Red Sox 2025 Trade Deadline Thread

[Hitch]

21 minutes ago, notin said:

It’s actually a fair price.  It’s a deal I’d make. Garcia isnt headlining a package for anyone significantly better…

We'll have to agree to disagree (quite strongly on my part).

[drewski6]

3 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Yes, we need 2 SP'ers, but one really good one would have been fine.

I love Duran, and mentioned with Rafaela needed at 2B, the need to keep him is higher, but I still see the drop off from Duran to Anthony as less than from Ryan to Criswell/Harrison/Fitts or even Buehler.

I'd have been fine trading one or two more mid level prospects to improve upon the May trade.

I hang up if I get offered any pitcher not named Skenes for Duran, and I wouldnt even say I love Duran.

I just know how important he is to the team.  Trading Duran, you lose the locker room. It would have been a punt.

[drewski6]

6 minutes ago, moonslav59 said:

Yes, we need 2 SP'ers, but one really good one would have been fine.

I love Duran, and mentioned with Rafaela needed at 2B, the need to keep him is higher, but I still see the drop off from Duran to Anthony as less than from Ryan to Criswell/Harrison/Fitts or even Buehler.

I'd have been fine trading one or two more mid level prospects to improve upon the May trade.

You are overrating the importance of a back end starter and underrating the importance of an emotional leader/rally cryer

They are riding high off not trading Duran, its exuberance right now. Its fun. Its personal. Its emotional. They are bought in. You lose all of that if you trade Duran.

[notin]

17 hours ago, FredLynn said:

I very much doubt that May will be an improvement over Dobbins/Fitts. We needed a Ferrari and Breslow got us a Ford.

The Sox didn't need a Ferrari.  Teams that need Ferraris are not deadline buyers.

 (And really, no human being ever has NEEDED a Ferrari.  It’s one of those luxury items thats only deemed a necessity by the remarkably spoiled.)

 

I’m not wild about May, but the Sox pitching isn’t exactly struggling right now.  Maybe you haven’t noticed how the team is doing?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

1 minute ago, drewski6 said:

You are overrating the importance of a back end starter and underrating the importance of an emotional leader/rally cryer

They are riding high off not trading Duran, its exuberance right now. Its fun. Its personal. Its emotional. They are bought in. You lose all of that if you trade Duran.

This is the kind of post that risks criticism from those that need cold hard data to quantify meaning. 

Good job.

[notin]

3 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

You are overrating the importance of a back end starter and underrating the importance of an emotional leader/rally cryer

They are riding high off not trading Duran, its exuberance right now. Its fun. Its personal. Its emotional. They are bought in. You lose all of that if you trade Duran.

I get not breaking up the roster.  I’m more surprised they held Password, since unless they do deal a couple outfielders, he has no future with this team if he doesn’t move to 1b.  And even then, he might be third in line to field grounders since Yoshida and Campbell are reportedly both learning 1b…

[notin]

16 hours ago, mvp 78 said:

Don’t need Ryan, but someone better than Buehler

To be fair, Dustin May might meet that requirement..

Buehler has been worth -1.3bWAR with a 72 ERA+.  May has been worth -0.3 bWAR with an 85 ERA+…

[Bellhorn04]

27 minutes ago, notin said:

I’m not wild about May, but the Sox pitching isn’t exactly struggling right now.  Maybe you haven’t noticed how the team is doing?

Remember you're talking to Freddie Frowner.  Fred thinks Breslow should be fired, regardless of being 21-6 in their last 27.

[mvp 78]

2 hours ago, moonslav59 said:

Will Sandlin be added to the 40, soon?

Before the Rule 5 deadline at the latest. Today at the soonest. 

[mvp 78]

39 minutes ago, notin said:

The Sox didn't need a Ferrari.  Teams that need Ferraris are not deadline buyers.

 (And really, no human being ever has NEEDED a Ferrari.  It’s one of those luxury items thats only deemed a necessity by the remarkably spoiled.)

 

I’m not wild about May, but the Sox pitching isn’t exactly struggling right now.  Maybe you haven’t noticed how the team is doing?

Just because the team isn't struggling now, doesn't mean that they aren't going to need help down the stretch. 

[Bellhorn04]

41 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

You are overrating the importance of a back end starter and underrating the importance of an emotional leader/rally cryer

They are riding high off not trading Duran, its exuberance right now. Its fun. Its personal. Its emotional. They are bought in. You lose all of that if you trade Duran.

You'd also lose the guy who's 15TH IN MLB IN TOTAL BASES!

[FredLynn]

23 minutes ago, Bellhorn04 said:

Remember you're talking to Freddie Frowner.  Fred thinks Breslow should be fired, regardless of being 21-6 in their last 27.

Thats nice. But the truth is that the team has ACCOMPLISHED nothing. Playing well is better than playing poorly. Winning the pennant is even better. I have been a fan of this team long enough to know that their history of summer collapses has tended to repeat itself over and over again. So before I pin a medal on Breslows lapel I'll wait to see how the season ends. As of now it certainly seems that he failed to significantly improve our chances. I think that is common knowledge.

[notin]

11 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Thats nice. But the truth is that the team has ACCOMPLISHED nothing. Playing well is better than playing poorly. Winning the pennant is even better. I have been a fan of this team long enough to know that their history of summer collapses has tended to repeat itself over and over again. So before I pin a medal on Breslows lapel I'll wait to see how the season ends. As of now it certainly seems that he failed to significantly improve our chances. I think that is common knowledge.

And what would they have accomplished at this point if they did acquire the infamous “#2 starter”?

[notin]

1 hour ago, Hitch said:

We'll have to agree to disagree (quite strongly on my part).

I think the most overused phrase concerning minor leaguers is the phrase “blocked prospect.”  I’ve seen it used on A ball players, on pitchers and occasionally on players a stage ahead of a more highly ranked prospect.  I mean, can a pitcher EVER be a blocked prospect?

That said, Password is about as blocked as any prospect Ive ever seen.  In AAA, and even if we are not counting Refsnyder, is fifth on the OF depth charts on the 40 man alone.  6th if we extend it to include DH.  And barring unforeseen trades and injuries, no one is going anywhere for at least two years. And even then it’s only Yoshida.

Yes Garcia is a Top 100 prospect, but that doesn’t make him some rare Earth precious metal.  There’s like, what, 100 of them every year?  Sure no one wants to give say the next Bagwell, but that doesn’t mean we need to devotedly clutch every future Garin Cecchini just to make sure.

Im surprised he survived the deadline.  Next I will be surprised if he survives the off-season…
 

 

[Bellhorn04]

25 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Thats nice. But the truth is that the team has ACCOMPLISHED nothing. Playing well is better than playing poorly. Winning the pennant is even better. I have been a fan of this team long enough to know that their history of summer collapses has tended to repeat itself over and over again. 

I've been a fan over 50 years too, as I'm sure a lot of people here have.

You keep talking about the collapses and you say nothing about the 4 titles and all the other playoff appearances.  Your negative bias appears to be a neurosis of some sort.

[moonslav59]

2 minutes ago, FredLynn said:

Yup. You have to overpay to go for it, don't you. The bottom line, as I keep writing, is that Breslow again FAILED miserably to address the needs of the club. Everyone knows what they are; they haven't gone away. Too late now to do anything about them other than hope the M&Ms perform.

If M & M do well, Brez won't have failed, so it's still TBD, but I do feel like he should have done more.

He did more, last summer, and we had less of a chance to win, then.

[Hitch]

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

Yup. You have to overpay to go for it, don't you. The bottom line, as I keep writing, is that Breslow again FAILED miserably to address the needs of the club. Everyone knows what they are; they haven't gone away. Too late now to do anything about them other than hope the M&Ms perform.

But where's your limit? What if they wanted Anthony? Because I'm not doing that trade.

[Hitch]

38 minutes ago, notin said:

I think the most overused phrase concerning minor leaguers is the phrase “blocked prospect.”  I’ve seen it used on A ball players, on pitchers and occasionally on players a stage ahead of a more highly ranked prospect.  I mean, can a pitcher EVER be a blocked prospect?

That said, Password is about as blocked as any prospect Ive ever seen.  In AAA, and even if we are not counting Refsnyder, is fifth on the OF depth charts on the 40 man alone.  6th if we extend it to include DH.  And barring unforeseen trades and injuries, no one is going anywhere for at least two years. And even then it’s only Yoshida.

Yes Garcia is a Top 100 prospect, but that doesn’t make him some rare Earth precious metal.  There’s like, what, 100 of them every year?  Sure no one wants to give say the next Bagwell, but that doesn’t mean we need to devotedly clutch every future Garin Cecchini just to make sure.

Im surprised he survived the deadline.  Next I will be surprised if he survives the off-season…
 

 

That's all fine, but he's worth far more than 2 months of a struggling Cease. Way, way more.

[drewski6]

1 hour ago, notin said:

I get not breaking up the roster.  I’m more surprised they held Password, since unless they do deal a couple outfielders, he has no future with this team if he doesn’t move to 1b.  And even then, he might be third in line to field grounders since Yoshida and Campbell are reportedly both learning 1b…

I just like the dude.  But I agree with you.

[drewski6]

1 hour ago, 5GoldGlovesOF,75 said:

This is the kind of post that risks criticism from those that need cold hard data to quantify meaning. 

Good job.

Intangibles are a thing, and by definition, are not quantifiable.  This is why I think AC should be promoted.  Bresbot/Bloombot/algorithmbot there is something human that is missing.  This is why Bres was rightfully called a stiff, and I want that dude who was sh*tcanned for that back.  Breslow IS a stiff.

To even entertain trading Duran means something is broken, IMO. These are individuals not an empty shell w/ accompanying stats

 

[drewski6]

1 hour ago, FredLynn said:

Thats nice. But the truth is that the team has ACCOMPLISHED nothing. Playing well is better than playing poorly. Winning the pennant is even better. I have been a fan of this team long enough to know that their history of summer collapses has tended to repeat itself over and over again. So before I pin a medal on Breslows lapel I'll wait to see how the season ends. As of now it certainly seems that he failed to significantly improve our chances. I think that is common knowledge.

Who even focuses on "the pennant" anymore?  Do we care about World Series losers?  Im not an all or nothing guy but the championships count for a lot.  Winning the AL, who really cares?  It just means you made the WS. Very weird to be all like "I only care about accomplishments!" So you better win the AL.  Winning the AL and losing in the series, isnt all that different from losing a round or 2 earlier, right?

[drewski6]

21 minutes ago, Hitch said:

That's all fine, but he's worth far more than 2 months of a struggling Cease. Way, way more.

The established market is the established market, and we need to operate within.  If every trade is judged by expected WAR over remaining time of control of outgoing vs incoming, then you are just never going to go for it.  You do have to be willing to overpay.  How much and when does not depend on as much on WAR in vs WAR out. On NESN they said the sox are perennially too focused on what they are giving, not what they are getting , and I kind of agree.

I like the May trade MORE than I liked the Paxton trade because we gave up more.  I know that seems backwards, and from a "winning the trade" standpoint it is. But I just never ever wanna be back to where we are running around with our hands up "my prospects! my prospects!"

We have a young team that is competitive.  We dont need to win every trade, and I would argue that its that very mentality that has us trigger-shy since DD.

[sk7326]

4 hours ago, notin said:

No kidding.

Only 780 humans are talented enough to suit up for MLB games on any given day, yet some folks act like half of them got there via the same process as jury duty…

oh without a doubt - but it was more fun to type than "various #4/#5 starter types" 

[drewski6]

I have friends who Ive been in fantasy leagues for years.  They have never made a trade once in a decade.  When there is a trade, they are immediately focused on what we gave up.  They did not want to make the Crochet trade, or the Celtics trade that brought in KP and Jrue.  They overrate our own guys, and poopoo the importance of the deadline every year. They are trade averse.

These guys also have a basement full of chotskies and a DVD collection in the thousands.  All of their stuff is taken care of. They collect, they hoard and they are good friends, but I just am not that way.  ANd I dont want my teams to operate that way, because hoarding is not always good sports management.  Every decision is case by case.  So yes, there are times when you overpay. There are times when you rent.

 

[moonslav59]

1 hour ago, drewski6 said:

You are overrating the importance of a back end starter and underrating the importance of an emotional leader/rally cryer

They are riding high off not trading Duran, its exuberance right now. Its fun. Its personal. Its emotional. They are bought in. You lose all of that if you trade Duran.

Ryan is not a back end starter.

Anthony is no slouch.

This is not about Duran for Ryan. That was one of many suggestions. Abreu was another. Trading for someone better than May for a couple more mid level prospects would have been better.

[Hitch]

1 hour ago, drewski6 said:

The established market is the established market, and we need to operate within.  If every trade is judged by expected WAR over remaining time of control of outgoing vs incoming, then you are just never going to go for it.  You do have to be willing to overpay.  How much and when does not depend on as much on WAR in vs WAR out. On NESN they said the sox are perennially too focused on what they are giving, not what they are getting , and I kind of agree.

I like the May trade MORE than I liked the Paxton trade because we gave up more.  I know that seems backwards, and from a "winning the trade" standpoint it is. But I just never ever wanna be back to where we are running around with our hands up "my prospects! my prospects!"

We have a young team that is competitive.  We dont need to win every trade, and I would argue that its that very mentality that has us trigger-shy since DD.

Again if you want to trade what is considered between our 2nd to 5th prospect for a 4.60era pitcher for 2 months I'm glad we aren't participating in that market.

[drewski6]

9 minutes ago, Hitch said:

Again if you want to trade what is considered between our 2nd to 5th prospect for a 4.60era pitcher for 2 months I'm glad we aren't participating in that market.

Acquiring and hoarding prospects doesnt work, see the success of teams that flip prospects vs those that hoard them.

I dont mind not wanting to pull the trigger on Cease specfically.  Im just glad they spent a prospect.  I dont care if they got a bullpen pitcher with a 14 ERA. The fact that they bought something is a good sign to me.  Hoarders need therapy.

[Hitch]

10 minutes ago, drewski6 said:

Acquiring and hoarding prospects doesnt work, see the success of teams that flip prospects vs those that hoard them.

I dont mind not wanting to pull the trigger on Cease specfically.  Im just glad they spent a prospect.  I dont care if they got a bullpen pitcher with a 14 ERA. The fact that they bought something is a good sign to me.  Hoarders need therapy.

Then you're responding to the wrong person. 

[drewski6]

1 minute ago, Hitch said:

Then you're responding to the wrong person. 

Fair enough.  I dont mind looking at a PW for Cease trade and saying no.  I do mind bowing out of the rental market entirely.  In my opinion, you have to be willing to overpay when the time is right, and the time is right.  That doesnt mean you take any deal thrown your way.

PW for Cease wasnt one I was personally hoping they make. 

[drewski6]

4 minutes ago, Hitch said:

Then you're responding to the wrong person. 

Also, I thought you were a cat.