Red Sox 2020 Starting Rotation

[jacksonianmarch]

I’d be interested to see the numbers, but this Sox starting rotation may be one of the worst of all time in Major League Baseball.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I’d be interested to see the numbers, but this Sox starting rotation may be one of the worst of all time in Major League Baseball.

 

There is no rotation -- not on the mound, not on the ball...

[mvp 78]

I’d be interested to see the numbers, but this Sox starting rotation may be one of the worst of all time in Major League Baseball.

 

The worst in recent history was the 2019 O's. It remains to be seen if the Sox will be worse.

[jacksonianmarch]

Strangely, the Sox don’t have the worst starting ERA in baseball. After today, it’s up to 6.47ERA. That’s a full 0.3 ahead of Arizona and Detroit. They do have the worst WHIP at 1.78 and it’s not close (next highest 1.64).

 

Believe it or not, the Rockies had the worst starters ERA last year at 5.87

[notin]

Strangely, the Sox don’t have the worst starting ERA in baseball. After today, it’s up to 6.47ERA. That’s a full 0.3 ahead of Arizona and Detroit. They do have the worst WHIP at 1.78 and it’s not close (next highest 1.64).

 

Believe it or not, the Rockies had the worst starters ERA last year at 5.87

 

To make it offer, the Rockies weren’t down 3 starters...

[jacksonianmarch]

There’s a time to suck and get kids their due and then there’s what the Sox are doing. They’re running total garbage out there. In a year where development is non existent, I’m surprised the Sox haven’t promoted Mata.

 

And this isn’t just a Sale and ERod thing. This entire staff is absolutely abysmal. Bloom cannot fix this in one offseason. This will take time and resetting during a pandemic shortened 60 game season was the right play. This team needs a total blowup

[Bellhorn04]

There’s a time to suck and get kids their due and then there’s what the Sox are doing. They’re running total garbage out there. In a year where development is non existent, I’m surprised the Sox haven’t promoted Mata.

 

And this isn’t just a Sale and ERod thing. This entire staff is absolutely abysmal. Bloom cannot fix this in one offseason. This will take time and resetting during a pandemic shortened 60 game season was the right play. This team needs a total blowup

 

I think we already had it.

[jad]

There’s a time to suck and get kids their due and then there’s what the Sox are doing. They’re running total garbage out there. In a year where development is non existent, I’m surprised the Sox haven’t promoted Mata.

 

And this isn’t just a Sale and ERod thing. This entire staff is absolutely abysmal. Bloom cannot fix this in one offseason. This will take time and resetting during a pandemic shortened 60 game season was the right play. This team needs a total blowup

 

Of course he can. He can straighten this out immediately by trading or releasing Workman, Eovaldi, and maybe Hembree. That will give the rotation the consistency it's been lacking all year. If ERod or Sale threaten to come back, trade them.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Thread title is a misnomer, please change to Starting NO tation.

 

This sprint season is good case study in what happens to a handful of big leaguers when they are forced to play with many minor leaguers against legitimate MLB teams. Even the Sox' former stars -- those talented regulars with World Series rings -- have struggled to compete and focus during such a lost cause. I'd bet many of them, like many fans, can't wait for 2020 to just end.

 

The only guys who show spark are newcomers trying to prove themselves and earn jobs and respect: Verdugo, Arauz, Perez, Pillar. It backs the theory of always striving for some constant roster turnover, even on a proven winner.

[jad]

Thread title is a misnomer, please change to Starting NO tation.

 

This sprint season is good case study in what happens to a handful of big leaguers when they are forced to play with many minor leaguers against legitimate MLB teams. Even the Sox' former stars -- those talented regulars with World Series rings -- have struggled to compete and focus during such a lost cause. I'd bet many of them, like many fans, can't wait for 2020 to just end.

 

The only guys who show spark are newcomers trying to prove themselves and earn jobs and respect: Verdugo, Arauz, Perez, Pillar. It backs the theory of always striving for some constant roster turnover, even on a proven winner.

 

I don't understand (and I mean this seriously; not arguing). Aren't the RS in the position they're in by 'roster turnover'? ensuring exactly the situation you describe at the beginning?-- a handful of big leaguers playing with minor leaguers? (Although given the disastrous pitching situation, it hardly matters what position players do, whether they're coasting, trying to prove themselves, or just giving up.)

[mvp 78]

Roster turnover, plus Sale injury and COVID for ERod/DHern/Taylor.

 

That’s 4 of their best arms.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I don't understand (and I mean this seriously; not arguing). Aren't the RS in the position they're in by 'roster turnover'? ensuring exactly the situation you describe at the beginning?-- a handful of big leaguers playing with minor leaguers? (Although given the disastrous pitching situation, it hardly matters what position players do, whether they're coasting, trying to prove themselves, or just giving up.)

 

What I meant by constant turnover is an old pre-free agency philosophy that winning GMs with deep systems employed, grooming heir-apparents in the minors that weren't called up until they were ready to step in and thrive. Of course, teams had the luxury of the reserve clause, so they could keep stars as long as they were productive, and then replace them when age and salary got too high.

 

To clarify, the "turnover" wasn't a complete teardown, just transitioning one or two new -- and younger -- players every year or so. It's all anti-Dombrowski, who just chose to sign or acquire as many established veterans as he could...

[jacksonianmarch]

When I essentially predicted the cliff (you’re welcome and feel free to look at the thread), I told you that DD would be the architect of it.

 

To fade to this level (high payroll, horrible team, horrible farm), you need to do a few things. Let’s see if DD did them.

 

1. Deal off every farm talent worth a damn for now players. DD- check

2. Sign or extend players into their post prime years. DD- check

3. Sign or extend players that are fragile. DD- check

4. Make almost no effort to add depth behind all star talent. DD- check

5. Entirely ignore drafting and never consider dealing for minor league talent even if it can come cheap. DD- check

 

The icing on the cake is that the Yanks are really good right now while the Sox flounder, so the public eye is on this train wreck a little more.

 

DD won his title. He then was sent packing within 10 months of the champagne. What he left behind will take years to recover from. Henry didn’t hire Bloom for 2020. He didn’t hire Bloom for 2021. Bloom’s task is enormous and not one that’s fixable with straight cash on an open market

[jacksonianmarch]

In terms of team runs allowed, the Sox are the worst in baseball by a WIDE margin. The Sox have allowed 6.33 runs per game. The closest to them is Pitt at 6.00.

[Nick]

When I essentially predicted the cliff (you’re welcome and feel free to look at the thread), I told you that DD would be the architect of it.

 

To fade to this level (high payroll, horrible team, horrible farm), you need to do a few things. Let’s see if DD did them.

 

1. Deal off every farm talent worth a damn for now players. DD- check

2. Sign or extend players into their post prime years. DD- check

3. Sign or extend players that are fragile. DD- check

4. Make almost no effort to add depth behind all star talent. DD- check

5. Entirely ignore drafting and never consider dealing for minor league talent even if it can come cheap. DD- check

 

The icing on the cake is that the Yanks are really good right now while the Sox flounder, so the public eye is on this train wreck a little more.

 

DD won his title. He then was sent packing within 10 months of the champagne. What he left behind will take years to recover from. Henry didn’t hire Bloom for 2020. He didn’t hire Bloom for 2021. Bloom’s task is enormous and not one that’s fixable with straight cash on an open market

 

 

Drafting rules have changed and we're in the aftermath of winning the Division three straight years.

 

For the Yankees, there's tons of pressure to win the World Series as Dodgers. As a Sox fan, if you don't win, well Yankees always have a good team so this year won't be any different. Meanwhile your players are getting more expensive. What is your window?

 

Red Sox 4 Giants 3 Cardinals 2 since new Red Sox era.

Edited August 16, 2020 by Nick

[notin]

I think we already had it.

 

 

Exactly. This rotation is shrapnel...

[dgalehouse]

Exactly. This rotation is shrapnel...

 

Well , you are the advocate for signing a bunch of jabronis to minor league contracts , hoping it works out . This is how it works out .

[notin]

Well , you are the advocate for signing a bunch of jabronis to minor league contracts , hoping it works out . This is how it works out .

 

It only works out like this if you have to rely on them for starters...

[Northern Star]

Sure glad we gave Sale the big extension. I'd hate to think he wasn't well paid while he sits on his ass all year recovering from TJ.

[Larry Cook]

11 different starters thus far.

 

The worst era in baseball.

 

I am hoping hang’em Chaim is working the phones feverishly these next two weeks.

 

Out with the non homegrown Players and in with prospects.

 

Maybe if hang’em Chaim interned at the home shopping network, he could learn how to sell junk at inflated prices and make idiots feel like they got a deal! First call after the internship is over should be cashman!

 

Of course if hang’em Chaim is serious about his current job and wants desperately to be successful, he can also intern at cnn and learn how to smile, while lying to idiots who will believe every lie he tells as gospel! Either way, first call after the internship is over needs to be to cashman!

[notin]

11 different starters thus far.

 

The worst era in baseball.

 

I am hoping hang’em Chaim is working the phones feverishly these next two weeks.

 

Out with the non homegrown Players and in with prospects.

 

Maybe if hang’em Chaim interned at the home shopping network, he could learn how to sell junk at inflated prices and make idiots feel like they got a deal! First call after the internship is over should be cashman!

 

Of course if hang’em Chaim is serious about his current job and wants desperately to be successful, he can also intern at cnn and learn how to smile, while lying to idiots who will believe every lie he tells as gospel! Either way, first call after the internship is over needs to be to cashman!

 

Right. Let’s dump Alex Verdugo so we can pave the way for Cole Sturgeon!!

[Larry Cook]

Right. Let’s dump Alex Verdugo so we can pave the way for Cole Sturgeon!!

 

Considering we got them in the Betts trade, we have to treat those three as homegrown,

[jacksonianmarch]

Chaim Bloom is an expert trader. Expert. Top notch. His Betts trade was a win for the Sox, clearly, as the Sox ain’t winning s*** this year with or without Betts and they now have 4 more years of Verdugo and a top prospect to show for it rather than a comp pick when Mookie left.

 

Bloom was given a s***** team with zero payroll room, a devoid farm and a pandemic. Cut the guy some slack

[notin]

Chaim Bloom is an expert trader. Expert. Top notch. His Betts trade was a win for the Sox, clearly, as the Sox ain’t winning s*** this year with or without Betts and they now have 4 more years of Verdugo and a top prospect to show for it rather than a comp pick when Mookie left.

 

Bloom was given a s***** team with zero payroll room, a devoid farm and a pandemic. Cut the guy some slack

 

The team was 84-78 when he took over, a drop of 24 wins from the previous season. They were at their budget limit, and had no prospects in the BA Top 100 prior to the season with their best one being a first baseman in A ball. WHat did people expect this year to be like, given they had absolutely zero methods of improving that thy could use? No money to sign. No prospects to trade. And all Bloom could do was cruise the waiver wire hoping to find some gold in the garbage dump...

[a700hitter]

Chaim Bloom is an expert trader. Expert. Top notch. His Betts trade was a win for the Sox, clearly, as the Sox ain’t winning s*** this year with or without Betts and they now have 4 more years of Verdugo and a top prospect to show for it rather than a comp pick when Mookie left.

 

Bloom was given a s***** team with zero payroll room, a devoid farm and a pandemic. Cut the guy some slack

Hw didn’t bring back a single pitching prospect. Downs is nothing special on either side of the ball.

[notin]

Hw didn’t bring back a single pitching prospect. Downs is nothing special on either side of the ball.

 

That was the big mistake with the Betts trade. Even a relief pitching prospect is needed on this team.

 

I disagree on Downs, although his future also might be nothing given how far away he is. Hopefully as he was clearly Plan B he can and will be dealt for a usuable arm...

[jacksonianmarch]

Hw didn’t bring back a single pitching prospect. Downs is nothing special on either side of the ball.

 

I think he realized his needs were to acquire as much talent as possible. Downs can be flipped for pitching

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

That was the big mistake with the Betts trade. Even a relief pitching prospect is needed on this team.

 

I disagree on Downs, although his future also might be nothing given how far away he is. Hopefully as he was clearly Plan B he can and will be dealt for a usuable arm...

 

No arms coming back is why I call it the Price trade. I'm convinced the only way LA agreed to take Price off our hands, besides the subsidies, was a secret edict that no Dodgers pitching prospects would be included. Evidence? First, Bloom had to settle for an arm from Minnesota, and after the Sox didn't like the medicals, LA still wouldn't substitute one of their own... from their entire system? Freidman really did his old pal a favor (all the while planning to lock up Betts forever asap).

 

At least Bloom insisted on Verdugo (who I was also adamant about, especially when others mentioned Pederson or Pollock). As for Downs, I'm with you on dealing him while his value is high for a decent mound prospect; the Reds thought so much of him that they traded him in a package for Puig and Kemp. The guy he was traded with to LA -- righthander Josiah Gray -- looks like he could be the real prize...

[vegasbob]

Solving the pitching dilemma has become Bloom's #1 priority over the next couple seasons, but he isn't the one or more GM/VP who failed to draft and develop any pitching of note for the last 10 years. Something worked for TB while he was there and seeing the depth of his problem in Boston I am sure he will address it, possibly starting by August 31, although he has little to work with.

[a700hitter]

I think he realized his needs were to acquire as much talent as possible. Downs can be flipped for pitching

No, Downs can't be flipped for pitching.