The Benintendi Thread

[sk7326]

I'm not laughing about it, but I'll be pissed if this ends up damaging the kid's MLB career.

 

If they screw with him the way Collins did to COnforto this season, that is a different kettle of fish.

[greenwell]

The spark this team needs is in the pitching department. All the offense in the world isn't going to save this season. Ortiz, Xander and Pedey all seem to be slowing down. It was to be expected as they couldn't possibly replicate the 1st half offensive numbers. They were due for a regression. It's the pitching staff's turn to try to win a few games.

 

3.58 ERA since the all star break. They're doing just fine.

[Wade Boggs]

Hilariously, this is exactly what Mets fans were saying about Michael Conforto last year. Rushing kids ends up being very damaging in a lot of cases. But all of the Talksox talent evaluators know better, so I'll trust your judgement.

 

I trust the Sox scouts more. If DD and Mike Hazen say he is ready .. That's it.. He has hit at all levels Pape. When the young prospects come up , I worry about mental toughness more than anything, like you said. The only thing I knew about Beni was that he was a first round pick last year. But could be pro-ready in less than 2 years. Plus from what I see of Beni he is more of an Ellsbury gap- slap hitter. I think those prospects stick better than the homerun prospects. I trust the scouting dept on the everyday players, the pitchers not so much. In the end it is all hit and miss.

[mvp 78]

3.58 ERA since the all star break. They're doing just fine.

 

Half of those games have been against the murderer's row of the Twins, Yankees and Angels.

 

For the year, they are behind Toronto and Baltimore, the teams they are chasing for the pennant. Baltimore's rotation isn't considered very good, so what does that say about our staff? It will be interesting to see how they hold up against the O's and the Jays when they meet head to head.

[Wade Boggs]

If the sox can play over say 7 games over 500 on the road from here on out , clean up at home, they win the East.

[Nick]

"And our people kept coming up and saying, 'Well, we think he can play at the big league level. We think he's ready,'" Dombrowski said. "Now, don't look for him to be in the middle of the lineup like he will eventually. But he's a well-rounded player. He's a good defensive player. He runs the bases well. He has a good arm." And there are many countless articles where DD or his subordinates are touting Benintendi.

 

Smugness of 'experts' on this board disparaging others are unbelievable.

 

Hey, it's NOT ME saying he's ready. IT'S THE ENTIRE FREAKING RED SOX MANAGEMENT so maybe you should reconsider who thinks who is smarter. Just because you think everyone marches to the same progression mean jack s***. YOU SHOULD BE SENDING YOUR RESUME TO THE SOX FRONT OFFICE.

Edited August 10, 2016 by Nick

[a700hitter]

Yup, all these talent evaluators that hadn't watched a lick of him just knew he was ready. I was erring on the said of caution as were the professionals at Soxprospects who actually go out and watch the guys play. In all the podcasts I've listened to, none of the scouts were saying that he should be brought up any sooner than September. What do they know? Hey, the unwashed masses were right on this one. Kuddos.

Yep, the offense bashed this team to competitiveness in the first half of the season, and the pitching staff gave away a number of games where the offense put up huge numbers. The dog days are here, and hitters are wearing down. It was unrealistic to think that they could keep up their pace (pace means nothing) for an entire season. It is the pitchers turn to win us some games where the offense doesn't do its job in the second half. They need to win some games where the offense scores only 2 or 3 runs. If this team doesn't make the playoffs, it will be because the pitching is not good enough. The offense is world class.

[a700hitter]

If the sox can play over say 7 games over 500 on the road from here on out , clean up at home, they win the East.

That is a very ambitious road record.

[mvp 78]

If the sox can play over say 7 games over 500 on the road from here on out , clean up at home, they win the East.

 

Sure. I don't see them playing above .500 on the road though. As it stands, they are 26-25. With 51 games left, they would need to go 29-22, .569. The Cardinals, Cubs and Nationals are the only teams 7 games above or more on the road at the moment.

[moonslav59]

ALL the scouts and coaches told DD that this kid was ready, both mentally and physically for the show. Some of you act as if EVERY kid takes, or should take the same path to the majors.

Reeks of desperation is such a comical opinion in this situation. If you watched this kid play or followed him you wouldnt be questioning this move. He was just different from a lot of the players you watch. He had that "It". Hes a ballplayer.

I dont hype many prospects, but when they signed this kid I thought it wouldnt be very long before he was here. Im not surprised hes here and is looking pretty good so far. Like he belongs here.

 

Well said. It's fuuny that they called us "silly" and :ridiculous" for daring to just suggest we think about going against "protocol".

 

When a kid is ready or very close to ready, you speed up the process to get him to MLB. It's not as complicated as it seams. Sure, you do this for every kid who gets hot in the minors, but you listen to your experts (scouts/talent evaluaters) and you make adjustments to traditional time tables and protocol.

 

It's the same with Moncada. I was nearly tied to a tree and executed for just suggesting we ought to think about giving him some reps (not moving him- just some reps in practice) at 3B. Then, when Sox management did just that at about the exact time I suggested it should happen, some posters still called me and the idea "silly", "ridiculous", "desperate" and "dangerous".

[Bellhorn04]

Then the problem is the run differential. Next question: You have an all-world offense and a mediocre pitching staff. Which area is the best one to try to "improve" to increase run differential? Where are you likely to be able to manage real improvements with the greatest efficienty (hint: it isn't the offense)

 

I don't disagree that the pitching is still by far the biggest concern.

 

But I do think we'll score more runs with Benintendi in left field than we would with Holt/Brentz/whoever. If we score even 5-10 more runs that might be the difference between playoffs or none.

[mvp 78]

"And our people kept coming up and saying, 'Well, we think he can play at the big league level. We think he's ready,'" Dombrowski said. "Now, don't look for him to be in the middle of the lineup like he will eventually. But he's a well-rounded player. He's a good defensive player. He runs the bases well. He has a good arm." And there are many countless articles where DD or his subordinates are touting Benintendi.

 

Smugness of 'experts' on this board disparaging others are unbelievable.

 

Hey, it's NOT ME saying he's ready. IT'S THE ENTIRE FREAKING RED SOX MANAGEMENT so maybe you should reconsider who thinks who is smarter. Just because you think everyone marches to the same progression mean jack s***. YOU SHOULD BE SENDING YOUR RESUME TO THE SOX FRONT OFFICE.

 

http://fullcount.weei.com/sports/boston/baseball/red-sox/2016/07/09/dave-dombrowski-hints-andrew-benintendi-might-not-be-that-far-away-from-big-leagues/

 

An article from July that is literally the second google hit:

 

"We’ve got a kid like Benintendi coming. I don’t know if it’s this year or next year"

 

Touting Benintendi and saying that he will be promoted in August are two totally different things.

[moonslav59]

Hilariously, this is exactly what Mets fans were saying about Michael Conforto last year. Rushing kids ends up being very damaging in a lot of cases. But all of the Talksox talent evaluators know better, so I'll trust your judgement.

 

You like to bring up examples to show your position is right. Well, one never knows, if bringing someone up too early damages anything. We don't even know if a player does badly out of the gate, because he was brought up too early or not. They could have waited 4 more years with Conforto, and he could have struggles adjusting to the majors.

 

You can bet, if Beni was oh for 16 right now, we'd be hearing the wrath of Khan right now.

 

Here's an example: Fred Lynn.

 

[moonslav59]

I trust the Sox scouts more. If DD and Mike Hazen say he is ready .. That's it.. He has hit at all levels Pape. When the young prospects come up , I worry about mental toughness more than anything, like you said. The only thing I knew about Beni was that he was a first round pick last year. But could be pro-ready in less than 2 years. Plus from what I see of Beni he is more of an Ellsbury gap- slap hitter. I think those prospects stick better than the homerun prospects. I trust the scouting dept on the everyday players, the pitchers not so much. In the end it is all hit and miss.

 

Exactly. My position was that I thought Beni was ready or very close to ready and "should be called up the second Sox management thinks he's ML ready".

[mvp 78]

The third google hit:

 

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox/clubhouse_insider/2016/06/dombrowski_andrew_benintendi_impressing_but_too_soon_for

 

"Asked if he was considered for a promotion straight to the majors, Dombrowski said, “Not really. We don’t think he’s ready at this point. We didn’t even talk about him in relation to this move. We just don’t think he’s ready and we wouldn’t want to bring him up here until he’s ready.”

[User Name]

Should I bring up examples that strengthen the other position? Isn't that up to the person I'm debating? Anyways, I digress. Still, that is a very ambitious comparison.

[User Name]

The third google hit:

 

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox/clubhouse_insider/2016/06/dombrowski_andrew_benintendi_impressing_but_too_soon_for

 

"Asked if he was considered for a promotion straight to the majors, Dombrowski said, “Not really. We don’t think he’s ready at this point. We didn’t even talk about him in relation to this move. We just don’t think he’s ready and we wouldn’t want to bring him up here until he’s ready.”

 

The talksox scout squad knows better broski.

[moonslav59]

"And our people kept coming up and saying, 'Well, we think he can play at the big league level. We think he's ready,'" Dombrowski said. "Now, don't look for him to be in the middle of the lineup like he will eventually. But he's a well-rounded player. He's a good defensive player. He runs the bases well. He has a good arm." And there are many countless articles where DD or his subordinates are touting Benintendi.

 

Smugness of 'experts' on this board disparaging others are unbelievable.

 

Hey, it's NOT ME saying he's ready. IT'S THE ENTIRE FREAKING RED SOX MANAGEMENT so maybe you should reconsider who thinks who is smarter. Just because you think everyone marches to the same progression mean jack s***. YOU SHOULD BE SENDING YOUR RESUME TO THE SOX FRONT OFFICE.

 

Wow Nick. You got your juices flowing this morning.

 

I agree though. They act like we were coming up with our opinions based on hopes and dreams of Fred Lynn revisited. We were only going off what we read and heard from "real experts": Sox personnel.

[User Name]

Exactly. My position was that I thought Beni was ready or very close to ready and "should be called up the second Sox management thinks he's ML ready".

 

For all intents and purposes, the Red Sox brass had indicated Benintendi was a September callup. You were ridiculed because the idea of bringing him up before that out of desperation was stupid and might blow up in their faces, and that's still the point.

 

"Those who do not learn from history are doomed to repeat it".

 

I've got my fingers crossed that Benintendi doesn't become another Conforto or WMB.

[User Name]

"And our people kept coming up and saying, 'Well, we think he can play at the big league level. We think he's ready,'" Dombrowski said. "Now, don't look for him to be in the middle of the lineup like he will eventually. But he's a well-rounded player. He's a good defensive player. He runs the bases well. He has a good arm." And there are many countless articles where DD or his subordinates are touting Benintendi.

 

Smugness of 'experts' on this board disparaging others are unbelievable.

 

Hey, it's NOT ME saying he's ready. IT'S THE ENTIRE FREAKING RED SOX MANAGEMENT so maybe you should reconsider who thinks who is smarter. Just because you think everyone marches to the same progression mean jack s***. YOU SHOULD BE SENDING YOUR RESUME TO THE SOX FRONT OFFICE.

 

You need some demerol.

[SoxnCycles]

The third google hit:

 

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/red_sox/clubhouse_insider/2016/06/dombrowski_andrew_benintendi_impressing_but_too_soon_for

 

"Asked if he was considered for a promotion straight to the majors, Dombrowski said, “Not really. We don’t think he’s ready at this point. We didn’t even talk about him in relation to this move. We just don’t think he’s ready and we wouldn’t want to bring him up here until he’s ready.”

 

 

Benintendi had been in Portland a little over a month when that article was written.

[Bellhorn04]

I ain't no scout, that's for sure...I don't even pay that much attention to the coverage of prospects.

 

I just defer to the judgment of the team unless and until there is very persuasive evidence that they f***ed up.

[User Name]

I ain't no scout, that's for sure...I don't even pay that much attention to the coverage of prospects.

 

I just defer to the judgment of the team unless and until there is very persuasive evidence that they f***ed up.

 

Their recent history is not promising. However, I will freely admit Dombrowski has always been very aggressive promoting prospects and rarely misses when he does.

[sk7326]

Really with the Schwarber and Conforto things, this is not any sort of surprise. Deflect questions about him so you can control the timetable, and then see what happens. I think what is interesting about the discussion is the relationship between the boxscore and the org assessment (or lack thereof). They have been very aggressive moving Benintendi, and more careful with Moncada - and both stances make sense individually for the guy.

 

Now what will happen when Benintendi hits a rut - because this is baseball, and everybody does. Do the Red Sox collectively wet themselves like the Mets have done this season? Now recent history with regard to small sample size reaction is problematic - but I don't think Dombrowski will fall into that. The one thing we know about Dombrowski is that he is driving the train (the decision authority is not as muddled as it has been in prior years).

[Emp9]

He's the baseball equivalent of a gym rat.

 

I think he's called a 4 tool player (not 5) due to just an average arm.

 

But hold on a minute.... height & weight aren't considered tools? /s/

[Slasher9]

Hilariously, this is exactly what Mets fans were saying about Michael Conforto last year. Rushing kids ends up being very damaging in a lot of cases. But all of the Talksox talent evaluators know better, so I'll trust your judgement.

 

or you could trust the judgement of...oh, i dont know...the Red Sox evaluators, FO, coaches that called him up???

[cp176]

I don't think we all saw it coming with this kid. Many on the sight wanted to wait for him getting 100 ab's in AAA and were fine letting the team play Holt and Brentz in left field until Beni was READY. I am pleased that DD, the managers and coaches were smart enough to bring him up. Even earlier would have suited me since we definitely needed help in the outfield.

 

Ok - you are right - 95+% of us.

 

And who gets to determine when someone is officially READY?

 

As an aside, I don't remember anyone really saying that a platoon of Holt and Brentz was fine.

 

I for one am just happy that he is off to a good start. There are people on here who are trying to make it seem as though they were responsible for the move. Maybe they need a HUG or a PAT on the back. Do some of YOU really care who was right or who was wrong? Once again, anyone who follows the game and this team in particular saw this coming.

[Slasher9]

Then the problem is the run differential. Next question: You have an all-world offense and a mediocre pitching staff. Which area is the best one to try to "improve" to increase run differential? Where are you likely to be able to manage real improvements with the greatest efficienty (hint: it isn't the offense)

 

if you have the opportunity to improve any position - guess what? you improve it. the Red Sox had the opprotunity to improve LF right now. and that is what they did. if Benintendi was a RHSP or RP then he would have been brought up to fill that need. you improve where you can.

are you saying they shouldnt improve the LF position because Pitching is a greater need? it kind of sounds like cutting your nose off to spite your face or something.....

[mvp 78]

Benintendi had been in Portland a little over a month when that article was written.

 

I was told there were "countless articles" about Dombrowski saying that he was ready. I couldn't find any that said Benintendi would be called up in the near future prior to August 1. The only articles I found stated that they didn't know when he would be ready.

 

Plain and simple, I don't remember Dombrowski ever stating that Benintendi would likely be called up this year. It directly refutes Nick's assertion.

 

I'm glad he's here. I hope he plays every single day.

[mvp 78]

if you have the opportunity to improve any position - guess what? you improve it. the Red Sox had the opprotunity to improve LF right now. and that is what they did. if Benintendi was a RHSP or RP then he would have been brought up to fill that need. you improve where you can.

are you saying they shouldnt improve the LF position because Pitching is a greater need? it kind of sounds like cutting your nose off to spite your face or something.....

 

I agree. I feel the same way about manager.