Red Sox: Off Season '23-'24

[Old Red]

Never heard about an ERod/Cora split.

 

I don't see them signing Snell or Monty at all. That's what we've been hearing for a while now. Miserly attitudes in ownership.

 

I thought the Red Sox should have resigned ERod in the first place after the 2021 season, but I guess he was to expensive then.

[Hugh2]

It doesn't take a decade to build a farm and infrastructure. It may take more than 4 years though.

 

It could take as little as ONE year if you hire the right people, it just might take several years to see the results at the MLB level.

[Bellhorn04]

It doesn't take a decade to build a farm and infrastructure. It may take more than 4 years though.

 

When I say 'to fruition' I mean the time until the pitchers are posting 3-4 WAR seasons in MLB.

[Old Red]

Becoming better at drafting and developing pitching is an admirable goal, but one that could take a decade to come to fruition, if it comes to fruition at all.

 

It's not about 82 wins, it's about making the playoffs.

 

We just saw a season where a 90 win team beat an 84 win team in the World Series, so the argument that there's no point going for it unless you're a 95 win team should be dead and buried forever.

To me you should never give any season away to just hope, and pray for the future that may never be as bright as it might look, because of some hyped prospects, and in the meantime waste away some of Raffy’s prime years. I’ve heard about Mayer for 3 years now, and at the moment he’s stuck in Portland.

[Bellhorn04]

To me you should never give any season away to just hope, and pray for the future that may never be as bright as it might look, because of some hyped prospects, and in the meantime waste away some of Raffy’s prime years. I’ve heard about Mayer for 3 years now, and at the moment he’s stuck in Portland.

 

I agree with you 100%. The Boston Red Sox should not be giving seasons away. They all count equally.

 

With the expanded playoffs and 84 win teams in the World Series, there's less excuse than ever for punting.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Never heard about an ERod/Cora split.

 

I don't see them signing Snell or Monty at all. That's what we've been hearing for a while now. Miserly attitudes in ownership.

 

I don't really care whether the Sox sign Snell or Montgomery, though I've suggested acquiring the latter since last July. But Boston needs more good pitchers now -- not when the team is good again, which is really hard to be without quality starters... (he said, ad nauseum).

 

And there's no such thing as "wasting" a good pitcher's prime if the club isn't a strong contender in any specific year. A good pitcher makes a bad team better in so many ways, not the least of which is to change the culture of upgrading a low-end roster.

 

Lights-out pitchers limit the times a bad D handles the ball, and reduces the amount of runs a bad O needs to win games. That alone improves a ballclub, not to mention the rest provided to the bullpen, which will then be better positioned to help win future games. A good pitcher can even make teammates better, like when Ohtani taught Chris Martin the best way to throw a splitter (Martin is already paying it forward in Boston).

[Hugh2]

I agree with you 100%. The Boston Red Sox should not be giving seasons away. They all count equally.

 

With the expanded playoffs and 84 win teams in the World Series, there's less excuse than ever for punting.

 

I'm not saying you punt, but you certainly shouldn't go over the luxury tax for an 84 win team, it's about a tempered appraoch.

[Bellhorn04]

I'm not saying you punt, but you certainly shouldn't go over the luxury tax for an 84 win team, it's about a tempered appraoch.

 

Why, what happens if you go over the luxury tax line a little?

 

And what's wrong with having an 84 win team in the World Series? Does that really qualify as a problem?

 

The approach has become a little too tempered for the third richest team in the game. There's a fine line between a tempered approach and fattening the bottom line.

[Old Red]

Why, what happens if you go over the luxury tax line a little?

 

And what's wrong with having an 84 win team in the World Series? Does that really qualify as a problem?

 

The approach has become a little too tempered for the third richest team in the game. There's a fine line between a tempered approach and fattening the bottom line.

 

If that 84 win team gets you into the postseason you certainly should go over the CBT to if if makes you better in the here, and now, and possibly down the road. If you are not going to play to win then don’t play at all.

[jacksonianmarch]

I thought the sox were two starters away from contention last year. Instead, they are just as backwards now minus their DH and RFer, added an injury prone OF on a pillow contract and subtracted an injury prone pitcher with one who wasn't effective. It seems the sox are treading water at best and fading at worst in a division that is many classes above them in talent. This is shaping up to be a bad year in the Bean and I am not sure why the sox aren't trying to win

[jacksonianmarch]

As slav has noted, I have been quoted many times that mediocrity kills in the MLB. You either bottom out and build or go for it if you have the money to do so. The sox do. So this middling ******** is not going to sit well with the fans.

[notin]

To me you should never give any season away to just hope, and pray for the future that may never be as bright as it might look, because of some hyped prospects, and in the meantime waste away some of Raffy’s prime years. I’ve heard about Mayer for 3 years now, and at the moment he’s stuck in Portland.

 

I’m only ok with punting if the season is shortened to 60 games by a pandemic. I’ve always felt that way, even as a wee lad…

[notin]

I don't really care whether the Sox sign Snell or Montgomery, though I've suggested acquiring the latter since last July. But Boston needs more good pitchers now -- not when the team is good again, which is really hard to be without quality starters... (he said, ad nauseum).

 

And there's no such thing as "wasting" a good pitcher's prime if the club isn't a strong contender in any specific year. A good pitcher makes a bad team better in so many ways, not the least of which is to change the culture of upgrading a low-end roster.

 

Lights-out pitchers limit the times a bad D handles the ball, and reduces the amount of runs a bad O needs to win games. That alone improves a ballclub, not to mention the rest provided to the bullpen, which will then be better positioned to help win future games. A good pitcher can even make teammates better, like when Ohtani taught Chris Martin the best way to throw a splitter (Martin is already paying it forward in Boston).

 

 

Waiting for the team to be good again to invest in pitching is a Catch 22. “We won’t invest in pitching until the team is good.” “But this team won’t be good until we invest in pitching.” Did the front office replace Bill James with Joseph Heller?

 

This team with mediocre pitching was just under .500 each of the last two years. A healthy Sale alone might have been enough to get either (or both?) teams into the postseason…

[Bellhorn04]

As slav has noted, I have been quoted many times that mediocrity kills in the MLB.

 

That was me!

[Bellhorn04]

I’m only ok with punting if the season is shortened to 60 games by a pandemic. I’ve always felt that way, even as a wee lad…

 

Yeah, 2020 was the one season we could approve a tank job, I think.

[Bellhorn04]

Waiting for the team to be good again to invest in pitching is a Catch 22. “We won’t invest in pitching until the team is good.” “But this team won’t be good until we invest in pitching.” Did the front office replace Bill James with Joseph Heller?

 

This team with mediocre pitching was just under .500 each of the last two years. A healthy Sale alone might have been enough to get either (or both?) teams into the postseason…

 

This is the thing - we're not that far away. All the more reason to give it that little extra push. No excuse for not doing so.

[notin]

Yeah, 2020 was the one season we could approve a tank job, I think.

 

However, if you’re tanking, THAT is the year to gamble on taking a pitcher in Rule 5, as opposed to a fringey utility infielder…

[mvp 78]

It could take as little as ONE year if you hire the right people, it just might take several years to see the results at the MLB level.

 

You could see some improvement at the MLB level in a year or two. Larger improvements would be 4-5 years most likely. Henry just doesn't seem to be patient though.

[Old Red]

This is the thing - we're not that far away. All the more reason to give it that little extra push. No excuse for not doing so.

 

Seems like money is the only excuse.

[mvp 78]

When I say 'to fruition' I mean the time until the pitchers are posting 3-4 WAR seasons in MLB.

 

Maybe if you only rely on IFA signings and low ceiling college guys.

[mvp 78]

I agree with you 100%. The Boston Red Sox should not be giving seasons away. They all count equally.

 

With the expanded playoffs and 84 win teams in the World Series, there's less excuse than ever for punting.

 

Without a real pitching rotation, this team has no shot even with an 84 win season.

[Old Red]

Without a real pitching rotation, this team has no shot even with an 84 win season.

 

Not unless Bello takes a big step forward, Gio gets straightened out, the good Pivetta shows up all year, and even then they need help.

[mvp 78]

However, if you’re tanking, THAT is the year to gamble on taking a pitcher in Rule 5, as opposed to a fringey utility infielder…

 

The Rule 5 draft happened long before anyone knew the season would be shortened. Only one pick was made after the Sox took Arauz.

 

1) Tigers: RHP Rony Garcia (Yankees)

2) Orioles: RHP Brandon Bailey (Astros)

3) Marlins: RHP Sterling Sharp (Nationals' No. 13 prospect)

4) Royals: RHP Stephen Woods (Rays)

5) Mariners: RHP Yohan Ramirez (Astros)

6) Reds: OF Mark Payton (A's)

7) Giants: RHP Dany Jimenez (Blue Jays)

8) Phillies: SS Vimael Machin (Cubs)

9) Cubs: RHP Trevor Megill (Padres)

10) Red Sox: SS Jonathan Arauz

11) Orioles: Michael Rucker (Cubs)

 

Here's a list of all 30 teams' Top 30 Prospects who are eligible to be selected in the 2019 Rule 5 Draft:

 

Atlanta Braves

16) Thomas Burrows, LHP

 

Baltimore Orioles

17) Cody Sedlock, RHP

30) Gray Fenter, RHP

 

Boston Red Sox

26) Eduard Bazardo, RHP

 

Chicago Cubs

22) Oscar De La Cruz, RHP

28) Trent Giambrone, INF/OF

 

Chicago White Sox

27) Alec Hansen, RHP

 

Cincinnati Reds

18) Alfredo Rodriguez, SS

19) Andy Sugilio, OF

20) TJ Friedl, OF

21) Michael Beltre, OF

24) Mariel Bautista, OF

 

Cleveland Guardians

14) Luis Oviedo, RHP

 

Colorado Rockies

17) Robert Tyler, RHP

19) Reid Humphreys, RHP

24) Daniel Montano, OF

27) Roberto Ramos, 1B

 

Detroit Tigers

22) Elvin Rodriguez, RHP

27) Jake Robson, OF

 

Houston Astros

16) Ronnie Dawson, OF

25) Jonathan Arauz, SS/3B

 

Kansas City Royals

11) Seuly Matias, OF

19) Emmanuel Rivera, 3B

29) Gabriel Cancel, 2B

 

Los Angeles Angels

24) Leonardo Rivas, SS/2B

 

Los Angeles Dodgers

23) Cristian Santana, 3B/1B

26) Jordan Sheffield, RHP

 

Miami Marlins

26) Will Stewart, LHP

 

Milwaukee Brewers

3) Zack Brown, RHP

14) Lucas Erceg, 3B/1B

18) Braden Webb, RHP

 

Minnesota Twins

7) Wander Javier, SS

21) Griffin Jax, RHP

 

New York Mets

8) Shervyen Newton, INF

27) Patrick Mazeika, C

28) Desmond Lindsay, OF

29) Luis Carpio, 2B/SS

 

Philadelphia Phillies

12) Jhailyn Ortiz, OF

13) Rafael Marchan, C

17) Rodolfo Duran, C

23) Daniel Brito, 2B/SS

28) Cornelius Randolph, OF

 

Pittsburgh Pirates

14) Luis Escobar, RHP

15) Lolo Sanchez, OF

 

San Diego Padres

18) Esteury Ruiz, 2B

25) Buddy Reed, OF

 

San Francisco Giants

16) Sandro Fabian, OF

20) Franklin Labour, OF

22) Ricardo Genoves, C

28) Garrett Williams, LHP

 

Seattle Mariners

24) Dom Thompson-Williams, OF

28) Ljay Newsome, RHP

 

St. Louis Cardinals

24) Conner Capel, OF

30) Max Schrock, 2B/3B

 

Tampa Bay Rays

13) Moises Gomez, OF

27) Resly Linares, LHP

 

Texas Rangers

30) Eli White, SS/OF

 

Washington Nationals

13) Sterling Sharp, RHP

21) Steven Fuentes, RHP

22) Malvin Pena, RHP

25) Gilbert Lara, SS/3B

27) Telmito Agustin, OF

28) Jhonatan German, RHP (Astros' No. 25 prospect)

 

Who did the Sox miss out on?

[mvp 78]

Not unless Bello takes a big step forward, Gio gets straightened out, the good Pivetta shows up all year, and even then they need help.

 

But in a playoff situation, they need upper echelon pitching. They don't have that.

[Old Red]

But in a playoff situation, they need upper echelon pitching. They don't have that.

 

I’m still waiting for that trade to happen.

[mvp 78]

I’m still waiting for that trade to happen.

 

Tick. Tock.

[Dipre]

They'll sign Clevinger and call it a day. They will then perform John Henry's signature juju rituals for a return to 2019 form for both Giolito and Clevinger.

[moonslav59]

For who? Soler? I'd rather keep Masa. The leftover FA's leave a lot to be desired. Even Bellinger has his share of warts. IDK. If they were dumping Masa so that they could trade for a young ace and extend then ok.

 

I'm not agreeing with the idea that the plan was to "free up budget space," so we could sign ______.

 

BTW, we did "free up budget space" on three trades: Sale, Dugo and Urias, already.

[Dipre]

They'll sign Clevinger and call it a day. They will then perform John Henry's signature juju rituals for a return to 2019 form for both Giolito and Clevinger.

 

Gio, Clev and pray for rain.

[moonslav59]

This is just wrong. Mayer, Anthony and Teel are impact prospects. Sox just don't want to give them up.

 

I agree. We also have some good secondary prospects to add to any package.

 

Now, if teams are looking for pitching prospects, then we fall short. Adding Wikelman, Perales, Mata or Monegro is not going to wow many GMs, if any.