A Realistic View of 2023: Part II

[notin]

You are right.

 

Sox fans would not be upset, if we had Betts and Bogey and 90 losses.

 

My bad.

 

Didn’t everyone remember how much fun 2019 was?

[moonslav59]

As bad as our offense has been playing for weeks, it's hard to imagine so many players with pretty decent numbers.

 

OPS

.868 Devers

.857 Casas

.832 Duvall

.828 Duran

.810 Turner

.784 Yoshida

.753 Verdugo

.691 Wong

 

Under 300 ABs

.944 Abreu

.806 Rafaela

.757 Dalbec

.728 Reyes

.698 Urias

.681 Refsnyder

.679 McGuire

.525 Story

 

BA

.295 Duran (332 ABs)

.288 Yoshida

.277 JT

.275 Devers

 

HRs & RBIs

33 98 Devers

23 95 JT

24 65 Casas

15 71 Yoshida

20 57 Duvall (303)

13 54 Verdugo

9 36 Wong

8 40 Duran (332)

 

 

[moonslav59]

OPS

 

v LHPs

1.000 McGuire (20 ABs)

.903 Turner

.857 Devers

.836 Rafaela (20)

.826 Refsnyder

.785 Duvall

.782 Reyes (48)

.749 Duran (45)

.738 Yoshida

.603 Dugo

.553 Wong

 

vs RHPs

1.015 Abreu (49 ABs)

.873 Devers

.865 Casas

.849 Duvall

.840 Duran

.806 Dugo

.799 Yoshida

.791 Rafaela (45)

.776 JT

.773 Valdez (111)

.746 Wong

.704 Reyes (109)

.639 McGuire

.515 Story (108)

 

 

[Bellhorn04]

OPS+ 103 T12 in MLB

 

Home OPS .802

Road OPS .710

 

Conclusion: thoroughly mediocre offense

[Bellhorn04]

Didn’t everyone remember how much fun 2019 was?

 

Yeah, Bloom really brought back the fun.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Didn’t everyone remember how much fun 2019 was?

 

I do. In '19, Mookie led the majors in runs scored. Raffy was second.

 

Devers also led MLB in extra base hits and total bases. Bogaerts was third -- in the bigs -- in XBH, sixth in TB, and led the Sox in Offensive WAR (5th overall).

 

Raffy was also second in the majors in hits, Xander was fourth. The pair of buds were also second and third in doubles, with 54 and 52. Benintendi and Betts were tied for 10th with 40 each.

 

Mookie was also second in the big leagues in times on base. His OPS was .915... but he was only fourth on the club, behind Raffy .916, X .936, and JD Martinez .936 -- who had 36 HRs, 105 RBI and BA .305.

 

The '19 Red Sox missed the playoffs, and maybe the ball was still juiced back then... but for this fan, watching that team was way more fun than the total slopfests we were fed in three of the past four years since.

[Bellhorn04]

2019 was disappointing, but the years after the Red Sox make the World Series usually are.

 

1968

1976

1987

2005

2008 (although they did make it to game 7 of the ALCS)

2014

[Nick]

I do. In '19, Mookie led the majors in runs scored. Raffy was second.

 

Devers also led MLB in extra base hits and total bases. Bogaerts was third -- in the bigs -- in XBH, sixth in TB, and led the Sox in Offensive WAR (5th overall).

 

Raffy was also second in the majors in hits, Xander was fourth. The pair of buds were also second and third in doubles, with 54 and 52. Benintendi and Betts were tied for 10th with 40 each.

 

Mookie was also second in the big leagues in times on base. His OPS was .915... but he was only fourth on the club, behind Raffy .916, X .936, and JD Martinez .936 -- who had 36 HRs, 105 RBI and BA .305.

 

The '19 Red Sox missed the playoffs, and maybe the ball was still juiced back then... but for this fan, watching that team was way more fun than the total slopfests we were fed in three of the past four years since.

 

$90M invested in 3 players and we would still suck?

 

Fun team to watch in19? That was agonizing year. Again pitching imploded.

 

Do you not see the common denominator with our World Series teams?

 

I wouldn't watch 10-6 games that we lose day after day.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

$90M invested in 3 players and we would still suck?

 

Fun team to watch in19? That was agonizing year. Again pitching imploded.

 

Do you not see the common denominator with our World Series teams?

 

I wouldn't watch 10-6 games that we lose day after day.

 

As a fan, I could care less about the money invested in payroll. What interests me is watching star ballplayers star for my favorite team.

 

That all-time team from 2018 that carried over into '19 had a lot star power. No team wins it all every year, and the Red Sox never did for the first four decades I followed them... but they always had really good players on usually good teams.

 

Agonizing to me isn't 84 wins and third place. What really sucks is having a losing record and finishing dead last in the division, three out of four years.

[Nick]

As a fan, I could care less about the money invested in payroll. What interests me is watching star ballplayers star for my favorite team.

 

That all-time team from 2018 that carried over into '19 had a lot star power. No team wins it all every year, and the Red Sox never did for the first four decades I followed them... but they always had really good players on usually good teams.

 

Agonizing to me isn't 84 wins and third place. What really sucks is having a losing record and finishing dead last in the division, three out of four years.

 

You may not care but having $90M invested in 3 offensive players probably means no money left over for starting pitching. You can't come up with fantasy baseball team without budget.

Is that how your fantasy league works?

[Bellhorn04]

You may not care but having $90M invested in 3 offensive players probably means no money left over for starting pitching. You can't come up with fantasy baseball team without budget.

Is that how your fantasy league works?

 

Betts AAV 29

Bogaerts AAV 25.5

Total 54.5

 

Story AAV 23.3

Yoshida AAV 18

Total 41.3

 

The delta between A and B is 13.2 mill.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

You may not care but having $90M invested in 3 offensive players probably means no money left over for starting pitching. You can't come up with fantasy baseball team without budget.

Is that how your fantasy league works?

 

No, in my fantasy, the GM goes into the season with a healthy starting rotation every year, and doesn't bank the whole season on guys coming off the IL. He also trades for legitimate bullpen help at every deadline -- and not just bank every August/September on waiver wire pick-ups DFAed by other clubs.

[notin]

Betts AAV 29

Bogaerts AAV 25.5

Total 54.5

 

Story AAV 23.3

Yoshida AAV 18

Total 41.3

 

The delta between A and B is 13.2 mill.

 

And now tell me what those numbers are in 2032…

[Bellhorn04]

And now tell me what those numbers are in 2032…

 

Story and Yoshida are zero, but someone will replace them.

 

Personally, I'm getting too old to be thinking that far ahead.

[notin]

2019 was disappointing, but the years after the Red Sox make the World Series usually are.

 

1968

1976

1987

2005

2008 (although they did make it to game 7 of the ALCS)

2014

 

 

1. Not sure what your point was beyond missing mine. Jad said all he cared about was following the star players. The gang was all there in 2019. Did that make it enjoyable?

2. Previous World Series followups are irrelevant.

3. And why just a casual mention of GAME SEVEN of the 2008 ALCS!? That was one of the most exciting LCS ever. Sox down 3 games to one and trailing 7-0 in the 7th inning of game 5 and NEARLY WON THE SERIES?!? That does fit your criteria for baseball excitement!?! What do you need? A fireworks display leading to a series of public executions where the axes all get swung by swimsuit models?

[Bellhorn04]

The Chaim Bloom Era has taught us that if your gaze is aimed mostly down the road, there's probably a wreck right in front of you.

 

Rebuilding and half-ass competing is a failure. Rebuilding and tanking would be better.

[notin]

Story and Yoshida are zero, but someone will replace them.

 

Personally, I'm getting too old to be thinking that far ahead.

 

It was part of Bloom’s job to think that far ahead. Although i would have greatly preferred he bring back Betts. Bogaerts and Devers just are not on that level.

[Bellhorn04]

1. Not sure what your point was beyond missing mine. Jad said all he cared about was following the star players. The gang was all there in 2019. Did that make it enjoyable?

2. Previous World Series followups are irrelevant.

3. And why just a casual mention of GAME SEVEN of the 2008 ALCS!? That was one of the most exciting LCS ever. Sox down 3 games to one and trailing 7-0 in the 7th inning of game 5 and NEARLY WON THE SERIES?!? That does fit your criteria for baseball excitement!?! What do you need? A fireworks display leading to a series of public executions where the axes all get swung by swimsuit models?

 

jad and 5 Gloves say they enjoyed 2019. Take it up with them.

 

The 2008 ALCS was not that exciting. Game 5 was an amazing comeback, but that's it.

[notin]

The Chaim Bloom Era has taught us that if your gaze is aimed mostly down the road, there's probably a wreck right in front of you.

 

Rebuilding and half-ass competing is a failure. Rebuilding and tanking would be better.

 

I disagree.

 

I think it is possible to do, but Bloom himself definitely didn’t do it.

[notin]

The 2008 ALCS was not that exciting. Game 5 was an amazing comeback, but that's it.

 

The two most exciting words in sports are “game seven”.

[Bellhorn04]

The two most exciting words in sports are “game seven”.

 

What part did you find most exciting about 2008 ALCS Game 7?

[Bellhorn04]

Game Sevens can be letdowns just like any other game can be.

[Nick]

The Chaim Bloom Era has taught us that if your gaze is aimed mostly down the road, there's probably a wreck right in front of you.

 

Rebuilding and half-ass competing is a failure. Rebuilding and tanking would be better.

 

Again, we should have been selling not standing still at trade deadline. Paxton and Duvall should have fetched us a solid reliever or two. No?

[Nick]

1. Not sure what your point was beyond missing mine. Jad said all he cared about was following the star players. The gang was all there in 2019. Did that make it enjoyable?

2. Previous World Series followups are irrelevant.

3. And why just a casual mention of GAME SEVEN of the 2008 ALCS!? That was one of the most exciting LCS ever. Sox down 3 games to one and trailing 7-0 in the 7th inning of game 5 and NEARLY WON THE SERIES?!? That does fit your criteria for baseball excitement!?! What do you need? A fireworks display leading to a series of public executions where the axes all get swung by swimsuit models?

 

No, it did not. (I am agreeing with you Notin)

 

Despite having these offensive prowess:

 

.940 JD Martinez

.939 Xander

.916 Devers

.915 Betts

 

Sox finished 84-78, 12 games back of Rays for the last wild card spot. (two teams)

 

Despite having opening day starting rotation of

34 GS E Rod

32 GS Porcello

25 GS Sale

22 GS Price

12 GS Eovaldi

 

How did that work out? I certainly didn't enjoy it. Not after what we did in 2018. 12 f***ING GAMES BACK. THINK ABOUT THAT. (We are 9 games back right now).

 

Now I have enjoyed watching Bello, Casas (after April), Duran, Wong and now Rafaela and Abreu. Our future along with Devers.

 

We have $79M to spend according to Cot's. That goes up to $90M if Turner opts out as many thinks he will. Pivetta and Verdugo may cost as much as $15M, reducing the 'available' to $75M.

 

I would hope we spend $30M and $20M on two starting pitchers and trade for third.

Edited September 24, 2023 by Nick

[notin]

Game Sevens can be letdowns just like any other game can be.

 

So can World Series, but in still want Boston to go…

[moonslav59]

Winning certainly makes watching more enjoyable, but the game is fun to watch, for me as long as there is some talent and many games are close.

 

Baseball is a game of frustrations and letdowns, and that's from a player's perspective. The same rings true for fans of this great game. It's not "fun" getting frustrated watching this team more often than we hoped, but I, for one, still enjoyed watching the Sox, this year, especially the younger players, but also vets like JT, Martin and others for stretches.

 

Not every team trying to make the playoffs makes them. A handful or so misses out, each season. It sucks that we were one of those left out in 2 of the last 3 years, but at least our future looks brighter than it did in 2019.

[Larry Cook]

Winning certainly makes watching more enjoyable, but the game is fun to watch, for me as long as there is some talent and many games are close.

 

Baseball is a game of frustrations and letdowns, and that's from a player's perspective. The same rings true for fans of this great game. It's not "fun" getting frustrated watching this team more often than we hoped, but I, for one, still enjoyed watching the Sox, this year, especially the younger players, but also vets like JT, Martin and others for stretches.

 

Not every team trying to make the playoffs makes them. A handful or so misses out, each season. It sucks that we were one of those left out in 2 of the last 3 years, but at least our future looks brighter than it did in 2019.

 

Is this post a snide way of pointing out Hang’em Chaim’s short comings????

[notin]

jad and 5 Gloves say they enjoyed 2019. Take it up with them.

 

 

I didn’t see jad respond at all, and 5Gold just said he liked the 2019 team more than the 2022 and 2023 teams. But that doesn’t have to mean he enjoyed that team…

[moonslav59]

Is this post a snide way of pointing out Hang’em Chaim’s short comings????

 

It wasn't meant to be, but sure, I'd have enjoyed watching more had we won more the last couple years or gone further in 2021.

 

I really did enjoy watching this season and even more than last season. I like watching baseball. There was a lot of good things to see, especially if you look for it.

[Bellhorn04]

I didn’t see jad respond at all, and 5Gold just said he liked the 2019 team more than the 2022 and 2023 teams. But that doesn’t have to mean he enjoyed that team…

 

The 2019 team was the 2018 team, one year removed in time. It wasn't a bad team, it was a team that had a bad year. Many things went wrong. I do think there are reasons no team has won it back to back this century.