Fire Bloom .

[moonslav59]

???

 

I answered the question on why a player might sign BorA$$ as their agent.

[Old Red]

I don't think Bogey would take a 3 year deal, even at $30M each, but if they offered that, at least they could sat they made a market level offer.

 

He'd probably rather take $25M x 5 than $30M x 3. I think he gets $25M+ x 6+. Maybe 25 x 8 or $26M x 7 or $27M x 6?.

 

I'm curious how many here would offer that.

 

I would have offer something like what Story got, maybe a little more, but now that we have Story, I would not.

 

I said to start with 6/150 with a final offer of 6/165 starting at $25M, and going up to $30M at year 6. If that wasn’t good enough then bye bye.

[jad]

I don't think Bogey would take a 3 year deal, even at $30M each, but if they offered that, at least they could sat they made a market level offer.

 

He'd probably rather take $25M x 5 than $30M x 3. I think he gets $25M+ x 6+. Maybe 25 x 8 or $26M x 7 or $27M x 6?.

 

I'm curious how many here would offer that.

 

I would have offer something like what Story got, maybe a little more, but now that we have Story, I would not.

 

So you're ok with Bloom replacing a 'face-of-the-franchise' player with someone half as good for what might be the same amount of money?

[moonslav59]

I said to start with 6/150 with a final offer of 6/165 starting at $25M, and going up to $30M at year 6. If that wasn’t good enough then bye bye.

 

Sounds fair, and in my mind, that is saying "bye, bye." (He won't agree to that, now.)

[moonslav59]

So you're ok with Bloom replacing a 'face-of-the-franchise' player with someone half as good for what might be the same amount of money?

 

Why do you assume paying another player what you offer Bogey will be half as good?

 

Now, they may take Bogey's money and pay 2 guy's half his money, each, and together, they may not amount to crap, but every signing or extension is a gamble to differing extents, and we all will never agree on what each player is precisely worth.

 

I'd have offered Bogey more than Story, but only if we still thought we could be in the ballpark to sign Devers, next year (and we should have been able to do that.)

 

However, now that we have Story, I would not offer him $25M x 8, $26M x76 or $27M x 6. It's close, but I think Story was likely told, he'd be the SS in 2023. (Just my opinion.)

 

I thought Betts was the face of the franchise, and in my biggest moment of weakness I suggested something like $400M/14 to keep him here, so I don't think I'm some heartless, will-nilly let 'em walk kinda fan. Now, most here know my bias towards having a great defensive SS and not thinking Bogey is one, so personally, Devers is the current face of the franchise, and who couldn't love that cheery baby face?

[Old Red]

Why do you assume paying another player what you offer Bogey will be half as good?

 

Now, they may take Bogey's money and pay 2 guy's half his money, each, and together, they may not amount to crap, but every signing or extension is a gamble to differing extents, and we all will never agree on what each player is precisely worth.

 

I'd have offered Bogey more than Story, but only if we still thought we could be in the ballpark to sign Devers, next year (and we should have been able to do that.)

 

However, now that we have Story, I would not offer him $25M x 8, $26M x76 or $27M x 6. It's close, but I think Story was likely told, he'd be the SS in 2023. (Just my opinion.)

 

I thought Betts was the face of the franchise, and in my biggest moment of weakness I suggested something like $400M/14 to keep him here, so I don't think I'm some heartless, will-nilly let 'em walk kinda fan. Now, most here know my bias towards having a great defensive SS and not thinking Bogey is one, so personally, Devers is the current face of the franchise, and who couldn't love that cheery baby face?

 

I agree with most, and I have said since the Story signing that I liked the signing, because Story would help the team this year, but wouldn’t like it if it was at the expense of resigning Bogey. I’m not saying that Bogey would have to stay at SS past this year. I do think that Bogey is the leader not only in the clubhouse, but on the field as well.

[moonslav59]

I agree with most, and I have said since the Story signing that I liked the signing, because Story would help the team this year, but wouldn’t like it if it was at the expense of resigning Bogey. I’m not saying that Bogey would have to stay at SS past this year. I do think that Bogey is the leader not only in the clubhouse, but on the field as well.

 

I think he's a leader, too.

 

I also think he will want to play SS, at least a few more years.

 

I doubt the Sox would assure him that AND offer him close to what he wants.

 

Now, let's see what other teams offer him, this winter, and maybe he'll face a reality he did not expect, and a Sox offer might be competitive, but I doubt it. He wants to stay at SS, and I can't blame him.

 

Chicks dig SSs. 2Bmen are pansies.

[jad]

Why do you assume paying another player what you offer Bogey will be half as good?

 

Now, they may take Bogey's money and pay 2 guy's half his money, each, and together, they may not amount to crap, but every signing or extension is a gamble to differing extents, and we all will never agree on what each player is precisely worth.

 

I'd have offered Bogey more than Story, but only if we still thought we could be in the ballpark to sign Devers, next year (and we should have been able to do that.)

 

However, now that we have Story, I would not offer him $25M x 8, $26M x76 or $27M x 6. It's close, but I think Story was likely told, he'd be the SS in 2023. (Just my opinion.)

 

I thought Betts was the face of the franchise, and in my biggest moment of weakness I suggested something like $400M/14 to keep him here, so I don't think I'm some heartless, will-nilly let 'em walk kinda fan. Now, most here know my bias towards having a great defensive SS and not thinking Bogey is one, so personally, Devers is the current face of the franchise, and who couldn't love that cheery baby face?

 

I assume that because I've been watching his presumed replacement play at 2B.

[Hitch]

I have to say, as much as I like Bloom and what he's done (trying to do), I was, and am, enormously frustrated we signed Story to let Bogey go (as seems clear).

 

Incredibly frustrated.

Edited May 12, 2022 by Hitch

[jad]

I'd rather have Leopold Bloom running this franchise.

[moonslav59]

I assume that because I've been watching his presumed replacement play at 2B.

 

For 6 weeks, yes, but in theory, we'll have Bogey's $20M to spend at upgrading another position, and maybe our defense improves at SS, next year.

 

Have you been watching Whitlock, Wacha, Hill, Schreiber and others that Bloom acquired play?

 

Whay assume they will all play like Story's first 6 weeks in Boston after just about no ST'ing?

[Bellhorn04]

I have to say, as much as I like Bloom and what he's done (trying to do), I was, and am, enormously frustrated we signed Story to let Bogey go (as seems clear).

 

Incredibly frustrated.

 

Bogey will get about 50% more than Story, I suspect.

[Bellhorn04]

I'd rather have Leopold Bloom running this franchise.

 

Or Molly?

 

How about Eric Bloom of Blue Oyster Cult?

[moonslav59]

Bogey will get about 50% more than Story, I suspect.

 

So, $210/6?

 

I'm thinking $210/8 or maybe $200/7 tops.

[mvp 78]

For 6 weeks, yes, but in theory, we'll have Bogey's $20M to spend at upgrading another position, and maybe our defense improves at SS, next year.

 

Have you been watching Whitlock, Wacha, Hill, Schreiber and others that Bloom acquired play?

 

Whay assume they will all play like Story's first 6 weeks in Boston after just about no ST'ing?

 

I've also seen Robles, Shaw, Diekman play as well as guys like Marwin Gonzalez, Danny Santana, Franchy, Garrett Richards, Ottavino, Andriese, Workman, Brice, Weber, Peacock, Peraza, Mazza, Godley, Springs, Osich, Covey, Kickham, Stock, Triggs, et al be acquired by Bloom and not play all that well.

[mvp 78]

Bogey will get about 50% more than Story, I suspect.

 

He's probably worth it.

[mvp 78]

Or Molly?

 

How about Eric Bloom of Blue Oyster Cult?

 

Judy Bloom.

[moonslav59]

How about Eric Bloom of Blue Oyster Cult?

 

I must have seen BOC about 5 times in my youth. Those guys could ROCK THE HOUSE!

[moonslav59]

I've also seen Robles, Shaw, Diekman play as well as guys like Marwin Gonzalez, Danny Santana, Franchy, Garrett Richards, Ottavino, Andriese, Workman, Brice, Weber, Peacock, Peraza, Mazza, Godley, Springs, Osich, Covey, Kickham, Stock, Triggs, et al be acquired by Bloom and not play all that well.

 

True, enough. (Shaw did well, last year, but Shaw II was a complete failure.)

 

It's fair game to criticize Blooms biggest contracts, as they seem to be his worst, so far.

[JDavis76]

I must have seen BOC about 5 times in my youth. Those guys could ROCK THE HOUSE!

 

I've seen them a few times myself in small venues around NYC

[JDavis76]

Or Molly?

 

How about Eric Bloom of Blue Oyster Cult?

 

I used to go to an Irish bar called Molly Bloom's in Smithtown, Long Island.

 

Great bar with very good live music.

[jad]

How about Al G. Bloom?

[mvp 78]

Definitely not the Champagne Bloom.

[jad]

Or Molly?

 

:

 

Molly! Oh yes! Yes to that! Yes yes yes!

[notin]

Judy Bloom.

 

I don’t think that’s how she spells it..

[JDavis76]

I don’t think that’s how she spells it..

 

Correct, it's Blume

[Hitch]

Bogey will get about 50% more than Story, I suspect.

 

Possibly elsewhere, but I think (total conjecture) that he would have signed with us for around $25-27 for six years, seven years.

[mvp 78]

I don’t think that’s how she spells it..

 

Berenstein

[Kimmi]

I have to say, as much as I like Bloom and what he's done (trying to do), I was, and am, enormously frustrated we signed Story to let Bogey go (as seems clear).

 

Incredibly frustrated.

 

Up until the last 10 days or so, it's been an extremely frustrating season. Most teams go through bad spells like this (maybe not quite as bad), but the fact that the Sox did it to open the season makes it so much more glaring.

 

The Story signing is starting to look a little better now. Either way it goes, it's obviously far too early to say whether his signing will be a good one or bad one.

 

With Bogaerts' comments recently about the Red Sox negotiating during the season, I now have just a tiny sliver of hope that Bogaerts can be re-signed, though he won't be, nor should he be, if he is looking for $200M.

 

Despite the terrible start to the season, Bloom is all right in my book. Stick to the plan.

[moonslav59]

Up until the last 10 days or so, it's been an extremely frustrating season. Most teams go through bad spells like this (maybe not quite as bad), but the fact that the Sox did it to open the season makes it so much more glaring.

 

The Story signing is starting to look a little better now. Either way it goes, it's obviously far too early to say whether his signing will be a good one or bad one.

 

With Bogaerts' comments recently about the Red Sox negotiating during the season, I now have just a tiny sliver of hope that Bogaerts can be re-signed, though he won't be, nor should he be, if he is looking for $200M.

 

Despite the terrible start to the season, Bloom is all right in my book. Stick to the plan.

 

Every GM makes moves and choices that, in hindsight, look bad or not so good. The fact that some posters hated some moves from day one, so it's "not hindsight," in those cases, does not mean they'd have been a better GM. It's one or two or maybe more moves out of hundreds of decisions that need to be made over a GMs career with one team.

 

I like the plan, too, and think we need to stick to it.

 

The farm needed rebuilding- not quite as badly as many of us had felt 3-4 years ago, as several of DD's farm choices look very good, now.

 

Perhaps less recognizable was the need to build up the 18-40th slots on the 40 man roster. Yes, Bloom took over a decent core of players left over from 2018, but the budget was strained and severely limited in his first two seasons, and some of the high-priced players, namely Price and Sale did not pull nearly their weight in production.

 

Those who keep saying "Henry can open his wallet, if he wants to" are correct, but that does not mean he will, and he really did not for Bloom's first two winters. He did give him a significant amount of money for 1 year deals, but with 18-22 slots to improve on a 40 man roster, $40M only goes so far. We saw that in 2020. We saw some of the wonders Bloom can do with a limited budget in 2021. This year started out very poorly, and of course sentiments like this thread title came to the surface.

 

Years ago, I had felt Ben deserved another year to let his long term plan come to fruition, but I totally understand the 3 last place finishes in 4 years part being thought of as the longest leash any Sox GM has been given in my lifetime- the ring in '13 not withstanding. The reason they went with DD, IMO, is that Henry decided he'd open his wallet for a 3-5 year window, and DD looked better equipped to handle that type of plan.

 

I hope Henry keeps the wallet open for a few more years, but let's give Bloom the chance Ben never got: let's see if he can build a power house team through spending, while still maintaining a solid farm from A ball to AAA. Keep the prospect pipeline working and contributing. Keep free agency and trades for filling the few gaps the farm can't fill. That's a long term winning strategy. It's one even Theo admitted he let get away from him, in his time with us. Let's not do it again.

 

2018 was an incredible season. I don't regret what we did to get that ring and the 3 first place finishes that went with it, but that was not really a sustainable plan, unless Henry was prepared to be the Dodgers East Coast team.

 

Just my take.