Why sign Houck and Casas?

[UtahSox]

5 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

I'm not for doing nothing for the offense. I'd be fine with signing E Suarez and trading Rafaela + Crawford for a 2Bman or 3Bman (Suarez to DH.) I think Duran brings back more, and I love CF defense, so adding Suarez and maybe Hoerner/Vientos/Donovan and losing Duran is still enough offense to get us to or close to glory.

I agree whole heartedly moon.
If you can get Suarez on a 2yr 36m- 2yr 40m.
And Ketel Marte for Rafaela+ MLB SP + Witherspoon type that is our absolute ceiling in terms of having some power additions for 2026 To lineup. 

[FredLynn]

21 minutes ago, notin said:

But if they find a way to win for $100 million, are they supposed to spend $250million to prove commitment?

Generally speaking the teams willing to spend money to attract top talent win rings more often than those that don’t. The dodgers are a good example of combining lots of money with good judgement. 

[notin]

6 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Generally speaking the teams willing to spend money to attract top talent win rings more often than those that don’t. The dodgers are a good example of combining lots of money with good judgement. 

But that’s one way.

They brought in Bloom because they wanted to win without spending so much.  They wanted a sustainable farm delivering them quality talent without wasting time and (lots of) money on players on the wrong side of 30 that had their best years for other teams.

It might not be as effective (it wasn’t, certainly not at first) and it might not work every year, but that’s not the same as not trying…

[moonslav59]

43 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

There is no one here that I know of who thinks that spending the available money wisely isn’t important. The issue is that there should be more money available based on the large revenue the franchise takes in. 

I agree.

I think other teams need to spend more, too, and where would that leave us?

More, more, MORE!

[moonslav59]

We should not waste this window or opportunity, or whatever one wants to call it by going into the season with an offense projected by some to be bottom 10.

We have trade chips. We have some money to spend and stay under the 3rd line, if JH allows for it.

There should be no playing it half way.

We have the best pitching staff in MLB, IMO. We are bottom 10-15 in batting. Do something.

[notin]

11 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

We should not waste this window or opportunity, or whatever one wants to call it by going into the season with an offense projected by some to be bottom 10.

We didn’t do that yet.

Last year Bregman didn’t get added until mid-February.  Even this year, as recently as 48 hours ago, people were still demanding a #2 starter.

Now, we have a topflight and very deep pitching staff.  All the Sox need is another infielder, and another bullpen arm certainly wouldn’t hurt.  

We’re in a good spot.  But baseball offseason is annoyingly slow.  Of course speeding it up doesn’t make the season start sooner…

[FredLynn]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

I agree.

I think other teams need to spend more, too, and where would that leave us?

More, more, MORE!

Only a few teams have the resources to outspend the Flops. When you are at #4 (or whatever it is) in revenue you shouldn’t be outspent by all but 7 other teams percentage-wise if you are serious about winning.

Henry is not serious about winning despite his claims to the contrary. He’s more concerned about lining his pockets, which is his prerogative-just don’t lie to the fans about it. Be up front. Something like “Hey-baseball is a business and businesses need to make money !”. Everyone can see it. Just speak the truth!

[moonslav59]

19 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Only a few teams have the resources to outspend the Flops. When you are at #4 (or whatever it is) in revenue you shouldn’t be outspent by all but 7 other teams percentage-wise if you are serious about winning.

Henry is not serious about winning despite his claims to the contrary. He’s more concerned about lining his pockets, which is his prerogative-just don’t lie to the fans about it. Be up front. Something like “Hey-baseball is a business and businesses need to make money !”. Everyone can see it. Just speak the truth!

I'm not saying outspend the Sox, and many can, if the owner wants to.

Say the Sox spend $35M more this winter, like you want. I'm saying every MLB owner can also spend $35M more, this winter than they will. Same next year. The player's union would love it. Spending would snowball, because the same amount of players are signed, no matter what is paid.

 

[FredLynn]

20 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I'm not saying outspend the Sox, and many can, if the owner wants to.

Say the Sox spend $35M more this winter, like you want. I'm saying every MLB owner can also spend $35M more, this winter than they will. Same next year. The player's union would love it. Spending would snowball, because the same amount of players are signed, no matter what is paid.

 

Then I guess the flops will have to beat the other teams to the star players. They certainly haven’t been doing tjat. They express a lot of “interest” in them but almost invariably get outbid. 
The bottom line is that Henry IS cheap. He can do better than offering excuses.

[moonslav59]

12 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Then I guess the flops will have to beat the other teams to the star players. They certainly haven’t been doing tjat. They express a lot of “interest” in them but almost invariably get outbid. 
The bottom line is that Henry IS cheap. He can do better than offering excuses.

Most teams invariably get outbid and that's not an excuse.

I'm not defending JH's miser tendencies.

[FredLynn]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Most teams invariably get outbid and that's not an excuse.

I'm not defending JH's miser tendencies.

I know you’re not. It’s just irritating that Henry has so obviously made the choice to pocket a higher percentage of team revenue than all but 7 teams all the while lying to the fans that he is committed to winning. I’ll tell you who is committed to winning: the Dodgers. They just signed Kyle Tucker to all to their already loaded roster. 
But hey! We got Sonny Gray!

[moonslav59]

6 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

I know you’re not. It’s just irritating that Henry has so obviously made the choice to pocket a higher percentage of team revenue than all but 7 teams all the while lying to the fans that he is committed to winning. I’ll tell you who is committed to winning: the Dodgers. They just signed Kyle Tucker to all to their already loaded roster. 
But hey! We got Sonny Gray!

We've done okay for two winters in a row. Don't jinx it! LOL!

We have a big task at hand. I think we are pretty close to having a very nice off season.

Who we get for 3B (or 2B) and how much offense he brings to the table will be the big tell.

We could use another pen arm, but I don't really see a great need other than Big BAT & 3B/2B, which could be one guy. Not many teams look one player away from top 3-4 status.

That's not done by neglect and apathy.

Please don't take that as a pat on JH's back, cause I'd like to kick his backside, but can you try to be optimistic about something? Just try it. Just once.

[vegasbob]

3 hours ago, FredLynn said:

Then I guess the flops will have to beat the other teams to the star players. They certainly haven’t been doing tjat. They express a lot of “interest” in them but almost invariably get outbid. 
The bottom line is that Henry IS cheap. He can do better than offering excuses.

And Fred, why don't the players themselves outperform their expectations  and BWars, FWars, Dwars and win the games on the field .  JH, TW and CB don't play the actual games .  The implication that salaries equal performance is wrong .   

Players need to challenge themselves to be the best they can.    

[FredLynn]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

We've done okay for two winters in a row. Don't jinx it! LOL!

We have a big task at hand. I think we are pretty close to having a very nice off season.

Who we get for 3B (or 2B) and how much offense he brings to the table will be the big tell.

We could use another pen arm, but I don't really see a great need other than Big BAT & 3B/2B, which could be one guy. Not many teams look one player away from top 3-4 status.

That's not done by neglect and apathy.

Please don't take that as a pat on JH's back, cause I'd like to kick his backside, but can you try to be optimistic about something? Just try it. Just once.

I look at the way the team has conducted business vis a vis talented FAs and I don’t see us getting the bat we need. Probably something less. It’s a real shame because we are close to having a really good team.

Now I admit that getting Suarez was a surprise and a good start. Let’s see if they can finish the job.

[FredLynn]

15 minutes ago, vegasbob said:

And Fred, why don't the players themselves outperform their expectations  and BWars, FWars, Dwars and win the games on the field .  JH, TW and CB don't play the actual games .  The implication that salaries equal performance is wrong .   

Players need to challenge themselves to be the best they can.    

I’m sure the players are doing the best they can for the most part. But some are capable of doing more than others. We need more of that kind of player and less dumpster rejects.

[mvp 78]

8 hours ago, FredLynn said:

I’m sure the players are doing the best they can for the most part. But some are capable of doing more than others. We need more of that kind of player and less dumpster rejects.

I think knowing which players to go out and set the market price on is a good skill. Know who is worth it to overextend for and who you can reasonably pass on. Bregman may be a bigger need in 2026, but maybe Suarez will be the better player in 2028-30? 

If you think about DD in PHI, he's done a good job of not paying the wrong players (aside from Castellanos). The Mets have two big contracts that worked and a whole bunch of crap that didn't work out, so they missed the playoffs. 

[moonslav59]

35 minutes ago, mvp 78 said:

I think knowing which players to go out and set the market price on is a good skill. Know who is worth it to overextend for and who you can reasonably pass on. Bregman may be a bigger need in 2026, but maybe Suarez will be the better player in 2028-30? 

If you think about DD in PHI, he's done a good job of not paying the wrong players (aside from Castellanos). The Mets have two big contracts that worked and a whole bunch of crap that didn't work out, so they missed the playoffs. 

Certainly BTV should not be used as a tool to judge GMs, but I was rather shocked by the few amount of high value players on their roster. (Yes, value is measured by performance projection minus salary, and DD pays his players well.)

Only 3 players over $28M (C Sanchez, Painter & A Miller, 2 are prospects)

Only 6 players between 9 and 28.

Their 25th man is valued at 3.2, while the Sox is 8.4.

The Phillies have 10 players in the minus zone, but their top 3 have high performance value:

176 T Turner (-219 salary)

43 Wheeler (-84)

99 Schwarber (-135)

Also, #6 Nola has 108 value -123 salary.

[JoeBrady]

1 hour ago, mvp 78 said:

If you think about DD in PHI, he's done a good job of not paying the wrong players

That worries me a fair amount.  DD extended everyone else, why not Suarez?

[mvp 78]

51 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Certainly BTV should not be used as a tool to judge GMs, but I was rather shocked by the few amount of high value players on their roster. (Yes, value is measured by performance projection minus salary, and DD pays his players well.)

Only 3 players over $28M (C Sanchez, Painter & A Miller, 2 are prospects)

Only 6 players between 9 and 28.

Their 25th man is valued at 3.2, while the Sox is 8.4.

The Phillies have 10 players in the minus zone, but their top 3 have high performance value:

176 T Turner (-219 salary)

43 Wheeler (-84)

99 Schwarber (-135)

Also, #6 Nola has 108 value -123 salary.

They may be in the minus zone, but Dave has taken the Phillies to the playoffs 4 out of 5 years, only missing the very first season. They've been over 90 wins the past 3 years. Maybe there will be a reckoning at some point. If there is one, it's because the farm system is generally towards the bottom third. DD can spend, but he does need to fill out the ballclub with some smaller contracts. 

[mvp 78]

10 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

That worries me a fair amount.  DD extended everyone else, why not Suarez?

I think he's just swapping out Suarez for Painter in his mind and going to use that money elsewhere. 

I think Suarez will be fine over the next 5 years. I think the only thing to watch out for is that he's NOT a workhorse. I hope Breslow doesn't try to tinker with his velo either.

[moonslav59]

32 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

That worries me a fair amount.  DD extended everyone else, why not Suarez?

Using the money for Bichette or Bellinger?

[notin]

41 minutes ago, JoeBrady said:

That worries me a fair amount.  DD extended everyone else, why not Suarez?

With Wheeler, Nola and Sánchez already on board, it was one area he didn’t have to worry about. 

From what I’m reading, DD might be getting close to his budget limits.  MLBTR has him not being able to sign Bichette unless he can unload some cash, notably Bohm as he wouldn’t be needed anyway, and isn’t unmovable like Castellanos…

[moonslav59]

23 minutes ago, notin said:

With Wheeler, Nola and Sánchez already on board, it was one area he didn’t have to worry about. 

From what I’m reading, DD might be getting close to his budget limits.  MLBTR has him not being able to sign Bichette unless he can unload some cash, notably Bohm as he wouldn’t be needed anyway, and isn’t unmovable like Castellanos…

PHI also has Painter & Luzardo.

[drewski6]

18 hours ago, notin said:

We didn’t do that yet.

Last year Bregman didn’t get added until mid-February.  Even this year, as recently as 48 hours ago, people were still demanding a #2 starter.

Now, we have a topflight and very deep pitching staff.  All the Sox need is another infielder, and another bullpen arm certainly wouldn’t hurt.  

We’re in a good spot.  But baseball offseason is annoyingly slow.  Of course speeding it up doesn’t make the season start sooner…

I would love to upgrade the DH spot, but I guess one way to do that is to not trade an OF'er

[FredLynn]

19 hours ago, UtahSox said:

I agree whole heartedly moon.
If you can get Suarez on a 2yr 36m- 2yr 40m.
And Ketel Marte for Rafaela+ MLB SP + Witherspoon type that is our absolute ceiling in terms of having some power additions for 2026 To lineup. 

I read that Marte is not going to be traded.

[drewski6]

1 hour ago, JoeBrady said:

That worries me a fair amount.  DD extended everyone else, why not Suarez?

I think that he understands that pitching will only take you so far.

[drewski6]

2 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

I read that Marte is not going to be traded.

Same, and right now its looking like hes not going to be traded, but that kind of stuff is fluid.

[moonslav59]

10 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

I would love to upgrade the DH spot, but I guess one way to do that is to not trade an OF'er

I've been set against "wasting" Duran at DH, and I do not see an OF rotation at DH, as the others are too good on D, but unless we sign Suarez, I don't see us getting the big bat we need via a trade for 3B or 2B. KMarte is likely not being traded. 

Duran may barely beat out Masa for 2026 OPS, he has more power and speed. I think he has more upside, too.

Romy could DH v L.

[drewski6]

1 minute ago, moonslav59 said:

I've been set against "wasting" Duran at DH, and I do not see an OF rotation at DH, as the others are too good on D, but unless we sign Suarez, I don't see us getting the big bat we need via a trade for 3B or 2B. KMarte is likely not being traded. 

Duran may barely beat out Masa for 2026 OPS, he has more power and speed. I think he has more upside, too.

Romy could DH v L.

Duran at DH is not a waste to me, its depth and versatility. But again, I dont think Duran is a DH, he may DH 50% of games ,sit 25% and and play OF 25% with a full team (no injuries/slumps) but its gonna change when the twists/turns of the season start.

[drewski6]

Baseball is a lot about managing attrition in 2026.  Its not just pitchers, although maybe especially pitchers.

Like everyone talks about needing a good 6th,7th,8th pitcher but nobody talks about needing a good 4th of

But I would submit that injuries to both pitchers AND position players are at an all time high. We didnt start last year intending to start Eaton, Lowe, Hamilton in the playoffs.

Granted I think you are most likely to lose pitchers than position players, so Im not saying people are wrong to prioritize starting pitching depth over positional depth, but its not like positional players arent getting hurt at a very high rate as well.

Its like pitching injuries are up 300% and positional player injuries are up 200%. At least thats how it feels.