Rumor: Are The Red Sox Planning To Trade Masataka Yoshida This Offseason?

[Brock Beauchamp]

Chris Cotillo of MassLive recently reported that there was friction between the Red Sox and Masataka Yoshida earlier this season over an injured left thumb. The Red Sox put Yoshida on the injured list but after an evaluation, decided surgery was not necessary. Yoshida then proceeded to pursue a second and then third opinion on the matter, which apparently rubbed team officials the wrong way. 

Yoshida has been a capable hitter in the majors, though with very little power. He has a career 111 OPS+ (11% above league average with the stick) but hits left-handed while the Red Sox believe they need to become more right-handed this offseason. Additionally, Yoshida has not shown to be a capable outfielder with Boston slotting him into permanent designated hitter duties in 2024.

Yoshida is owed $55.8 million over the next three seasons.

View full rumor

[notin]

They’ll move him, pay a huge chunk, and get nothing except maybe some other team’ questionable contract in return..

[mvp 78]

26 minutes ago, Brock Beauchamp said:

Chris Cotillo of MassLive recently reported that there was friction between the Red Sox and Masataka Yoshida earlier this season over an injured left thumb. The Red Sox put Yoshida on the injured list but after an evaluation, decided surgery was not necessary. Yoshida then proceeded to pursue a second and then third opinion on the matter, which apparently rubbed team officials the wrong way. 

Yoshida has been a capable hitter in the majors, though with very little power. He has a career 111 OPS+ (11% above league average with the stick) but hits left-handed while the Red Sox believe they need to become more right-handed this offseason. Additionally, Yoshida has not shown to be a capable outfielder with Boston slotting him into permanent designated hitter duties in 2024.

Yoshida is owed $55.8 million over the next three seasons.

 

View full rumor

 

There's also friction because Masa wants to continue to play LF and the Sox don't want him anywhere near there. 

[Old Red]

10 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

There's also friction because Masa wants to continue to play LF and the Sox don't want him anywhere near there. 

Did Bloom, and his minions see something that Masa hasn’t shown yet that the Red Sox wanted him so bad they not only outbid everyone, but shut the bidding down in record time?

[Duran Is The Man]

Just now, Old Red said:

Did Bloom, and his minions see something that Masa hasn’t shown yet that the Red Sox wanted him so bad they not only outbid everyone, but shut the bidding down in record time?

Bloom is the first guy they need to call. He loved him so much, maybe he wants him back.

[Old Red]

8 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

Bloom is the first guy they need to call. He loved him so much, maybe he wants him back.

I think Bloom knows now he over evaluated Masa.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Maybe the front office overbid on Yoshida in the hopes it could influence some of his tournament teammates -- who pitch -- to also consider signing with the Red Sox.

They were ultimately only a few billion dollars short on getting Ohtani, Imanaga and Yo Mama. 

[moonslav59]

3 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

Bloom is the first guy they need to call. He loved him so much, maybe he wants him back.

Word was the Sox scouts were drooling over Masa for years.

He has not come close to earning his keep, and $18M/yr sets a high bar for a DH to meet.

I still think finding a team looking to dump an even bigger salary might be the best was to get something for him, but teams looking to dump salary, will not want Yoshida and his contract. Usually, teams looking to shed salary are rebuilding, and Yoshida is not at a point where he would be part of any rebuild.

I'm not even sure many teams would take him for nothing in return at $6-8M a year. Maybe a few might take him at $5-6M a year- maybe a few more at $3-4M a year, but that's a hefty loss to take on anyone.

This is becoming an awful habit- paying other teams to take our players.

[Bellhorn04]

They're planning to explore it, I'm sure.

[mvp 78]

20 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

This is becoming an awful habit- paying other teams to take our players.

Easy enough to do when you have cheap, younger, better players coming along in the pipeline. 

[notin]

30 minutes ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

Maybe the front office overbid on Yoshida in the hopes it could influence some of his tournament teammates -- who pitch -- to also consider signing with the Red Sox.

They were ultimately only a few billion dollars short on getting Ohtani, Imanaga and Yo Mama. 

Wouldn’t that mean they also had to overbid on his teammates?

[Maxbialystock]

7 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

They're planning to explore it, I'm sure.

Of course they are.  I was probably Yoshida's biggest booster/fan this year because I argued (and gave 5 reasons) why Cora should play him, which he did.  Moreover, Yoshida had a couple of pretty good months in July and August (OPS's close to .900).  

But I agree the Sox should try to get rid of him, even if they have to pay some or even most of his remaining salary.   As everyone has already said, Yoshida is a lefty bat on a team with too many lefty bats, plus he's a contact hitter with not much power, plus he can't play the outfield (no range, no arm).  

[notin]

Just now, Maxbialystock said:

Of course they are.  I was probably Yoshida's biggest booster/fan this year because I argued (and gave 5 reasons) why Cora should play him, which he did.  Moreover, Yoshida had a couple of pretty good months in July and August (OPS's close to .900).  

But I agree the Sox should try to get rid of him, even if they have to pay some or even most of his remaining salary.   As everyone has already said, Yoshida is a lefty bat on a team with too many lefty bats, plus he's a contact hitter with not much power, plus he can't play the outfield (no range, no arm).  

Yoshida isn’t Mike Lansing, who was well paid to do almost nothing; Yoshida does have a skill set. And one that’s always useful somewhere. 

The big issue is the contract.  Even teams that could use a LHH contact hitter wouldn’t pay that much for one…

[Old Red]

13 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Easy enough to do when you have cheap, younger, better players coming along in the pipeline. 

It all depends if JH likes smoking that pipe.

[Maxbialystock]

7 minutes ago, notin said:

Yoshida isn’t Mike Lansing, who was well paid to do almost nothing; Yoshida does have a skill set. And one that’s always useful somewhere. 

The big issue is the contract.  Even teams that could use a LHH contact hitter wouldn’t pay that much for one…

Exactly.  

[moonslav59]

47 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

Easy enough to do when you have cheap, younger, better players coming along in the pipeline. 

I'm not sure that's why we paid to let Sale pitch for ATL.

I do think that is an aspect of the Yoshida trade desire, along with the LHB overload.

The Price dump as not about having better pitchers in the system. Our 2020 rotation is a testament to that fact.

We paid a chunk of Barnes' deal beyond what Blier cost us.

We paid a little of Beni's deal, but saved enough to afford Renfroe (or marwin, if you are a glass half-empty guy.).

Am I missing anyone else we paid to play elsewhere, since Carl Crawford?

I think we DFA'd Pablito.

I think we are all done paying other teams, so why not add Yoshida to the tally?

[moonslav59]

45 minutes ago, notin said:

Yoshida isn’t Mike Lansing, who was well paid to do almost nothing; Yoshida does have a skill set. And one that’s always useful somewhere. 

The big issue is the contract.  Even teams that could use a LHH contact hitter wouldn’t pay that much for one…

I've mentioned some teams might want him for $3-6M a year, but how many would pay $6-9M a year? Would anyone want him at $10M a year?

[Hugh2]

Be prepared to either trade player/prospect package or eat all his salary. 

Depending on how that looks, I'm not against it at all.  

[Duran Is The Man]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Word was the Sox scouts were drooling over Masa for years.

He has not come close to earning his keep, and $18M/yr sets a high bar for a DH to meet.

I still think finding a team looking to dump an even bigger salary might be the best was to get something for him, but teams looking to dump salary, will not want Yoshida and his contract. Usually, teams looking to shed salary are rebuilding, and Yoshida is not at a point where he would be part of any rebuild.

I'm not even sure many teams would take him for nothing in return at $6-8M a year. Maybe a few might take him at $5-6M a year- maybe a few more at $3-4M a year, but that's a hefty loss to take on anyone.

This is becoming an awful habit- paying other teams to take our players.

if this is the case, then i would look at not only replacing Masa, but also replacing those scouts.

[Bellhorn04]

39 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

if this is the case, then i would look at not only replacing Masa, but also replacing those scouts.

Surely the scouts should have realized he was a poor fielder, slow as molasses and with limited power.

The whole thing is just embarrassing.

[Old Red]

2 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Surely the scouts should have realized he was a poor fielder, slow as molasses and with limited power.

The whole thing is just embarrassing.

And costly.

[Larry Cook]

 I think the scouts over estimated yoshida’s fielding ability. I think we need to pay 40-50mm of the contract if we hope to move yoshida. 
we will get a prospect ranked 20-30 in a team’s list, but in rookie ball or low A! 
the important thing is to move yoshida out of town and open up the DH spot 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, Duran Is The Man said:

if this is the case, then i would look at not only replacing Masa, but also replacing those scouts.

All scouts swing and miss, sometimes, badly.

I think we have made some major changes, already, but I'm not sure about the specific people involved.

I am pretty certain it was the scouts who got Bloom to want Yoshida. This is usually the case with all these sort of decisions made.

[Bellhorn04]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

All scouts swing and miss, sometimes, badly.

I think we have made some major changes, already, but I'm not sure about the specific people involved.

I am pretty certain it was the scouts who got Bloom to want Yoshida. This is usually the case with all these sort of decisions made.

Personally I'd like to think the CBO would take a deep personal interest in a player he's going to spend over a hundred million on.  Bloom was the guy who was supposed to be the architect of the team.  This was a pretty big move so he shouldn't just be taking the advice of the scouts.  There would be a ton of data and presumably video for him to peruse. 

[moonslav59]

4 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Personally I'd like to think the CBO would take a deep personal interest in a player he's going to spend over a hundred million on.  Bloom was the guy who was supposed to be the architect of the team.  This was a pretty big move so he shouldn't just be taking the advice of the scouts.  There would be a ton of data and presumably video for him to peruse. 

Agreed. I didn't mean to sound like this was all on the scouts. Bloom, JH & Co. made the final call. I do think a lot of stock is put into what scouts say, and apparently they really liked Yoshida.

He may still end up hitting better than he's shown, but $18M for a low-powered DH has to be a guy with a .400+ OBP and a ton of doubles.

[mvp 78]

18 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

I'm not sure that's why we paid to let Sale pitch for ATL.

I do think that is an aspect of the Yoshida trade desire, along with the LHB overload.

The Price dump as not about having better pitchers in the system. Our 2020 rotation is a testament to that fact.

We paid a chunk of Barnes' deal beyond what Blier cost us.

We paid a little of Beni's deal, but saved enough to afford Renfroe (or marwin, if you are a glass half-empty guy.).

Am I missing anyone else we paid to play elsewhere, since Carl Crawford?

I think we DFA'd Pablito.

I think we are all done paying other teams, so why not add Yoshida to the tally?

The reasons they dumped previous players aren't necessarily the same reasons they'd dump a player now. The organization is in a different space than it used to be in respect to luxury tax, farm development and other issues. 

[moonslav59]

2 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

The reasons they dumped previous players aren't necessarily the same reasons they'd dump a player now. The organization is in a different space than it used to be in respect to luxury tax, farm development and other issues. 

Yes, agreed, and until recently, I always felt like JH's spending was cyclical and matched up with certain "windows" of opportunity to win a ring. 

I kept thinking, "this could be the winter," but that got tiring. At this point, I'm not sure JH ever spends like he did, before. I'm not counting on it. I'm not expecting it. However, I've not given up hope, either.

"I'll believe it when I see it," is my current mantra.

I'm very optimistic about our future, and maybe we can with without major financial outlays- maybe not.

Many of us realized, even before 2018, that the spending was enormous, and so many of our younger players were all approaching free agency, around the same 1-3 year period. We wondered how we could sustain a great team, without massive budget increases, and what appeared to be a very low ranked farm system. We called a word, some hate to hear, so I won't say "cliff." (LOL)

I doubt anyone saw it ever getting this bad and letting so many of our stars walk. Some had faith we could rebuild the farm, quickly and get right back into the swing of it, without missing a beat, but that also presupposed JH would spend "enough" to bridge to this new farm system. As it turned out, the farm took many years to get where it is now, and we still lack many farm pitchers that are great or even real good.

With little farm infusion between Devers and Houck/Duran/Bello, I think JH saw the window was going to be closed for a longer period than we've seen under him. Hopefully, he see the window as being open, now and changes his way, but I'm not believing in that, until I see some actions. (emphasis on the plural "s.")

[notin]

21 hours ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Surely the scouts should have realized he was a poor fielder, slow as molasses and with limited power.

The whole thing is just embarrassing.

Yoshida played 7 years in NPB with a career .960 OPS and 133 HRs.  His numbers there were fairly comparable to Seiya Suzuki.  It’s not like he was putting up Nick Punto numbers overseas.  He just hasn’t hit as well as Suzuki so far…

[mvp 78]

35 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Yes, agreed, and until recently, I always felt like JH's spending was cyclical and matched up with certain "windows" of opportunity to win a ring. 

I kept thinking, "this could be the winter," but that got tiring. At this point, I'm not sure JH ever spends like he did, before. I'm not counting on it. I'm not expecting it. However, I've not given up hope, either.

"I'll believe it when I see it," is my current mantra.

I'm very optimistic about our future, and maybe we can with without major financial outlays- maybe not.

Many of us realized, even before 2018, that the spending was enormous, and so many of our younger players were all approaching free agency, around the same 1-3 year period. We wondered how we could sustain a great team, without massive budget increases, and what appeared to be a very low ranked farm system. We called a word, some hate to hear, so I won't say "cliff." (LOL)

I doubt anyone saw it ever getting this bad and letting so many of our stars walk. Some had faith we could rebuild the farm, quickly and get right back into the swing of it, without missing a beat, but that also presupposed JH would spend "enough" to bridge to this new farm system. As it turned out, the farm took many years to get where it is now, and we still lack many farm pitchers that are great or even real good.

With little farm infusion between Devers and Houck/Duran/Bello, I think JH saw the window was going to be closed for a longer period than we've seen under him. Hopefully, he see the window as being open, now and changes his way, but I'm not believing in that, until I see some actions. (emphasis on the plural "s.")

Rebuilding the farm is only the part of the answer. You need those prospects to develop into fulltime starters OR flip them. Sox have a good system right now, but it needs to start bearing fruit next season. 

[mvp 78]

11 minutes ago, notin said:

Yoshida played 7 years in NPB with a career .960 OPS and 133 HRs.  His numbers there were fairly comparable to Seiya Suzuki.  It’s not like he was putting up Nick Punto numbers overseas.  He just hasn’t hit as well as Suzuki so far…

He's had some good runs. His hit tool hasn't been consistent enough though.