2020-2021 Offseason Thread

[notin]

I share your enthusiasm for Song, but Wright is closer to impacting a big league club and may have a higher ceiling as well.

 

Doesn't matter, I don't Song even gets you close to Wright.

 

But Dalbec does...

[Bellhorn04]

Two members, if you count Bloom.

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2020/11/yasiel-puig-looking-to-return-to-majors-in-2021.html

 

I see no mention of the recent lawsuit for sexual battery against him.

[Hugh2]

But Dalbec does...

 

Atlanta has enough talent in their rotation to not have to worry about losing Wright, but they are going to lose Teheran next year and Gausman the following year. Wright is a guy who they should hope to slide in and take a rotation spot which is what you want as a first-place team. I just don't see Atlanta taking that deal seriously.

 

Dalbec was never a top 100 prospect and his ceiling strikes me as a Mark Reynolds type of guy if he pans out. There's a lot of swing and miss in his game and he could have a very pedestrian year (despite a decent showing in 2020 sss) and struggle before adjusting to MLB pitching. Atlanta, being a 1st place team might not want to part with a pitcher they think is on the cusp of entering their rotation for a guy who plays a position they don't really need an upgrade at. Riley is probably closer to producing at the MLB level than Dalbec is and he was regarded higher....and I certainly don't see Atlanta moving Dalbec to 1B and kicking Freeman out.

 

A bird in hand is worth two in the bush, and that trade is asking for a bird in hand for a bird in the bush for a team that is in compete now mode.

[Hugh2]

wait....we're talking about Kyle Wright right?

[notin]

wait....we're talking about Kyle Wright right?

 

I am.

 

The Braves might keep Riley at 3b, but they do keep moving him to the OF for some reason, and it isn’t to get more playing time for Johan Camargo...

[notin]

Atlanta has enough talent in their rotation to not have to worry about losing Wright, but they are going to lose Teheran next year and Gausman the following year. Wright is a guy who they should hope to slide in and take a rotation spot which is what you want as a first-place team. I just don't see Atlanta taking that deal seriously.

 

Dalbec was never a top 100 prospect and his ceiling strikes me as a Mark Reynolds type of guy if he pans out. There's a lot of swing and miss in his game and he could have a very pedestrian year (despite a decent showing in 2020 sss) and struggle before adjusting to MLB pitching. Atlanta, being a 1st place team might not want to part with a pitcher they think is on the cusp of entering their rotation for a guy who plays a position they don't really need an upgrade at. Riley is probably closer to producing at the MLB level than Dalbec is and he was regarded higher....and I certainly don't see Atlanta moving Dalbec to 1B and kicking Freeman out.

 

A bird in hand is worth two in the bush, and that trade is asking for a bird in hand for a bird in the bush for a team that is in compete now mode.

 

Also, the Braves lost Teheran to free agency a year ago and released Gausman last August. (Gausman received and accepted a Qualifying Offer from the Giants just a couple weeks ago.)

[kenmeister]

I'm still hoping the Sox sign Corey Kleuber. The upside is very high.

[Hugh2]

Also, the Braves lost Teheran to free agency a year ago and released Gausman last August. (Gausman received and accepted a Qualifying Offer from the Giants just a couple weeks ago.)

 

My god what year am I living in?

 

Well, if anything that makes Wright more valuable to them.

[notin]

My god what year am I living in?

 

Well, if anything that makes Wright more valuable to them.

 

Mid 2018? Trust me. It's better. Take me there.

 

Also, Wright is really just a depth piece for them as they have Soroka, Fried, Newcomb, Wright, Davidson, Wilson, Muller, Anderson and just added Smyly and Morton. All of them except Muller have MLB experience. (Tucker Davidson does only have 1.2 career IP in MLB.)

 

And they have more arms on the way, including Jasseel De La Cruz, Patrick Weigel, Freddy Tarnok, Bryce Elder, and so on and so on.

 

Pitching is not a problem for the Braves. Austin Riley, with his -9.2 career UZR at third and his career .288 OBP (but improving) might be one area they look to improve...

[moonslav59]

Mid 2018? Trust me. It's better. Take me there.

 

Also, Wright is really just a depth piece for them as they have Soroka, Fried, Newcomb, Wright, Davidson, Wilson, Muller, Anderson and just added Smyly and Morton. All of them except Muller have MLB experience. (Tucker Davidson does only have 1.2 career IP in MLB.)

 

And they have more arms on the way, including Jasseel De La Cruz, Patrick Weigel, Freddy Tarnok, Bryce Elder, and so on and so on.

 

Pitching is not a problem for the Braves. Austin Riley, with his -9.2 career UZR at third and his career .288 OBP (but improving) might be one area they look to improve...

 

I like the idea of sweetening the return from the Braves by taking Inciarte. I think we can get Wright, Wilson and Inciarte for Dalbec and some smaller piece. I'm not sure they like Dalbec or what "small piece" they might want.

[cp176]

I very much enjoyed the article I read yesterday about Tanner Houck and the work that he has been putting in this off season in Miami. His work is just as impressive as the Cy Young award winners that he is working out with. I think that he might be one of the special ones. If he isn't successful, it will not be due to a lack of effort on his part. His type of story tends to get me excited.

[moonslav59]

I very much enjoyed the article I read yesterday about Tanner Houck and the work that he has been putting in this off season in Miami. His work is just as impressive as the Cy Young award winners that he is working out with. I think that he might be one of the special ones. If he isn't successful, it will not be due to a lack of effort on his part. His type of story tends to get me excited.

 

Me, too, and to be honest, he came out of nowhere, in terms of my radar. I never expected him to show what he has shown, so far.

 

It's a small sample size, and he still has a lot to prove, but I'm super excited, too!

 

I'm thinking "special one," as well.

[Hugh2]

Here is the Soxprospects summation on Houck

 

"Potential late-inning reliever, with a chance to develop into a back-end starter if his splitter develops to complement his slider and he refines his fastball command. Could also succeed in a multi-inning relief role. Will likely struggle to turn over a lineup of major league-quality hitters with his current pitch mix and mechanics. Arm slot and fastball-slider combination make him extremely difficult on right-handers, but his low arm slot and lack of a third pitch give him trouble against lefties. Splitter is a new addition to his arsenal, but it has shown potential against left-handed hitters, which will be vital to chances stick in the starting rotation. Has the size and demeanor you look for in a pitcher; able to bear down when necessary."

 

A couple of things I'd like to add. At one time Roger Clemens was pegged as a guy who had a ceiling of a #3 starter. You never truly know what a guy can become, and we've been so used to our pitching prospects falling short of expecations I feel like we are due to have a guy shatter them in the other direction. Very SSS but Tanner showed us a lot of promise last year.

[Hugh2]

Mid 2018? Trust me. It's better. Take me there.

 

Also, Wright is really just a depth piece for them as they have Soroka, Fried, Newcomb, Wright, Davidson, Wilson, Muller, Anderson and just added Smyly and Morton. All of them except Muller have MLB experience. (Tucker Davidson does only have 1.2 career IP in MLB.)

 

And they have more arms on the way, including Jasseel De La Cruz, Patrick Weigel, Freddy Tarnok, Bryce Elder, and so on and so on.

 

Pitching is not a problem for the Braves. Austin Riley, with his -9.2 career UZR at third and his career .288 OBP (but improving) might be one area they look to improve...

 

To be fair, Riley has less than 1/3 a season worth of innings at 3B during his first two partial seasons. Before he Graduated from the minors he was a consensus top 50 prospects and ranked 22 by BA with a much higher ceiling and higher floor than Dalbec. Doesn't mean he's going to be better....but if I was a G.M. I'd rather have Riley than Bobby over the next 5 years. I don't see Atlanta parting ways with young pitching for that.

[harmony]

The Red Sox make a waiver claim and outright Ryan Weber and Matt Hall to Triple A:

 

[cp176]

Here is the Soxprospects summation on Houck

 

"Potential late-inning reliever, with a chance to develop into a back-end starter if his splitter develops to complement his slider and he refines his fastball command. Could also succeed in a multi-inning relief role. Will likely struggle to turn over a lineup of major league-quality hitters with his current pitch mix and mechanics. Arm slot and fastball-slider combination make him extremely difficult on right-handers, but his low arm slot and lack of a third pitch give him trouble against lefties. Splitter is a new addition to his arsenal, but it has shown potential against left-handed hitters, which will be vital to chances stick in the starting rotation. Has the size and demeanor you look for in a pitcher; able to bear down when necessary."

 

A couple of things I'd like to add. At one time Roger Clemens was pegged as a guy who had a ceiling of a #3 starter. You never truly know what a guy can become, and we've been so used to our pitching prospects falling short of expecations I feel like we are due to have a guy shatter them in the other direction. Very SSS but Tanner showed us a lot of promise last year.

 

I thought that I had read somewhere that he was being viewed as a late inning kind of guy. Small sample size for sure but he looked very good starting last fall. The work that he is currently putting in isn't done at this level by a lot of guys. he really wants to be out there for a long time. hey I'm fairly excited about Pivetta and Groome. If any one two or three of these guys pan out, we might be enjoyable to watch once again.

[mvp 78]

Stock DFA’d

 

Signed Joel Payamps

[mvp 78]

Also, Hall and Weber cleared waivers to AAA

[moonslav59]

Also, Hall and Weber cleared waivers to AAA

 

We can all breathe easier, now.

[notin]

I thought that I had read somewhere that he was being viewed as a late inning kind of guy. Small sample size for sure but he looked very good starting last fall. The work that he is currently putting in isn't done at this level by a lot of guys. he really wants to be out there for a long time. hey I'm fairly excited about Pivetta and Groome. If any one two or three of these guys pan out, we might be enjoyable to watch once again.

 

Pivetta was a perennial “stuff” guy in Philly and annual breakout candidate who never broke out. Hopefully now is the time. I doubt Groome reaches Boston in 2021. Mata might...

[moonslav59]

Pivetta was a perennial “stuff” guy in Philly and annual breakout candidate who never broke out. Hopefully now is the time. I doubt Groome reaches Boston in 2021. Mata might...

 

I'm cautiously optimistic one or two of these guys will be better than decent- maybe more. I also like Seabold and Ward.

 

Here's a list of the Sox prospects pitchers, their ranking by soxprospects.com, age and projected 2021 level:

 

3. Mata 21 AAA

7. Houck 24 MLB (AAA?)

8. Ward 23 AA (>AAA?)

9. Seabold 24 AAA (>MLB?)

10. A Ramirez 19 A

11. Song 23 N/A

12. Groome 22 A+ (>AA?)

18. C Murphy 22 A+

22. Bello 21 A+

23. J Wallace 22 A+

24. Zeferjahn 22 A+

26. Bazardo 25 AAA (>MLB?)

27. J Rodriguez 20 A

28. D Feltman 23 AAA

30. Chih-Jung Liu 21 A

 

 

 

[Larry Cook]

I thought that I had read somewhere that he was being viewed as a late inning kind of guy. Small sample size for sure but he looked very good starting last fall. The work that he is currently putting in isn't done at this level by a lot of guys. he really wants to be out there for a long time. hey I'm fairly excited about Pivetta and Groome. If any one two or three of these guys pan out, we might be enjoyable to watch once again.

 

I thought houck was our closer of the future from the minute he was drafted.

 

Hernandez-Feldman-houck! I thought this would be the best 7th-9th inning shut down trio in baseball by 2022!

[moonslav59]

I thought houck was our closer of the future from the minute he was drafted.

 

Hernandez-Feldman-houck! I thought this would be the best 7th-9th inning shut down trio in baseball by 2022!

 

Then, you woke up.

 

Was there coffee brewing?

 

[notin]

Then, you woke up.

 

Was there coffee brewing?

 

 

Other than Feltman, it could still happen...

[Bellhorn04]

Other than Feltman, it could still happen...

 

It could, but hopefully it doesn't, because Houck is in the rotation.

[moonslav59]

It could, but hopefully it doesn't, because Houck is in the rotation.

 

I actually feel better about D Hern being a great pitcher than Houck, but that's not a put down on Houck.

 

I know there are countless has been pitchers who "only had to improve their control" to be great but never did, but D Hern has near record-breaking K rates. He can be unhittable.

 

True, the sample size is small (39 IP in MLB), but a 16.3 K/9 rate is astounding! Sadly, so is his 7.9 BB/9 rate. His 5.4 H/9 rate was encouraging, this year, but his BB rate actually went up from 2019.

 

No ML pitcher has a higher K/9 rate and more IP'd than DHern has since 2019. The same can be said about his BB rate. (Actually, no pitcher in MLB history has had a K rate like DHern's after 39 IP.) BTW, DHern's 39 IP small sample size is over double Houck's 17 IP in MLB.

 

 

[notin]

It could, but hopefully it doesn't, because Houck is in the rotation.

 

For now, probably. But that doesn’t mean his successful 3 start stint has him locked in. He might be the 6th starter this year, starting out in Pawtucket. He might be more of an opener than a starter. Or they might move him to the bullpen, an area that also needs help and lots of it.

 

His role might not be as defined as we think it is today...

[cp176]

For now, probably. But that doesn’t mean his successful 3 start stint has him locked in. He might be the 6th starter this year, starting out in Pawtucket. He might be more of an opener than a starter. Or they might move him to the bullpen, an area that also needs help and lots of it.

 

His role might not be as defined as we think it is today...

 

and it is also a possibility that as the season progresses he moves right on up the food chain! he might be a little more talented than your average everyday #6 starting pitcher.

[notin]

and it is also a possibility that as the season progresses he moves right on up the food chain! he might be a little more talented than your average everyday #6 starting pitcher.

 

He will have his share of IP (assuming an actual 162 game season). But the Sox would be better off with 5 better SPs in the rotation and calling up Houck when someone (Eovaldi?) gets hurt.

 

Right now they have ERod, Eovaldi and Pivetta in the rotation, and hopefully they add 1-2 more MLB starting pitchers. Houck has never thrown 120 IP at any level and putting him in a role where he is expected to throw 150-180 IP is not a good idea...

[moonslav59]

He will have his share of IP (assuming an actual 162 game season). But the Sox would be better off with 5 better SPs in the rotation and calling up Houck when someone (Eovaldi?) gets hurt.

 

Right now they have ERod, Eovaldi and Pivetta in the rotation, and hopefully they add 1-2 more MLB starting pitchers. Houck has never thrown 120 IP at any level and putting him in a role where he is expected to throw 150-180 IP is not a good idea...

 

My guess is it's more like 140-160 IP, and they may try to extend his team control years by sending him to AAA for the needed time frame.

 

With Sale starting the season on the IL- likely the 60 day IL, I could see Houck starting the season in the rotation with a pretty strict pitch count, then spending the middle of the season in AAA on a vert low pitch count regime before being called back up, especially if we are in the playoff hunt, later in the season.