Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[moonslav59]

even with the Sox being out of it for quite some time, Cora has still yet to use Devers at 1B. this blows my mind that we can see this but he doesn't. at this point, what do they have to lose? it's ridiculous having such an aawful defense and even more ridiculous that he doesn't seem to care to do anything about it. i really like your Matt CHapman idea. and it makes a ton of sense so....it will never happen. i guess Cora is going to stick with guys that can't play defense for s*** (see Rodriguez, Kike) because he's a "players coach".

 

It would make sense to have Devers learn 1B during the winter. IMO.

[Duran Is The Man]

That’s an assumption. Duran is light years better defensively than he was last year, but only because he was a complete horror show who looked like he has never even seen an outfield last year, let alone tried to defend one.

 

It’s interesting that most of the ideas on this board about how to improve the defense include giving another player “more time to get better.” Casas needs more time to learn that position he’s been playing his entire professional career. Duran will get better if we give him an easier position and more time. But Yoshida? Apparently he’s barely a step above Stevie Wonder in the 700 innings he played out there. “No chance! Can’t improve!

 

“But we should give Devers another year. He’s only been playing third base for 10 or 12 years now. He will het better soon. Possibly jump all the way up to second worst defensive third baseman in MLB.”

 

 

 

;)

[Duran Is The Man]

It would make sense to have Devers learn 1B during the winter. IMO.

 

it has made sense for far too long yet hasn't happened. he's only been worst or second worst defensive 3B every year he's played but his first. and had he played a full year that year, he would have been the worst then too.

[moonslav59]

it has made sense for far too long yet hasn't happened. he's only been worst or second worst defensive 3B every year he's played but his first. and had he played a full year that year, he would have been the worst then too.

 

Some metrics show this is not true.

 

Devers has shown signs of improvement and then relapsed, at least twice.

 

DRS

-9 in '23

-6 in '22 (improved from '21)

-13 in '21

-5 in '19 (improved from '18)

-11 in '18

-5 in '17

 

UZR/150

-11.5

-5.2

+2,4

-10'6

-5.8

-1.9

-2.2

 

OAA shows he's worse...

-9 in '23 worst in MLB

-9 in '22 2nd worst

-14 in '21 worst

+17 in '19 2nd best

-4 in '18 was 28th out of 38

-9 in '17 was 4th worst

[notin]

It would make sense to have Devers learn 1B during the winter. IMO.

 

Or now.

 

Why have they been wasting time with Dalbec?

[moonslav59]

Or now.

 

Why have they been wasting time with Dalbec?

 

I would not have been against the idea. Maybe they felt Dalbec could get hot and get a slightly better PTBNL.

[notin]

I would not have been against the idea. Maybe they felt Dalbec could get hot and get a slightly better PTBNL.

 

I don’t think there is any MLB GM would change their opinion of Dalbec based on a few at bats, not to mention it doesn’t change that he requires a 40 man roster spot, which is a BIG DEAL…

[moonslav59]

I don’t think there is any MLB GM would change their opinion of Dalbec based on a few at bats, not to mention it doesn’t change that he requires a 40 man roster spot, which is a BIG DEAL…

 

We've beaten this horse.

 

I doubt any GM would give a PTBNL for Dalbec or claim him off waivers, but all it takes is one, and Dalbec has shown he can hit in the bigs for pretty long stretches- just not recently. He raked in AAA, this year, but has not shown any improvement on defense or in limiting his K's.

 

Again, he will likely not have any GM calling us, but it's not impossible, IMO. Obviously, it is to you. I get it. You are likely right.

[Bellhorn04]

Or now.

 

Why have they been wasting time with Dalbec?

 

Dalbec put up great numbers at Woo this year.

 

The injury to Casas provided one last chance to show if he had improved his approach.

 

MLB pitchers are eating him up again.

 

Game over, basically.

[Old Red]

Dalbec put up great numbers at Woo this year.

 

The injury to Casas provided one last chance to show if he had improved his approach.

 

MLB pitchers are eating him up again.

 

Game over, basically.

 

I’ve heard all kinds of talk that Raffy should be getting time at 1B, and to me that is a BIG no. IF, and when they decide to move him to 1B then start try him out in ST. Until then he needs all the reps he can get at 3B' which means NO on him being the backup at 1B also. Like I keep saying I believe JT will be back anyway.

[Old Red]

Chapman isn’t coming either!

[Bellhorn04]

Chapman isn’t coming either!

 

Probably not, but it's not the worst idea. I agree with the premise that if we're spending big this offseason the focus has to be pitching.

[notin]

Chapman isn’t coming either!

 

Do you have any ideas of your own out do you just criticize other people’s?

 

I suppose you also like to patronize Sox fans for getting excited when the team is playing well. (Something that caused you to go into hiding.)

 

We all get it’s Porter unlikely Chapman gets signed by Boston. It’s also pretty unlikely Nola does Yamamoto does. Should we we also stop talking about starting pitching?

 

But before you overcommit yourself on this anti-Chapman tirade. Two simple questions

 

1. Should the Sox sign Chapman? Or Fo you prefer they continue with the worst defensive infield in MLB?

 

2. How do you know they won’t since we don’t even know who makes those decisions yet?

[notin]

Probably not, but it's not the worst idea. I agree with the premise that if we're spending big this offseason the focus has to be pitching.

 

I think they can open do both.

 

Last year they made offers to Eflin and Eovaldi. They didn’t pivot to Yoshida as Plan C when those didn’t work out…

[Bellhorn04]

I think they can open do both.

 

Last year they made offers to Eflin and Eovaldi. They didn’t pivot to Yoshida as Plan C when those didn’t work out…

 

True, but last offseason they were operating on a pretty tight budget, apparently, the end result of which was only $10 million being spent on starting pitching.

[notin]

No to mention, how many pitchers do people think the Sox are going to add to the MLB roster?

 

Think they’re bringing in 10-12 new pitchers? Maybe just 8?

 

Probably 2 or 3 tops. Not counting MiLB deals, of course…

[notin]

Dalbec put up great numbers at Woo this year.

 

The injury to Casas provided one last chance to show if he had improved his approach.

 

MLB pitchers are eating him up again.

 

Game over, basically.

 

Maybe the Sox could DFA Dalbec, re-sign him, and see if he can still pitch?

[Old Red]

Do you have any ideas of your own out do you just criticize other people’s?

 

I suppose you also like to patronize Sox fans for getting excited when the team is playing well. (Something that caused you to go into hiding.)

 

We all get it’s Porter unlikely Chapman gets signed by Boston. It’s also pretty unlikely Nola does Yamamoto does. Should we we also stop talking about starting pitching?

 

But before you overcommit yourself on this anti-Chapman tirade. Two simple questions

 

1. Should the Sox sign Chapman? Or Fo you prefer they continue with the worst defensive infield in MLB?

 

2. How do you know they won’t since we don’t even know who makes those decisions yet?

Cut out the company line stuff about going into hiding you are just play copycat.

I have already said more than once that I believe JT is coming back, so all the suggestions I keep hearing is mute. I know how some get things in their craw, and think if they shout long, and loud enough Cora will hear,and do it. Just last offseason after Bogey left, and everyone was saying the Red Sox need to go out, and get a SS, and Story should stay at 2B. I kept saying that Story should be the SS, and that’s what they signed him for, and low, and behold if Story hadn’t of come up lame he would have been the opening day SS just like he is now. Or all the talk of Whitlock being in the rotation when for 2 years now I’ve been saying he should stay in the pen. They are not going to sign Chapman, who yes is a good 3B, but not much of a hitter, and would be too costly anyways when money should go to pitching. For better, or worse Raffy is your 3B, and Casas is your 1B, and hopefully they can get better on D. By the way have you figured out yet with 1 game to go that JT wasn’t signed for the bench. That was a doozy of a question you asked on that one.🙈

[notin]

Cut out the company line stuff about going into hiding you are just play copycat.

I have already said more than once that I believe JT is coming back, so all the suggestions I keep hearing is mute. I know how some get things in their craw, and think if they shout long, and loud enough Cora will hear,and do it. Just last offseason after Bogey left, and everyone was saying the Red Sox need to go out, and get a SS, and Story should stay at 2B. I kept saying that Story should be the SS, and that’s what they signed him for, and low, and behold if Story hadn’t of come up lame he would have been the opening day SS just like he is now. Or all the talk of Whitlock being in the rotation when for 2 years now I’ve been saying he should stay in the pen. They are not going to sign Chapman, who yes is a good 3B, but not much of a hitter, and would be too costly anyways when money should go to pitching. For better, or worse Raffy is your 3B, and Casas is your 1B, and hopefully they can get better on D. By the way have you figured out yet with 1 game to go that JT wasn’t signed for the bench. That was a doozy of a question you asked on that one.

 

It doesn’t matter “if you think” Turner is coming back. We know with 100% certainty he is not accepting the option, so he will be free to negotiate with any and every team. And as a few teams have former Dodger executives, Turner has a bunch of fans. He is as likely as Chapman right now.

 

It’s so cute how you pay yourself on the back. Exactly how ardent was that “new shortstop” fervor in the two weeks between Bogaerts signing with San Diego and Story injuring himself warning up for the WBC? Most of the other shortstop stuff came long after Story himself was out of the equation, including Andrus and any other names mentioned.

[Bellhorn04]

No to mention, how many pitchers do people think the Sox are going to add to the MLB roster?

 

Think they’re bringing in 10-12 new pitchers? Maybe just 8?

 

Probably 2 or 3 tops. Not counting MiLB deals, of course…

 

I think most of us would be satisfied if they bring in 2 good starters and 1 good reliever.

[Bellhorn04]

It doesn’t matter “if you think” Turner is coming back. We know with 100% certainty he is not accepting the option, so he will be free to negotiate with any and every team. And as a few teams have former Dodger executives, Turner has a bunch of fans. He is as likely as Chapman right now.

 

It might be worth mentioning that Turner has experienced a pretty bad late slide, possibly injury-related. His fWAR has sunk to 1.3.

[notin]

I think most of us would be satisfied if they bring in 2 good starters and 1 good reliever.

 

I’m ok with just two good SP. And some AAA depth.

 

The bullpen was really not a problem this year and none of them are eligible for free agency and only Pivetta (if he is in the pen) and Schreiber are eligible for arbitration…

[notin]

It might be worth mentioning that Turner has experienced a pretty bad late slide, possibly injury-related. His fWAR has sunk to 1.3.

 

I’d like Turner back. He’s just a flat out good hitter. But it will leave a gaping hole in the defense. Make that two gaping holes…

[Bellhorn04]

I’m ok with just two good SP. And some AAA depth.

 

The bullpen was really not a problem this year and none of them are eligible for free agency and only Pivetta (if he is in the pen) and Schreiber are eligible for arbitration…

 

Pivetta has actually complicated things a bit by pitching incredibly well down the stretch.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

How bad is modern hitting?

 

The year 1968 was the worst batting season in modern history. It's forever remembered as The Year of the Pitcher, when ace starters were MVPs in both leagues. It was so bad that MLB made major changes to the strike zone and mound to try to generate more offense. Yaz won the AL batting crown with an all-time low of .301. Danny Cater, a singles hitting first baseman, was second at .290 (a few years later, the Smart Sox acquired Danny in a coup for a lefty reliever called Sparky).

 

Tied for 9th in the AL Top 10 in '68 were Frank Howard and Rick Monday with BAs of .274.

 

Tied for 9th in the AL Top 10 in 2023 are Justin Turner and Adley Rutschman with BAs of .277.

 

Btw, I'm not on board with acquiring Matt Chapman. He has 165 strikeouts -- 33 more than Boston K-king Connor Wong. I hate watching dozens of strikeouts more than a few errors per game.

 

For perspective, 165 Ks would've been second in the AL in '68 (Reggie Jackson led with 171). Chappy is tied for 10th this season; that's how bad modern hitting is...

[Bellhorn04]

How bad is modern hitting?

 

The year 1968 was the worst batting season in modern history. It's forever remembered as The Year of the Pitcher, when ace starters were MVPs in both leagues. It was so bad that MLB made major changes to the strike zone and mound to try to generate more offense. Yaz won the AL batting crown with an all-time low of .301. Danny Cater, a singles hitting first baseman, was second at .290 (a few years later, the Smart Sox acquired Danny in a coup for a lefty reliever called Sparky).

 

Tied for 9th in the AL Top 10 in '68 were Frank Howard and Rick Monday with BAs of .274.

 

Tied for 9th in the AL Top 10 in 2023 are Justin Turner and Adley Rutschman with BAs of .277.

 

Btw, I'm not on board with acquiring Matt Chapman. He has 165 strikeouts -- 33 more than Boston K-king Connor Wong. I hate watching dozens of strikeouts more than a few errors per game.

 

For perspective, 165 Ks would've been second in the AL in '68 (Reggie Jackson led with 171). Chappy is tied for 10th this season; that's how bad modern hitting is...

 

Runs scored is the bottom line, though.

 

1968 teams scored 3.42 per game.

2023 teams score 4.62 per game.

 

All the strikeouts do tend to make the game itself uglier, that's for sure.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Runs scored is the bottom line, though.

 

1968 teams scored 3.42 per game.

2023 teams score 4.62 per game.

 

All the strikeouts do tend to make the game itself uglier, that's for sure.

 

The baserunning rule changes have certainly helped.

 

I'd say: but you still can't steal first -- though we know that hasn't been the issue with the Red Sox vaunted O, tied for second in AL hits.

 

It's moving the pieces around the gameboard... they're either really unlucky or really sucky.

[Tedballgame]

Pivetta has actually complicated things a bit by pitching incredibly well down the stretch.

 

Wacha 14-4, 3.22 E.R.A. Bloom thought it was smarter to give Kluber 10 million. Another reason he got fired. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

[moonslav59]

Dalbec put up great numbers at Woo this year.

 

The injury to Casas provided one last chance to show if he had improved his approach.

 

MLB pitchers are eating him up again.

 

Game over, basically.

 

24 Ks in 48 PAs, when he knows this is what he needed to improve on, certainly has not helped his case or value. That being said, the league trend seems to be to look the other way on K rates, if they guy can hit HRs or do something else- like get on base of play plus D.

 

Dalbec has not shown he can do either of those, at the ML level, since the end of 2021 (not the '21 playoffs.)

 

If we DFA him, and he goes unclaimed, we will know that no GM felt he was worth a slot on the 40. I do hope we can re-sign him to a minor league deal, if he does pass through waivers. The WOO fans must love him!

[moonslav59]

Wacha 14-4, 3.22 E.R.A. Bloom thought it was smarter to give Kluber 10 million. Another reason he got fired. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

 

I really liked Wacha. At one point, I suggested we offer hima QO, but then I realized, he could be signed for much less.

 

The deal he signed for was a steal for the Padres, even if he bolts.

 

At least we offered Nate a fair deal and a QO. There was no word we even talked to Wacha.