The Pen

[TylerD]

I’ve defended Barnes quite a bit but he’s a major league screw up. Get him off this team. It’s a guarantee we cough up the lead when he comes in. This team is in shambles right now. Starters also haven’t been good. Sales last two starts have not been good. Porcello was horrible yesterday. E Rod was excellent today. Too bad we couldn’t get him a win. It’s insane we go from one of the best teams we have ever had last year to this crap. So many changes needed.

[bosoxmal]

Start with any relief pitcher. 10 day auctions, starting bid $12.95

[TylerD]

That’s too high. Barnes we need to call 1-800 Got Junk to come and get him.

[oldtimer]

I’ve defended Barnes quite a bit but he’s a major league screw up. Get him off this team. It’s a guarantee we cough up the lead when he comes in. This team is in shambles right now. Starters also haven’t been good. Sales last two starts have not been good. Porcello was horrible yesterday. E Rod was excellent today. Too bad we couldn’t get him a win. It’s insane we go from one of the best teams we have ever had last year to this crap. So many changes needed.

 

Realistically, we are toast. The BP only has a couple of guys who can hold their own. Part of it is over use and part is in their heads. Our starters have also weakened and unlike you, I wouldn't say that E-Rod had an excellent start. He was gifted with a 4 run lead and immediately went on his nibbling drill. He gave up 2 that he shouldn't have. He has good stuff but he cant seem to get beyond the idea of going 3 and 2 on each batter. He was helped by Nunez defense nor was the BP helped by Chavis defense.

[Elktonnick]

I’ve defended Barnes quite a bit but he’s a major league screw up. Get him off this team. It’s a guarantee we cough up the lead when he comes in. This team is in shambles right now. Starters also haven’t been good. Sales last two starts have not been good. Porcello was horrible yesterday. E Rod was excellent today. Too bad we couldn’t get him a win. It’s insane we go from one of the best teams we have ever had last year to this crap. So many changes needed.

 

The entire pitching staff, in general with few exceptions, has lost confidence in themselves. Major changes are needed not only in personnel but also philosophy. DD et al needs to do a rethink on their approach towards pitching and the development of pitchers. This club has not developed a major league pitcher in more than a dozen years.

[Elktonnick]

Realistically, we are toast. The BP only has a couple of guys who can hold their own. Part of it is over use and part is in their heads. Our starters have also weakened and unlike you, I wouldn't say that E-Rod had an excellent start. He was gifted with a 4 run lead and immediately went on his nibbling drill. He gave up 2 that he shouldn't have. He has good stuff but he cant seem to get beyond the idea of going 3 and 2 on each batter. He was helped by Nunez defense nor was the BP helped by Chavis defense.

 

I agree 100%

[Bellhorn04]

Dave's Dare has become Dave's Disgrace.

[Jasonbay44]

Well... I think if there was anyone defending bullpen, they’re gone now. This is officially a s*** show

[Maxbialystock]

I’ve defended the bullpen relentlessly, but no more, although I do wonder if this stadium isn’t a factor. Yesterday the Yankees gave up 13 runs and today 8. Tanaka their ace gave up 6 in the 1st inning.

[Bellhorn04]

I’ve defended the bullpen relentlessly, but no more, although I do wonder if this stadium isn’t a factor. Yesterday the Yankees gave up 13 runs and today 8. Tanaka their ace gave up 6 in the 1st inning.

 

The stadium might be a factor in the number of runs.

 

But if the Sox lose today, it will be 5 blown saves resulting in losses since June 10.

[notin]

The stadium might be a factor in the number of runs.

 

But if the Sox lose today, it will be 5 blown saves resulting in losses since June 10.

 

The bullpen has gone from Barely Tolerable to Completely Unacceptable rather quickly. I don’t think the solution is to keep working them harder...

[bosoxmal]

This afternoon, you relieved your starting pitcher with one out in the 6th. He gave up one walk and fanned the other two batters he facedd. THEN YOU TOOK HIM OUT OF THE f***ING GAME! And brought in a pircher who couldn't anybody, and on it went/

 

Why? Brewer didn't look fatigued, out of breath, arm weary, ot whatever,. Is one inning the mazimum your relievers are allowed to face? Why? Are "lonmg relievers" ;imited to one inning? If theu're pitching well, why are you throwing the dice, and jhoping the next guy will do well also.

 

Wake up. Your present management eforts are stupid. This is about the 10th game YOU have lost this year. with yoir bullpen guesses.

[a700hitter]

This afternoon, you relieved your starting pitcher with one out in the 6th. He gave up one walk and fanned the other two batters he facedd. THEN YOU TOOK HIM OUT OF THE f***ING GAME! And brought in a pircher who couldn't anybody, and on it went/

 

Why? Brewer didn't look fatigued, out of breath, arm weary, ot whatever,. Is one inning the mazimum your relievers are allowed to face? Why? Are "lonmg relievers" ;imited to one inning? If theu're pitching well, why are you throwing the dice, and jhoping the next guy will do well also.

 

Wake up. Your present management eforts are stupid. This is about the 10th game YOU have lost this year. with yoir bullpen guesses.

Sometimes you have to ride the hot hand, and Brewer looked good today. I would have had him on a short leash, but removing him after consecutive Ks where he made the batters look bad was dumb.

[Elktonnick]

Sometimes you have to ride the hot hand, and Brewer looked good today. I would have had him on a short leash, but removing him after consecutive Ks where he made the batters look bad was dumb.

The manager has stuck to an over reliance on a very rigid approach to managing his pitching staff both starters and relievers. It's as if events on field have no importance to how many pitches a particular reliever throws. It all goes back to his philosophy of not chasing regular season wins.

[Bellhorn04]

The manager has stuck to an over reliance on a very rigid approach to managing his pitching staff both starters and relievers. It's as if events on field have no importance to how many pitches a particular reliever throws. It all goes back to his philosophy of not chasing regular season wins.

 

The not chasing wins part refers to games when you're behind, though.

 

Cora manages his pitching staff pretty much the way every other manager does now. The pitch counts are indeed pretty rigid.

[dgalehouse]

Most of this is just second guessing . Previously , people wanted Brewer dfa'd . They praised Walden . Sometimes you just can't win . If the relievers screw up , the manager always looks bad . The fact is , there is no one in the pen that you can really count on .

[Bellhorn04]

Most of this is just second guessing . Previously , people wanted Brewer dfa'd . They praised Walden . Sometimes you just can't win . If the relievers screw up , the manager always looks bad . The fact is , there is no one in the pen that you can really count on .

 

Right now this pen is like playing Russian Roulette with 3 or 4 bullets in the chambers.

[dgalehouse]

Right now this pen is like playing Russian Roulette with 3 or 4 bullets in the chambers.

 

Yup .

[Elktonnick]

The not chasing wins part refers to games when you're behind, though.

 

Cora manages his pitching staff pretty much the way every other manager does now. The pitch counts are indeed pretty rigid.

 

Disagree. He has screwed his pitching staff up since the season began. No team manager with this many blown saves can credibly be cited with managing pitchers the way every other manager does.

[bosoxmal]

i AGR

Most of this is just second guessing . Previously , people wanted Brewer dfa'd . They praised Walden . Sometimes you just can't win . If the relievers screw up , the manager always looks bad . The fact is , there is no one in the pen that you can really count on .

i agree. They are all inconsistent. When a pitcher is hot (in the groove) it makes no sense to yank him for your next hopeful. There was a time when managers let the middle guys go two or even 3 innings id they were still effective.

 

These guys 1re 71 200 lb athletes. They do no hard work all week. They play catch, run a little, try and stay in shape. THREE INNINGS IS TOO MUCH FOR THEM? If tjeir arms are that weak, they better see a doctor.

[dgalehouse]

Disagree. He has screwed his pitching staff up since the season began. No team manager with this many blown saves can credibly be cited with managing pitchers the way every other manager does.

 

Is it the way Cora manages the pen , or is it that these guys are just not very good ?

[Bellhorn04]

Is it the way Cora manages the pen , or is it that these guys are just not very good ?

 

It's the latter.

[Elktonnick]

It's the latter.

 

They are better than the way they have been managed. No one wants to admit it but the pen is burnt out. They were over worked from opening day. The reason they were over worked early in the season was because the starters weren't stretched out and could not go long in games. The reason the starters weren't stretched out early in the year was because the Manager did not have them start ST games until very late in ST.

Edited June 30, 2019 by Elktonnick

[dgalehouse]

What I don't care for is the " committee " approach. I think a bullpen functions better when they all have their roles and can prepare themselves accordingly. Of course that starts with having a reliable closer.

[Elktonnick]

What I don't care for is the " committee " approach. I think a bullpen functions better when they all have their roles and can prepare themselves accordingly. Of course that starts with having a reliable closer.

 

Can't argue with all of the above.

[vegasbob]

What I don't care for is the " committee " approach. I think a bullpen functions better when they all have their roles and can prepare themselves accordingly. Of course that starts with having a reliable closer.

 

Or ,ore reliable, predictable starters who show up and do professional work for 6 innings+,

[MADSTORK]

Blaming Cora is a joke!

 

Dombrowski is Cap strapped by the former GM’s p!ss poor acquisitions

 

Bullpen overall sucks, but you had to bet DD is waiting a half season so the money goes down on any contract traded for so you don’t once again take a hit in the Draft order

 

This Team needs to buy and sell at the deadline much like the yanks did a few years ago

[dannycater]

What I don't care for is the " committee " approach. I think a bullpen functions better when they all have their roles and can prepare themselves accordingly. Of course that starts with having a reliable closer.

 

I agree, the more defined the role, the better. set-up guys know they are coming in at certain times, long guys are ready if the SP falls apart early, closers manage the 9th or a tie in extra innings. This is important and has been dismissed by way too many managers in today's game.

[Station 13]

Roles are earned, they haven't earned squat.

[a700hitter]

The not chasing wins part refers to games when you're behind, though.

 

Cora manages his pitching staff pretty much the way every other manager does now. The pitch counts are indeed pretty rigid.

Doing what other managers do doesn't mean that it is smart. Most managers are buffoons. Don't get me started on my opinion of them as a group. With this pen, if Cora finds a guy is getting outs on a particular night and he is commanding his stuff, he should probably stay with him a little longer than to reach into the cheap box of chocolates for another bad piece.