Red Sox 2025 Season Review/Offseason Preview Thread

[moonslav59]

Just now, Randy Red Sox said:

the "major" signing you mention likely won't even be Bregman IMO.  I think he will get a great offer by the Tigers and I'd be willing to bet Schwarber re-ups in Philly.  With Casas due back next year I dont see JH  approving an Alonso signing. We may in fact simply resign Lowe on a much more reasonable amount on a 1 yr deal.

If we have just one "major signing," I'd prefer it not be Bregman or Bichette. We need more power and higher OPS from the "major." To me, that's Alonso or Schwarber.

Signing or adding two from this group would be okay: Bregman, Bichette, Suarez, Polanco, KMarte.

Casas coudl end up at DH, if he finds his way back to a starting role and proves he's healthy.

IMO, having Casas at a low cost should not be a  reason we avoid Alonso. How JH sees it may be as you suggest. I fully understand that point.

[Old Red]

12 minutes ago, notin said:

Players get demoted and promoted all the time.  This season, Campbell might outhit Anthony.  It’s common for fans to only look at small samples they are familiar with and assume that is reality.  I remember back when the Sox traded for Eric Gagne, fans were upset that the Sox had sent the “wrong pitcher” in Kason Gabbard and should have dealt away Jon Lester instead…

The bottom line to me is the Red Sox have been desperate for a long time for a 2B, and took the shot with KC ready, or not, and when it was not, and KC was sent down to WOO he was never to return again. IF Grissom would have had a good ST he might have started the season as the Red Sox starting 2B, and KC might have started the season down in WOO like Mayer, and Roman did. 

[Randy Red Sox]

2 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

If we have just one "major signing," I'd prefer it not be Bregman or Bichette. We need more power and higher OPS from the "major." To me, that's Alonso or Schwarber.

Signing or adding two from this group would be okay: Bregman, Bichette, Suarez, Polanco, KMarte.

Casas coudl end up at DH, if he finds his way back to a starting role and proves he's healthy.

IMO, having Casas at a low cost should not be a  reason we avoid Alonso. How JH sees it may be as you suggest. I fully understand that point.

that has been JH's philosophy for several years now to go with the cheaper option.

[moonslav59]

17 minutes ago, notin said:

Players get demoted and promoted all the time.  This season, Campbell might outhit Anthony.  It’s common for fans to only look at small samples they are familiar with and assume that is reality.  I remember back when the Sox traded for Eric Gagne, fans were upset that the Sox had sent the “wrong pitcher” in Kason Gabbard and should have dealt away Jon Lester instead…

Indeed. There was a reason KC won Minor League Player of the Year over Anthony, Mayer and others. When you look at the list of previous winners, we should not be thinking so negatively about KC. I'm sure when you look at the first 200+ PAs by previous winners and other MLB stars, we find many struggles early on.

It might not mean they were rushed or wrongly promoted.

[Old Red]

9 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I don't see things in black and white so much. There were several reasons to give KC a shot, including the point about trying 11 secondbasemen the year before.

I did prefer giving Mayer the first shot, but there were reasons to think he needed some rehab time, as well as wanting to keep him getting SS reps, until we got a clearer idea on Story and his health at SS.

In hindsight, we can argue "KC was not ready and it showed," but that is an opinion. It could have just been a long slump that he was about to snap out of. We'll never know. I have no issue with the opinion we were wrong or that he was "rushed," but it's not a certainty.

The big question, now is are we ready to hand him another FT slot or even an inside track to one?

2B was the only open spot for KC to try bad D, or not, and that is black, and white.

[moonslav59]

Just now, Randy Red Sox said:

that has been JH's philosophy for several years now to go with the cheaper option.

Oh, I get that, but last winter saw some significant changes:

1. Bregman was signed at an AAV 30% higher than any previous contract.

2. The Buehler SP'er signing was double the AAV of any SP'er FA, except Gio (see below), signing since Price.

3. The multi prospect extensions show a clear change in direction/philosophy.

 

The 1-2 seasons before last winter saw:

1. The Devers extension that blew away the record Price signing from many years ago.

2. The Giolito signing was about almost double the AAV and double the years of any FA SP'er signing since Price. (I see the Nate signing as an extension.)

3. The 2023 signings of Yoshida (5 yrs) and Jansen (highest closer AAV ever by a Sox RP'er.)

4. The Bello & Rafaela extensions marked the start of a new philosophy.

 

Please do not take these facts as me defending JH or as a projection that he will continue breaking his stubborn ways, but the fact is the trend is moving towards a willingness to do things he hasn't approved of in many many years.

I'm hopeful but not expecting anything. We can do a lot of what I suggest and still stay under the tax line, so I think there is some room for hope. The next big hurdle for JH to jump is to go Large and Long- and I'm not talking Story or Masa type deals.

I'm actually talking 2 deals: one for someone like Alonso and then another in the Story/Masas range (Suarez/Polanco or even Bregman/Bichette, but that is highly unlikely)

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

11 minutes ago, Old Red said:

2B was the only open spot for KC to try bad D, or not, and that is black, and white.

No doubt. I'm not sure they thought he'd be that bad on D, but they also thought the 2024 2B bar was so low, they didn't need much to "improve" at 2B on O and D.

Yes, 11 players played 2B, last year, but E Valdez played about 1/3 of the innings and did worse on O & D than KC. Grissom was 3rd in innings at 2B and was way worse on O and D.

I really think it was about wanting Mayer to have more time to rehab and get ready for SS, in case Story got hurt. Sometimes choices made involve more than just who is better or "more ready."

[Hitch]

3 hours ago, notin said:

Actually, there is a chance he is handed a position.  For all the “they gave him an MLB spot to justify the contract talk,” the Sox didnt give him that contract based on numbers they pull out of a hat.  He had an unprecedented run through the minors and impressed at every stop along the way.   The notion that he was just handed everything is ridiculous.  Yes, Campbell had a terrible spring training, but maybe (re: clearly) ST isn’t the tryout many think it is…

What position exactly? He hasn't proven he can play defence anywhere as yet. Something has gone quite wrong if Campbell is handed a position. 

[Hitch]

1 hour ago, notin said:

Players get demoted and promoted all the time.  This season, Campbell might outhit Anthony.  It’s common for fans to only look at small samples they are familiar with and assume that is reality.  I remember back when the Sox traded for Eric Gagne, fans were upset that the Sox had sent the “wrong pitcher” in Kason Gabbard and should have dealt away Jon Lester instead…

Yes and I might marry Scarlett Johansson. Campbell was horrible in defence, didn't stick at a position in the minors (last I heard he is being earmarked for outfield now) and did little with the bat to show he was ready to come back up. He has got a lot to prove.

[Cameron Tran]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

If we have just one "major signing," I'd prefer it not be Bregman or Bichette. We need more power and higher OPS from the "major." To me, that's Alonso or Schwarber.

Signing or adding two from this group would be okay: Bregman, Bichette, Suarez, Polanco, KMarte.

Casas coudl end up at DH, if he finds his way back to a starting role and proves he's healthy.

IMO, having Casas at a low cost should not be a  reason we avoid Alonso. How JH sees it may be as you suggest. I fully understand that point.

I agree. I much rather us go with Alonso. If Casas comes out of camp playing well he could factor in at DH, we can never have too many middle of the order bats. Of course, that leaves Yoshida with nowhere to play, but I'd be fine with us taking a good chunk of that contract to move him. 

[Cameron Tran]

I have Alonso, Helsley, and Weaver coming in as FA signings, while we make a trade for a Joe Ryan or a Hunter Greene. I think our position player group is good enough where just one big time middle of the order bat can push us into that upper echelon. Would rather trade from surplus (OF) to gain a top line starter. Interesting to see how other teams would value Duran, and how much he could get us in terms of that top line starter. How much more would the Reds ask for Hunter Greene? Saw a Duran + for Ketel Marte trade idea I honestly didnt hate, but would rather trade for a starter and sign a middle of the order bat.

[Cameron Tran]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

Indeed. There was a reason KC won Minor League Player of the Year over Anthony, Mayer and others. When you look at the list of previous winners, we should not be thinking so negatively about KC. I'm sure when you look at the first 200+ PAs by previous winners and other MLB stars, we find many struggles early on.

It might not mean they were rushed or wrongly promoted.

I think KC was definetly rushed. Him signing that big contract put too much pressure on him to perform immediately, as having that money in AAA might not go down well with the "casual" fan.  

[moonslav59]

32 minutes ago, Cameron Tran said:

I think KC was definetly rushed. Him signing that big contract put too much pressure on him to perform immediately, as having that money in AAA might not go down well with the "casual" fan.  

The thing is, he did "perform immediately." He just fell off a cliff after about 20 games. His D sucked from day one.

Again, I'm fine with the opinion he was "rushed." I'm not saying he wasn't. My point is that just because someone has a prolonged slump, we don't always know for sure why.

[Larry Cook]

4 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

To those who think we have to re-examine our prospect MLB readiness evaluations, how many of these call-ups worked vs not worked?

Campbell

Narvaez

Dobbins

Mayer

Anthony

Early

Tolle

The more important question is many did we feel showed enough in the minor leagues to prove they were ready???

[Cameron Tran]

1 hour ago, moonslav59 said:

The thing is, he did "perform immediately." He just fell off a cliff after about 20 games. His D sucked from day one.

Again, I'm fine with the opinion he was "rushed." I'm not saying he wasn't. My point is that just because someone has a prolonged slump, we don't always know for sure why.

I didn't hear anything about any sort of mechanical issues with KC, but check me if im wrong. The hope is with a full offseason of putting on strength and a mental reset and we can just write off last season as a weird fluke.

[Larry Cook]

42 minutes ago, Cameron Tran said:

I didn't hear anything about any sort of mechanical issues with KC, but check me if im wrong. The hope is with a full offseason of putting on strength and a mental reset and we can just write off last season as a weird fluke.

Baseball is a game of adjustments! After a month, pitchers made an adjustment to how they pitched Campbell and Campbell never made the a correcting adjustment. And add in the problems he had defensively, and you can see why his confidence was shattered 

[Randy Red Sox]

3 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Oh, I get that, but last winter saw some significant changes:

1. Bregman was signed at an AAV 30% higher than any previous contract.

2. The Buehler SP'er signing was double the AAV of any SP'er FA, except Gio (see below), signing since Price.

3. The multi prospect extensions show a clear change in direction/philosophy.

 

The 1-2 seasons before last winter saw:

1. The Devers extension that blew away the record Price signing from many years ago.

2. The Giolito signing was about almost double the AAV and double the years of any FA SP'er signing since Price. (I see the Nate signing as an extension.)

3. The 2023 signings of Yoshida (5 yrs) and Jansen (highest closer AAV ever by a Sox RP'er.)

4. The Bello & Rafaela extensions marked the start of a new philosophy.

 

Please do not take these facts as me defending JH or as a projection that he will continue breaking his stubborn ways, but the fact is the trend is moving towards a willingness to do things he hasn't approved of in many many years.

I'm hopeful but not expecting anything. We can do a lot of what I suggest and still stay under the tax line, so I think there is some room for hope. The next big hurdle for JH to jump is to go Large and Long- and I'm not talking Story or Masa type deals.

I'm actually talking 2 deals: one for someone like Alonso and then another in the Story/Masas range (Suarez/Polanco or even Bregman/Bichette, but that is highly unlikely)

 

 

 

the facts remain that the Sox have gone from a top 3-4 in payroll to now something in the 10-15 range. 

[harmony]

14 minutes ago, Randy Red Sox said:

the facts remain that the Sox have gone from a top 3-4 in payroll to now something in the 10-15 range. 

According to Spotrac, this year the Red Sox ranked 10th in payroll:

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/payroll/_/year/2025

The Red Sox ranked 18th in 2024:

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/payroll/_/year/2024

,,, and have not ranked in the Top 4 since 2019.

[Randy Red Sox]

19 minutes ago, harmony said:

According to Spotrac, this year the Red Sox ranked 10th in payroll:

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/payroll/_/year/2025

The Red Sox ranked 18th in 2024:

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/payroll/_/year/2024

,,, and have not ranked in the Top 4 since 2019.

proving my point

[Randy Red Sox]

wow the first real FA signing-- Josh Naylor about to sign a 5 yr deal to stay in seattle

[Duran Is The Man]

42 minutes ago, Randy Red Sox said:

wow the first real FA signing-- Josh Naylor about to sign a 5 yr deal to stay in seattle

they needed a first baseman and signed one. we need a 1B, 2B & 3B, so I expect Brez to sign .......an outfielder.

[Larry Cook]

41 minutes ago, Duran Is The Man said:

they needed a first baseman and signed one. we need a 1B, 2B & 3B, so I expect Brez to sign .......an outfielder.

A left handed hitting outfielder???

[notin]

2 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

Baseball is a game of adjustments! After a month, pitchers made an adjustment to how they pitched Campbell and Campbell never made the a correcting adjustment. And add in the problems he had defensively, and you can see why his confidence was shattered 

So was he rushed or did the league make adjustments?

I think the “rushed” thing gets thrown around a lot.  Folks are saying the Sox didn’t rush Anthony and Mayer.  So April is rushed but June/July isn’t?  How much did those two improve in that 10-12 week stretch?

[Old Red]

20 minutes ago, notin said:

So was he rushed or did the league make adjustments?

I think the “rushed” thing gets thrown around a lot.  Folks are saying the Sox didn’t rush Anthony and Mayer.  So April is rushed but June/July isn’t?  How much did those two improve in that 10-12 week stretch?

It’s not just the 10-12 week stretch, which can yes make a big difference, but both Mayer, and Anthony had a lot more minor league games, and AB under their belts, which can make a big difference also. Campbell wasn’t ready, and that’s why he didn’t  last long in Boston, or ever come back up.🤔

[moonslav59]

4 hours ago, Larry Cook said:

The more important question is many did we feel showed enough in the minor leagues to prove they were ready???

I think all of them. The most "rushed" were probably Tolle & Early and NOT Campbell.

[Duran Is The Man]

45 minutes ago, Larry Cook said:

A left handed hitting outfielder???

bet on it.

[Old Red]

2 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

I think all of them. The most "rushed" were probably Tolle & Early and NOT Campbell.

How does that make any difference on if Campbell was rushed, or not,and it wasn’t even a question if others were rushed more, and two completely different situations position, and otherwise. 

[moonslav59]

3 hours ago, Randy Red Sox said:

the facts remain that the Sox have gone from a top 3-4 in payroll to now something in the 10-15 range. 

Yes. Agreed. I do think part od the drop in rankings was that other owners went nutty, but facts are facts, and JH slouched. The Devers trade also dropped our end of season ranking.

The fact that JH has spent much more in the last 2.5 years does not change the rankings fact.

He needs to bring us back into top 7-8, at least.

[Randy Red Sox]

4 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Yes. Agreed. I do think part od the drop in rankings was that other owners went nutty, but facts are facts, and JH slouched. The Devers trade also dropped our end of season ranking.

The fact that JH has spent much more in the last 2.5 years does not change the rankings fact.

He needs to bring us back into top 7-8, at least.

i agree.

[moonslav59]

15 minutes ago, Old Red said:

How does that make any difference on if Campbell was rushed, or not,and it wasn’t even a question if others were rushed more, and two completely different situations position, and otherwise. 

It doesn't. I was answering another question.

Again, I'm not claiming he wasn't rushed, only that we can not be certain "being rushed" was the reason he slumped.