Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Bellhorn04]

Fine with me.

 

Yes, that could be a pretty good trade.

[Bellhorn04]

I can't say I'm "excited" per se, but I think his trades so far have been competent.

 

Agreed, but my inner pessimist sees Giolito bombing, Sale doing well, and the Sox winning 75 games. And in that scenario Crag will take a beating just like Bloom.

[moonslav59]

Beltran -1.2 fWAR, zero impact for HOU, bad example

McCann only 2 seasons and less important than Christian Vazquez who I didn't mention

 

Porcello was a fair comp for Keuchel who you mentioned.

 

No Beni comps? Y Gurriel? Reddick?

 

Kimbrell- Osuna?

 

You gotta admit, it's a pretty close comp, and one team survived the losses: the other did not.

[Bellhorn04]

Houston has been the model franchise over the last decade, aside from the tanking and the cheating perhaps.

[mvp 78]

No Beni comps? Y Gurriel? Reddick?

 

Kimbrell- Osuna?

 

You gotta admit, it's a pretty close comp, and one team survived the losses: the other did not.

 

HOU lost a lot and had a better GM at the helm when the players started leaving.

[Old Red]

Agreed, but my inner pessimist sees Giolito bombing, Sale doing well, and the Sox winning 75 games. And in that scenario Crag will take a beating just like Bloom.

 

I think Sale does well in Atlanta, but if Grissom does well it was well worth it. Gio could go either way.

[notin]

I think Sale does well in Atlanta, but if Grissom does well it was well worth it. Gio could go either way.

 

So you think he finally stops being Chris Frail?

[notin]

Beltran -1.2 fWAR, zero impact for HOU, bad example

McCann only 2 seasons and less important than Christian Vazquez who I didn't mention

 

Porcello was a fair comp for Keuchel who you mentioned.

 

Beltran had zero impact?

 

He was the KEY PLAYER in the sign-stealing scandal...

[moonslav59]

HOU lost a lot and had a better GM at the helm when the players started leaving.

 

Having Tucker for Springer, Pena for Correa and a bunch of home grown SP'ers to step in was more important than the GM, IMO.

[mvp 78]

Having Tucker for Springer, Pena for Correa and a bunch of home grown SP'ers to step in was more important than the GM, IMO.

 

The previous GM could have made deals to fill the holes rather than just shrug his shoulders.

[moonslav59]

The previous GM could have made deals to fill the holes rather than just shrug his shoulders.

 

Certainly, the GM was better, but their farm was the bigger difference, to me.

 

We got Houck & Dalbec, and more recently Bello, Casas and Crawford. They got 6+ SP'ers, Tucker, Pena, and a few others.

[mvp 78]

Maybe DD shouldn't have left the cupboard bare then?

[mvp 78]

@mlbtraderumors

Marlins Designate Kaleb Ort For Assignment

[Old Red]

Maybe DD shouldn't have left the cupboard bare then?

 

Casas was a good pick in 2018, but Jeremy Peña was just up the road 300 miles, or so, which Houston didn’t take to the 3rd round, and could have been had, and would most likely be the starting SS now.

[mvp 78]

Casas was a good pick in 2018, but Jeremy Peña was just up the road 300 miles, or so, which Houston didn’t take to the 3rd round, and could have been had, and would most likely be the starting SS now.

 

It's fine. We still have the 2nd rounder from that year. https://www.milb.com/player/nick-decker-678006

[moonslav59]

It's fine. We still have the 2nd rounder from that year. https://www.milb.com/player/nick-decker-678006

 

He was not all the great, in 2023.

[mvp 78]

He was not all the great, in 2023.

 

Oh?

[mvp 78]

Castillo and Weiss were claimed off waivers today.

[moonslav59]

Oh?

 

Maybe, I should have said not great... or not as good as 2022...

 

OPS+ 102>95

wRC+ 102>96

BWAR 4.9>3.8 is still good.

fWAR 3.4>2.8

DRS 16>7 (despite 170 more innings)

[mvp 78]

Maybe, I should have said not great... or not as good as 2022...

 

OPS+ 102>95

wRC+ 102>96

BWAR 4.9>3.8 is still good.

fWAR 3.4>2.8

DRS 16>7 (despite 170 more innings)

 

He's been around long enough to have been selected in the MiLB portion of the Rule 5 draft and nobody wanted him. He's almost post prospect stage. He's always injured. If he doesn't have a tremendous season this year, you can stick a fork in him.

[notin]

He's been around long enough to have been selected in the MiLB portion of the Rule 5 draft and nobody wanted him. He's almost post prospect stage. He's always injured. If he doesn't have a tremendous season this year, you can stick a fork in him.

 

You probably can anyway. It’s taken him 6 years to get to AA. What’s his timeline for Boston? Ten more?

[jad]

You think he should have held him and let him walk through free agency? It doesn't seem like trading Betts was just something he did to shake things up...

 

No. I think they should have offered him market value, i.e., as much or more than other teams did.

[jacksonianmarch]

This is an embarrassment of an offseason for the Sox. Usually, when the media starts crushing them, they make a stupid signing. My bet is Snell to the Sox at some $200 mil plus guarantee

[mvp 78]

This is an embarrassment of an offseason for the Sox. Usually, when the media starts crushing them, they make a stupid signing. My bet is Snell to the Sox at some $200 mil plus guarantee

 

Zero chance for Snell.

[moonslav59]

Zero chance for Snell.

 

Agreed.

 

0% Snell

10% Monty

15% Clevinger

20% some scrub on a ML deal

 

(Notice the total is under 50%.)

 

[notin]

No. I think they should have offered him market value, i.e., as much or more than other teams did.

 

Unfortunately that option seems to have not been on the table. And stories at the time seemed to indicate Mookie’s strong desire to test the market. (He did reportedly ask for $400mill.)

 

Really the issue was waiting until year five to try to lock him up. It should have been done at the latest by year three.

 

Maybe even year two instead of signing Price…

[jad]

Unfortunately that option seems to have not been on the table. And stories at the time seemed to indicate Mookie’s strong desire to test the market. (He did reportedly ask for $400mill.)

 

Really the issue was waiting until year five to try to lock him up. It should have been done at the latest by year three.

 

Maybe even year two instead of signing Price…

 

That desire must not have been stronger than an offer at market value, since he never did become a free agent. But I think we all pretty much agree that the reasons/excuses don't matter as much as the simple fact that the RS totally f*cked it up.

[notin]

That desire must not have been stronger than an offer at market value, since he never did become a free agent. But I think we all pretty much agree that the reasons/excuses don't matter as much as the simple fact that the RS totally f*cked it up.

 

 

COVID (and cancelled games) may have been a factor, too.

 

They traded for Betts in February but he didn’t extend until late July. Think the Dodgers postponed those negotiations for over five months? If not, how low did they start?

[jad]

Meanwhile, LAD's attendance last year topped Boston by 1.2 million. Average LA ticket price: 209 vs. Boston 170. (The only fig. that surprises me is the ave ticket price in LA; when I used to go, ticket price was essentially negligible). Imagine what that gap is going to look like this year, w/ Ohtani and Yamamoto.

[Randy Red Sox]

Agreed.

 

0% Snell

10% Monty

15% Clevinger

20% some scrub on a ML deal

 

(Notice the total is under 50%.)

 

 

actually 80% on some scrub on a M/L deal