Craig Breslow: CBO of the Red Sox

[S5Dewey]

12 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I think the CWS will certainly ask for Anthony, but I doubt any team offers them more than Mayer, Wink & Abreu. That might even be too much to offer. 

Crochet only has 2 years of control left and only one good season under his belt- and under 150 IP, at that.

Crochet was only an example, my point was that we should be prepared to give good players to get good pitching.  Nothing come cheap and the situation in Chicago made me think that the CWS might match up well with the Sox.

I never thought I'd be saying this because I've been on the Mayer bandwagon ever since Day 1, but his ability to stay on the field concerns me.  I won't be heartbroken whether he stays or goes but whichever it is, it's a gamble. He could become the guy we're looking for or he could be another Tyler O'Neill whom we love when he's in the lineup but can't seem to stay there.

[moonslav59]

47 minutes ago, S5Dewey said:

Crochet was only an example, my point was that we should be prepared to give good players to get good pitching.  Nothing come cheap and the situation in Chicago made me think that the CWS might match up well with the Sox.

I never thought I'd be saying this because I've been on the Mayer bandwagon ever since Day 1, but his ability to stay on the field concerns me.  I won't be heartbroken whether he stays or goes but whichever it is, it's a gamble. He could become the guy we're looking for or he could be another Tyler O'Neill whom we love when he's in the lineup but can't seem to stay there.

I think Luis Castillo was a way better pitcher, when traded, than Crochet is, now. I know SEA gave up a lot, but not a Roman Anthony, or even a Mayer.

I'm fully prepared to give to get, but I'd want a Gilbert or Kirby for Anthony, or a Miller for Mayer. 

The 2 years turns me off. If they'd take Abreu, DHam and Wink for Crochet, I'm all in. Maybe add Dobbins.

[Duran Is The Man]

1 hour ago, S5Dewey said:

I believe Moon is right ^here^ and this should be "make or break" year for JH.  JH is in a position right now where he can afford to pay some big money for some big pitchers.  If he doesn't do this it's going to be apparent that he truly values his pocketbook over the Red Sox.

OTOH, there is the belief (and I confess to being one of those believers) that because this team has so many young, impact, non-pitchers that they were going to take 2024 and see what they've got - who can play at the ML level and who can't- and use the 2024-25 winter to 1) decide who to keep, who to trade, and who to cut loose, and 2) start to assemble a pitching staff that will lead them to being more than "competitive".

If my second paragraphs is what's happening we're going to see some controversial trades in the off season, seeing some fan-favorite young players get traded.  As an example, I can see two or even three of our young position players traded to the CWS for Garrett Crochet. Crochet is good, young, and cheap, and the CWS aren't going anywhere even with him  in 2025 so he's a good match for a team with young talent to spare,  That's the Sox,  But we have to be prepared to give up a Roman Anthony ++ to get him.  

As usual, JMO!

no f***ing way i'd trade Anthony for Crochet. no f***ing way.

[Duran Is The Man]

Just now, moonslav59 said:

I think Luis Castillo was a way better pitcher, when traded, than Crochet is, now. I know SEA gave up a lot, but not a Roman Anthony, or even a Mayer.

I'm fully prepared to give to get, but I'd want a Gilbert or Kirby for Anthony, or a Miller for Mayer. 

The 2 years turns me off. If they'd take Abreu, DHam and Wink for Crochet, I'm all in. Maybe add Dobbins.

i'd give up Mayer & Abreu for Gilbert or Kirby. i'd even give up Casas for either of them and move Devers to first as you suggested earlier. the Mariner's definitely have pitching capital to spend. i think they would need and want Casas more than Mayer. they have a really good SS in AA named Cole Young that is their version of Mayer with very similar stats. and he doesn't seem to be injury-prone like Mayer.

[Randy Red Sox]

9 hours ago, notin said:

Breslow has an advantage Bloom did not.  Breslow inherited a team with several young players breaking out and a farm system with 6 prospects in the Top 100.  That was the plan all along - get the farm going and start producing with young, competitive CHEAP talent.  Hopefully the competitive part improves a little more in 2025…

i was on another forum called Love our Sox and stated this exact thing that Henry wanted the Sox built on YOUNG CHEAP talent through the farm system. and got banned for 'being too negative"  I guess i was wrong ??

[Randy Red Sox]

3 hours ago, S5Dewey said:

Crochet was only an example, my point was that we should be prepared to give good players to get good pitching.  Nothing come cheap and the situation in Chicago made me think that the CWS might match up well with the Sox.

I never thought I'd be saying this because I've been on the Mayer bandwagon ever since Day 1, but his ability to stay on the field concerns me.  I won't be heartbroken whether he stays or goes but whichever it is, it's a gamble. He could become the guy we're looking for or he could be another Tyler O'Neill whom we love when he's in the lineup but can't seem to stay there.

who loves Tyler Oneill ??

[notin]

2 minutes ago, Randy Red Sox said:

i was on another forum called Love our Sox and stated this exact thing that Henry wanted the Sox built on YOUNG CHEAP talent through the farm system. and got banned for 'being too negative"  I guess i was wrong ??

Depends how you said.

If you said “Henry wants homegrown talent fans can identify with from th Time their rookies, and wants a steady flow to keep the wins coming, sun shining and to help save the whales!”  Probably ok.

But if you said “Cheap ass Henry just wants minimum wage talentless players so he can spend more resources hiring child labor to raise ticket prices faster while killing puppies!!”  Might be too negative…

[notin]

6 minutes ago, Randy Red Sox said:

who loves Tyler Oneill ??

Mrs O’Neill?  And his daughter is on the fence…

[notin]

2 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

i'd give up Mayer & Abreu for Gilbert or Kirby. i'd even give up Casas for either of them and move Devers to first as you suggested earlier. the Mariner's definitely have pitching capital to spend. i think they would need and want Casas more than Mayer. they have a really good SS in AA named Cole Young that is their version of Mayer with very similar stats. and he doesn't seem to be injury-prone like Mayer.

BTV suggests the price for Kirby or Gilbert is Duran.  Probably accurate.  Definitely unlikely…

[Randy Red Sox]

5 minutes ago, notin said:

BTV suggests the price for Kirby or Gilbert is Duran.  Probably accurate.  Definitely unlikely…

i would do that trade for either Kirby or Gilbert

[Duran Is The Man]

9 minutes ago, notin said:

BTV suggests the price for Kirby or Gilbert is Duran.  Probably accurate.  Definitely unlikely…

yeah, i don't think so. Duran has an 8.7 bWAR while Gilbert's is the same as Kutter Crawford's.  and Kirby's is even less. 

[moonslav59]

fWAR

4.2 Kirby

3.8 Gilbert

3.7 Burnes

3.5 Kikuchi

3.4 Fried

3.2 Flaherty

3.1 Snell

2.8 Miller

2.5 Nate

2.3 Castillo, Taillon, Woo

2.2 Bassitt

2.1 Severino

2.0 Pivetta

2023-2024

8.5 Kirby (6th in MLB)

7.2 Burnes & Snell (15th)

6.9 Gilbert 20th

6.0 Kikuchi 25th

5.7 Castillo 28th

5.2 Fried 35th

5.0 Flaherty 38th

4.7-4.9 Nate, Crochet, Miller, Bassitt

 

[S5Dewey]

10 hours ago, Randy Red Sox said:

i would do that trade for either Kirby or Gilbert

Not me.  Now we get into the balancing act of offense/defense/pitching and Duran brings a whole new offensive dimension to the Sox.  For me to be willing to consider trading Duran I'd have to be looking at a trade no partnering  team would make.

[Bellhorn04]

11 hours ago, Randy Red Sox said:

who loves Tyler Oneill ??

His supplement supplier.  😁

[moonslav59]

As much as we need a big RHB, I don't think we should spend a penny on O'Neill or anyone else on offense. Maybe a back-up catcher.

We have a few options:

1. Put all our faith in Refsnyder (a top 20 batter vs LHPs in the last 3 seasons) and the return of Story. Maybe a bump up  from Rafaela, Wong or the call-up of Campbell. Call this the in-system solution.

2. Trade Abreu and or DHam for a RHB with similar attributes and add this guy to the pool listed in #1.

DO NOT take any money away from signing pitchers to help the offense. NOT-A-DIME!

[Randy Red Sox]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

As much as we need a big RHB, I don't think we should spend a penny on O'Neill or anyone else on offense. Maybe a back-up catcher.

We have a few options:

1. Put all our faith in Refsnyder (a top 20 batter vs LHPs in the last 3 seasons) and the return of Story. Maybe a bump up  from Rafaela, Wong or the call-up of Campbell. Call this the in-system solution.

2. Trade Abreu and or DHam for a RHB with similar attributes and add this guy to the pool listed in #1.

DO NOT take any money away from signing pitchers to help the offense. NOT-A-DIME!

i am sure John Henry will be happy to accommodate your wishes on spending. We will lucky to resign Pivetta as our #5

Houck

Bello

Crawford

Giolita

Pivetta

[Randy Red Sox]

16 hours ago, notin said:

BTV suggests the price for Kirby or Gilbert is Duran.  Probably accurate.  Definitely unlikely…

there is an article on MLB trade Rumours today that Dipoto says he is not trading any of his starters.  Why would he when he can simply sign a FA bat or 2

[moonslav59]

46 minutes ago, Randy Red Sox said:

there is an article on MLB trade Rumours today that Dipoto says he is not trading any of his starters.  Why would he when he can simply sign a FA bat or 2

Famous last words by a GM.

He will take an offer that returns greater value.

He could trade Castillo for a bat and then also sign another bat or pitcher with the money saved.

[moonslav59]

53 minutes ago, Randy Red Sox said:

i am sure John Henry will be happy to accommodate your wishes on spending. We will lucky to resign Pivetta as our #5

Houck

Bello

Crawford

Giolita

Pivetta

I could see us doing just that: Pivetta, Martin and a cheap LH'd RP'er. Maybe trade Abreu & DHam for a RP and back-up C. Call it a day and pocket more money.

[mvp 78]

 

[notin]

On 9/29/2024 at 6:42 AM, S5Dewey said:

Not me.  Now we get into the balancing act of offense/defense/pitching and Duran brings a whole new offensive dimension to the Sox.  For me to be willing to consider trading Duran I'd have to be looking at a trade no partnering  team would make.

Entirely possible dealing him for Gilbert or Kirby meets that requirement…

[Duran Is The Man]

3 hours ago, notin said:

Entirely possible dealing him for Gilbert or Kirby meets that requirement…

i think someone wondered the other day what the Seattle pitchers looked like at home vs on the road. i stole this from the Mariners forum. not sure how this compares with other teams pitching splits though.

 

 

 

[harmony]

18 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

i think someone wondered the other day what the Seattle pitchers looked like at home vs on the road. i stole this from the Mariners forum. not sure how this compares with other teams pitching splits though.

 

 

 

The Red Sox hope to improve on their 2024 team ERA+ of 106 and team OPS+ of 104 while the Seattle Mariners hope to improve on their 2024 team ERA+ of 106 and team OPS+ of 103 (after August 15 the M'ss led all AL clubs with a wRC+ of 118 while the Sox were near the bottom with a wRC+ of 83).

The thought that the Red Sox need pitching and the Mariners need hitting overlooks their significant diferences in playing environments.

[notin]

On 9/29/2024 at 12:41 PM, Randy Red Sox said:

there is an article on MLB trade Rumours today that Dipoto says he is not trading any of his starters.  Why would he when he can simply sign a FA bat or 2

I agree.

 

Its hard to argue about the value of quality, cost-controlled starting pitching on one hand, and then think other teams will readily trade it to fill gaps on the other…

[Bellhorn04]

49 minutes ago, harmony said:

The Red Sox hope to improve on their 2024 team ERA+ of 106 and team OPS+ of 104 while the Seattle Mariners hope to improve on their 2024 team ERA+ of 106 and team OPS+ of 103 (after August 15 the M'ss led all AL clubs with a wRC+ of 118 while the Sox were near the bottom with a wRC+ of 83).

The thought that the Red Sox need pitching and the Mariners need hitting overlooks their significant diferences in playing environments.

The thing about pitching is, it's the one position where every team has room to improve.  If you acquire a 4 WAR starting pitcher and he bumps a 1.5 WAR pitcher from the rotation to the pen you pick up 2.5 wins and also improve your rotation depth and/or your bullpen.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

1 hour ago, notin said:

I agree.

 

Its hard to argue about the value of quality, cost-controlled starting pitching on one hand, and then think other teams will readily trade it to fill gaps on the other…

It would be like trading a Bronson Arroyo for someone like Wily Mo Pena.

Those days are gone forever, over a long time ago... oh, yeah

(yikes, that deal is 20 years old, and the song quote is 20 years older than that...)

[Bellhorn04]

6 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

It would be like trading a Bronson Arroyo for someone like Wily Mo Pena.

Those days are gone forever, over a long time ago... oh, yeah

(yikes, that deal is 20 years old, and the song quote is 20 years older than that...)

That song is actually 50 years old LOL.  Great song, great album.

[mvp 78]

Breslow did get some things right this year:

[mvp 78]

Kendrik: "Looking back, in hindsight, a horrible decision to have invested that money in a guy that performed as poorly as he did. It was or biggest mistake this season from a talent standpoint. And I'm the perpetrator of that.''

[Bellhorn04]

1 hour ago, mvp 78 said:

Kendrik: "Looking back, in hindsight, a horrible decision to have invested that money in a guy that performed as poorly as he did. It was or biggest mistake this season from a talent standpoint. And I'm the perpetrator of that.''

Seems like a really over the top reaction to me.