A Realistic View at 2023: Part I

[notin]

I think we will sign a couple RP'ers who are capable of sliding into the closer role, but may not have a proven record there, and we let Houck and those 2 fight it out.

 

Oh give me all the closer-caliber relievers we can afford!!

[Old Red]

I think we will sign a couple RP'ers who are capable of sliding into the closer role, but may not have a proven record there, and we let Houck and those 2 fight it out.

 

Doesn’t sound like a Winning formula to me.

[notin]

Doesn’t sound like a Winning formula to me.

 

So multiple relievers capable of being the closer is a bad thing?

[Old Red]

So multiple relievers capable of being the closer is a bad thing?

 

More like a plan B when you don’t have a reliable lockdown closer, which I believe the Red Sox have needed since last offseason.

[Bellhorn04]

So multiple relievers capable of being the closer is a bad thing?

 

It is if it looks like 2022.

[Bellhorn04]

In 2022 the following pitchers recorded saves for the Red Sox:

 

Ryan Brasier (5.78 ERA)

Jake Diekman (4.23)

Kaleb Ort (6.35)

Hansel Robles (5.84)

 

They were all "capable of closing".

[mvp 78]

Doesn’t sound like a Winning formula to me.

 

Worked in 2013. In 2007, they didn't go out and sign a closer.

[mvp 78]

In 2022 the following pitchers recorded saves for the Red Sox:

 

Ryan Brasier (5.78 ERA)

Jake Diekman (4.23)

Kaleb Ort (6.35)

Hansel Robles (5.84)

 

They were all "capable of closing".

 

No. Capable of closing vs capable of being a closer

[Old Red]

Worked in 2013. In 2007, they didn't go out and sign a closer.

 

You counting on next year working out like 2007, or 2013? Seems like a big risk to me. I don’t think Koji will pop up.

Edited November 8, 2022 by Old Red

[moonslav59]

Doesn’t sound like a Winning formula to me.

 

Many teams have won without a clear closer on opening day, or the same closer by the end of the season.

 

I'd love a lock down closer, but can we afford one and still fill the holes in RF, SS, SP and more?

 

Maybe. (I hope so.)

[Old Red]

Many teams have won without a clear closer on opening day, or the same closer by the end of the season.

 

I'd love a lock down closer, but can we afford one and still fill the holes in RF, SS, SP and more?

 

Maybe. (I hope so.)

I understand your first point like the Red Sox in 2013, but I just think any team is better off with a good, lock down, reliable closer.

[moonslav59]

Worked in 2013. In 2007, they didn't go out and sign a closer.

 

The 2013 example is interesting.

 

We had traded Reddick for Andrew Bailey before the 2012 season and had hopes he might close in 2013.

 

We traded Melancon to Pitt for Holt and Hanrahan before the 2013 season, in hopes Joel could maybe be our closer.

 

We signed Uehara before the 2013 season as a RP'er "capable of being a closer," but with just one save from 2011-2012. I think he is the type we might be looking for., but so is every team. Koji has an 0.693 WHIP from 2011-2012 (101 IP.)

[moonslav59]

I understand your first point like the Red Sox in 2013, but I just think any team is better off with a good, lock down, reliable closer.

 

I'm not sure anyone disagrees. The question is where do we go lighter, so we can spend more on a closer?

[notin]

It is if it looks like 2022.

 

What if it looked like the Phillies’ bullpen of 2022?

[notin]

In 2022 the following pitchers recorded saves for the Red Sox:

 

Ryan Brasier (5.78 ERA)

Jake Diekman (4.23)

Kaleb Ort (6.35)

Hansel Robles (5.84)

 

They were all "capable of closing".

 

Extremely weak and faulty logic.

 

Dalbec started a game at shortstop. Did that make him capable of being a major league shortstop?

[moonslav59]

What if it looked like the Phillies’ bullpen of 2022?

 

The Astros gave Pressly 37 save opportunities and others 32 (Montero 16, Neris 7, Stanek 5, Abreu 2 and Maton 2.)

 

In 2021, Pressly got 28 chances while 9 others shared 33 opportunities.

[moonslav59]

Extremely weak and faulty logic.

 

Dalbec started a game at shortstop. Did that make him capable of being a major league shortstop?

 

As of now, he may be our SS for 2023.

 

[notin]

Many teams have won without a clear closer on opening day, or the same closer by the end of the season.

 

I'd love a lock down closer, but can we afford one and still fill the holes in RF, SS, SP and more?

 

Maybe. (I hope so.)

 

I think if someone looked into it, probably about half of the WSC in recent years changed closers midseason. This includes the Red Sox in 2013…

[notin]

As of now, he may be our SS for 2023.

 

 

 

… which is why worrying about the starting lineup between the World Series and Thanksgiving is a pointless task

[dgalehouse]

You counting on next year working out like 2007, or 2013? Seems like a big risk to me. I don’t think Koji will pop up.

 

In 2007 , Papelbon was the closer. He was more than " capable of closing". He is all time top ten in saves. I do not see another Papelbon among in the Sox bullpen crew right now.

[moonslav59]

I think if someone looked into it, probably about half of the WSC in recent years changed closers midseason. This includes the Red Sox in 2013…

 

This is about piece of mind for some fans and not some locked in essential strategy to winning rings.

[moonslav59]

IMO, having a whole bunch of qualified RP'ers in our pen is more important than obtaining one lockdown closer and a smattering of decent set-up guys..

[moonslav59]

In 2007 , Papelbon was the closer. He was more than " capable of closing". He is all time top ten in saves. I do not see another Papelbon among in the Sox bullpen crew right now.

 

Papelbon was already an established closer in 2007, but he wasn't before 2006. Uehara was not considered a closer at the start of 2013.

 

Nobody said he was "another Papelbon" at the start of 2013.

 

Of course, we'd all like to see someone resembling a lock-down closer on the 2023 roster, but I'd be happy going into 2023 with Montero, Fulmer, Houck, Strahm and maybe Whitlock in the mix. (I'm not counting out Barnes, either, and maybe Taylor can come back as a decent set-up guy, too.)

[Old Red]

Papelbon was already an established closer in 2007, but he wasn't before 2006. Uehara was not considered a closer at the start of 2013.

 

Nobody said he was "another Papelbon" at the start of 2013.

 

Of course, we'd all like to see someone resembling a lock-down closer on the 2023 roster, but I'd be happy going into 2023 with Montero, Fulmer, Houck, Strahm and maybe Whitlock in the mix. (I'm not counting out Barnes, either, and maybe Taylor can come back as a decent set-up guy, too.)

 

That’s all wishing, and hoping that someone will take the job, and run with it, and just isn’t sound strategy to me.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Since 2016, Gray has had 1 season above 3 fWAR. Paxton has had 4 seasons above 3 fWAR. When Paxton is healthy, he's much better than Gray.

 

I should have said since they both left New York... Gray has pitched in 92 games. Paxton has pitched in one.

 

But I won't argue health. It's probably the story with every pitching staff since the beginning of time... yet it somehow with Bloom rotations it seems like an even bigger factor than talent and potential.

 

Hell, when I was healthy, even I was much better (at a few things, anyway).

[Bellhorn04]

IMO, having a whole bunch of qualified RP'ers in our pen is more important than obtaining one lockdown closer and a smattering of decent set-up guys..

 

Pretty hard to argue with that.

[dgalehouse]

The Sox had one of the worst bullpens in MLB this past season. And it cost them quite a few games. Major improvement is needed, not just a couple of tweaks . This should be priority number one.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

… which is why worrying about the starting lineup between the World Series and Thanksgiving is a pointless task

 

Tryptofans worrying about or even staying awake for any sports after Thanksgiving is pointless.

[notin]

In 2007 , Papelbon was the closer. He was more than " capable of closing". He is all time top ten in saves. I do not see another Papelbon among in the Sox bullpen crew right now.

 

… which means what?

 

I don’t see anyone capable of being Manny or Ortiz either.

 

I’m not saying the Sox don’t need bullpen help, but comparing their current and even future staff to all time top ten players will always be wrong…

[dgalehouse]

… which means what?

 

I don’t see anyone capable of being Manny or Ortiz either.

 

I’m not saying the Sox don’t need bullpen help, but comparing their current and even future staff to all time top ten players will always be wrong…

 

The contrarian.