Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Hitch]

Ok I don’t mind dealing Schreiber specifically. (And can we quit pretending average = bad.)

 

That they are moving healthy arms to clear way for longer term recovery hopefuls isn’t an exciting plan to watch. It’s Paxton Redux. And Paxton took two years to give the Sox 96 innings of a 4.68 FIP. Do you think he was worth it?

 

It would have been well worth it if Bloom traded the guy!

[mvp 78]

Yes. I’m hoping he works out. I know nothing about the guy.

 

 

At some point the Sox should add an actual starter…

 

May not be this season.

[Hitch]

If Crag was CBO, I believe he would have dealt JD or Sale in '22 and the Sox would have gotten under the CBT. There's also no way Paxton would have been on the team after the trade deadline in '23.

 

If Bloom was the CBO this offseason:

 

Sale is still here

Verdugo is still here

Bloom signs low stakes starter like Lorenzen for 1 year

Churns through the waiver wire for relievers like nobody's business

Doesn't trade for Slaten, but drafts Anthony Prato from the Twins (UTIL)

 

We're all waiting for Bloom to do something, but he's wishy washy about how amazing this season will be.

 

Preach.

[mvp 78]

It looks to me like Breslow is doing some good work. But what's frustrating is that he seems to be confined to playing on the margins.

 

I think the Verdugo and Sale trades were more than playing on the margins. I think he's definitely stuck with this low budget for some ungodly reason. I wonder if the trades slow down for Crag once he gets "his guys" in the org?

[mvp 78]

He’s the most likely one.

 

Luetge is on a minor league deal. Weissert is a 29yo career minor leaguer who probably gets DFAd before the season ends…

 

Funny since his xWOBA, bb rate, hard hit rate, k rate, xERA aren't dramatically different that what Schreiber had last season.

[mvp 78]

Liking Crag so far. Unfortunately, as it stands, he has an excellent chance to Three-Peat the 78-84 record.

 

It's a dirty bit of business. Like some of us have said, they can take a step back in the win column and still be a better ballclub. Crag is doing some work that should have been done prior to the '23 deadline at the very least.

[mvp 78]

It would have been well worth it if Bloom traded the guy!

 

At the trade deadline:

3.34 ERA

7 QS (>50%)

10.29 k/9

2.57 bb/9

 

Needed to trade that guy!

 

After:

 

7.62 ERA

1 QS

7.27 k/9

4.5 bb/9

[Bellhorn04]

I think the Verdugo and Sale trades were more than playing on the margins.

 

Maybe so, but the net result of those trades was moving established players for prospects/depth and shedding salary.

[notin]

Woodruff back to Milwaukee…

[mvp 78]

Maybe so, but the net result of those trades was moving established players for prospects/depth and shedding salary.

 

So that they could sign Yamamoto... errr Montgomery... errr Clevinger... nevermind...

[mvp 78]

Woodruff back to Milwaukee…

 

Worse than missing out on Seth Lugo.

[mvp 78]

@mlbtraderumors

Phillies Designate Kaleb Ort For Assignment

[Bellhorn04]

How's my boy Noah Song doing these days?

[notin]

So that they could sign Yamamoto... errr Montgomery... errr Clevinger... nevermind...

 

Bauer!

[notin]

How's my boy Noah Song doing these days?

 

Probably in camp gearing up for AA ball…

[Hugh2]

Hard to have a bullpen arm when your control is all over the place. He had a 10 bb/9 last year. Not good! He's very inconsistent from game to game and batter to batter. Can't hold his delivery at all.

 

He's Ryan Fernandez with double the bb rate. Ceiling of a middle reliever. I'd just DFA him and not worry about it.

 

Certainly he can fail in the bullpen too, but young arm moves to the bullpen and cuts down on his arsenal and improves his command isn't the most unlikely story. It's the reason why many guys get moved to the bullpen to begin with.

[mvp 78]

Certainly he can fail in the bullpen too, but young arm moves to the bullpen and cuts down on his arsenal and improves his command isn't the most unlikely story. It's the reason why many guys get moved to the bullpen to begin with.

 

Hard to expect that for various reasons with Mata. First, he's perpetually injured. Second, he's forced into an MLB role and can't figure it out in AAA unless he's snuck through waivers. If I were Crag, I'd try putting him through waivers at some point.

[moonslav59]

i get the attempt to be at least a little optimistic, but I'm not buying that the defense looks significantly better at the outset. The only upgrade for certain will be at short if he can stay on the field.

 

You don't see an upgrade from 30th to around 15th at 2B as being significant?

 

We don't need GG at 2B to see a huge improvement over '23.

 

Yoshida at DH has to improve LF.

 

Casas showed growth on D at 1B, as 2023 finished out.

 

CF depends on how much Rafaela plays there. The Duran-Duvall combo of '23 was pretty bad.

[moonslav59]

What is Schreiber like going forward?

 

All below 50th percentile:

 

Av Exit Velo

Chase %

Whiff %

BB %

Hard Hit %

 

xERA 51st

GB % 54th

 

He's an average reliever?

 

Is this just 2023, after coming off the 60 day IL?

 

What were his 2022 numbers like?

 

Or, 2022-2023, combined?

 

(Where do you find these numbers?)

[moonslav59]

Ok I don’t mind dealing Schreiber specifically. (And can we quit pretending average = bad.)

 

Indeed. I made the same point about him being labelled "mediocre."

 

We used 28 pitchers in the pen, last year! YES-- 28! Hell, 23 pitched more than 6 innings, and 19 pitched 11+ IP. It was a recycling bin.

 

Where would Schreiber fall in those rankings?

 

[moonslav59]

And Jansen's $16 million will be gone by 2025 if not sooner.

 

They are probably kicking themselves for not trading him before his injury was discovered.

[mvp 78]

They are probably kicking themselves for not trading him before his injury was discovered.

 

Now they'll just have to let him get healthy and wait for someone else's closer to go down.

[mvp 78]

Is this just 2023, after coming off the 60 day IL?

 

What were his 2022 numbers like?

 

Or, 2022-2023, combined?

 

(Where do you find these numbers?)

 

His '23 numbers only. He pitched well through May 31, but his bb rate was still higher than '22 at 4.24.

 

Maybe he'll be better after resting this offseason, but I'd still do that trade. Should have dealt him in '22 IMO.

[moonslav59]

They need to fix the pipeline. A large way to do that is via trade since they ignored it in the draft for a very long time. Waiting for IFA's is a horrible idea. Only drafting pitchers after the 4th round is a horrible idea.

 

Bloom tried to add young or younger pitchers in other ways than IFA and drafting, too.

 

Whitlock, Winckowski, Pivetta (not real young when added,) Schreiber, Bernardino, Kelly and countless flameouts.

 

Until we draft again, it's hard to know if Brez will change our drafting strategy. We do know little changed in this IFA signing phase. Only one out of the 7 players give a $200K or higher signing bonus was a pitcher. (Dalvinson Reyes at $450K) To be fair, the next two down the list were pitchers at $175K and $140K, making it 3 of the top 9.

 

How Soon Is Now?

 

[moonslav59]

Hard to expect that for various reasons with Mata. First, he's perpetually injured. Second, he's forced into an MLB role and can't figure it out in AAA unless he's snuck through waivers. If I were Crag, I'd try putting him through waivers at some point.

 

I'm not sure how waivers work, but can we pull Mata back off waivers, if someone claims him?

 

I would not be torn up, if we lose him, but the guy was very highly ranked by soxprospects.com, at various points, so maybe he has something. (Yes, I know, there is a long list of top 3 ranked pitching prospects that never amounted to squat.)

[mvp 78]

Indeed. I made the same point about him being labelled "mediocre."

 

We used 28 pitchers in the pen, last year! YES-- 28! Hell, 23 pitched more than 6 innings, and 19 pitched 11+ IP. It was a recycling bin.

 

Where would Schreiber fall in those rankings?

 

Overall:

Martin

Jansen

Winckowski

Pivetta

Crawford

Whitlock

Schreiber

Bernardino

Kelly

Murphy

Jacques

 

Ignoring all others worse than Jacques and/or not around.

[mvp 78]

I'm not sure how waivers work, but can we pull Mata back off waivers, if someone claims him?

 

I would not be torn up, if we lose him, but the guy was very highly ranked by soxprospects.com, at various points, so maybe he has something. (Yes, I know, there is a long list of top 3 ranked pitching prospects that never amounted to squat.)

 

Once DFA'd, Sox can't reclaim them. They could put him through trade waivers instead of irrevocable which get him off he 40 man, but there's no point.

 

Was ranked highly, but the injuries piled up and he took several steps backwards.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Offense- should be better.

 

As a fan it's more fun when your team is bashing its way to wins. But the O is the area most underrated in its neglect this winter.

 

It would be great if all last season's first-year Red Sox improve -- but progress isn't linear, and the sophomore jinx can be very real for batters who don't adjust as well as the editors of pitchers' books on hitters.

 

Story has to be better, because only good teams can carry a glove man who bats .227 with a sub-.700 OPS, which is what he's done in Boston so far.

 

For the new guys, would you take .287 BA, .716 OPS and a game-winning grand slam out of Grissom? Those are feats posted by Pablo Reyes in '23. Can O'Neill produce 44 homers and 154 RBIs? Those are marks combined by Turner and Duvall last year. Verdugo wasn't quite a star, but his career 15% K-rate was half of O'Neill's 30%.

 

As for Devers, we'd gladly accept a repeat of 33-100-.851. But most who watched last year would agree that a better approach to situational hitting is needed. However, with even less big bats in the order to protect Raffy, opposing pitchers have even less reason to throw him anything in the zone. At least the front office can invest in longer bats...

[mvp 78]

As a fan it's more fun when your team is bashing its way to wins. But the O is the area most underrated in its neglect this winter.

 

It would be great if all last season's first-year Red Sox improve -- but progress isn't linear, and the sophomore jinx can be very real for batters who don't adjust as well as the editors of pitchers' books on hitters.

 

Story has to be better, because only good teams can carry a glove man who bats .227 with a sub-.700 OPS, which is what he's done in Boston so far.

 

For the new guys, would you take .287 BA, .716 OPS and a game-winning grand slam out of Grissom? Those are feats posted by Pablo Reyes in '23. Can O'Neill produce 44 homers and 154 RBIs? Those are marks combined by Turner and Duvall last year. Verdugo wasn't quite a star, but his career 15% K-rate was half of O'Neill's 30%.

 

As for Devers, we'd gladly accept a repeat of 33-100-.851. But most who watched last year would agree that a better approach to situational hitting is needed. However, with even less big bats in the order to protect Raffy, opposing pitchers have even less reason to throw him anything in the zone. At least the front office can invest in longer bats...

 

Not sure O'Neillllll will get to the 979 PA's Turner and Duvall got last year. Would be quite the season though. I think Grissom will beat that OPS number. He should figure out 2B. I'm not worried. I think OF could be interesting. Abreu is a huge question mark. He hit well, but can't keep up that torrid pace. Can Duran stay healthy and repeat what he did? Rafaela has a great glove, but is it just a AAAA bat?

[mvp 78]

Unreliable:

 

@Feinsand

Blake Snell has an offer on the table from the Yankees, per source, though the Angels and Giants remain possibilities for the reigning NL Cy Young winner.