Hanley DFA’d

[moonslav59]

If baserunning miscues were grounds for DFA, Moreland himself might be the first one out the door. Starting with that boneheaded triple play in Baltimore and up through his single off the center field wall against the White Sox, Moreland has shown a pretty fair lack of awareness on the bases.

 

It was the option and very likely the option alone. ..

 

No doubt about it.

 

We could actually use HRam's bat vs LHPs right now. He's still a way better option than Swihart or Nunez at DH.

 

It was the 2019 option. Period.

[Maxbialystock]

If baserunning miscues were grounds for DFA, Moreland himself might be the first one out the door. Starting with that boneheaded triple play in Baltimore and up through his single off the center field wall against the White Sox, Moreland has shown a pretty fair lack of awareness on the bases.

 

It was the option and very likely the option alone. ..

 

True. Thus my choice of "one little factor." Moreland's problem is he is just slow.

[OH FOY]

Hanley didn't hit Lefties at all last year, he might have reverted back to that. Hit .179 last year against Lefties.

[notin]

True. Thus my choice of "one little factor." Moreland's problem is he is just slow.

 

And that he just stupid there in man's land on that triple play

[Bellhorn04]

Hanley didn't hit Lefties at all last year, he might have reverted back to that. Hit .179 last year against Lefties.

 

You beat me to it. .679 OPS against lefties last year vs. .769 against righties. So by no means a consistent force against lefties.

[Maxbialystock]

No doubt about it.

 

We could actually use HRam's bat vs LHPs right now. He's still a way better option than Swihart or Nunez at DH.

 

It was the 2019 option. Period.

 

Against lefties, of course. Against righties it would still be Moreland at 1B, JDM at DH, and HanRam riding the pine.

 

To date the Sox have had 145 at bats vs. lefties and 519 vs. righties. Divide that 145 by 9 hitters, and you get 20 at bats for HanRam, assuming he gets the extra at bat every now and then.

 

Now multiply those 20 at bats by, say, 1.5 to account for the rest of this season. That gets us to 30 at bats for which the Sox will pay, what, $15M, or is it less than that now? Isn't that a tad pricey?

[OH FOY]

Hanley was hitting better this year against Lefties, but I don't think he would have handled the platoon only against Lefties very good.

Managers especially ones who played the game have a good feel how players react to just a part time basis.

I'll rely on Cora on this.

Edited June 18, 2018 by OH FOY!

[Maxbialystock]

And that he just stupid there in man's land on that triple play

 

Probably. My favorite example is Nava, who was on 2b when the next guy hit a drive to right center off the wall. Where did Nava end up? 2b of course. He took the obligatory short lead off 2b when he saw where the ball was going and that it might get caught. At the last second, no doubt under some kind of uncontrollable impulse, he decided he must return to the safe island of 2b. As the ball hit the wall, there was Nava sliding--yes, sliding--into 2B. Moreland's gaffe doesn't come within miles of that.

[notin]

Probably. My favorite example is Nava, who was on 2b when the next guy hit a drive to right center off the wall. Where did Nava end up? 2b of course. He took the obligatory short lead off 2b when he saw where the ball was going and that it might get caught. At the last second, no doubt under some kind of uncontrollable impulse, he decided he must return to the safe island of 2b. As the ball hit the wall, there was Nava sliding--yes, sliding--into 2B. Moreland's gaffe doesn't come within miles of that.

 

My favorite baserunning blunder was Clay Buchholz trying to score from second on a double and getting thrown out. Or (going back a bit here), Allen Trammell getting thrown out going to second base on a successful hit-and-run single to right field by Chet Lemon. (Credit to one Marty Barrett for fooling Trammell into running back to first.)

Edited June 18, 2018 by notin

[moonslav59]

Hanley didn't hit Lefties at all last year, he might have reverted back to that. Hit .179 last year against Lefties.

 

I firmly believe it was the shoulder injury.

 

HRam was always one of the very best vs lefties.

[moonslav59]

Against lefties, of course. Against righties it would still be Moreland at 1B, JDM at DH, and HanRam riding the pine.

 

To date the Sox have had 145 at bats vs. lefties and 519 vs. righties. Divide that 145 by 9 hitters, and you get 20 at bats for HanRam, assuming he gets the extra at bat every now and then.

 

Now multiply those 20 at bats by, say, 1.5 to account for the rest of this season. That gets us to 30 at bats for which the Sox will pay, what, $15M, or is it less than that now? Isn't that a tad pricey?

 

I'm not arguing for keeping HRam.

 

I loved the move.

 

The fact remains, the move hurt us vs lefties.

 

Plus, if we took him back now (not saying I want to), he wouldn't get enough PAs to vest.

 

 

BTW, it's 675 vs LHPs at .672 and 2151 PAs at .813 so far this year.

 

Last year we had 1400+ vs LHPs. Someone batting 4th vs LH'd starters, might get 150 PAs vs lefties over a full season. HRam had 123 last year vs lefties, so your 20 PAs is not accurate.

Edited June 18, 2018 by moonslav59

[Maxbialystock]

I'm not arguing for keeping HRam.

 

I loved the move.

 

The fact remains, the move hurt us vs lefties.

 

Plus, if we took him back now (not saying I want to), he wouldn't get enough PAs to vest.

 

 

BTW, it's 675 vs LHPs at .672 and 2151 PAs at .813 so far this year.

 

Last year we had 1400+ vs LHPs. Someone batting 4th vs LH'd starters, might get 150 PAs vs lefties over a full season. HRam had 123 last year vs lefties, so your 20 PAs is not accurate.

 

I got my numbers from espn splits for the Sox, but obviously misread or misinterpreted. You usually have better stats, so my 20 PA's is off. But your PA's remaining would be, I think, between 50 and 60, so my point remains.

 

And wow, I did not know you liked the move. Great. But you of course are thinking about 2019, which is fine.

[oldtimer]

No doubt about it.

 

We could actually use HRam's bat vs LHPs right now. He's still a way better option than Swihart or Nunez at DH.

 

It was the 2019 option. Period.

 

My management training courses including one in which is was deemed foolish to make declaritive statements about things you could not possibly know. Perhaps there was another important reason for the DFA of Rameriz. We won't ever know unless someone comes out with a book. I repect your opinion that it was the 2019 option that caused us to release Hanley, but I for one suspect there was more to it than that.

[moonslav59]

I got my numbers from espn splits for the Sox, but obviously misread or misinterpreted. You usually have better stats, so my 20 PA's is off. But your PA's remaining would be, I think, between 50 and 60, so my point remains.

 

And wow, I did not know you liked the move. Great. But you of course are thinking about 2019, which is fine.

 

We're paying HRam anyways for 2018. I'd have been fine with keeping HRam for 2018, as long as he never reached the vest. I thought that was why we got Moreland, so we could platoon HRam and prevent the vest.

 

They started HRam FT, and lo and behold, he started hot. That must have scared the bejezus out of DD. HRam's slump gave DD the chance to pounce, and pounce he did.

 

I loved the move, yes for 2019, but I knew it would hurt us vs lefties.

 

I had hoped Pedey would take up that slack, but...

[moonslav59]

My management training courses including one in which is was deemed foolish to make declaritive statements about things you could not possibly know. Perhaps there was another important reason for the DFA of Rameriz. We won't ever know unless someone comes out with a book. I repect your opinion that it was the 2019 option that caused us to release Hanley, but I for one suspect there was more to it than that.

 

Of course, it's just my opinion, but it looked clear to me.

[Bellhorn04]

I firmly believe it was the shoulder injury.

 

HRam was always one of the very best vs lefties.

 

He had a .750 OPS in 2017 with the injury.

 

He had a .708 OPS in 2018 after the surgery.

 

His ISO in 2018 was only .141, considerably lower than even 2015 or 2017.

 

Smaller sample size in 2018 obviously but the warning signs were there that he might just be toast - possibly from lingering effects of the injury.

[Larry Cook]

Speculation on the radio is that Hanley is rehabbing yet another injury and that is why he has not signed with anyone to date.

[cp176]

My management training courses including one in which is was deemed foolish to make declaritive statements about things you could not possibly know. Perhaps there was another important reason for the DFA of Rameriz. We won't ever know unless someone comes out with a book. I repect your opinion that it was the 2019 option that caused us to release Hanley, but I for one suspect there was more to it than that.

 

This I agree with. I truly do believe that there is more to this story than we may never know.

[Slasher9]

This I agree with. I truly do believe that there is more to this story than we may never know.

 

Red Sox FO has never been shy throwing outgoing players under the bus. big time. if there was more to it...we would know about it. this i have no doubt.

[cp176]

Red Sox FO has never been shy throwing outgoing players under the bus. big time. if there was more to it...we would know about it. this i have no doubt.

 

It is possible that they have changed for the good here with respect to throwing out information that we don't need to know.

[Slasher9]

It is possible that they have changed for the good here with respect to throwing out information that we don't need to know.

 

fair point.

[Kimmi]

This I agree with. I truly do believe that there is more to this story than we may never know.

 

Nope.

[Kimmi]

Red Sox FO has never been shy throwing outgoing players under the bus. big time. if there was more to it...we would know about it. this i have no doubt.

 

Cora actually spoke very highly of Hanley just a couple of days ago, saying that he was surprised that no team has grabbed him yet.

 

Which kind of begs the question, why did we DFA him then?

 

Oh yeah, the option....

[moonslav59]

Cora actually spoke very highly of Hanley just a couple of days ago, saying that he was surprised that no team has grabbed him yet.

 

Which kind of begs the question, why did we DFA him then?

 

Oh yeah, the option....

 

Cora is not going to diss HRam.

 

Word is out that HRam is rehabbing an injury. Maybe that's why he hasn't signed.

 

BTW, if HRam was so valuable to a championship run, why hasn't a contender signed him?

 

Could it be other GMs don't even think he is worth min wage?

[Kimmi]

Cora is not going to diss HRam.

 

Word is out that HRam is rehabbing an injury. Maybe that's why he hasn't signed.

 

BTW, if HRam was so valuable to a championship run, why hasn't a contender signed him?

 

Could it be other GMs don't even think he is worth min wage?

 

Maybe the contending teams don't need him? I think they are mostly set.

 

At any rate, I have stated that Hanley is not the player that is going to make or break this team. So I'm not saying he is 'so valuable' to a championship run. Do I think he could help though? Absolutely.

 

Why not wait until at least the deadline to DFA him? What's the harm? Oh yeah, the CYA thing with the option.

[moonslav59]

Maybe the contending teams don't need him? I think they are mostly set.

 

At any rate, I have stated that Hanley is not the player that is going to make or break this team. So I'm not saying he is 'so valuable' to a championship run. Do I think he could help though? Absolutely.

 

Why not wait until at least the deadline to DFA him? What's the harm? Oh yeah, the CYA thing with the option.

 

Because he might not have been slumping, and we'd have a grievance to deal with that could have caused us to have to pay HRam in 2019AND not have him for the playoffs.

 

I do agree, we'dbe a better team with HRam over Swihart, but not by much, and I still think either Pedey comes back or we trade for a guy that kills lefties and would have made HRam obsolete.

[Kimmi]

Because he might not have been slumping, and we'd have a grievance to deal with that could have caused us to have to pay HRam in 2019AND not have him for the playoffs.

 

I do agree, we'dbe a better team with HRam over Swihart, but not by much, and I still think either Pedey comes back or we trade for a guy that kills lefties and would have made HRam obsolete.

 

So once again it comes down to the option.

 

As I've said, I get the logic behind DFAing him when they did (CYA), but I don't agree with it at all.

[oldtimer]

Cora is not going to diss HRam.

 

Word is out that HRam is rehabbing an injury. Maybe that's why he hasn't signed.

 

BTW, if HRam was so valuable to a championship run, why hasn't a contender signed him?

 

Could it be other GMs don't even think he is worth min wage?

 

Maybe he is rehabbinh his hurt pride.

[Kimmi]

Maybe he is rehabbinh his hurt pride.

 

That's possible. I'm not sure about his hurt pride, but my understanding is that Hanley was pretty torn up about being DFA'd, which I can't say that I blame him. It's very possible that he's taking some time away from baseball.

[Bellhorn04]

So once again it comes down to the option.

 

As I've said, I get the logic behind DFAing him when they did (CYA), but I don't agree with it at all.

 

I believe they would have kept Hanley if his numbers were better.

 

He put them in a pretty bad position, facing the prospect of having him continue to post replacement level numbers and have the option vest. And another prospect of them limiting his PA's and causing problems in the clubhouse or with the union.

 

That's two significantly bad possibilities against the one good one of him getting hot again.