2020-2021 Offseason Thread

[Kimmi]

We're almost due for a Scott Boras tirade, methinks.

 

He has already gone on a tirade against Tampa Bay's methodology after they traded Snell. LOL

[moonslav59]

Strange offseason, to say the least. It will be interesting to see if Bauer or Springer end up getting close to what they are asking for.

 

If you go by what Morton & McCann got, you'd think they would, but this is indeed a strange off season.

[Kimmi]

Our next target of interest is Sugano. I understand that decision will come by Jan 7th. The Mets are reportedly in the lead, but we are in there as well. He would fit our needs very well.

 

We may or may not land him, but that doesn't mean that Bloom is not aggressively pursuing these guys.

[Bellhorn04]

Strange offseason, to say the least. It will be interesting to see if Bauer or Springer end up getting close to what they are asking for.

 

I think MLBTR said Springer has a couple of offers in hand over $100 mill, but that he's looking for something like $150 mill. We'll see where he settles.

[Kimmi]

I think MLBTR said Springer has a couple of offers in hand over $100 mill, but that he's looking for something like $150 mill. We'll see where he settles.

 

Yes, I read that as well. Where he settles might depend on how the scenarios for spring training and the season unfold over that upcoming weeks.

[moonslav59]

I'm dying for some action!

[Sox75]

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/report-red-sox-hire-first-black-female-coach-pro-baseball-history

 

Congrats to ... um? Ah... Well, I've forgotten her name, but I'm sure this was a bold PR move none the less.

 

Still, I'd say any help we can give minor leaguers in Fort Myres is a good thing.

 

No doubt this is a bold and interesting move, but I do look forward to some bold moves with respect to 2nd base, 1b, the OF, SP, & our BP.

 

Congrats to Bianca Smith.

[Kimmi]

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/red-sox/report-red-sox-hire-first-black-female-coach-pro-baseball-history

 

Congrats to ... um? Ah... Well, I've forgotten her name, but I'm sure this was a bold PR move none the less.

 

Still, I'd say any help we can give minor leaguers in Fort Myres is a good thing.

 

No doubt this is a bold and interesting move, but I do look forward to some bold moves with respect to 2nd base, 1b, the OF, SP, & our BP.

 

Congrats to Bianca Smith.

 

Congrats to Bianca. I hope that she is welcomed and respected by all. I know that there are posters here who believe that a woman who has never 'played the game' could not possibly teach them anything about hitting, or baseball in general. Thankfully for her, the younger generation seems to be more receptive to changes like these than some of the older generation.

 

Also, kudos to the San Antonio Spurs who had a woman coach part of a game a few nights ago.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Congrats to Bianca. I hope that she is welcomed and respected by all. I know that there are posters here who believe that a woman who has never 'played the game' could not possibly teach them anything about hitting, or baseball in general. Thankfully for her, the younger generation seems to be more receptive to changes like these than some of the older generation.

 

Also, kudos to the San Antonio Spurs who had a woman coach part of a game a few nights ago.

 

I bet those posters never worked in education or are familiar with "those who can't, teach".

 

Not sure what you mean by 'played the game' -- if it is the pro game, then that could give a coach credibility... but it is not a requirement; how many good K-12 science teachers were ever actual scientists?

 

In the same sense that not everyone can play pro sports, not everyone can teach -- from those once drafted or signed that didn't learn how to develop natural abilities to those HOF superstars who could never teach their own god-given talents to less fortunates. The best coaches maybe have some experience honing their own various skills, but are always good observers, communicators and students of the game.

[jacksonianmarch]

Hammon is different. She played basketball, just against other women. Also, the female football coach is different as well. X’s and O’s are so cerebral and technical that you have a ton of coaches who never played doing well. Baseball is a different beast as coaching is involved in development, but the X’s and O’s Matter little. Also, the game isnt even offered to women. Women typically play softball where the mechanics of hitting and pitching are different than baseball. When it’s a game that isn’t even offered to women to play, it does make it hard to relate. This seems to be an experiment. Maybe it works. Maybe she has a keen eye and becomes something more. I’ll be intrigued to see her progress. She will be held to a higher standard whether she likes it or not. I, for one, will be hoping she succeeds

[a700hitter]

Hammon is different. She played basketball, just against other women. Also, the female football coach is different as well. X’s and O’s are so cerebral and technical that you have a ton of coaches who never played doing well. Baseball is a different beast as coaching is involved in development, but the X’s and O’s Matter little. Also, the game isnt even offered to women. Women typically play softball where the mechanics of hitting and pitching are different than baseball. When it’s a game that isn’t even offered to women to play, it does make it hard to relate. This seems to be an experiment. Maybe it works. Maybe she has a keen eye and becomes something more. I’ll be intrigued to see her progress. She will be held to a higher standard whether she likes it or not. I, for one, will be hoping she succeeds

The Red Sox excel at virtue signaling.

[Kimmi]

I bet those posters never worked in education or are familiar with "those who can't, teach".

 

Not sure what you mean by 'played the game' -- if it is the pro game, then that could give a coach credibility... but it is not a requirement; how many good K-12 science teachers were ever actual scientists?

 

In the same sense that not everyone can play pro sports, not everyone can teach -- from those once drafted or signed that didn't learn how to develop natural abilities to those HOF superstars who could never teach their own god-given talents to less fortunates. The best coaches maybe have some experience honing their own various skills, but are always good observers, communicators and students of the game.

 

You would have to ask other posters what they mean by 'played the game'. I am simply quoting them. Personally, I think that Bianca could be a very good coach despite the fact that she never played Major League Baseball. I think that there are a lot of people who disagree with that opinion.

[Kimmi]

Hammon is different. She played basketball, just against other women. Also, the female football coach is different as well. X’s and O’s are so cerebral and technical that you have a ton of coaches who never played doing well. Baseball is a different beast as coaching is involved in development, but the X’s and O’s Matter little. Also, the game isnt even offered to women. Women typically play softball where the mechanics of hitting and pitching are different than baseball. When it’s a game that isn’t even offered to women to play, it does make it hard to relate. This seems to be an experiment. Maybe it works. Maybe she has a keen eye and becomes something more. I’ll be intrigued to see her progress. She will be held to a higher standard whether she likes it or not. I, for one, will be hoping she succeeds

 

From what I've read, the mechanics of hitting are very much alike in softball and baseball. One person who has coached both major league hitters and pro softball hitters states that 99% of the mechanics are the same.

 

Regardless, if a person watches batters closely and often enough, studies all the video tape available, and gets trained/mentored by other baseball hitting coaches, that person can most definitely learn how to be a great hitting coach.

 

Yes, it might be a hard sell to baseball players to be coached by someone who hasn't played baseball. But that is because of their own biases, not because of anything factual in their beliefs.

[notin]

Per MLBTR, the Red Sox are 1 of 5 teams showing interest in Alex Colome.

 

Eh. Hand and Bradley, please....

[Sox75]

Congrats to Bianca. I hope that she is welcomed and respected by all. I know that there are posters here who believe that a woman who has never 'played the game' could not possibly teach them anything about hitting, or baseball in general. Thankfully for her, the younger generation seems to be more receptive to changes like these than some of the older generation.

 

Also, kudos to the San Antonio Spurs who had a woman coach part of a game a few nights ago.

 

NO DOUBT there are strong arguments on both sides, and I have no doubt that even poor mlb players can be GREAT COACHES!

 

GREAT COACHING stems from confidence and ability to teach and lead. You don't need to be a GREAT or "accomplished" scientist to teach the basics of science, but even your GREAT HS or college science teacher is not going to coach an astronaut on how to do a space-dock at a scace station.

 

YES! A truly GREAT college science teacher might be tapped to work at NASA, and be an integral part of a space mission to space dock at a space station.

 

I guess the equivalent would be an average college softball player studying hard to work in the MLB?

 

Starting in the minors seems appropriate. Not sure she has the resume or experience to leap from college softball to Major League Baseball, but I'm willing to accept some do. Perhaps she has the personality and PRESENCE to command the respect and trust of young talent, but only time will tell.

 

I'm doubtful that a young Chuck Yeager is going to take coaching from a college hang glider pro., but I'm willing to hope so.

 

I'm not sure if NASA taps talent from Carroll University in Wisconsin, but I fully understand why the Red Sox would want to.

 

Time will tell?

 

In the mean time, I would LOVE TO KNOW what Bloom has planned to make the 2021 Red Sox a legitimate contender.

Edited January 3, 2021 by Sox75

[jacksonianmarch]

The other thing that raises my concern is the adjustment to failure. Pro baseball is a different beast altogether. The guys entering the pros hit over .500 in high school, .350 in college, had ERA’s under 1 in high school 2.5 in college. None of them have experienced years of failures. They’ve all been the best and that’s translated into success. Part of learning how to be a pro ball player is learning from failure and embracing that they can fail. Many, many players fail to progress, not because they lack the physical gifts, but because the game is no longer fun when they have a season hitting .210. It will be very hard for her to relate to that. Being a great coach in the minors is more therapist, so maybe this is a heady move or maybe it burns in flames. Time will tell. I am hopeful for her success

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

The other thing that raises my concern is the adjustment to failure. Pro baseball is a different beast altogether. The guys entering the pros hit over .500 in high school, .350 in college, had ERA’s under 1 in high school 2.5 in college. None of them have experienced years of failures. They’ve all been the best and that’s translated into success. Part of learning how to be a pro ball player is learning from failure and embracing that they can fail. Many, many players fail to progress, not because they lack the physical gifts, but because the game is no longer fun when they have a season hitting .210. It will be very hard for her to relate to that. Being a great coach in the minors is more therapist, so maybe this is a heady move or maybe it burns in flames. Time will tell. I am hopeful for her success

 

When I was young and even dumber than I am now, my step-father -- the ex-pro player and longtime amateur coach -- used to postulate, "The reason you play is to not get down when you fail."

 

I couldn't for the life of me relate to that. I played for the fun of competition, constantly striving for addictive moments of celebration, dreaming of ultimate victory. Along the way we drowned a lot of sorrows. Baseball is hard.

[Elktonnick]

The other thing that raises my concern is the adjustment to failure. Pro baseball is a different beast altogether. The guys entering the pros hit over .500 in high school, .350 in college, had ERA’s under 1 in high school 2.5 in college. None of them have experienced years of failures. They’ve all been the best and that’s translated into success. Part of learning how to be a pro ball player is learning from failure and embracing that they can fail. Many, many players fail to progress, not because they lack the physical gifts, but because the game is no longer fun when they have a season hitting .210. It will be very hard for her to relate to that. Being a great coach in the minors is more therapist, so maybe this is a heady move or maybe it burns in flames. Time will tell. I am hopeful for her success

 

The great Yogi said it all when he allegedly said, "Ninety percent of this game is half mental!"

[Kimmi]

NO DOUBT there are strong arguments on both sides, and I have no doubt that even poor mlb players can be GREAT COACHES!

 

GREAT COACHING stems from confidence and ability to teach and lead. You don't need to be a GREAT or "accomplished" scientist to teach the basics of science, but even your GREAT HS or college science teacher is not going to coach an astronaut on how to do a space-dock at a scace station.

 

YES! A truly GREAT college science teacher might be tapped to work at NASA, and be an integral part of a space mission to space dock at a space station.

 

I guess the equivalent would be an average college softball player studying hard to work in the MLB?

 

Starting in the minors seems appropriate. Not sure she has the resume or experience to leap from college softball to Major League Baseball, but I'm willing to accept some do. Perhaps she has the personality and PRESENCE to command the respect and trust of young talent, but only time will tell.

 

I'm doubtful that a young Chuck Yeager is going to take coaching from a college hang glider pro., but I'm willing to hope so.

 

I'm not sure if NASA taps talent from Carroll University in Wisconsin, but I fully understand why the Red Sox would want to.

 

Time will tell?

 

In the mean time, I would LOVE TO KNOW what Bloom has planned to make the 2021 Red Sox a legitimate contender.

 

Alex Cora was not a great player by any means, but by most accounts, he was a smart player. Most people feel that he is a great manager. John Farrell was not a great pitcher. Most people feel that he was a great pitching coach. As far as I know, all players were very receptive to these two. I'm sure there are many other similar situations. I think it's very possible to be a great coach without having actually played the game.

 

I can only hope that young players will be open and receptive to Bianca.

[Kimmi]

The other thing that raises my concern is the adjustment to failure. Pro baseball is a different beast altogether. The guys entering the pros hit over .500 in high school, .350 in college, had ERA’s under 1 in high school 2.5 in college. None of them have experienced years of failures. They’ve all been the best and that’s translated into success. Part of learning how to be a pro ball player is learning from failure and embracing that they can fail. Many, many players fail to progress, not because they lack the physical gifts, but because the game is no longer fun when they have a season hitting .210. It will be very hard for her to relate to that. Being a great coach in the minors is more therapist, so maybe this is a heady move or maybe it burns in flames. Time will tell. I am hopeful for her success

 

Dealing with the emotional or mental side of the game is a different story altogether. I agree that if it would be hard for someone who has not played competitive sports to relate to the emotional and mental states of players. That said, Bianca has played competitive sports. Maybe she hasn't experienced failure to the degree that some of these minor leaguers will experience failure, but I can guarantee you that she has experienced failure along the way. She can relate to what these players will be going through.

 

It sounds to me like you are trying very hard to come up with reasons why she won't be a good coach. She might very well fail. I just hope that if she does fail, it's not because players tuned her out because she is a woman or because she hasn't played baseball. That would be a mistake.

[notin]

I am going to put some faith in the Sox for knowing what they’re doing. Because, you know, unlike us they have actually met her and used her person as criteria rather than sweeping generalizations.

 

And you don’t have to play a sport to coach it. It probably helps, but history has clearly shown it’s not necessary. Some of the most successful coaches in NFL history (Vince Lombardi, Paul Brown, Bill Walsh) never played in the NFL. (And college football isn’t really the same.) The most successful coach in women’s gymnastics history - Bela Karolyi - did not compete in gymnastics above high school.

 

I get the lack of activity, but this is a non-issue...

[harmony]

Cot's Baseball Contracts now offers a feature that lists free agent contracts over the past 30 years for each team, including the Red Sox:

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1L4T9k8pGDDt8kVd1rvboacYdXpafHsOB2nhEGAGEaAY/edit#gid=1428273551

[moonslav59]

Cot's Baseball Contracts now offers a feature that lists free agent contracts over the past 30 years for each team, including the Red Sox:

 

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1L4T9k8pGDDt8kVd1rvboacYdXpafHsOB2nhEGAGEaAY/edit#gid=1428273551

 

Thanks! It took me close to an hour to assemble an incomplete list I posted a couple days ago.

 

I'd like to see a list that also includes large and long extensions for a truer picture of how often and when we made big financial commitments.

 

Going by just free agent contracts of 3 or more years and adjusting for inflation, here are the years we made the big splash signings:

1991 Matt Young 3

1992 Frank Viola 3

1999 Jose Offerman 4

2001 Manny Ramirez 8

2004 Keith Foulke 4

2005 Edgar Renteria 4, Jason Varitek 4, Matt Clement 3

2007 JD Drew 5, Julio Lugo 4

2008 Mike Lowell 3

2011 Carl Crawford 7

2013 Shane Victorino 3

2015 Pablo Sandoval 5, Hanley Ramirez 4

2016 David Price 7

2018 JD Martinez 5

2019 Nathan Eovaldi 4

 

As you can see, starting in 1999, we never went more than 3 years without a major signing, and if you count major extensions, those gaps are mostly filled to the point where the records is nearly seemless.

Edited January 3, 2021 by moonslav59

[harmony]

MLB Trade Rumors updates on the Red Sox offseason (including Ha-Seong Kim, Kiké Hernández and Jackie Bradley Jr.):

 

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2021/01/red-sox-notes-kim-hernandez-arroyo-bradley-jr.html

[kenmeister]

Thanks! It took me close to an hour to assemble an incomplete list I posted a couple days ago.

 

I'd like to see a list that also includes large and long extensions for a truer picture of how often and when we made big financial commitments.

 

Going by just free agent contracts of 3 or more years and adjusting for inflation, here are the years we made the big splash signings:

1991 Matt Young 3

1992 Frank Viola 3

1999 Jose Offerman 4

2001 Manny Ramirez 8

2004 Keith Foulke 4

2005 Edgar Renteria 4, Jason Varitek 4, Matt Clement 3

2007 JD Drew 5, Julio Lugo 4

2008 Mike Lowell 3

2011 Carl Crawford 7

2013 Shane Victorino 3

2015 Pablo Sandoval 5, Hanley Ramirez 4

2016 David Price 7

2018 JD Martinez 5

2019 Nathan Eovaldi 4

 

As you can see, starting in 1999, we never went more than 3 years without a major signing, and if you count major extensions, those gaps are mostly filled to the point where the records is nearly seemless.

 

Wow it's depressing how few of those worked out overall. Matt Young is the guy who worked everybody to a 3-2 count right? I seem to remember the booth guys joking that when he's pitching they should just start the batter 3-2. But I may be misremembering him for someone else. I do think he's the guy who pitched a no-hitter and lost. Jose Offerman, gadzooks he was the worst fielder I've ever seen. Well at least until Hanley Ramirez was put in the outfield. Shane Victorino was clutch in 2013, I don't remember him staying beyond that year.

 

At any rate, it's freakin' Jan 3rd and nothing has happened. This sport completely blew the whole 'hot stove' thing. Wake me up in spring training I guess.

[moonslav59]

Wow it's depressing how few of those worked out overall. Matt Young is the guy who worked everybody to a 3-2 count right? I seem to remember the booth guys joking that when he's pitching they should just start the batter 3-2. But I may be misremembering him for someone else. I do think he's the guy who pitched a no-hitter and lost. Jose Offerman, gadzooks he was the worst fielder I've ever seen. Well at least until Hanley Ramirez was put in the outfield. Shane Victorino was clutch in 2013, I don't remember him staying beyond that year.

 

At any rate, it's freakin' Jan 3rd and nothing has happened. This sport completely blew the whole 'hot stove' thing. Wake me up in spring training I guess.

 

Matt Young was also the pitcher who could not throw the ball to 1B, too.

[moonslav59]

Here is with some selected large and long extensions (*) added:

 

(Please point out any I missed.)

 

Going by just free agent contracts of 3 or more years and adjusting for inflation, here are the years we made the big splash signings:

 

1991 Matt Young 3

1992 Frank Viola 3

1999 Jose Offerman 4

2001 Manny Ramirez 8

2002 Johnny Damon 4

2004 Keith Foulke 4

2005 Edgar Renteria 4, Jason Varitek 4, Matt Clement 3

2007 JD Drew 5, Julio Lugo 4, *Ortiz 4, *Beckett 3

2008 Mike Lowell 3

2009 *Youkilis 4, *Pedey 6, *Lester5

2010 John Lackey 5

2011 Carl Crawford 7

2012 *Adrian Gonzalez 7, *Buchholz 4

2013 Shane Victorino 3

2014 *Pedroia 8, Castillo 7

2015 Pablo Sandoval 5, Hanley Ramirez 4, *Porcello 4

2016 David Price 7

2018 JD Martinez 5

2019 Nathan Eovaldi 4, *Vaz 4

2020 *Sale 5, *Bogey 6

 

2003, 2006 & 2017 are the only 3 seasons since 1999 where no player was signed or extended to a 3+ year deal of significant value.

 

Years with 4+ year deals:

99, 01, 02, 04,05, 07, 09, 10, 11, 12, 14, 15, 16, 18, 19, 20

 

Years with 5+ year deals:

01, 07, 09, 10, 11, 12, 14, 15, 16, 18, 20

 

Years with 6+:

01, 09, 11, 12, 14, 16, 20

 

Years with 7+:

01, 11, 12, 14, 16

 

Years with 8 years:

2001 (Manny)

 

 

Edited January 4, 2021 by moonslav59

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Matt Young was also the pitcher who could not throw the ball to 1B, too.

 

I remember being in the bleachers at a game during that era. This was before all the food courts in the back, and I was dying for a sausage, onions and peppers... but they were only on sale on the street at the time. I talked an usher into letting me leave if I came right back. He waited at the turnstiles and when I returned I noticed a large mound under a tarp... The usher looked at me and said, "That's where they buried Matt Young."

[mvp 78]

I am going to put some faith in the Sox for knowing what they’re doing. Because, you know, unlike us they have actually met her and used her person as criteria rather than sweeping generalizations.

 

And you don’t have to play a sport to coach it. It probably helps, but history has clearly shown it’s not necessary. Some of the most successful coaches in NFL history (Vince Lombardi, Paul Brown, Bill Walsh) never played in the NFL. (And college football isn’t really the same.) The most successful coach in women’s gymnastics history - Bela Karolyi - did not compete in gymnastics above high school.

 

I get the lack of activity, but this is a non-issue...

 

Yup. If they hired some shmoe off the streets with zero background at all, this would have gone well under the radar. How often have we spent more than one or two posts on a low level coach?

Edited January 4, 2021 by mvp 78

[notin]

Yup. If they hired some shmoe off the streets with zero background at all, this would have gone well under the radar. How often have we spent more than one or two posts on a low level coach?

 

So... I have a chance and my hiring will be quiet?