Time For the Hypo Trade Talks to Begin ?

[notin]

I’d like to see 1b, RP and a RF. I have my doubts they fill all three. A lot probably depends on the recovery of Kike…

[redsoxrules]

Soto is apparently seeking a 500MIL contract

[moonslav59]

Soto is apparently seeking a 500MIL contract

 

Yes, let's pay that and give up the entire farm to get him.

 

Worse, let's trade away the entire farm, then watch Soto walk.

[Larry Cook]

Yes, let's pay that and give up the entire farm to get him.

 

Worse, let's trade away the entire farm, then watch Soto walk.

 

I would hope Hang’em Chaim would not trade the cream of the minor league system without having a deal for an extension in place!

[moonslav59]

I would hope Hang’em Chaim would not trade the cream of the minor league system without having a deal for an extension in place!

 

So, you are for giving away the whole farm, and I mean everybody who is anybody, and then pay so much money to extend him that we end up like the Angels with Trout and 2-3 helpers, but nothing more?

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

The Red Sox are OVER the first tax threshold for 2022. They're at 241.8, the threshold is 230.

 

Anyway, Fred Lynn is talking nonsense.

 

242 million doesn't buy what it used to. That damn inflation.

[notin]

Soto is apparently seeking a 500MIL contract

 

Big deal. So am I. Doesn’t mean either of us will get it…

[notin]

So, you are for giving away the whole farm, and I mean everybody who is anybody, and then pay so much money to extend him that we end up like the Angels with Trout and 2-3 helpers, but nothing more?

 

Hold the farm. Extend Devers.

 

Let Soto go elsewhere.

 

Trading for and extending Soto means no Devers extension. And Devers + whatever it takes to get Soto > Soto…

[SPLENDIDSPLINTER]

Big deal. So am I. Doesn’t mean either of us will get it…

 

Who's your agent? It better be Boreass.

[moonslav59]

Hold the farm. Extend Devers.

 

Let Soto go elsewhere.

 

Trading for and extending Soto means no Devers extension. And Devers + whatever it takes to get Soto > Soto…

 

Yes. I am not for trading the moon for Soto.

 

I am for giving the moon contract to Devers. (No prospects lost.)

[Larry Cook]

Yes. I am not for trading the moon for Soto.

 

I am for giving the moon contract to Devers. (No prospects lost.)

 

And why can’t we have both Soto and devers. Something like 100 million leaves our payroll this offseason.

[moonslav59]

And why can’t we have both Soto and devers. Something like 100 million leaves our payroll this offseason.

 

We can, but we'd have nothing else on the team. Those two might take up 25-30% of the whole player budget for 10 years.

 

We'd be worse than the Angels.

[moonslav59]

For argument's sake, let's say we are full sellers at the deadline. I'm not saying we will be out of it. I'm not throwing in the towel. I'm just exploring the hypothetical:

 

Trade:

Bogey

Eovaldi

Wacha

JD

Kike

Vaz

Hill

Strahm

Plawecki

 

Not counting who we get in return who might be ML ready, this could be the 26 man roster after the 9 free agent-so-be are traded and Diekman & JBJ are DFA'd.

 

SP: Pivetta, Sale, Winckowski, Crawford, Bello

RP: Houck, Whitlock, Schreiber, Sawamura, Brasier, Davis, Mata, German

C: Wong, RHernandez

1B: Dalbec (Casas?)

2B: Story

SS: Downs, Arroyo

3B: Devers

LF: Verdugo

CF: Duran

RF: Refsnyder

DH: Cordero

 

14 others on the 40 (not counting trade additions):

P: Seabold, Danish, Ort, Groome, DHern, Ort, Valdez (Maybe add German & Murphy)

OF: Stewart, Sanchez, Fitzy, J Davis (Maybe Grullon or Cottam)

 

[Kimmi]

Sox would be a thousand times smarter to just meet Devers’ demands without even negotiating than to trade Soto.

 

On BTV, the Sox can’t even trade for Soto without including Devers, which actually makes no sense for the Nationals. (A third team needs to be involved.)

 

100%

 

If the Sox are going to give out that type of contract, extending Devers would make so much more sense, the biggest reason of which is to save the farm.

[oldtimer]

For argument's sake, let's say we are full sellers at the deadline. I'm not saying we will be out of it. I'm not throwing in the towel. I'm just exploring the hypothetical:

 

Trade:

Bogey

Eovaldi

Wacha

JD

Kike

Vaz

Hill

Strahm

Plawecki

 

Not counting who we get in return who might be ML ready, this could be the 26 man roster after the 9 free agent-so-be are traded and Diekman & JBJ are DFA'd.

 

SP: Pivetta, Sale, Winckowski, Crawford, Bello

RP: Houck, Whitlock, Schreiber, Sawamura, Brasier, Davis, Mata, German

C: Wong, RHernandez

1B: Dalbec (Casas?)

2B: Story

SS: Downs, Arroyo

3B: Devers

LF: Verdugo

CF: Duran

RF: Refsnyder

DH: Cordero

 

14 others on the 40 (not counting trade additions):

P: Seabold, Danish, Ort, Groome, DHern, Ort, Valdez (Maybe add German & Murphy)

OF: Stewart, Sanchez, Fitzy, J Davis (Maybe Grullon or Cottam)

 

 

Who knows if we become sellers? None of us do at this point as we are on the edge of selling. Of your list of field players I would suggest that we currently have 5 ML quality players on the roster, and 6 when Story returns. (JDM, Bogey, Devers, Verdugo and Vazquez). My view is that Kike has been marginal this year so I didn't include him.

 

I don't think we intent to extend JDM again so he could be traded as he won't be back next year anyway.

 

With Bogey, i posited that he might be a player to keep on the roster to help us with the Devers negotiation. If he would be willing to switch to 2nd base and do some DH, I could see a contract extension. Could we pay him enough to keep him? I don't know, but he is an important part of the team and we should try to keep him.

 

Vaz is a serviceable catcher who likes Boston. There aren't a lot of guys with as much talent out there. I know you have pointed out his defense is not top line, but if we want to maintain our competitiveness going forward, I would try to keep him.

 

Devers is a must keep and lets hope we can do it without venturing into Sotoland. No player is worth what he is asking.

 

Dugo is a serviceable outfielder on a team without a lot of strength in that position. I don't think we get enough for him to make it worth selling.

 

Story is our SS of the near future and I would keep him.

 

Other field players on our current roster are not people I would protect as I don't see them as a long term answer. I doubt we would get much for the lot.

[notin]

Who knows if we become sellers? None of us do at this point as we are on the edge of selling. Of your list of field players I would suggest that we currently have 5 ML quality players on the roster, and 6 when Story returns. (JDM, Bogey, Devers, Verdugo and Vazquez). My view is that Kike has been marginal this year so I didn't include him.

 

I don't think we intent to extend JDM again so he could be traded as he won't be back next year anyway.

 

With Bogey, i posited that he might be a player to keep on the roster to help us with the Devers negotiation. If he would be willing to switch to 2nd base and do some DH, I could see a contract extension. Could we pay him enough to keep him? I don't know, but he is an important part of the team and we should try to keep him.

 

Vaz is a serviceable catcher who likes Boston. There aren't a lot of guys with as much talent out there. I know you have pointed out his defense is not top line, but if we want to maintain our competitiveness going forward, I would try to keep him.

 

Devers is a must keep and lets hope we can do it without venturing into Sotoland. No player is worth what he is asking.

 

Dugo is a serviceable outfielder on a team without a lot of strength in that position. I don't think we get enough for him to make it worth selling.

 

Story is our SS of the near future and I would keep him.

 

Other field players on our current roster are not people I would protect as I don't see them as a long term answer. I doubt we would get much for the lot.

 

The Sox are one game out of a wild card and just got Eovaldi and Sale back and people still think this team needs to sell?

[Larry Cook]

The Sox are one game out of a wild card and just got Eovaldi and Sale back and people still think this team needs to sell?

 

Sale’s injury looked really ugly today! However, we got Whitlock back as well!

 

The real question is do we move bogey before the trade deadline. Is something better than nothing?

[Hitch]

The Sox are one game out of a wild card and just got Eovaldi and Sale back and people still think this team needs to sell?

 

Not that it needs to, but that it's a possibility. Are you not seeing the way we're playing at the moment?

[Fan_since_Boggs]

With Sale's injury (I'm assuming he is out for the rest of the season) I think the Red Sox should be sellers at the trade deadline. If they can't see where this is going, they are totally blind. The other problem: the Red Sox have so many holes for next season. Their OF is in complete disarray with no clear plan. They have nothing at 1b. Bogaerts is a free agent. They need a catcher. They need a DH. I would use the trade deadline as a way to fill a few of these holes to reduce the burden during the offseason. Eavoldi should definitely be traded--he might bring back a quality AAA OF who can start next season in the major leagues. I would shop Bogaerts as well. Shop Vazquez (the Mets?). No one is going to want Verdugo, a non-tender candidate for next season. I would trade away JD Martinez to any team that needs a DH.

 

Interestingly, the Red Sox have a lot of pieces that no one will want. No one is trading for Verdugo, no one is trading for Bradley. No one wants Arroyo, no one wants Dalbec and no one wants Cordero. The Red Sox have a lot of crappy players on their roster.

 

Maybe the Red Sox could trade a bullpen piece, but I would obviously keep Houck and Whitlock.

 

Oh, that's right, Wacha and Hill -- shop them at the deadline.

Edited July 17, 2022 by Fan_since_Boggs

[Larry Cook]

How long a broken pinky take to heal? 6 weeks?

[notin]

Not that it needs to, but that it's a possibility. Are you not seeing the way we're playing at the moment?

 

Yes.

 

Are you going to continue to forget that we’ve been using Worcester’s rotation?

 

The Sox shouldn’t give up on a 6 month season because of two bad weeks…

[Larry Cook]

Yes.

 

Are you going to continue to forget that we’ve been using Worcester’s rotation?

 

The Sox shouldn’t give up on a 6 month season because of two bad weeks…

 

One game at a time.

[notin]

With Sale's injury (I'm assuming he is out for the rest of the season) I think the Red Sox should be sellers at the trade deadline. If they can't see where this is going, they are totally blind. The other problem: the Red Sox have so many holes for next season. Their OF is in complete disarray with no clear plan. They have nothing at 1b. Bogaerts is a free agent. They need a catcher. They need a DH. I would use the trade deadline as a way to fill a few of these holes to reduce the burden during the offseason. Eavoldi should definitely be traded--he might bring back a quality AAA OF who can start next season in the major leagues. I would shop Bogaerts as well. Shop Vazquez (the Mets?). No one is going to want Verdugo, a non-tender candidate for next season. I would trade away JD Martinez to any team that needs a DH.

 

Interestingly, the Red Sox have a lot of pieces that no one will want. No one is trading for Verdugo, no one is trading for Bradley. No one wants Arroyo, no one wants Dalbec and no one wants Cordero. The Red Sox have a lot of crappy players on their roster.

 

Maybe the Red Sox could trade a bullpen piece, but I would obviously keep Houck and Whitlock.

 

Oh, that's right, Wacha and Hill -- shop them at the deadline.

 

Seriously? If you think 26yo Verdugo - who makes $3.5 mill and might be looking at $5-6mill is a non-tender candidate, not sure what to say. Especially after advocating for a AAA outfielder…

[moonslav59]

Verdugo is not going to be non tendered, but he may be traded.

 

Next season’s team might be unrecognisable… not that this might be a bad thing.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Seriously? If you think 26yo Verdugo - who makes $3.5 mill and might be looking at $5-6mill is a non-tender candidate, not sure what to say. Especially after advocating for a AAA outfielder…

 

I know, you love Verdugo, you say it everywhere about how he is going to be great when there are no shifts. But the Red Sox have two LFs, Verdugo and Duran, and the latter is a less expensive option. If the Red Sox can trade Verdugo, trade him, but I don't think teams are going to be knocking down the door to trade for Verdugo, a guy who doesn't play great defense and has an 87 OPS+. In trading for an OF, the Red Sox need to find a starting CF (for 2023) and a starting RF (for 2023), they already have an inexpensive option for LF for next season (Duran).

Edited July 17, 2022 by Fan_since_Boggs

[Bellhorn04]

Verdugo is not going to be non tendered, but he may be traded.

 

Next season’s team might be unrecognisable… not that this might be a bad thing.

 

I doubt he'll be traded. He's affordable and he's a decent player.

 

As you say, Bloom will have plenty of other things to keep him busy.

[Bellhorn04]

I know, you love Verdugo, you say it everywhere about how he is going to be great when there are no shifts. But the Red Sox have two LFs, Verdugo and Duran, and the latter is a less expensive option. If the Red Sox can trade Verdugo, trade him, but I don't think teams are going to be knocking down the door to trade for Verdugo, a guy who doesn't play great defense and has an 87 OPS+. In trading for an OF, the Red Sox need to find a starting CF (for 2023) and a starting RF (for 2023), they already have an inexpensive option for LF for next season (Duran).

 

Verdugo has at least proven he can hit major league pitching. He has a career OPS of .767.

 

Duran has not proven he can hit major league pitching.

[notin]

I know, you love Verdugo, you say it everywhere about how he is going to be great when there are no shifts. But the Red Sox have two LFs, Verdugo and Duran, and the latter is a less expensive option. If the Red Sox can trade Verdugo, trade him, but I don't think teams are going to be knocking down the door to trade for Verdugo, a guy who doesn't play great defense and has an 87 OPS+. In trading for an OF, the Red Sox need to find a starting CF (for 2023) and a starting RF (for 2023), they already have an inexpensive option for LF for next season (Duran).

 

Even if you think Duran is in LF, there is still a massive gray area between “not starting” and “non-tender candidate”…

[notin]

I doubt he'll be traded. He's affordable and he's a decent player.

 

As you say, Bloom will have plenty of other things to keep him busy.

 

 

I doubt Verdugo goes anywhere.

 

He’s also only 26. You don’t give up on a 26yo putting up respectable numbers…

[jacksonianmarch]

Verdugo has been really weird this year. With most players sacrificing contact for power, Dugo is going the other way. 10% K rate is way better than his prior history. But he’s sacrificed power and his BABIP plummeted, essentially noting that while he’s making better contact, he not making harder contact. If I’m Bloom, I have him work with the hitting coaches in the off-season to add some loft to his swing and sacrifice some of that contact