Red Sox Starting Rotation 2023

[Dipre]

Does more power make you a better player?

 

Usually, yes. As does better OBP. Look, it's really simple. Every time you get on base, you don't make an out, therefore you help the offense. And hitting for more power directly causes more run production.

[Old Red]

You're moving the goalposts. That wasn't your initial argument.

 

What was my argument?

[Dipre]

What was my argument?

 

"Hank Aaron's favorite stat was BA, BA and the awesomeness that is the eye test is all you need for evaluating players". Old Red, June 2023.

[notin]

That is where the old times stats BA, HR, and RBI would tell you all you needed to know about Hank. TB was always a big thing with Rice too.

 

RBI tells you very little about a hitter. Did Joe Carter drive in 115 RBI with a .232 BA because he was a great hitter? Or because he batted behind Roberto Alomar and Tony Gwynn? RBI depends too much on other hitters getting on base for you…

[notin]

You're moving the goalposts. That wasn't your initial argument.

 

Ted Williams thought so. Or was his quote “production comes from hitting weak groundballs”?

[Old Red]

RBI tells you very little about a hitter. Did Joe Carter drive in 115 RBI with a .232 BA because he was a great hitter? Or because he batted behind Roberto Alomar and Tony Gwynn? RBI depends too much on other hitters getting on base for you…

 

We were talking about Hank Aaron, and all his numbers tell me all I need to know, which is what this whole thing is all about to me. What I want, and need to know is differently than what you need to want, and know. I don’t care what you seem to want, and know, but it bothers the hell out of you for some reason what I need, and want to know. Like I said before when I mention BA, and, or eye test it sets off bells, and whistles to some on here.

[Old Red]

"Hank Aaron's favorite stat was BA, BA and the awesomeness that is the eye test is all you need for evaluating players". Old Red, June 2023.

 

That obviously is an argument to you, but just an opinion to me that hasn’t, and won’t change much to the chagrin to you, and others.

[moonslav59]

BA surely matters, as do HRs, XBHs and BBs.

 

If only there was a stat that counted all of these!

 

[Old Red]

BA surely matters, as do HRs, XBHs and BBs.

 

If only there was a stat that counted all of these!

 

I’m sure there is for some, but for others it’s just BA, HR, and RBI, and don’t forget the eye test.

[Bellhorn04]

BA surely matters, as do HRs, XBHs and BBs.

 

If only there was a stat that counted all of these!

 

 

BA is so nice, OPS counts it twice.

[notin]

BA is so nice, OPS counts it twice.

 

Just once…

[Bellhorn04]

Just once…

 

A guy who is hitting .350 with no walks and no XBH's has an OPS of .700. .700 is twice .350.

[notin]

A guy who is hitting .350 with no walks and no XBH's has an OPS of .700. .700 is twice .350.

 

But OBP isn’t based on BA; one is per at-bat the other is per plate appearance…

[Bellhorn04]

But OBP isn’t based on BA; one is per at-bat the other is per plate appearance…

 

I get that, but my example is still a fact. A guy who is hitting .350 is guaranteed an OPS of at least .700.

[Dipre]

That obviously is an argument to you, but just an opinion to me that hasn’t, and won’t change much to the chagrin to you, and others.

 

Now it's a semantics issue. Alrighty then.

[Dipre]

I get that, but my example is still a fact. A guy who is hitting .350 is guaranteed an OPS of at least .700.

 

Because BA is a component of OBP and SLG%

[notin]

I get that, but my example is still a fact. A guy who is hitting .350 is guaranteed an OPS of at least .700.

 

 

No he isn’t. It’s very likely, but not guaranteed. It’s rare but it does happen where a player has a lower OBP than BA. This can be accomplished by having more sac flies and sacrifices than walks…

[Dipre]

No he isn’t. It’s very likely, but not guaranteed. It’s rare but it does happen where a player has a lower OBP than BA. This can be accomplished by having more sac flies and sacrifices than walks…

 

Didn't Jeff Francoeur sustain that over almost a season at one point?

[notin]

Didn't Jeff Francoeur sustain that over almost a season at one point?

 

He probably had prolonged stretches. The first hitter I saw do this was Jay Payton when he was in Boston. He did eventually get his OBP above his BA, however.

 

Still, he showed it was possible. Although I hate crediting a whiny blowhard like Payton with anything…

[Jasonbay44]

Tim Anderson about made it about a 1/3 of the season a few years with a higher batting average than OBP.

[moonslav59]

Tim Anderson about made it about a 1/3 of the season a few years with a higher batting average than OBP.

 

What year was that?

[Dipre]

What year was that?

 

Either 2017 or 208, two seasons where he had a sub .300 OBP and a terrible batting average too.

[Larry Cook]

Is there any chance we move pivetta back into the rotation????

[Hugh2]

Is there any chance we move pivetta back into the rotation????

 

Yes, logically that's probably the best decision until Houck is back. I wonder if they try to move Kluber back, with maybe Pivetta set to piggyback him on days if he doesn't "have it" which by my about 60-70% chance on any given start)

[a700hitter]

Kluber’s contract was like flushing money down the toilet.

[Jasonbay44]

Either 2017 or 208, two seasons where he had a sub .300 OBP and a terrible batting average too.

 

Yeah I believe it was 2017. He’s always kinda flirting with doing it though due to his awful walk rate.

[moonslav59]

Yes, logically that's probably the best decision until Houck is back. I wonder if they try to move Kluber back, with maybe Pivetta set to piggyback him on days if he doesn't "have it" which by my about 60-70% chance on any given start)

 

I can't see any other choice but Pivetta.

 

Since Pivetta's last start on May 16th, he has pitched 16.1 innings

2.20 ERA

3.34 FIP

.479 OPS Against (Best on the staff in the last 28 days w 30+ PAs agaisnt)

 

Maybe he found his spot in the pen, but let's give him another chnace at SP'er.

[Nick]

I can't see any other choice but Pivetta.

 

Since Pivetta's last start on May 16th, he has pitched 16.1 innings

2.20 ERA

3.34 FIP

.479 OPS Against (Best on the staff in the last 28 days w 30+ PAs agaisnt)

 

Maybe he found his spot in the pen, but let's give him another chnace at SP'er.

No just as an emergency.

 

You are so gullible. He sucks as a starter. Period.

[moonslav59]

No just as an emergency.

 

You are so gullible. He sucks as a starter. Period.

 

Houck will be out a while. Pivetta should start, until he returns.

 

I never said give Pivetta a chance to stay in the rotation, all year, but with all our pitching injuries, he may end up there for a while.

 

No Sale.

No Houck.

Pen is missing Schreiber, Joely, Bleier, Kelly and Mills

[Nick]

Houck will be out a while. Pivetta should start, until he returns.

 

I never said give Pivetta a chance to stay in the rotation, all year, but with all our pitching injuries, he may end up there for a while.

 

No Sale.

No Houck.

Pen is missing Schreiber, Joely, Bleier, Kelly and Mills

Maybe it's time to give up something of value for young team controlle d starting pitcher.