Red Sox 2025 Season Review/Offseason Preview Thread

[Duran Is The Man]

10 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

I believe that is the definition of a rebuild 

it wasn't a rebuild. it was a "let's burn it down because i'm a greedy SOB that's tired of spending money". 

[Old Red]

7 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

it wasn't a rebuild. it was a "let's burn it down because i'm a greedy SOB that's tired of spending money". 

Rebuild/cliff, or whatever you want to call it was self inflicted, and didn’t have to happen.

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Old Red said:

If Mayer was to start at 2B he would most likely do some platooning with Romy, so you don’t need 2 more IF. 

I see it this way, too, at least from Brez's perspective.

I'd like to get one big bat infielder, and my broken record is KMarte.

[moonslav59]

4 minutes ago, Old Red said:

Rebuild/cliff, or whatever you want to call it was self inflicted, and didn’t have to happen.

Exactly.

[Larry Cook]

24 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

I do not believe the Sox are going to get two of Marte/Bregman/Bichette.  They're only getting one of those guys and I think Bregman is currently the favored odds. 

Bregman wants 6 years! Bres-slow is at 3 years. 

[Hugh2]

35 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

Bregman wants 6 years! Bres-slow is at 3 years. 

Did he even have a 6 year offer last year? and he's one year older

[Old Red]

7 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

Did he even have a 6 year offer last year? and he's one year older

Detroit, and Houston both offered 6 yrs last year.

[Bellhorn04]

1 hour ago, Larry Cook said:

I believe that is the definition of a rebuild 

Or a screwup. 🙂   

[Hugh2]

22 minutes ago, Old Red said:

Detroit, and Houston both offered 6 yrs last year.

You’re right they did.  I’d feel very uncomfortable with anything over 5 years with him

[Old Red]

16 minutes ago, Hugh2 said:

You’re right they did.  I’d feel very uncomfortable with anything over 5 years with him

 

20 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Or a screwup. 🙂   

A Self Inflicted Man Made screwup.

[Larry Cook]

1 hour ago, Old Red said:

 

A Self Inflicted Man Made screwup.

A screwup that got us into the playoffs and maybe gone further if we did not run out of pitching and have to play Duran in the field!!! 

[Old Red]

6 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

A screwup that got us into the playoffs and maybe gone further if we did not run out of pitching and have to play Duran in the field!!! 

The screwup wasn’t about last year, and Duran has always played in the field. Nothing new. Think Raffy would have helped the RED Sox going further against the YANKEES IN Yankee Stadium in the playoffs?🤔

[Larry Cook]

11 minutes ago, Old Red said:

The screwup wasn’t about last year, and Duran has always played in the field. Nothing new. Think Raffy would have helped the RED Sox going further against the YANKEES IN Yankee Stadium in the playoffs?🤔

If we had kept Devers, we would have been watching the playoffs from home!! 

[Old Red]

2 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

If we had kept Devers, we would have been watching the playoffs from home!! 

🙈🤭🤮.

[Larry Cook]

1 minute ago, Old Red said:

🙈🤭🤮.

Win loss records before and after the Devers trade do not lie 

[Old Red]

5 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

Win loss records before and after the Devers trade do not lie 

That’s the total proof? Of course it couldn’t have been the better than good starting pitching over an extended period of time from CRO MAN, Gio, and Bello that made the record what it was over that time period. We’ll never know, but I think it had more to do with the pitching than it did with RAFFY leaving, and I’ve always have thought the Red SOX would have had an even better record if RAFFY had stayed not to mention making a difference in  the PS.

[moonslav59]

3 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

Bregman wants 6 years! Bres-slow is at 3 years. 

It all depends on what other GMs are offering.

He will likely get 5- maybe with an option 6th year and decent buyout.

Maybe Brez offers 5 with another opt-out, of 4 with a hefty buyout on 5th year option or a huge signing bonus.

[Old Red]

8 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

It all depends on what other GMs are offering.

He will likely get 5- maybe with an option 6th year and decent buyout.

Maybe Brez offers 5 with another opt-out, of 4 with a hefty buyout on 5th year option or a huge signing bonus.

If Bregman gets at least 5 years I hope it’s with someone else. NO opt-outs either.

[moonslav59]

12 minutes ago, Old Red said:

If Bregman gets at least 5 years I hope it’s with someone else. NO opt-outs either.

I don't really want him at 4 years, either, but if the option is 4 years or nobody else significant, then I'd do it.

I agree, 5 is too much. The guy was in a 3 year decline before 2025, then missed about 30% of the season. (I'm not for paying what Bichette will get either.)

I think I'd rather get Suarez on a 2 year deal or maybe trade for Paredes, assuming we don't trade for KMarte.

[Kimmi]

On 12/18/2025 at 4:40 PM, oldtimer said:

I was hoping for results to propel the team forward this off season. To date, the front office appears to be back peddling while other teams make meaningful moves. Bregman is  now gone, yet we have not yet gotten power bats or a #2 starter Breslow gives us rhetoric but little else while O'Henry provides the irony. What will it take to get the attention In this game, money needs to be spent, but wisely. The Sox have had more than their share of bad contracts. I of ownership? Menaingful adverse fan reaction?

Money needs to be spent, but wisely.  That's the key.  I know it often sounds like I'm trying to save Henry's money.  I'm not.  I think the Red Sox should be willing to go over the first and even second luxury tax lines from time to time.  What I am opposed to is those insane monster contracts.

I think Breslow has made some good, though possibly underwhelming, moves this offseason.  I say 'underwhelming' because they are not the blockbuster moves that fans typically hope for.  I don't think Breslow is finished.  I'm still holding out hope for a #2 starter.

[moonslav59]

3 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

Money needs to be spent, but wisely.  That's the key.  I know it often sounds like I'm trying to save Henry's money.  I'm not.  I think the Red Sox should be willing to go over the first and even second luxury tax lines from time to time.  What I am opposed to is those insane monster contracts.

I think Breslow has made some good, though possibly underwhelming, moves this offseason.  I say 'underwhelming' because they are not the blockbuster moves that fans typically hope for.  I don't think Breslow is finished.  I'm still holding out hope for a #2 starter.

I share your deep concern on large and long contracts, and also not about saving JH money, but about knowing we always have a limited budget and wasting money will hurt us for years to come. I plan on living longer than the longest contract we have signed or will sign.

I'm thinking a big bat is a higher priority than a #2 SP. I'm wondering if Brez sees Gray as the #2 or if Gray + Oviedo makes up for not getting a true #2. (If you go by fWAR and projected fWAR, Gray has been and will be a top 60  SP'er- even a top 30 in some categories.)

We have made a ton of trades, so far, and still have 4 OF'ers plus Campbell/Masa as OF depth. We may be looking at the biggest winter trade yet to come, or perhaps a major signing. Maybe both.

I think we will avoid a large and long deal, so maybe E Suarez or C Bassitt might be the one signing we make.

Trades might involve KMarte, Paredes, Donovan, Vientos or someone we never thought of.

[Kimmi]

On 12/18/2025 at 5:00 PM, Bellhorn04 said:

We're all wired differently, that's for sure.  I don't expect Henry to spend as much as the Dodgers, but for me it stings that the Dodgers have been killing us in terms of success, basically since Betts left.  Not as bad as it would be if it was the Yankees doing this, but it's running a pretty strong second.

The Red Sox just don't seem to have much urgency any more.  Last offseason was encouraging, but I have a nagging feeling they're not going to do much this offseason.  I think Henry is looking at the possible lockout in 2027 and the potential losses that will occur.   

I completely agree with your first paragraph.  It really does sting to see the Dodgers and Betts having so much success.  I'm almost at the point where I'd pull for the Yankees over the Dodgers, but nah.  Can't do that. 

The odd thing is, I'm really happy for most of the individual Dodgers players.  I was very happy that  Kershaw, one of my long-time favorite non Red Sox players, retired on such a high note.  It's the organizational philosophy that I'm vehemently opposed to.  

As far at the Red Sox seemingly not having much urgency, I think it's just their unwillingness to give out the huge contracts.  I can't say that I blame them.  I think that Henry would balk at the huge contracts regardless, but I think you're absolutely right that the possible lockout is one more additional factor to that.

[Kimmi]

5 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

Bregman wants 6 years! Bres-slow is at 3 years. 

There is no way that the Red Sox should sign Bregman for 6 years.  Three years should be the limit, IMO.

[Old Red]

13 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

Money needs to be spent, but wisely.  That's the key.  I know it often sounds like I'm trying to save Henry's money.  I'm not.  I think the Red Sox should be willing to go over the first and even second luxury tax lines from time to time.  What I am opposed to is those insane monster contracts.

I think Breslow has made some good, though possibly underwhelming, moves this offseason.  I say 'underwhelming' because they are not the blockbuster moves that fans typically hope for.  I don't think Breslow is finished.  I'm still holding out hope for a #2 starter.

I think right now Brez, and BorASS are having a tug of war on the length of a contract for Bregman.

[Old Red]

1 minute ago, Kimmi said:

There is no way that the Red Sox should sign Bregman for 6 years.  Three years should be the limit, IMO.

👍👍👍.

[Kimmi]

6 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I share your deep concern on large and long contracts, and also not about saving JH money, but about knowing we always have a limited budget and wasting money will hurt us for years to come. I plan on living longer than the longest contract we have signed or will sign.

I'm thinking a big bat is a higher priority than a #2 SP. I'm wondering if Brez sees Gray as the #2 or if Gray + Oviedo makes up for not getting a true #2. (If you go by fWAR and projected fWAR, Gray has been and will be a top 60  SP'er- even a top 30 in some categories.)

We have made a ton of trades, so far, and still have 4 OF'ers plus Campbell/Masa as OF depth. We may be looking at the biggest winter trade yet to come, or perhaps a major signing. Maybe both.

I think we will avoid a large and long deal, so maybe E Suarez or C Bassitt might be the one signing we make.

Trades might involve KMarte, Paredes, Donovan, Vientos or someone we never thought of.

That's the thing.  Henry's budget is limited, regardless of the fact that he can spend without limit if he wanted to.  Bad long-term contracts can hurt us for years to come.  

I think that Gray could possibly perform at the #2 level.  I would still prefer another top starting pitcher  over a big bat, if we are only doing one of the two.  There's still a lot of offseason left.  We may be surprised, or not.  LOL

[Kimmi]

8 minutes ago, Old Red said:

I think right now Brez, and BorASS are having a tug of war on the length of a contract for Bregman.

I'm sure they are.  This is the problem with opt outs.  If we want Bregman back, we'll probably have to give him at least 2 additional years over what his original contract with us was.

[moonslav59]

15 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

There is no way that the Red Sox should sign Bregman for 6 years.  Three years should be the limit, IMO.

Pretty much saying no, then.

[moonslav59]

9 minutes ago, Kimmi said:

That's the thing.  Henry's budget is limited, regardless of the fact that he can spend without limit if he wanted to.  Bad long-term contracts can hurt us for years to come.  

I think that Gray could possibly perform at the #2 level.  I would still prefer another top starting pitcher  over a big bat, if we are only doing one of the two.  There's still a lot of offseason left.  We may be surprised, or not.  LOL

The history of the largest and longest deals is not very good.

The Sox history is even worse, especially if you view Nate's re-signing as not really a FA deal.

Under JH and over $70M and 3+ years

2023 Yoshida (Pretty damn bad)

2022 Story (Not good)

2018 JD Martinez (Very good)

2016 Price (Not good.)

2015 Sandoval & HRam (Both were awful)

2011 Carl Crawford (Yuck-a-doodle-doo-doo!)

2010 Lackey (Not good)

We are 1 for 7 on the L & L deals under JH.

[Kimmi]

6 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Pretty much saying no, then.

More than likely.