quite clear that he wasn’t going to do it. 

[mvp 78]

8 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Of course not. Devers made it quite clear that he wasn’t going to do it. 

991 OPS since April 2. He should never play the field again! 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, mvp 78 said:

The only guy he chose was Breggie.

...and then, apparently, wanted him at 2B.

[cp176]

2 hours ago, Nick said:

He has the lowest walk rate per 9 innings on our staff. He challenges the hitters. He'll give up home runs because he will make mistakes in the strike zone.

Just think about his pitch count of 64 over 5 innings. I rather watch him pitch over Bello any time. So sick and tired of major leaguers that can't throw strikes.

Nothing irks me more than watching Bello get ahead in the count 0-2 then go to 3-2 count. No wonder he has trouble getting through the fourth inning. It's a miracle when he's not over 80 pitches after 5 innings.

When Crochet pitches, I watch.  When Dobbins pitches, I watch.  Guess I’m not much of a fan oh well.

[mvp 78]

10 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

...and then, apparently, wanted him at 2B.

That's because he knew Raffy (real coach of the team) wouldn't let Cora adjust the lineup.

[mvp 78]

3 minutes ago, cp176 said:

When Crochet pitches, I watch.  When Dobbins pitches, I watch.  Guess I’m not much of a fan oh well.

I'm glad you're taking care of your mental health. Some people on here are not. 

[moonslav59]

22 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

That's because he knew Raffy (real coach of the team) wouldn't let Cora adjust the lineup.

Maybe, probably... The reason does not matter, to me.

Breg at 3B was obvious.

[Bellhorn04]

49 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

...and then, apparently, wanted him at 2B.

That talk was just to make Raffy relax a little!

(No idea if this contains any truth or not.)

[FredLynn]

1 hour ago, mvp 78 said:

991 OPS since April 2. He should never play the field again! 

Right now our current 1Bman, Romy Gonzales is batting with an OPS of .809, so its all good. But his career OPS is under .700. Being forced to play him at 1B instead of someone who is a proven offensive star because that star player refuses to put the team first isn't how to develop a winning culture. Devers playing 1B would no doubt be a learning experience for him but others have made the switch from 3B to 1B. When Bregman returns our best lineup has Bregman at 3B and Devers at 1B and whoever needs a day off at DH-except that Devers is a selfish child who apparently thinks he can tell the manager where he is going to play.

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

That talk was just to make Raffy relax a little!

(No idea if this contains any truth or not.)

It made it worse, IMO.

[Bellhorn04]

4 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Right now our current 1Bman, Romy Gonzales is batting with an OPS of .809, so its all good. But his career OPS is under .700.

You haven't noticed Toro also playing 1B?

[Bellhorn04]

1 minute ago, moonslav59 said:

It made it worse, IMO.

Maybe to us in the armchairs.  

The Red Sox didn't know they were going to sign Bregman until it actually happened, that's pretty obvious.  Maybe it even surprised them that he took their offer over Detroit's.

[moonslav59]

8 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Maybe to us in the armchairs.  

The Red Sox didn't know they were going to sign Bregman until it actually happened, that's pretty obvious.  Maybe it even surprised them that he took their offer over Detroit's.

I was speaking to Cora's talking about Bregman playing 2B.

Then, when they told Devers he was moving off 3B, they should have mentioned the possibility of playing 1B, someday. (Assuming they did not.)

[Bellhorn04]

5 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I was speaking to Cora's talking about Bregman playing 2B.

Then, when they told Devers he was moving off 3B, they should have mentioned the possibility of playing 1B, someday. (Assuming they did not.)

We're all just guessing about things we have very little information on.

[moonslav59]

7 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

We're all just guessing about things we have very little information on.

Agreed, but Cora did say he liked Bregman at 2B.

[Bellhorn04]

2 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Agreed, but Cora did say he liked Bregman at 2B.

That much is not in dispute.

[mvp 78]

52 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Right now our current 1Bman, Romy Gonzales is batting with an OPS of .809, so its all good. But his career OPS is under .700. Being forced to play him at 1B instead of someone who is a proven offensive star because that star player refuses to put the team first isn't how to develop a winning culture. Devers playing 1B would no doubt be a learning experience for him but others have made the switch from 3B to 1B. When Bregman returns our best lineup has Bregman at 3B and Devers at 1B and whoever needs a day off at DH-except that Devers is a selfish child who apparently thinks he can tell the manager where he is going to play.

The Red Sox have NEVER done the "our DH is whoever needs a day off" gimmick. It's not going to happen. Raffy is the DH. He's hitting the buhjesus out of the ball right now. He needs to stay healthy for the next decade. Just leave him at DH. There's no proof that he'd be an adequate 1b anyway.  

[mvp 78]

49 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

You haven't noticed Toro also playing 1B?

154 OPS+ Abraham Toro? Don't look at his FIELDING PERCENTAGE at 3B where he makes Raffy look like Brooks Robinson. 

[mvp 78]

49 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Maybe to us in the armchairs.  

The Red Sox didn't know they were going to sign Bregman until it actually happened, that's pretty obvious.  Maybe it even surprised them that he took their offer over Detroit's.

Armchair? It's usually an outdoor sofa when I'm watching the game. 

[jdc69]

5 hours ago, cp176 said:

Hunter Dobbins is good right now and he has the potential to be much better.  If they choose to never let this kid could pitch to a lineup that third time through, we never get to see whether he can or not.  60 and a few pitches just wasn’t enough.  I’d also like to see him throw that fastball a little more often.   

Garrett Crochet is the pitcher with the second most innings pitched of any starter in mlb, he was number one. As a team though, even counting Crochet, the Red Sox are well below average in starters innings pitched. That means other than Crochet, the Red Sox starters  probably pitch the least in mlb. 

[FredLynn]

1 hour ago, Bellhorn04 said:

You haven't noticed Toro also playing 1B?

Of course I have. He has done great! His ops currently is .926. Think he can maintain that all year? Keep in mind his career ops is under .700 (.656). The point is that Devers should be at 1B when Bregman returns. Thats our best lineup.