2022 Starting Rotation Thread

[Nick]

Well I did hear that both Verdugo and Story pitched in high school.

 

BTW, didn't Dalbec also pitch in college? Maybe he can DH and come out of bullpen. Then we can sign both Xander and Devers.

[notin]

I didn’t know you was doing the signing for some club.

 

 

Just predicting with remarkable accuracy. I make no mention of any club…

[notin]

Why are we discussing Xander's contract in the "2022 Starting Rotation" thread? Is he going to pitch with his next contract?

 

We can switch to Eovaldi’s next contract.

 

My thoughts - be afraid. Be very, very afraid…

[Nick]

DATE IP-(ER) Pitcher

 

Eovaldi

04/08 5.0-(3)

04/13 5.0-(2) Quality TEAM WON

04/19 4.1-(1) Quality TEAM WON

04/25 7.0-(2) Quality

 

Pivetta

04/09 5.2-(4)

04/15 2.0-(4)

04/20 4.0-(5)

04/26 4.2-(2)

 

Houck (he's not on the 40 man roster right now, no stats in MLB.com, back on tomorrow)

04/00 3.1-(3) TEAM WON

04/16 5.2-(0) Quality TEAM WON

 

Wacha

04/11 4.1-(1) Quality

04/17 5.0-(0) Quality TEAM WON

04/22 5.0-(2) Quality TEAM WON

04/27 6.0-(1) Quality TEAM WON

 

Hill

04/12 4.1-(3) TEAM WON

04/18 4.2-(4)

04/24 4.0-(0) Quality

 

Whitlock

04/23 4.0-(0) Quality

 

Board members want to minimize starting pitching. Making fun of me of my statement that a team has a fiduciary responsibility to start a pitcher that give us a reasonable chance to compete, every game.

 

6 of 8 wins come via Quality Starts (say Moon's definition)

 

I'm not ready to discount the role of starting pitchers. No kid grows up wanting to be a closer.

Edited April 28, 2022 by Nick

[Bellhorn04]

The New Quality, that is.

[Old Red]

Just predicting with remarkable accuracy. I make no mention of any club…

 

Ok. I’ve written it down, so we’ll see how close you are.

[Old Red]

DATE IP-(ER) Pitcher

 

Eovaldi

04/08 5.0-(3)

04/13 5.0-(2) Quality TEAM WON

04/19 4.1-(1) Quality TEAM WON

04/25 7.0-(2) Quality

 

Pivetta

04/09 5.2-(4)

04/15 2.0-(4)

04/20 4.0-(5)

04/26 4.2-(2)

 

Houck (he's not on the 40 man roster right now, no stats in MLB.com, back on tomorrow)

04/00 3.1-(3) TEAM WON

04/16 5.2-(0) Quality TEAM WON

 

Wacha

04/11 4.1-(1) Quality

04/17 5.0-(0) Quality TEAM WON

04/22 5.0-(2) Quality TEAM WON

04/27 6.0-(1) Quality TEAM WON

 

Hill

04/12 4.1-(3) TEAM WON

04/18 4.2-(4)

04/24 4.0-(0) Quality

 

Whitlock

04/23 4.0-(0) Quality

 

Board members want to minimize starting pitching. Making fun of me of my statement that a team has a fiduciary responsibility to start a pitcher that give us a reasonable chance to compete, every game.

 

6 of 8 wins come via Quality Starts (say Moon's definition)

 

I'm not ready to discount the role of starting pitchers. No kid grows up wanting to be a closer.

 

Here’s my question. If Whitlock had been the closer from day 1 do you think the Sox record would still be 8-11 as it is now?

[Nick]

Here’s my question. If Whitlock had been the closer from day 1 do you think the Sox record would still be 8-11 as it is now?

 

I'm old school. He's a starter. Moon does all the thinking for me.

 

Maybe Bob Gibson would have helped the team more as a closer. Who the hell knows.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

DATE IP-(ER) Pitcher

 

Eovaldi

04/08 5.0-(3)

04/13 5.0-(2) Quality TEAM WON

04/19 4.1-(1) Quality TEAM WON

04/25 7.0-(2) Quality

 

Pivetta

04/09 5.2-(4)

04/15 2.0-(4)

04/20 4.0-(5)

04/26 4.2-(2)

 

Houck (he's not on the 40 man roster right now, no stats in MLB.com, back on tomorrow)

04/00 3.1-(3) TEAM WON

04/16 5.2-(0) Quality TEAM WON

 

Wacha

04/11 4.1-(1) Quality

04/17 5.0-(0) Quality TEAM WON

04/22 5.0-(2) Quality TEAM WON

04/27 6.0-(1) Quality TEAM WON

 

Hill

04/12 4.1-(3) TEAM WON

04/18 4.2-(4)

04/24 4.0-(0) Quality

 

Whitlock

04/23 4.0-(0) Quality

 

Board members want to minimize starting pitching. Making fun of me of my statement that a team has a fiduciary responsibility to start a pitcher that give us a reasonable chance to compete, every game.

 

6 of 8 wins come via Quality Starts (say Moon's definition)

 

I'm not ready to discount the role of starting pitchers. No kid grows up wanting to be a closer.

 

Who can disagree with your chart? Most who regularly refute are data-driven dissenters. So the Sox win 60% of Quality, but only 25% of Faulty.

 

It all flows from the starters; is it mere coincidence that relievers preserve more Ws when they have time to complete their early seed-spitting contests in the bullpen?

[notin]

Ok. I’ve written it down, so we’ll see how close you are.

 

No need. I stand by my predictions. Always…

[notin]

I'm old school. He's a starter. Moon does all the thinking for me.

 

Maybe Bob Gibson would have helped the team more as a closer. Who the hell knows.

 

I’d be surprised if Whitlock started all year. I would imagine there’s an IP limit on him, probably somewhere between 90 and 110 IP. Something to get him more stretched out and able to jump to the rotation in 2023 full time. But not so much he needs another TJ

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I’d be surprised if Whitlock started all year. I would imagine there’s an IP limit on him, probably somewhere between 90 and 110 IP. Something to get him more stretched out and able to jump to the rotation in 2023 full time. But not so much he needs another TJ

 

Someone must have already said this: but if they're honestly only going to let Whitlock pitch three or four innings because they're still babying their new longterm investment, then let him do it at the end of games, when we can lock down a couple wins a week -- instead of starting and leaving one game per week he has no control of for the last five or six frames.

 

Unless, of course, they're slowly stretching him out to become a "quality" starter -- for a full time job in the rotation next year -- while our deficient bullpen quickly plummets us towards the basement this year. Just don't admit that's the plan.

[Bellhorn04]

Someone must have already said this: but if they're honestly only going to let Whitlock pitch three or four innings because they're still babying their new longterm investment, then let him do it at the end of games, when we can lock down a couple wins a week -- instead of starting and leaving one game per week he has no control of for the last five or six frames.

 

But as others have pointed out, what happens if the team falls behind 4 or 5 games in a row?

 

It's not easy to plan for him to have those meaningful 4 inning stretches at the end of games and space them out nicely so he gets his days of rest...

[Old Red]

But as others have pointed out, what happens if the team falls behind 4 or 5 games in a row?

 

It's not easy to plan for him to have those meaningful 4 inning stretches at the end of games and space them out nicely so he gets his days of rest...

 

Forget about 4 inning stints. I still say he should be the closer. How many times could he have been used since last weekend in Tampa? Instead he’s pitched just twice in wasted efforts to no fault of his own, and the Sox lost both games. If the team had a closer I would have a different opinion, but they don’t.

[dgalehouse]

Forget about 4 inning stints. I still say he should be the closer. How many times could he have been used since last weekend in Tampa? Instead he’s pitched just twice in wasted efforts to no fault of his own, and the Sox lost both games. If the team had a closer I would have a different opinion, but they don’t.

 

Everything seems kind of helter skelter right now. They need to get guys settled into their defined roles.

[moonslav59]

Everything seems kind of helter skelter right now. They need to get guys settled into their defined roles.

 

The only pitcher with a defined role who is doing well is Wacha.

 

Go figure.

 

Whiltock is doing great but has no defined role.

 

I have hope with Houck & Eovaldi, but someone else needs to step up.

 

Yes, I'm avoiding the awful offense. There are no words.

[notin]

Someone must have already said this: but if they're honestly only going to let Whitlock pitch three or four innings because they're still babying their new longterm investment, then let him do it at the end of games, when we can lock down a couple wins a week -- instead of starting and leaving one game per week he has no control of for the last five or six frames.

 

Unless, of course, they're slowly stretching him out to become a "quality" starter -- for a full time job in the rotation next year -- while our deficient bullpen quickly plummets us towards the basement this year. Just don't admit that's the plan.

 

And that might be the plan.

 

Houck can play again, so he'll probably bump Whitlock from the rotation...

[moonslav59]

And that might be the plan.

 

Houck can play again, so he'll probably bump Whitlock from the rotation...

 

Back to the "long man" or steady closer?

 

If we are, indeed, limiting Whitlock in innings, then I guess either could suit that priority, but maybe being a 1 inning closer would work best, with a few time going 1.1 to 2 IP.

[notin]

Back to the "long man" or steady closer?

 

If we are, indeed, limiting Whitlock in innings, then I guess either could suit that priority, but maybe being a 1 inning closer would work best, with a few time going 1.1 to 2 IP.

 

I have no idea what their plan is, but if I’m right, he’d pitch a lot more IP than a normal closer…

[moonslav59]

I have no idea what their plan is, but if I’m right, he’d pitch a lot more IP than a normal closer…

 

So, maybe morph the two roles and pitch him 1-2 IP more often than he's currently doing 2-4 IP?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

And that might be the plan.

 

Houck can play again, so he'll probably bump Whitlock from the rotation...

 

Whitlock is too valuable as a multi-inning weapon to be classified as a traditional Eck-Pap-Kimbrel closer, only used with a lead in the 9th.

 

He's a throwback to all those relievers who threw 100+ innings in the 70s, entering a game in key spots, whenever -- in the 6th, 7th, 8th -- shutting the door to preserve leads or keep games close, and staying in to a hopefully glorified ending.

[moonslav59]

Whitlock is too valuable as a multi-inning weapon to be classified as a traditional Eck-Pap-Kimbrel closer, only used with a lead in the 9th.

 

He's a throwback to all those relievers who threw 100+ innings in the 70s, entering a game in key spots, whenever -- in the 6th, 7th, 8th -- shutting the door to preserve leads or keep games close, and staying in to a hopefully glorified ending.

 

We don't really know, if he can sustain 100+ IP of this type of long relief over 162 games.

[dgalehouse]

I think every pitcher would like to know their role on the staff. Whitlock is probably no exception. The Sox still seem undecided on it.

[Bellhorn04]

I think every pitcher would like to know their role on the staff. Whitlock is probably no exception. The Sox still seem undecided on it.

 

He keeps pitching well no matter how they use him, so I don't really see any negative effects on him.

[notin]

I think every pitcher would like to know their role on the staff. Whitlock is probably no exception. The Sox still seem undecided on it.

 

 

Some pitchers are absolutely vocal about knowing their role and even wanting an established routine. But I doubt they all do. I remember guys like Kent Tekulve and Mike Marshall who just wanted to be out there as often as possible regardless of the situation. But there are absolutely pitchers like Clayton Kershaw who thrive on the routine and knowing his place.

 

No idea where Whitlock is.

 

But I do get the idea of keeping his IP down around 100. He’s only had one season where he threw more, and that was back in A ball before TJ…

[dgalehouse]

Some pitchers are absolutely vocal about knowing their role and even wanting an established routine. But I doubt they all do. I remember guys like Kent Tekulve and Mike Marshall who just wanted to be out there as often as possible regardless of the situation. But there are absolutely pitchers like Clayton Kershaw who thrive on the routine and knowing his place.

 

No idea where Whitlock is.

 

But I do get the idea of keeping his IP down around 100. He’s only had one season where he threw more, and that was back in A ball before TJ…

 

If he is going to be a starter he will have to do that sooner or later. Being the closer would limit his innings a lot , but do nothing to help him develop as a starter. He does seem to have too much ability to be stuck in middle relief. I guess they have a plan , but it just doesn't seem clear at this point.

[moonslav59]

If he is going to be a starter he will have to do that sooner or later. Being the closer would limit his innings a lot , but do nothing to help him develop as a starter. He does seem to have too much ability to be stuck in middle relief. I guess they have a plan , but it just doesn't seem clear at this point.

 

If he's on a season IP limit, then sooner may not be better, but if not, I agree.

 

I'd like to eventaully see Houck as the closer and Whitlock in the rotation, but that might be as far away as 2023.

[notin]

If he is going to be a starter he will have to do that sooner or later. Being the closer would limit his innings a lot , but do nothing to help him develop as a starter. He does seem to have too much ability to be stuck in middle relief. I guess they have a plan , but it just doesn't seem clear at this point.

 

I think it’s obvious (to me) he’s staying in the bullpen.

 

 

His last two starts weren’t auditions; he was filling in…

[Bellhorn04]

I think it’s obvious (to me) he’s staying in the bullpen.

 

 

His last two starts weren’t auditions; he was filling in…

 

I think you're right, it makes sense because of the innings limit.

[Bellhorn04]

Why did Whitlock start the game against the Rays? I can't remember.