Fire Bloom .

[moonslav59]

For all the Coors experts: what factor there causes a batter to strike out 105 times in 307 at bats in a new park and league? Does Coors have a special sky or batter's eye background that makes it easier or better to see a pitched baseball?

 

My point was to highlight...

 

.756 Away Bogey

.752 Away Story (Pre-2022)

 

[Old Red]

My point was to highlight...

 

.756 Away Bogey

.752 Away Story (Pre-2022)

 

 

Counter point is that now Story now plays all his games away from Coors, and I already knew what you were getting at. You fooled no one. Plus the fact that this was already brought up a few months ago, so not very original.

Edited August 3, 2022 by Old Red

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I’m no expert, but the word on the street is that batted balls travel farther, and breaking balls break less, because of the high altitude. Of course that doesn’t explain why Story has had such a hard time hitting good fastballs this year.

 

I've never faced 100 mph pitching, but if I did and held my bat over my shoulder with the barrel pointing at my heels like Story, I would definitely hit .000 (and maybe die).

 

Is it possible that the thin air at Coors makes it easier for pro athletes to whip such wayward lumber into the hitting zone faster... than, say, the thick humidity of the East Coast?

[Old Red]

I've never faced 100 mph pitching, but if I did and held my bat over my shoulder with the barrel pointing at my heels like Story, I would definitely hit .000 (and maybe die).

 

Is it possible that the thin air at Coors makes it easier for pro athletes to whip such wayward lumber into the hitting zone faster... than, say, the thick humidity of the East Coast?

 

Have to call in a real expert.

[moonslav59]

Every GM has a budget . How it is spent is what matters. There is no use crying about old contracts . Every team that takes risks has them. This year , we are paying Story about 22 mil. Hill - 5 mil. Wacha - 7 mil. Barnes - 9 mil. That is 43 mil right there. Are we getting our money's worth ? Could that money have been better spent ?

 

We heard a lot of crying about Pablo, HRam and Porcello (until his Cy Young season), not to mention Pedey & Rusney.

 

DD's first season:

 

Inherited: (bWAR in 2016)

23 HRam 2.6

21 Porcello 4.8 (Cy Young)

19 Pablito -0.2

16 Papi 5.2

13 Pedey 5.4

13 Buch 0.1)

11 Rusney (not on tax line)

9 Uehara (0.7)

 

Core (bWAR 2016):

Betts 9.5

JBJ 5.8

Bogey 3.8

Leon 2.9

Wright 1.9

Shaw 1.7

Holt 1.6

Beni 0.8

Ross 0.8

Erod 0.4

Hembree 0.4

Barnes 0.3

Tazawa 0.3

 

Spent winter '15-'16

$210M/7 Price

$13M/2 Young

(Traded for $13M Kimbrel)

 

Bloom:

Inherited: (2020 bWAR in short season)

32 Price- traded

?? Betts- traded

25 Sale 0.0 (INJ)

22 JD -0.7

20 Bogey 1.6

17 Nate 1.2

13 Pedey 0.0

11 JBJ 2.0

8 ERod 0.0 (COVID)

5 Vaz 0.9

4 Beni -0.1

3 Barnes 0.3

 

Core:

(2.1 Dugo in Betts trade)

1.3 Houck

0.7 Devers

0.6 Dalbec

0.6 Plawecki

 

Spent:

6 M Perez 1.1

4 Pillar 0.7

3 Peraza 0.0

3 Moreland 1.2

min Weber 1.2

Min Munoz 0.6

Min Mazza 0.5

Min Arroyo 0.2

Min Puello 0.2

added Pivetta 0.6

[notin]

I've got 140 million reasons.

 

You don't pay that kind of money for just a good defensive infielder. Those are a dime a dozen.

 

You pay that kind of money for a premium bat that has the good defense included. Bloom's evaluation as typical was off. He overpaid for an aging infielder who can't hit outside of Coors field.

 

Has the man never heard of Park Factors?! *SMH* But of course some fans are so EAGER to find excuses for the 'baseball genius'.

 

Story OPS on the road is basically the same as Bogaerts’. Should we avoid X, too?

[Bellhorn04]

Speaking of Dave Dombrowski, he joined the Tigers in 2002, and they did not finish first until 2011. (They did make it to the WS in 2006 as a Wild Card team.)

 

Does that mean he was doing a terrible job all those years, or was it because of the situation he walked into? And why did he get a leash that long?

 

Things to ponder for Dave fans.

[Maxbialystock]

We heard a lot of crying about Pablo, HRam and Porcello (until his Cy Young season), not to mention Pedey & Rusney.

 

DD's first season:

 

Inherited: (bWAR in 2016)

23 HRam 2.6

21 Porcello 4.8 (Cy Young)

19 Pablito -0.2

16 Papi 5.2

13 Pedey 5.4

13 Buch 0.1)

11 Rusney (not on tax line)

9 Uehara (0.7)

 

Core (bWAR 2016):

Betts 9.5

JBJ 5.8

Bogey 3.8

Leon 2.9

Wright 1.9

Shaw 1.7

Holt 1.6

Beni 0.8

Ross 0.8

Erod 0.4

Hembree 0.4

Barnes 0.3

Tazawa 0.3

 

Spent winter '15-'16

$210M/7 Price

$13M/2 Young

(Traded for $13M Kimbrel)

 

Bloom:

Inherited: (2020 bWAR in short season)

32 Price- traded

?? Betts- traded

25 Sale 0.0 (INJ)

22 JD -0.7

20 Bogey 1.6

17 Nate 1.2

13 Pedey 0.0

11 JBJ 2.0

8 ERod 0.0 (COVID)

5 Vaz 0.9

4 Beni -0.1

3 Barnes 0.3

 

Core:

(2.1 Dugo in Betts trade)

1.3 Houck

0.7 Devers

0.6 Dalbec

0.6 Plawecki

 

Spent:

6 M Perez 1.1

4 Pillar 0.7

3 Peraza 0.0

3 Moreland 1.2

min Weber 1.2

Min Munoz 0.6

Min Mazza 0.5

Min Arroyo 0.2

Min Puello 0.2

added Pivetta 0.6

 

Indeed. The 2016 Sox, whose lineup all arrived in Boston before DD, led MLB in runs scored and team OPS. They were an offensive powerhouse and a veritable gift to the new GM, who only had to focus on the pitching staff, which was lousy in 2015 (24th best ERA in MLB). He did that quickly with money and trades. Later, he brought in JDM, who made the whole Sox lineup better in 2018. And he replaced Farrell with Cora.

[Maxbialystock]

Counter point is that now Story now plays all his games away from Coors, and I already knew what you were getting at. You fooled no one. Plus the fact that this was already brought up a few months ago, so not very original.

 

When Story struggled early on (his OPS is still only .713), I figured two things. First, he was seeing a whole lot of pitchers for the first time. Second, the thin air in Denver is advantageous to hitters and disadvantageous to pitchers. Now all his games are near sea level.

[Old Red]

When Story struggled early on (his OPS is still only .713), I figured two things. First, he was seeing a whole lot of pitchers for the first time. Second, the thin air in Denver is advantageous to hitters and disadvantageous to pitchers. Now all his games are near sea level.

 

You got it.

[moonslav59]

Indeed. The 2016 Sox, whose lineup all arrived in Boston before DD, led MLB in runs scored and team OPS. They were an offensive powerhouse and a veritable gift to the new GM, who only had to focus on the pitching staff, which was lousy in 2015 (24th best ERA in MLB). He did that quickly with money and trades. Later, he brought in JDM, who made the whole Sox lineup better in 2018. And he replaced Farrell with Cora.

 

The top 6 salary guys DD inherited had about an 18 bWAR in DD's first year, and that's not counting Uehara. While Pablo was "deadwood," it's not really comparable to Bloom's "deadwood."

 

Bloom's top 6 contracts gave him 5.1 bWAR, led by 2 from JBJ. Pro-rate that to a 162 game season and it's maybe a 13 bWAR, but it's hard to imagine JBJ ending up with a 5+ BWAR in 2020.

 

On top of that, DD was not forced to trade his best players to help shed Price's contract the DD made, BTW.

 

How would 2016 have gone had DD not been able to sign Price, and was forced to trade Porcello to get rid of half of Pablo's contract?

[moonslav59]

When Story struggled early on (his OPS is still only .713), I figured two things. First, he was seeing a whole lot of pitchers for the first time. Second, the thin air in Denver is advantageous to hitters and disadvantageous to pitchers. Now all his games are near sea level.

 

He did have a nearly identical career OPS away as Bogey, so if away OPS is the true measure of what a hitter can do, I'm thinking Story's total OPS decline was expected on the "home" front, but should not have been on the away front.

 

.752 Away pre 2022

.625 Away 2022

 

I'm hopeful he can bring that back up to near .750, when healthy, and if he can hit over .800 at Fenway, he'll have a total OPS very similar to Bogey's career OPS.(BTW, he's hitting .800 at Fenway, this year.)

 

All speculation, of course, but it's not just about his Coors numbers. That was only half the equation.

 

He still plays half his games on the road- same as everyone.

[Old Red]

He did have a nearly identical career OPS away as Bogey, so if away OPS is the true measure of what a hitter can do, I'm thinking Story's total OPS decline was expected on the "home" front, but should not have been on the away front.

 

.752 Away pre 2022

.625 Away 2022

 

I'm hopeful he can bring that back up to near .750, when healthy, and if he can hit over .800 at Fenway, he'll have a total OPS very similar to Bogey's career OPS.(BTW, he's hitting .800 at Fenway, this year.)

 

All speculation, of course, but it's not just about his Coors numbers. That was only half the equation.

 

He still plays half his games on the road- same as everyone.

 

But now doesn’t play ANY games at Coors. Fenway is not Coors.

[MADSTORK]

I've got 140 million reasons.

 

You don't pay that kind of money for just a good defensive infielder. Those are a dime a dozen.

 

You pay that kind of money for a premium bat that has the good defense included. Bloom's evaluation as typical was off. He overpaid for an aging infielder who can't hit outside of Coors field.

 

Has the man never heard of Park Factors?! *SMH* But of course some fans are so EAGER to find excuses for the 'baseball genius'.

 

 

Stork is that you ?

[Maxbialystock]

I've never faced 100 mph pitching, but if I did and held my bat over my shoulder with the barrel pointing at my heels like Story, I would definitely hit .000 (and maybe die).

 

Is it possible that the thin air at Coors makes it easier for pro athletes to whip such wayward lumber into the hitting zone faster... than, say, the thick humidity of the East Coast?

 

Story leads the Sox in rbi's and is 2d in dingers (with 15), so he must be doing something right. And he's the best defender on the team by a big margin. His overall WAR of +2.1 is 3d best among position players despite playing 20 games fewer than Bogey, 8 games fewer than JDM and Devers, 18 games fewer than Verdugo, etc. The Sox record with Story in the lineup is 44-37. Without him it's 7-14.

 

So, frankly, I don't care how he holds his freaking bat. I think his biggest problem is facing a slew of pitchers he's never faced before.

[Old Red]

Story leads the Sox in rbi's and is 2d in dingers (with 15), so he must be doing something right. And he's the best defender on the team by a big margin. His overall WAR of +2.1 is 3d best among position players despite playing 20 games fewer than Bogey, 8 games fewer than JDM and Devers, 18 games fewer than Verdugo, etc. The Sox record with Story in the lineup is 44-37. Without him it's 7-14.

 

So, frankly, I don't care how he holds his freaking bat. I think his biggest problem is facing a slew of pitchers he's never faced before.

That was the same excuse used for JBJ’s bad season last year after Bloom made the trade this year for him. Yea that was the reason.

[cp176]

Speaking of Dave Dombrowski, he joined the Tigers in 2002, and they did not finish first until 2011. (They did make it to the WS in 2006 as a Wild Card team.)

 

Does that mean he was doing a terrible job all those years, or was it because of the situation he walked into? And why did he get a leash that long?

 

Things to ponder for Dave fans.

 

The gift that keeps on giving Bell.

[Yaz Fan Since 67]

What a bunch of little bitches we have here now. This team was 2 games from the World Series, and leading Game 4, not even a year ago. But reading the posts you would think they have been the Florida Marlins for years.

 

This is not new. The Sox have had a number of last place finishes and always bounced back, winning multiple rings after last place finishes. Calm down children, it'll be alright.

[Bellhorn04]

What a bunch of little bitches we have here now. This team was 2 games from the World Series, and leading Game 4, not even a year ago. But reading the posts you would think they have been the Florida Marlins for years.

 

This is not new. The Sox have had a number of last place finishes and always bounced back, winning multiple rings after last place finishes. Calm down children, it'll be alright.

 

Thanks Yaz. You're right, it has really gotten bad here.

[notin]

I've never faced 100 mph pitching, but if I did and held my bat over my shoulder with the barrel pointing at my heels like Story, I would definitely hit .000 (and maybe die).

 

Is it possible that the thin air at Coors makes it easier for pro athletes to whip such wayward lumber into the hitting zone faster... than, say, the thick humidity of the East Coast?

 

 

Interesting theory, but the Occam’s Razor is that he’s just facing a boatload of pitchers he’s never seen before, and it’s made extra tough because contact wasn’t his forte against the guys he was familiar with…

[Elktonnick]

The gift that keeps on giving Bell.

It will be interesting to see which team wins a World Series first, the Phillies or Red Sox. Conversely it will be interesting to see who gets fired first Dombrowski or Bloom.

Given the track record of both teams I think it is even money

[Old Red]

What a bunch of little bitches we have here now. This team was 2 games from the World Series, and leading Game 4, not even a year ago. But reading the posts you would think they have been the Florida Marlins for years.

 

This is not new. The Sox have had a number of last place finishes and always bounced back, winning multiple rings after last place finishes. Calm down children, it'll be alright.

 

I agree, but the big question to me is why should a team with a $200M payroll be in last place.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Interesting theory, but the Occam’s Razor is that he’s just facing a boatload of pitchers he’s never seen before, and it’s made extra tough because contact wasn’t his forte against the guys he was familiar with…

 

I agree there's always an adjustment period that includes new pitchers, coaches, teammates, systems, apartments, menus, time zones, groupies, etc. A few posters for some reason dispute such factors (except for maybe prevailing winds).

 

If we accept that many big leaguers are guess-hitters -- since it's almost impossible not to guess for humans facing pitchers with 100 mph fastballs mixed with same arm-speed change-ups -- then how much difference is there really between Trevor Story and say, Dalbec-Duran-Downs-Franchy, who are also seemingly in constant 0-2 counts? And don't say: "$139,300,000 dollars."

[Bellhorn04]

If we accept that many big leaguers are guess-hitters -- since it's almost impossible not to guess for humans facing pitchers with 100 mph fastballs mixed with same arm-speed change-ups -- then how much difference is there really between Trevor Story and say, Dalbec-Duran-Downs-Franchy, who are also seemingly in constant 0-2 counts? And don't say: "$139,300,000 dollars."

 

The difference shows up in the numbers.

 

The numbers of Dalbec-Duran-Downs-Franchy indicate they may not be major league players.

 

But you're right that the difference is not that big at this level.

[mvp 78]

It will be interesting to see which team wins a World Series first, the Phillies or Red Sox. Conversely it will be interesting to see who gets fired first Dombrowski or Bloom.

Given the track record of both teams I think it is even money

 

Bettor's money would be on neither Dombrowski nor Bloom winning a WS with their current team.

[Old Red]

Can anybody show any publication that praises Bloom for his trade deadline deals, or his job in general since he’s been in Boston?

[Bellhorn04]

Bettor's money would be on neither Dombrowski nor Bloom winning a WS with their current team.

 

The Phillies are 34-19 since DD canned Girardi. It does look like he might be turning the team around a bit.

[JDavis76]

What a bunch of little bitches we have here now. This team was 2 games from the World Series' date=' and leading Game 4, not even a year ago. [/color'] But reading the posts you would think they have been the Florida Marlins for years.

 

This is not new. The Sox have had a number of last place finishes and always bounced back, winning multiple rings after last place finishes. Calm down children, it'll be alright.

 

And that has exactly what to do with the current state of the team?

[Bellhorn04]

And that has exactly what to do with the current state of the team?

 

It should have something to do with the mood of the fans. It's not like the team is on a long run of missing the playoffs.

[notin]

I agree, but the big question to me is why should a team with a $200M payroll be in last place.

 

A lot of that is the artificial stigma you’re putting on last place.

 

By virtue of being in last place, it becomes arguable that the Sox might have the toughest schedule among teams competing for the postseason, and will eventually play 76 games against teams within their division that are all over .500 (assuming Baltimore stays at that pace).

 

The Red Sox and the White Sox have similar payrolls and similar records, but only one of them gets to play 38 games (roughly 1/4 of their schedule) against the Tigers and Royals…