Red Sox ownership

[Bellhorn04]

It's like little by little, Henry is being exposed as the cold-blooded greedy prick we were afraid he might be. We were saved in the past by people around him or working for him, but they're all gone.

[Hitch]

When baseball insiders are saying "they are out on the top FA's and need to cut payroll to bring guys in" what are we supposed to believe? Just wait until ST for the roster to round into form? Some magical pot of money is going to appear? Henry's cold heart will melt with the snow in springtime?

 

We've also both said that this off season has been a dumpster fire for baseball insiders. Nothing is locked in until it's locked in.

 

But I agree, it doesn't look great.

[mvp 78]

It's like little by little, Henry is being exposed as the cold-blooded greedy prick we were afraid he might be. We were saved in the past by people around him or working for him, but they're all gone.

 

Vlad Dracul

 

I regret distrusting Larry back in the day. He was the motor we needed.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Bellhorn's note on snowballing reminds that the Sox did their worst to allow the Yankees to pass them at last year's finish line.

 

Both were snowed in at the end. To dig out, Boston's owners replaced a plastic shovel with a metal one. New York bought a brand new star-powered snow blower.

 

And who's honking that horn? Why, it's the Dodgers, driving by in a hummer with a giant plow -- waving buh-bye.

[Duran Is The Man]

Bellhorn's note on snowballing reminds that the Sox did their worst to allow the Yankees to pass them at last year's finish line.

 

Both were snowed in at the end. To dig out, Boston's owners replaced a plastic shovel with a metal one. New York bought a brand new star-powered snow blower.

 

And who's honking that horn? Why, it's the Dodgers, driving by in a hummer with a giant plow -- waving buh-bye.

 

nice.

[notin]

It's like little by little, Henry is being exposed as the cold-blooded greedy prick we were afraid he might be. We were saved in the past by people around him or working for him, but they're all gone.

 

I feel more and more vindicated every day as one of the few Pro-Lucchino folks out here. Although admittedly I didn’t start out that way…

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

One report yesterday (McCaffrey?) said the Sox refuse to sign another outfielder for more than two years because they plan on relying on Anthony and Rafaela in the near future.

 

It explained that Teoscar wanted three years, so pivoted to one for $23.5M from LA for almost the same amount that Boston offered him for two ($28M). This also shows why Gurriel wasn't coming to Fenway (he got three for $44M to stay with the NL champs).

 

If the reporter has some kind of source and is not just guessing like the rest of us, maybe it's reassuring that Anthony and Rafaela won't be traded... which also makes a guy like Duran or even Yoshida expendable. We'll see how many years Soler and Duvall wind up with; obviously they'll also want more than two, which their careers make a case for... at least as old DHs.

[mvp 78]

One report yesterday (McCaffrey?) said the Sox refuse to sign another outfielder for more than two years because they plan on relying on Anthony and Rafaela in the near future.

 

It explained that Teoscar wanted three years, so pivoted to one for $23.5M from LA for almost the same amount that Boston offered him for two ($28M). This also shows why Gurriel wasn't coming to Fenway (he got three for $44M to stay with the NL champs).

 

If the reporter has some kind of source and is not just guessing like the rest of us, maybe it's reassuring that Anthony and Rafaela won't be traded... which also makes a guy like Duran or even Yoshida expendable. We'll see how many years Soler and Duvall wind up with; obviously they'll also want more than two, which their careers make a case for... at least as old DHs.

 

Old DH's don't typically get multi-year deals. Duvall doesn't stay healthy. Soler isn't consistent. I think the idea of overpaying a guy on a one year deal (Teoscar) makes sense. The spend thrift Sox probably just want to pinch as many pennies as they can.

[notin]

Old DH's don't typically get multi-year deals. Duvall doesn't stay healthy. Soler isn't consistent. I think the idea of overpaying a guy on a one year deal (Teoscar) makes sense. The spend thrift Sox probably just want to pinch as many pennies as they can.

 

If the Sox are penny-pinching, maybe another potential sensible solution is Gio Urshela, who could bolster some infield defense and hit somewhat from the right side…

[mvp 78]

If the Sox are penny-pinching, maybe another potential sensible solution is Gio Urshela, who could bolster some infield defense and hit somewhat from the right side…

 

He backs up all IF positions. He's better than Pablo Reyes.

[moonslav59]

I dunno moon, when you look at what's going on, it seems like Bloom did just about what he could be expected to do. He built up the farm, he kept payroll under control. The 2021-2023 teams were all somewhat in the hunt in July.

 

How much the budget affected some of his choices we'll never know.

 

But I think there's a strong possibility he was fired just to temporarily appease the fans.

 

And I feel kind of sorry for Breslow because they're putting him in a s***** position.

 

I don't think my statement opposes this one.

 

Had Bloom done better with more of his bigger signings, we might not have finished in last place 2 of the last 3 seasons.

Story

Yoshi

Richards

Kluber

Kike II

Perez I & II

 

Only Jansen made more than some on this list and did better.

 

It's not absurd to think someone else could have and will do better.

 

I only feel bad for Brez, if they lied to him about the budget.

[moonslav59]

One report yesterday (McCaffrey?) said the Sox refuse to sign another outfielder for more than two years because they plan on relying on Anthony and Rafaela in the near future.

 

It explained that Teoscar wanted three years, so pivoted to one for $23.5M from LA for almost the same amount that Boston offered him for two ($28M). This also shows why Gurriel wasn't coming to Fenway (he got three for $44M to stay with the NL champs).

 

If the reporter has some kind of source and is not just guessing like the rest of us, maybe it's reassuring that Anthony and Rafaela won't be traded... which also makes a guy like Duran or even Yoshida expendable. We'll see how many years Soler and Duvall wind up with; obviously they'll also want more than two, which their careers make a case for... at least as old DHs.

 

If they get the OF signing right, they should be able to trade him after 1-2 years, anyway.

[moonslav59]

Bellhorn's note on snowballing reminds that the Sox did their worst to allow the Yankees to pass them at last year's finish line.

 

Both were snowed in at the end. To dig out, Boston's owners replaced a plastic shovel with a metal one. New York bought a brand new star-powered snow blower.

 

And who's honking that horn? Why, it's the Dodgers, driving by in a hummer with a giant plow -- waving buh-bye.

 

Indeed.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

He backs up all IF positions. He's better than Pablo Reyes.

 

An Urshela or Eduardo Nunez makes total sense to carry on a contender's roster...

 

... but why in the world would a tank team want to pay market rate for a decent player when it can find someone serviceable at minimum wage off waiver wires -- or in the minors for another doormat (like Pablo on the A's last year).

 

Urshela made upwards of $8M last year, which could mean Boston has to clear around 10 replacement players making league minimum just to sign him.

[notin]

An Urshela or Eduardo Nunez makes total sense to carry on a contender's roster...

 

... but why in the world would a tank team want to pay market rate for a decent player when it can find someone serviceable at minimum wage off waiver wires -- or in the minors for another doormat (like Pablo on the A's last year).

 

Urshela made upwards of $8M last year, which could mean Boston has to clear around 10 replacement players making league minimum just to sign him.

 

 

Unless the Sox are talking about using Urshela as a starter and not a bench piece.

[mvp 78]

An Urshela or Eduardo Nunez makes total sense to carry on a contender's roster...

 

... but why in the world would a tank team want to pay market rate for a decent player when it can find someone serviceable at minimum wage off waiver wires -- or in the minors for another doormat (like Pablo on the A's last year).

 

Urshela made upwards of $8M last year, which could mean Boston has to clear around 10 replacement players making league minimum just to sign him.

 

Urshela isn't going to make that in FA. The previous one was an arb contract and those can get inflated.

[Bellhorn04]

I don't think my statement opposes this one.

 

Had Bloom done better with more of his bigger signings, we might not have finished in last place 2 of the last 3 seasons.

Story

Yoshi

Richards

Kluber

Kike II

Perez I & II

 

Only Jansen made more than some on this list and did better.

 

It's not absurd to think someone else could have and will do better.

 

I only feel bad for Brez, if they lied to him about the budget.

 

Richards and Perez I were in 2021. They made the playoffs that year and Bloom made other moves which worked. Not sure why you are counting them against him.

[mvp 78]

McAdam:

 

Other than a few informal exchanges with reporters during the 2021 postseason and a few exchanges with two reporters via email last February, Henry has not made himself available to the media in a press conference setting since February of 2020, almost four years ago.

[notin]

McAdam:

 

Other than a few informal exchanges with reporters during the 2021 postseason and a few exchanges with two reporters via email last February, Henry has not made himself available to the media in a press conference setting since February of 2020, almost four years ago.

 

It’s almost as of there was some franchise-altering move around that time…

[moonslav59]

Richards and Perez I were in 2021. They made the playoffs that year and Bloom made other moves which worked. Not sure why you are counting them against him.

 

Because they were on the list of highest contracts given out who sucked.

 

(Wacha made as much as Perez, but I lumped Perez I & II together to get him on the list.

 

That is the whole list of every player Bloom signed for $10M or more. except jansen and Martin: two worked or have worked, so far.

 

I'm fine with what Bloom did in other areas, including deals under $7.1M. My point was, Bloom was canned because of these moves, in large part, and I am not thinking the idea that his replacement could do better than 2 for 8 is not absurd.

 

The other thing is, we were assuming Brez was going with the same budget restrictions as Bloom: this looks worse!

 

(Actually, it looks closest to what Bloom was given in 2020, than any other winter.)

 

I'm no big fan of Giolito, but spending $19M on himlooks better than $10M on Richards + $10M on Kluber.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm no big fan of Giolito, but spending $19M on himlooks better than $10M on Richards + $10M on Kluber.

 

It looks better now because he hasn't thrown a pitch for us yet.

 

Kluber looked pretty good for $10 mill this time last year.

[moonslav59]

It looks better now because he hasn't thrown a pitch for us yet.

 

Kluber looked pretty good for $10 mill this time last year.

 

Good point.

 

I certainly hoped for better than Kluber, last winter, but I thought he was okay for $10M.

 

At least Brez went about twice as bold on that big dollar amount!

[vjcsmoke]

McAdam:

 

Other than a few informal exchanges with reporters during the 2021 postseason and a few exchanges with two reporters via email last February, Henry has not made himself available to the media in a press conference setting since February of 2020, almost four years ago.

 

He got mad that he got booed by the fans and deservedly so. The guy has simply decided to TUNE OUT the fans who care about the team and just focus on counting the money coming in.

 

He also doesn't want to answer 'uncomfortable questions' from the media and wants to dodge responsibility for his cheapness. It's really sad what JWH has become.

[Randy Red Sox]

It looks better now because he hasn't thrown a pitch for us yet.

 

Kluber looked pretty good for $10 mill this time last year.

 

Kluber did not look good to me at any price given his past few seasons

[Randy Red Sox]

If you were operating this team like Henry is would you be holding media conferences?

[notin]

Kluber did not look good to me at any price given his past few seasons

 

In Kluber’s two previous seasons, he posted a 4.17 ERA/3.66 FIP with a 4.1:1 K:BB over 244 IP. There isn’t much there that didn’t say he deserved to be paid as much as Kyle Gibson or Matthew Boyd…

[Elktonnick]

He got mad that he got booed by the fans and deservedly so. The guy has simply decided to TUNE OUT the fans who care about the team and just focus on counting the money coming in.

 

He also doesn't want to answer 'uncomfortable questions' from the media and wants to dodge responsibility for his cheapness. It's really sad what JWH has become.

 

I have thought for sometime that Henry's first priority is building the FSG empire and the Red Sox are only one enterprise in that empire.

 

An article in the Athletic implies that Henry is more interested in developing Fenway Park and its environs as a year round destination than the Red Sox team at the present time. With 4 titles under his belt I think he is serious about building a sustainable club without spending exhortation rates for free agents who are no guarantee of producing a winner.

[notin]

I have thought for sometime that Henry's first priority is building the FSG empire and the Red Sox are only one enterprise in that empire.

 

An article in the Athletic implies that Henry is more interested in developing Fenway Park and its environs as a year round destination than the Red Sox team at the present time. With 4 titles under his belt I think he is serious about building a sustainable club without spending exhortation rates for free agents who are no guarantee of producing a winner.

 

 

I absolutely agree with that. And I don’t think it’s impossible. I do think it’s extremely difficult despite how easy Tampa makes it look…

Edited January 13, 2024 by notin

[moonslav59]

Kluber did not look good to me at any price given his past few seasons

 

With the numbers he had before 2023, he'd be getting paid $15-19M, this year.

 

The guy was in the Cy Young running just about every year before the injury. He missed two years and came back to put up these numbers from '21-'22:

244 IP

4.17 ERA

3.66 FIP

8.2 K/9 & 2.0 BB/9

 

Certainly not great, but at $10M, I expected better than what we got.

 

I also think JH & Co. feel Brez can do better than this.

 

Let's see how GIO does, because he might be all Brez gets.

 

[moonslav59]

I absolutely agree with that. And I don’t think it’s impossible. I do think it’s extremely difficult despite how easy Tampa makes it look…

 

Yup.

 

They also help their team out by trading some very good players "just in time." Our GM would be roasted for some of the trades the Rays have made, yet many of them seem to work out.

 

The list of SP'ers they have traded away is long and noteworthy.

 

(They have a pretty decent list of pitchers they traded for, as well.