Jump to content
Talk Sox
  • Create Account

Recommended Posts

Posted
Just now, Hugh2 said:

If you can find an exception to a norm should you strive for that? Or go with what you know works.  Like you said…..for good reason.  This team needed more

This Sox season is an exception to the norm.  How many other teams in MLB history have a run differential of 7 but are 11 games under .500? 
 

And is Milwaukee the exception?  Three of six highest scoring teams are Pitt, Milwaukee and Minnesota.  Four of the bottom six include the Mets, Padres, Giants and Blue Jays.   How many sole exceptions are necessary to prove there is no magic formula?

Posted
22 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Yup. It must be Brez's fault.

He shoulda known.

I didn't say that.  Just saw Slaten's name and stated the facts about him.

Posted
32 minutes ago, southpaw777 said:

 

A tad but I’m trying to make my main point. Which is he’s traded away a TON of depth that I certainly at the time, and now, disagree with. priester going down this year just proves how valuable depth is.  I didn’t think they would all be all stars, just bodies that I believed we needed. Pitchers go down all the time. I’m not bashing everything he’s done, but pitching depth is important and if you trade it away get something equal back. Durbin, who they messed up, a replacement IF, and some kid from the Yankees drafted in 2018 isn’t exactly a great return for a couple MLB ready starters and Hamilton, in my very humble opinion.

I’ve been complaining about trading Priester for about a year now for the exact reasons you stated; he was just dealt for no reason and the Sox had very little behind him.  

Harrison netted us a starting infielder and another player who looks like a useful bench guy.  Not enough?  Fair, but a different point.  As for Dobbins, Fitts, Perales, etc.  I think the Sox did fine in those trades.  

And Breslow did add Bennett, who has been better than any pitcher Breslow dealt away this off-season except Harrison…

Posted
20 hours ago, southpaw777 said:

Boy wouldn’t all the depth arms we had that Breslow traded away come in handy this year?

😑

Posted
11 minutes ago, notin said:

This Sox season is an exception to the norm.  How many other teams in MLB history have a run differential of 7 but are 11 games under .500? 
And is Milwaukee the exception?  Three of six highest scoring teams are Pitt, Milwaukee and Minnesota.  Four of the bottom six include the Mets, Padres, Giants and Blue Jays.   How many sole exceptions are necessary to prove there is no magic formula?

Like Boston, Milwaukee doesn't hit home runs. But what the Brewers do have are many more "sluggers."

In team slug, the Brew crew is middle of the pack, while the Sox are near the bottom. But consider this: MLB stats lists 82 batters with Slugging Percentages of at least .423. Boston has three regulars: Contreras, Rafaela and Abreu at that mark. Milwaukee has seven (and Yelich is not one of them); that's almost an entire batting order.

The Brewers have also drawn over 100 more walks than the Red Sox. So more baserunners being driven around by more gappers equals more runs.

They're better batters. 

 

 

Posted
4 hours ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Like Boston, Milwaukee doesn't hit home runs. But what the Brewers do have are many more "sluggers."

In team slug, the Brew crew is middle of the pack, while the Sox are near the bottom. But consider this: MLB stats lists 82 batters with Slugging Percentages of at least .423. Boston has three regulars: Contreras, Rafaela and Abreu at that mark. Milwaukee has seven (and Yelich is not one of them); that's almost an entire batting order.

The Brewers have also drawn over 100 more walks than the Red Sox. So more baserunners being driven around by more gappers equals more runs.

They're better batters. 

 

 

Ok, but the point wasn’t that Milwaukee was hitting similar to Boston; the point was Milwaukee disproves the need for STAR POWER.  Look at those 7 (really 4) hitters and tell me how many are currently stars?  If the Sox added Jake Bauers or Garrett Mitchell, who would think “Finally!! The missing piece!!”?

 

Milwaukee walks more and takes advantage of their speed, unlike Boston…

Posted
6 hours ago, southpaw777 said:

I told you I liked the starter for starter trade. He traded away healthy arms to rely on starters with injury histories. Sandoval, Oviedo, and relied on other hurt guys like Houck and Crawford. Dumb.  That’s a stupid plan. Trade away young healthy arms and pay guys who have arm issues.

Suarez and Gray did not have recent injury issues. Bennett was a depth add for 2026 as Perales was not ready.

Yes, Sandoval and Oviedo were additions, who had recent injury histories, but these days almost every pitcher does. It was depth added that did nt work out. Crawford and Sandoval were supposed to be healthy by the end of 2025. It's kind of a bummer they still have zero IP in 2026. Houck was a known injury, so did not count as immediate depth or even last season depth.

We started the winter with Crochet, Suarez, Gray, Bello and Oviedo/Sandoval/Crawford as the top 7 rotation pieces. We had a couple young and promising SP'ers in Tolle & Early with Bennett seemingly ML ready, but largely an unknown commodity- much like Harrison and Drohan were. That's 9-10 SP'ers with the possibility that Houck might return by late July/early August or later. I would not count Uberstine, Sikkema or Anderson as more than one pitcher as viable MLB depth. That makes it more like 10 or maybe 11 in total.

This was not even close to our weakest position on the team. Some of us were hoping the excess might be used to fill the big need we had in the pen.

Many felt we should have signed a bat over Suarez, in part because they felt the rotation and rotation depth was a strength we could deal from.

No doubt, Brez traded away a lot of pitching- mostly unproven ML ready pitcher and pitching prospects. We don't hear about Fitts, Dobbins, Clarke, Fajardo, Travieso and others I can't remember, now, because none are pitching like Harrison 2026 or Priester 2025. However, none are pitching like these newly acquired pitchers, either:

Suarez, Gray, Bennett

Brez also added Tolle in the '24 draft along with Futrell, Cason & others, then Eyanson in the '25 draft as well as Witherspoon, Phillips, Brown and others. Delzine and other promising IFA signings have been added to pitching depth of the extended future.

There have been some promising pen additions from getting Bastardo, Song & Paez back to adding Samaniego and the struggling Watson. He even got Drohan back before trading him. Coulombe has exceeded expectations. Guerrero has looked good as pen depth. (He did trade for Harrison and Priester, too, before trading them away, and neither pitched well enough to get a shot with the Sox MLB club. Wasn't that adding depth, at the time?

To many, Brez has focused too much on pitching and pitcher acquisitions to the determent of missing out on our needs on offense. Within the context of a limited budget and the desire to keep the farm strong, I think the rotation was built up stronger than any other high need area under Brez. Picking that area to say he shoulda done more seems to be missing the bigger picture. Many, including myself, think he missed the big picture, this past winter, and while his singular major moves all look good on paper, he created an unbalanced roster with too much concentration of the rotation and defense and not enough on the hitting.

 

Posted
4 hours ago, notin said:

Ok, but the point wasn’t that Milwaukee was hitting similar to Boston; the point was Milwaukee disproves the need for STAR POWER.  Look at those 7 (really 4) hitters and tell me how many are currently stars?  If the Sox added Jake Bauers or Garrett Mitchell, who would think “Finally!! The missing piece!!”?

Milwaukee has averaged 93 wins the past half decade and is on pace to do it again with maybe their 5th division title of the 2020s. Baseball can't keep blaming the NL Central or the no-name Brewers who might be unappreciated by fans and media. I'll bet one thing: they're not unappreciated by their peers in Chicago, St. Louis, Pittsburgh and Cincinnati. 

The Brew Crew may not have star names or contracts, but they have plenty of winning ballplayers. Boston does not.

Posted
58 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Milwaukee has averaged 93 wins the past half decade and is on pace to do it again with maybe their 5th division title of the 2020s. Baseball can't keep blaming the NL Central or the no-name Brewers who might be unappreciated by fans and media. I'll bet one thing: they're not unappreciated by their peers in Chicago, St. Louis, Pittsburgh and Cincinnati. 

The Brew Crew may not have star names or contracts, but they have plenty of winning ballplayers. Boston does not.

They have done well, but I have no regrets switching from MIL to BOS back in the early 70's.

Posted
6 hours ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Milwaukee has averaged 93 wins the past half decade and is on pace to do it again with maybe their 5th division title of the 2020s. Baseball can't keep blaming the NL Central or the no-name Brewers who might be unappreciated by fans and media. I'll bet one thing: they're not unappreciated by their peers in Chicago, St. Louis, Pittsburgh and Cincinnati. 

The Brew Crew may not have star names or contracts, but they have plenty of winning ballplayers. Boston does not.

Sooooo…. you agree they win without the “necessary” star power.

That was my point all along…

Posted
6 hours ago, notin said:

Sooooo…. you agree they win without the “necessary” star power.

That was my point all along…

Once again you pivot to claims by another poster that were never posted.

Jacob Misiorowski is a star and no serious baseball fan would argue that. He leads the majors in ERA, Ks, and WHIP. Bryce Turang is also a star, though big market fans might not know he's in the Top 10 in NL WAR, just like he was last year and in 2024 (when he was right behind teammate William Contreras).

What is your point again? It can't their documented accomplishments. Is it that the Brewers lack name recognition and massive contracts? How do you define "star power"? 

When I use that phrase, it doesn't just mean Juan Soto, but above-average big leaguers -- guys good enough to be All-Star candidates or considered for awards; not every season of their careers, but enough to be reliable regulars. 

The Red Sox haven't had enough of those players lately. Picking up someone cut by a team with the worst record like Romy is great as a roster supplement... but not to be counted on as your clean-up batter in the playoffs. Guys like that can thrive in the right environment, like Bill Mueller winning the batting crown hitting 9th in the order while pitchers worried about Papi and Manny... 

... which brings me full circle to early Theo, when Boston targeted and stockpiled position player talent like Millar, Walker, Bellhorn, Reese, etc. Not all worked out, like Giambi, and we all lucked out getting Ortiz, but those Red Sox made their own luck by their approach to loading up instead of skimping.

 

 

Posted
1 hour ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Once again you pivot to claims by another poster that were never posted.

Jacob Misiorowski is a star and no serious baseball fan would argue that. He leads the majors in ERA, Ks, and WHIP. Bryce Turang is also a star, though big market fans might not know he's in the Top 10 in NL WAR, just like he was last year and in 2024 (when he was right behind teammate William Contreras).

What is your point again? It can't their documented accomplishments. Is it that the Brewers lack name recognition and massive contracts? How do you define "star power"? 

When I use that phrase, it doesn't just mean Juan Soto, but above-average big leaguers -- guys good enough to be All-Star candidates or considered for awards; not every season of their careers, but enough to be reliable regulars. 

The Red Sox haven't had enough of those players lately. Picking up someone cut by a team with the worst record like Romy is great as a roster supplement... but not to be counted on as your clean-up batter in the playoffs. Guys like that can thrive in the right environment, like Bill Mueller winning the batting crown hitting 9th in the order while pitchers worried about Papi and Manny... 

... which brings me full circle to early Theo, when Boston targeted and stockpiled position player talent like Millar, Walker, Bellhorn, Reese, etc. Not all worked out, like Giambi, and we all lucked out getting Ortiz, but those Red Sox made their own luck by their approach to loading up instead of skimping.

 

 

Holy f***. Read the thread and know the conversation you’re attacking.

Hugh said:

the offense however couldn’t contrast anymore from the pitching.  It’s been awful, and this year is a clear cut example that you need star power at the helm. They have none of that side of the ball.

It’s an untrue sweeping generalization, also one where Jacob Misiorowski’s star power and Brice Turang’s star power DO NOT APPLY.  You know, since it’s about OFFENSE.  Misiorowski cannot hit and Turang is a glove first but all around player.

The original postulate was that you can have a good offense without having stars at the helm.  I disagreed vehemently and provided an example for proof.  And then you made a lot of comments in this part of the thread and not a single one addressed or refuted that point.  No idea what your point was supposed to be, to be honest.

So do you disagree that star power is necessary to have a good offense? And that Milwaukee, as one of the highest scoring teams in MLB with no true offensive star leading the way, offers proof to Hugh’s original postulate?  Or not?

 

 

Posted
20 hours ago, Duran Is The Man said:

so Early disappears into the Sox IL Black Hole. never to be seen again. too bad, i had high hopes for the kid.

There is a disturbing accuracy to this comment.  Does the Sox doctor have his office on Sugarcandy Mountain?

Posted
7 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Relax

I toned my response down.  
 

My original response contained illegal levels of snark (in Illinois only), a felony.  I dialed back to levels that almost pass most Snark Tests, at least the ones that involve blood collection..

Posted
On 7/1/2026 at 12:02 PM, Nick John said:

The Boston Red Sox made multiple roster moves pertaining to their pitching staff following the conclusion of an 8-1 loss to the Washington Nationals. The major news is the loss of Connelly Early. The left-hander exited Tuesday night’s start after just four innings and 61 pitches with left elbow discomfort.

While Early himself didn’t seem too worried about the injury, the team sent him for imaging Wednesday morning just to be certain. The result led to Early being placed on the 15-day Injured List with left elbow inflammation.

To fill his spot on the roster, the Red Sox activated left-handed pitcher Jovani Morán from the injured list and added him to the active roster. The left-hander was a trusted arm in the Sox bullpen prior to his injury, appearing in 21 games and tossing 33 innings with a 3.00 ERA. He also struck out 38 batters. Morán made two rehab appearances last week with Worcester and looked ready to return to Boston after tossing three scoreless innings.

The other change in the pitching staff pertains to Tommy Kahnle. The 36-year-old reliever was designated for assignment after a tough stint in the bullpen. Kahnle signed a minor-league deal with Boston near the end of spring training and pitched well there, leading to the team adding him to the active roster following the activation of his opt out clause. Since then, the right-hander made eight appearances in Boston and pitched nine innings while allowing eight runs on 12 hits and six walks.

To replace Kahnle on the active roster, the Red Sox recalled Alec Gamboa. This will be Gamboa’s third stint with the team, having pitched twice for them previously. Overall, he’s tossed 1 2/3 innings out of the bullpen and struck out three. He’s spent most of the season with Worcester, where he’s tossed 17 2/3 innings out of the bullpen while allowing just two earned runs.

The Red Sox look to close out their homestand with a win today against the Nationals at 1:35pm.

 

View full rumor

 

Kahnle was terrible. No big loss. Maybe Gamboa will click this time around.

On 7/1/2026 at 6:24 PM, moonslav59 said:

He added many depth arms, too. While Kahnle, Watson and Oviedo have not helped us, Brez did add depth like Coulombe, Guerrero, Samaniego, Weissert & Slaten,

Would you rather have minor leaguer Perales or Bennett?

Fitts & Clarke for depth or Gray in the rotation, which added depth by knocking almost every SP'er down a notch?

Suarez knocked all but Crochet down one slot on the depth charts, too.

A pitcher out for the year (Priester) or Holobetz & Phillips as a longshot depth piece?

You want Hicks and Sandlin back? You want Dobbins back for Willson?

To me, one of Brez's top focus areas has been pitching depth and farm pitching improvement. He's traded away a ton of pitching, including Sale, Priester, Harrison and Drohan. Some were bound to do well, and they did. More have done squat or are still TBD,

Every time I read the Red Sox traded away a pitcher now I have to brace myself and think how badly did we get fleeced this time?

It would be nice to win some trades but I just keep seeing losses piling up. I just don't see how Breslow still has his job. 

Posted
25 minutes ago, notin said:

 

So do you disagree that star power is necessary to have a good offense? And that Milwaukee, as one of the highest scoring teams in MLB with no true offensive star leading the way, offers proof to Hugh’s original postulate?  Or not?

 

As usual, you answer questions by asking more.

AGAIN: How do you define "star power"? 

Posted
23 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

As usual, you answer questions by asking more.

AGAIN: How do you define "star power"? 

A fair question. 
 

In MLB, when I think of star power, I think of the repeated performances at or near the top a set of statistical categories, usually combined with name recognition.  In many cases, it also means salary/contract value. 

Kyle Schwarber has star power.  Miguel Vargas does not.  The Sox could use either this year (but neither is the singular “missing piece”.)

Perhaps Hugh’s original definition differed; only he can answer that.  But I strongly suspect he was NOT saying the Sox need more Romy Gonzalez or even Bill Mueller types.  There has been enough forum context to support that suspicion.

So do you agree or disagree with the original point or not?  

Posted
20 minutes ago, vjcsmoke said:

Kahnle was terrible. No big loss. Maybe Gamboa will click this time around.

Every time I read the Red Sox traded away a pitcher now I have to brace myself and think how badly did we get fleeced this time?

It would be nice to win some trades but I just keep seeing losses piling up. I just don't see how Breslow still has his job. 

Well, we seem to have done ok trading Fitts snd Clarke for Sonny Gray.  Also Hunter Dobbins for Willson Contreras.

Heck I don’t even mind Elmer Rodriguez-Cruz for Carlos Narvaez…

Posted
22 hours ago, notin said:

This Sox season is an exception to the norm.  How many other teams in MLB history have a run differential of 7 but are 11 games under .500? 
 

And is Milwaukee the exception?  Three of six highest scoring teams are Pitt, Milwaukee and Minnesota.  Four of the bottom six include the Mets, Padres, Giants and Blue Jays.   How many sole exceptions are necessary to prove there is no magic formula?

I agree, but how many of those teams have won a World Series recently?
 

A lot of the Sox losses can be attributed to bad luck.  At best they’re more like a .500 team, still highly flawed and not built for October baseball……because they lack thumb and veteran leadership in the lineup

Posted
11 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

I agree, but how many of those teams have won a World Series recently?
 

A lot of the Sox losses can be attributed to bad luck.  At best they’re more like a .500 team, still highly flawed and not built for October baseball……because they lack thumb and veteran leadership in the lineup

Well, how many of them were top six offenses recently?  And you cannot come closer to winning the World Series than the Blue Jays did last year, with IKF as the winning run less than two inches from home plate.  Even if you want to counter and say “but they didn’t win”, at least acknowledge that doesn’t make them a .500 team.

The Sox probably lack veteran leadership.  My point all along was “too many inexperienced players,” and that’s sort of related.   They clearly lack thump, but I would say a lot of that is because the players that used to supply seem to have stopped.  Story played injured, has a spotty history recently and is getting older.  But the fade we have seen from Duran, who is only 29, has been devastating.  This is the guy who should have been the leadoff fhitter.

As for luck, a term I have rarely if ever mentioned.  Sure, they are unlucky.  Run differential tells you they’re better than 11 games under .500.  But it also tells you they’re probably a .500 team at best…

Posted
28 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Blue Jays spend money, including FA money on bats.  

Honestly it was a mistake to bring them up.  I mentioned the Blue Jays originally as a high payroll, low scoring team - the opposite of my point.  They have star power in their offense right now.  What their offense lacks is actual runs…
 

 

Posted

Both Hugh and notin are right or can be right. But most champs have a few stars leading the way.

The '25 Blue Jays had Bad Vlad kicking Yankee ass, but they also had breakout supporting players like Clement and Barger peaking in the playoffs. 

The '06 White Sox had the lowest team batting average in the AL but pulled off a major upset in the World Series, knocking off the heavily-favored Cubs. But longtime Chicago baseball fans know those champs for their nickname as the Hitless Wonders, not the Usual Winners.

As a fan, I prefer the former model for better balance, consistency, and entertainment value. I'd rather see established veterans like Victorino and Napoli, plus a high-rated prospect like Bogaerts contributing with less pressure because of the presence of Papi and Pedey.

Posted
34 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Both Hugh and notin are right or can be right. But most champs have a few stars leading the way.

The '25 Blue Jays had Bad Vlad kicking Yankee ass, but they also had breakout supporting players like Clement and Barger peaking in the playoffs. 

The '06 White Sox had the lowest team batting average in the AL but pulled off a major upset in the World Series, knocking off the heavily-favored Cubs. But longtime Chicago baseball fans know those champs for their nickname as the Hitless Wonders, not the Usual Winners.

As a fan, I prefer the former model for better balance, consistency, and entertainment value. I'd rather see established veterans like Victorino and Napoli, plus a high-rated prospect like Bogaerts contributing with less pressure because of the presence of Papi and Pedey.

I like star players.  But I prefer not getting free agents.  Most of them are over 30 and have less star left in them than I prefer given the years on many deals.  I like seeing guys like Betts and Devers come up and be the stars.  I think Anthony can be that guy, as well.  And I haven’t given up on Mater and Campbell (but I would trade Mayer in the right deal)…

Posted

What the Red Sox lack is scouts who can observe whether or not a player can actually play.  I can't say for sure, but I'm betting Milwaukee knows the strengths and weaknesses of every player in their farm system and they scout the AA and AAA leagues hard to find ballplayers in other organizations.  Breslow knows nothing except his models and spreadsheets.

Hopefully now that the Sox have started hiring scouts again, maybe some of this will change.  But any decent scouts are most likely employed elsewhere, including the ones Breslow didn't think he needed and fired, 

Posted
2 minutes ago, notin said:

I like star players.  But I prefer not getting free agents.  Most of them are over 30 and have less star left in them than I prefer given the years on many deals.  I like seeing guys like Betts and Devers come up and be the stars.  I think Anthony can be that guy, as well.  And I haven’t given up on Mater and Campbell (but I would trade Mayer in the right deal)…

One big plus from building up the farm is the opportunity it creates to trade for guys like Gray and Contreras. DD mastered that idea and maximized is by trading just about every over-rated prospects we had. (Somehow, lucky or not, he kept the ones that ended up doing well.)

What would the future outlook of this team be without Tolle, Early, Rafaela and several other homegrown talent we decided to keep. Plus prospects and young players traded for like Abreu, Durbin and Bennett.

I'm not sure we can trade away as many prospects and young players as we did last winter, and still maintain a young pipeline infusion for the next few years, but we may have to in order to put together a winning team in 2027.

Hoping our young players grow and improve did not work in 2026. While some are upset we lost Harrison and Priester, where would we be without Gray, Contreras and others we traded for?

Posted
Just now, illinoisredsox said:

What the Red Sox lack is scouts who can observe whether or not a player can actually play.  I can't say for sure, but I'm betting Milwaukee knows the strengths and weaknesses of every player in their farm system and they scout the AA and AAA leagues hard to find ballplayers in other organizations.  Breslow knows nothing except his models and spreadsheets.

Hopefully now that the Sox have started hiring scouts again, maybe some of this will change.  But any decent scouts are most likely employed elsewhere, including the ones Breslow didn't think he needed and fired, 

It's hard to know if only spreadsheets and models got Brez to make trades for Crochet, Contreras, Gray, Durbin, O'Neill and others that have done well, along with those that have not gone well or not so well, so far like Sale, Harrison and Priester, but I see a major improvement over the moves made after the Eovaldi trade in 2028 to the end of the Bloom era.

This major step back in record, this year sucks and is the bottom line for many fans, but I think we are a better team now than when Brez took over the team. The farm is better. The young core is better. The 40 is better. The 26 is better. The record is NOT, for now.

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
The Talk Sox Caretaker Fund
The Talk Sox Caretaker Fund

You all care about this site. The next step is caring for it. We’re asking you to caretake this site so it can remain the premier Red Sox community on the internet.

×
×
  • Create New...