Red Sox Starting Rotation 2023

[notin]

What if it's a necessary evil? Without Foulke and Lackey and Price, how many rings?

 

I asked ChatGPT, and it said this could not be determined.

 

I’m scouring the web for a Talksox from an alternate timeline where the Sox signed none of those players. I found one where they only signed Lackey, but you don’t want to go there. Their version of Notin has a very foul mouth and their Bellhorn is best described as “surly”…

[illinoisredsox]

Oh the poor, poor Bloom defense again that we’ve heard a 1000 times over.

 

Followed by the Pavlovian response we've heard 1000 times over.

[Larry Cook]

Followed by the Pavlovian response we've heard 1000 times over.

 

When does it all end?

[illinoisredsox]

When does it all end?

 

If I knew the answer to that . . .

[moonslav59]

When does it all end?

 

Tonight?

[cp176]

yes generally for twice through the rotation.

 

I'm just not so much into the metrics thing I guess.

[cp176]

Sale is more relevant to this team than Wacha…

 

Whatever you mean by relevance in this instance I guess notin. never under any circumstances would I even mention Wacha's name when talking about anything relevant to Sale. There are likely not many players in the game today who have gone through what Sale has gone through to attempt to get back to where he once was. He gets a pass in my book. It's once thing to keep piling on Bloom or Dombrowski I guess but Sale's saga strikes me as a bit different. If more players today, had a little more "Sale" in them, the game might be actually fun to watch. Now I guess this is where some one gets to talk about torn jerseys and how he has collected millions for nothing right?

[Nick]

I haven't been this excited about our young starting pitchers in a long time.

 

True Judge wasn"t in the lineup. So what? Every team deals with injuries.

 

I don't care that we didn't score much.

 

Winning starts with starting rotation. At minimum 3 more years of Bello Houck and Whitlock.

 

If u can't get excited about these three then baseball isn't your game.

 

I got what I wanted. Both Kluber and Pivetta no longer starting. Life is good.

 

I am all in this winter on that Japanese pitcher.

Edited June 12, 2023 by Nick

[Nick]

I'd say other than Mayer no minor leauger is untradeable.

 

I am not advocating cleaning house.

 

If there is a Bello out there then get him.

[notin]

I'd say other than Mayer no minor leauger is untradeable.

 

I am not advocating cleaning house.

 

If there is a Bello out there then get him.

 

The Sox match up with the Marlins on BTV.

 

The Sox have depth IN CF with Duran (30.4) and Rafaela (25.3). These do match up with a few the Marlins’ SP, including Rogers (33.4), Luzardo (27.6), Garrett (22), and Cabrera (21.7).

 

The Marlins desperately need a controllable CF. But no idea how they feel about Duran or Rafaela…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I haven't been this excited about our young starting pitchers in a long time.

 

True Judge wasn"t in the lineup. So what? Every team deals with injuries.

 

I don't care that we didn't score much.

 

Winning starts with starting rotation. At minimum 3 more years of Bello Houck and Whitlock.

 

If u can't get excited about these three then baseball isn't your game.

 

I got what I wanted. Both Kluber and Pivetta no longer starting. Life is good.

 

I am all in this winter on that Japanese pitcher.

 

If only Bloom is...

 

If -- as the old adage goes -- pitching is indeed 70% of the game, and starting pitching is at least half of that (based on a meager 4.5-5 innings per start), then Bloom has failed pretty miserably in this most important category: acquiring sufficient young arm depth for his current and future staff.

 

Of the quartet of Bello, Houck, Crawford and Whitlock, only the latter was added to the organization by Bloom. Paxton has been decent, but no one will be surprised by another IL trip or even a deadline trade before the end of the summer.

 

We know Bloom doesn't want to deal any of his hitting prospects, probably until the front office has had enough time to identify potential core big leaguers. So we just have to be patient, and content with yet more one-year free agent signings next winter... in Year Five of the Pretension of Contention in the Bloom Rebuild.

[notin]

If only Bloom is...

 

If -- as the old adage goes -- pitching is indeed 70% of the game, and starting pitching is at least half of that (based on a meager 4.5-5 innings per start), then Bloom has failed pretty miserably in this most important category: acquiring sufficient young arm depth for his current and future staff.

 

Of the quartet of Bello, Houck, Crawford and Whitlock, only the latter was added to the organization by Bloom. Paxton has been decent, but no one will be surprised by another IL trip or even a deadline trade before the end of the summer.

 

We know Bloom doesn't want to deal any of his hitting prospects, probably until the front office has had enough time to identify potential core big leaguers. So we just have to be patient, and content with yet more one-year free agent signings next winter... in Year Five of the Pretension of Contention in the Bloom Rebuild.

 

 

Will he even add pitchers in a way we’re expecting? If you look at the Tampa staff, the only pitchers they drafted were McClanahan and Bradley…

[cp176]

I'd say other than Mayer no minor leauger is untradeable.

 

I am not advocating cleaning house.

 

If there is a Bello out there then get him.

 

I tend to agree with you about Mayer right now. One of the reasons being that we need deep a shortstop desperately. I would also keep Yorke. Our potential second baseman of the future. To be perfectly honest, I wouldn't mind seeing both of those guys up there right now and I could care less about the mumble jumble about bringing anybody up too soon. Personally I would like to have a better reason to watch them then what they are selling most of the time. Everybody wants to crap on the starting pitching but I tend to tune in when Bello, Paxton, and Houck have the ball.

[mvp 78]

I haven't been this excited about our young starting pitchers in a long time.

 

True Judge wasn"t in the lineup. So what? Every team deals with injuries.

 

I don't care that we didn't score much.

 

Winning starts with starting rotation. At minimum 3 more years of Bello Houck and Whitlock.

 

If u can't get excited about these three then baseball isn't your game.

 

I got what I wanted. Both Kluber and Pivetta no longer starting. Life is good.

 

I am all in this winter on that Japanese pitcher.

 

The offense will have ups and downs. If the pitching comes around it will be HUGE.

[mvp 78]

The Sox match up with the Marlins on BTV.

 

The Sox have depth IN CF with Duran (30.4) and Rafaela (25.3). These do match up with a few the Marlins’ SP, including Rogers (33.4), Luzardo (27.6), Garrett (22), and Cabrera (21.7).

 

The Marlins desperately need a controllable CF. But no idea how they feel about Duran or Rafaela…

 

Luzardo has really struggled against RHB this season and is close to being done with ARB for that valuation. Garrett is too much of a soft tosser for me. Rogers is currently rehabbing an injury and took a huge step backwards last season. Cabrera just walks the park.

 

Not saying that I wouldn't deal for those guys, just that Lopez was the better get there.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Luzardo has really struggled against RHB this season and is close to being done with ARB for that valuation. Garrett is too much of a soft tosser for me. Rogers is currently rehabbing an injury and took a huge step backwards last season. Cabrera just walks the park.

 

Not saying that I wouldn't deal for those guys, just that Lopez was the better get there.

 

If only we had a .400 hitter to trade for a Pablo Lopez...

[notin]

Luzardo has really struggled against RHB this season and is close to being done with ARB for that valuation. Garrett is too much of a soft tosser for me. Rogers is currently rehabbing an injury and took a huge step backwards last season. Cabrera just walks the park.

 

Not saying that I wouldn't deal for those guys, just that Lopez was the better get there.

 

I liked Lopez, too. But if you go by BTV’s model, Duran was only worth a surplus value of $5.9mill when that deal was made. His new (and possibly already outdated) surplus value of $30.8mill is significantly better. Whether or not Miami cares is another matter. But that they got a reigning batting champion for Lopez does place the bat for him much higher.

 

But this is a case where each team has a surplus in one area and a clear need in another. If Miami insist on Arraez-level players, the Sox (and most teams) are out…

[notin]

If only we had a .400 hitter to trade for a Pablo Lopez...

 

Offer up Ted Williams!

[Bellhorn04]

I liked Lopez, too. But if you go by BTV’s model, Duran was only worth a surplus value of $5.9mill when that deal was made. His new (and possibly already outdated) surplus value of $30.8mill is significantly better. Whether or not Miami cares is another matter. But that they got a reigning batting champion for Lopez does place the bat for him much higher.

 

But batting average is meaningless!

[notin]

But batting average is meaningless!

 

No one said it was meaningless. But it is the least informative offensive stat. Agree or disagree?

[Old Red]

No one said it was meaningless. But it is the least informative offensive stat. Agree or disagree?

 

Nothing beats the eye test.

[notin]

Nothing beats the eye test.

 

The eye test is subjective and biased and often incomplete. If I asked you for an assessment of Arraez as a hitter, you’d probably have to look up stats due to a complete dearth of eye test data this year…

[Old Red]

The eye test is subjective and biased and often incomplete. If I asked you for an assessment of Arraez as a hitter, you’d probably have to look up stats due to a complete dearth of eye test data this year…

 

I will admit you have to go to other stats if the eye test isn’t available. Arreaz is on my fantasy team though, so I do know somewhat what he does on a daily basis.

[mvp 78]

I liked Lopez, too. But if you go by BTV’s model, Duran was only worth a surplus value of $5.9mill when that deal was made. His new (and possibly already outdated) surplus value of $30.8mill is significantly better. Whether or not Miami cares is another matter. But that they got a reigning batting champion for Lopez does place the bat for him much higher.

 

But this is a case where each team has a surplus in one area and a clear need in another. If Miami insist on Arraez-level players, the Sox (and most teams) are out…

 

Arraez was a 3 fWAR player. He wasn't Mike Trout. He has a career -18 OAA at 2B, his natural position.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

No one said it was meaningless. But it is the least informative offensive stat. Agree or disagree?

 

I'm going to say the least informative stat is number of walks to 2023 Devers. If he walks more, does that mean he's becoming more selective, or do opponents realize the Sox have absolutely nobody that can protect him in the batting order (until maybe Duvall shows he can bop again with a bum wrist)? Or does it mean Raffy is adopting Casas' approach, looking only for the perfect pitch, and welcomes the base on balls? But does anyone even want their $300 million dollar man strolling to first every game, on an offensive incident that generates traffic on the bases, but only ever moves it one car at a time -- instead of swinging from the heels as much as possible trying to clear the bags?

[mvp 78]

The eye test is subjective and biased and often incomplete. If I asked you for an assessment of Arraez as a hitter, you’d probably have to look up stats due to a complete dearth of eye test data this year…

 

There are only a lucky few TalkSoxers who see Marlins gear at their local Target.

[Old Red]

The eye test is subjective and biased and often incomplete. If I asked you for an assessment of Arraez as a hitter, you’d probably have to look up stats due to a complete dearth of eye test data this year…

 

Can’t stats be misleading too? If you look at Raffy, and his power numbers they look pretty good, but if you watched the games the eye test tells you they might not be as good as they look on paper.

[Dipre]

Can’t stats be misleading too? If you look at Raffy, and his power numbers they look pretty good, but if you watched the games the eye test tells you they might not be as good as they look on paper.

 

This is a clear indication of why the eye test is an incomplete and biased way to evaluate a player. Devers has been exactly as he looks on paper. Objectively good power numbers with a low average and K-prone, yet the eye testers are out here saying he needs a binky and whatever other stuff they can come up with. You can look at him and think he's pressing because of the swing rates, but y'all keep talking like he's lost his entire offensive toolkit because of one bad month because you "see" his childhood insecurities when he's up at the plate. Stop.

[notin]

Can’t stats be misleading too? If you look at Raffy, and his power numbers they look pretty good, but if you watched the games the eye test tells you they might not be as good as they look on paper.

 

You’re moving the goal posts.

 

I said no stat gives you less information about a hitter than batting average. If you disagree, tell me what stat is less informative?

[Bellhorn04]

You’re moving the goal posts.

 

I said no stat gives you less information about a hitter than batting average. If you disagree, tell me what stat is less informative?

 

Triples?