Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Hugh2]

They matter. Look at how this pen got used up this year. This rotation needs a dawgs.

 

I fixed it for you.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Pads and Orsillo were on MLB channel last night. Don was interviewing Snell live during game action. It was revealed that Nate Quickly has never pitched into the 8th inning in his big league career.

 

Watching a double, he also yelled, "Go, Bogey!" to a teammate who leads all NL shortstops this year in OPS.

[moonslav59]

I'd rather have them sign two and trade for a big RH bat.

 

An under-the-radar signing for someone to replace Turner if he walks could be Rhys Hoskins. The downside there is you won't have Yoshida moving to DH and you keep him in the field, which might be fine if Verdugo/Rafaela solidifies it out there.

 

Have you guys looked at the position side of free agency? it's about as ugly as I've ever seen it.

 

It's the perfect storm to spend almost everything on the rotation.

 

Maybe, bring back Duvall. The rest should be spent on the rotation and maybe a little on a LH RP'er. I'm not sure Joely, Bernardino and Murphy do the trick, but if we squeeze Whitlock, Houck and one or both of Crawford and Pivetta to the pen, maybe we don't need any better lefties.

 

RH'd RP'ers Career OPS Against

v RHP/vLHB

.517/.589 Jansen

.674/.663 Martin (reverse splits)

.830/.740 Winckowski (reverse splits and .811/.619 in 2023)

.685/.723 Whitlock

.551/.771 Houck

.759/.791 Pivetta

.701/.791 Crawford (.680/.703 in 2023)

[Hugh2]

It's the perfect storm to spend almost everything on the rotation.

 

Maybe, bring back Duvall. The rest should be spent on the rotation and maybe a little on a LH RP'er. I'm not sure Joely, Bernardino and Murphy do the trick, but if we squeeze Whitlock, Houck and one or both of Crawford and Pivetta to the pen, maybe we don't need any better lefties.

 

RH'd RP'ers Career OPS Against

v RHP/vLHB

.517/.589 Jansen

.674/.663 Martin (reverse splits)

.830/.740 Winckowski (reverse splits and .811/.619 in 2023)

.685/.723 Whitlock

.551/.771 Houck

.759/.791 Pivetta

.701/.791 Crawford (.680/.703 in 2023)

 

agree. I think you figure one of Murphy, Joely, Bernardino can do the trick and then you pick someone up on the free agent market.

 

Left Handed relievers who I really like.

 

Matt Moore,

Wandy Peralta

Brent Sutter

 

give me Sutter, Yamamoto, Duval, + another mid-rotation starter. With a little bounce back, sophomore progression, and luck that team should be a f***ton better.

[Bellhorn04]

It's the perfect storm to spend almost everything on the rotation.

 

Unfortunately there will be other teams thinking the same way.

[Bellhorn04]

agree. I think you figure one of Murphy, Joely, Bernardino can do the trick and then you pick someone up on the free agent market.

 

Joely? We got 11 innings out of the guy. He was more a problem than a solution.

[Nick]

I would love to see Dalbec get another shot as a utility player. I heard he's learning to play outfield.

 

He just looks more comfortable at the plate.

[Hugh2]

Joely? We got 11 innings out of the guy. He was more a problem than a solution.

 

Because he was hurt, I didn't name him I put him in a bag of balls. If you want to talk about Joely in a vacuum I don't think he's on the roster next year. I just don't think they're going to go out and buy two LHP relievers.

 

Also, we are talking about a reliever, these guys are so up and down year to year. If Murphy and Bernardino look like crap in camp and Joely is pitching decently he probably makes the 26-man. If he even comes to camp that is.

[moonslav59]

Joely? We got 11 innings out of the guy. He was more a problem than a solution.

 

He probably won't see his option picked up, so cross him off.

[Bellhorn04]

I would love to see Dalbec get another shot as a utility player. I heard he's learning to play outfield.

 

He just looks more comfortable at the plate.

 

And good small samples are better than bad small samples.

[notin]

They matter. Look at how this pen got used up this year. This rotation needs a dawg.

 

They could get by with a sufficient volume of dawgs. There was too much “bullpen” day built in from the start…

[sk7326]

The focus on the offseason is clearly starting pitching. Now, we want better pitchers than Nick Pavetta ... but give Pavetta this ... he was always there to take the ball, and that has been an all too rare trait.

 

Aaron Nola is a clear top target - I am not sure how the ceiling is outcomewise, but you are going to get a lot of solid to pretty good innings.

Lucas Giolito has been up and down, but some clear upside - though if I were him, I'd take a 1-year to stay in Cleveland's pitching development environment.

Hyun Jim Ryu back from TJS

 

Cora has talked about reviewing the throwing program ramping up for the season. I am not sure how much that would have helped the crew he had this season but find the inches where you can.

 

Having an ace would be awesome - but even just raising the floor would do so much help. Like this team is only going to end up with 1 pitcher over 150 IP. You can't win with that.

[moonslav59]

And good small samples are better than bad small samples.

 

He's had some long good and long bad, too.

[Bellhorn04]

The focus on the offseason is clearly starting pitching. Now, we want better pitchers than Nick Pavetta ... but give Pavetta this ... he was always there to take the ball, and that has been an all too rare trait.

 

And I think we should keep him around for 2024, his final arb year.

[Bellhorn04]

He's had some long good and long bad, too.

 

Yes. There's chat that he has improved his approach. Will still strike out a ton but takes more walks etc.

[Larry Cook]

I would be happy if we signed ryu, snell and inenaga (lefty reliever Japan) this offseason. Maybe bring back duvall.

[oldtimer]

The sooner we get a GM signed, the sooner we can start to make the much needed moves to structure the 2024 team. Let's hope we get someone up to the task this time.

[moonslav59]

I would be happy if we signed ryu, snell and inenaga (lefty reliever Japan) this offseason. Maybe bring back duvall.

 

I'd stay away from TJS recoverees.

 

[Larry Cook]

I'd stay away from TJS recoverees.

 

 

Risk vs. reward.

 

I think he has pitched pretty good so far in late 2023.

 

We could always sign wacha as insurance in case ryu does not return to form

[Nick]

Risk vs. reward.

 

I think he has pitched pretty good so far in late 2023.

 

We could always sign wacha as insurance in case ryu does not return to form

 

Taking the page out of Bloom's play book I see.

[moonslav59]

Taking the page out of Bloom's play book I see.

 

The one page that should have been ripped out years ago.

[moonslav59]

One tier one and one tier two would be a dream come true, but we might be lucky to get one tier two and a tier three.

 

We'll never come to a consensus on wo belongs in tier 1, 2 or 3, but my top two tiers would include:

 

One

Yamamoto

Nola

Snell

Kershaw

 

Two

S Gray

Montgomery

Morton

ERod (opt out)

 

Borderline 2-3 tier

Giolito

Wacha

Stroman

Edited September 21, 2023 by moonslav59

[notin]

One tier one and one tier two would be a dream come true, but we might be lucky to get one tier two and a tier three.

 

We'll never come to a consensus on wo belongs in tier 1, 2 or 3, but my top two tiers would include:

 

One

Yamamoto

Nola

Snell

Kershaw

 

Two

Montgomery

Morton

ERod (opt out)

 

Borderline 2-3 tier

Giolito

Wacha

Stroman

 

 

No Sonny Gray?

 

Not liking Nola as an option. It’ll take a 7-8 year deal and he will break down in year two.

 

If the Sox want a high mileage arm, try the trade market first. Some of the pitchers are still on the right side of 30…

[mvp 78]

Nola will break down because of mileage, so they should bet on guys that typically can only go 130 innings a year?

[Bellhorn04]

Nola will break down because of mileage, so they should bet on guys that typically can only go 130 innings a year?

 

You do have a good point about durability risk. Going forward, Nola looks less risky than Snell by maybe 20-30%.

[moonslav59]

No Sonny Gray?

 

Not liking Nola as an option. It’ll take a 7-8 year deal and he will break down in year two.

 

If the Sox want a high mileage arm, try the trade market first. Some of the pitchers are still on the right side of 30…

 

I was going to put him in tier 1, then forgot to put him in 2.

[moonslav59]

Go for younger arms.

 

Outbid everyone for Yamamoto

 

Trade for a younger pitcher.

[moonslav59]

MLB.com on some interesting facts about Snell's 2023 season...

 

Snell is looking to become the first AL/NL pitcher since 1913 -- when earned runs became official in both leagues -- to lead the Majors in both ERA and walks. Snell leads in ERA by 30 points over Justin Steele (2.73) and has 12 more walks than Charlie Morton (81).

Snell has a whopping 13.4% walk rate, making this one of 173 seasons in MLB history in which a pitcher had a walk rate above 13% in 150 or more innings. Snell’s 169 ERA+ would be the highest of all those seasons, besting Hal Newhouser's 162 ERA+ in the 1942 season.

If Snell walks seven more batters the rest of the season, he'd become the second pitcher ever -- and first since Sam McDowell in 1966 -- with 200 or more strikeouts and 100-plus walks across fewer than 200 innings in a season.

If he wins the Cy Young Award, Snell would become the first pitcher since Early Wynn in 1959 to lead the Majors in walks while winning the award.

[Larry Cook]

The Japanese site lists inamgea as a left handed starter.

 

They list matsui as the lefty reliever.

 

These are the two guys I think we need to sign!!!!!

 

Along with snell

[moonslav59]

The Japanese site lists inamgea as a left handed starter.

 

They list matsui as the lefty reliever.

 

These are the two guys I think we need to sign!!!!!

 

Along with snell

 

Sub Yamamoto for Snell, trade for Senga and we can get a big Japanese TV deal to pay for them all.