Fire Bloom .

[notin]

If I got confused by Song, books and movies connected to the military, maybe Dombrowski did, too. Dave and I certainly both remember how good Song looked in an amateur tournament back when he was Red Sox property all these years ago now...

 

... but is it possible that Dombro, replaced in Beantown by younger analytics people (some of whom he ignored or refused to work with), has actually found some loophole that allows Song to become a Phillies pitcher that Bloom and his nerds missed? It's at least ironic.

 

There’s no loophole. He took him in the Rule 5 draft.

 

Dombrowski clearly likes Song. He drafted him before.

 

The reason you never see players drafted in Rule 5 from the Military List is Rule 5 players are too often in AA and AAA and still playing. They’re usually close enough to MLB that hoping they stick for one year isn’t such a gamble. Teams rarely take active A ball players. Taking inactive Military List is unheard of. Would you draft a pitcher who had only pitched in A ball four years ago and not since. Heck, unlike Ward, I don’t even blame Bloom for not protecting him; Song is the highest risk if taken.

 

But it makes more sense for both sides if a trade or other arrangement gets worked out…

[moonslav59]

Would this highly unlikely change of events call off the fire bloom brigade?

 

Sign Carlos Correa

 

Trade Dugo for Urquidy

 

Trade Mayer, Wong, Duran and Dalbec for Sean Murphy and Ramon Laureano

 

1. Yoshida LF

2. Story 2B

3. Devers 3B

4. Correa SS

5. Murphy C

6. Casas 1B

7. Kike CF

8. Laureano RF

9. Hosmer/Refsnyder/Arroyo DH

 

SP: Sale, Whitlock, Bello, Urquidy, Pivetta (Paxton, Crawford, Winckowski, Seabold. Walter)

RP: Jansen, Martin, Houck, Schreiber, Barnes, Joely, Taylor, Brasier (Kelly, German, Mata, Murphy)

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

Would this highly unlikely change of events call off the fire bloom brigade?

 

Sign Carlos Correa

 

Trade Dugo for Urquidy

 

Trade Mayer, Wong, Duran and Dalbec for Sean Murphy and Ramon Laureano

 

1. Yoshida LF

2. Story 2B

3. Devers 3B

4. Correa SS

5. Murphy C

6. Casas 1B

7. Kike CF

8. Laureano RF

9. Hosmer/Refsnyder/Arroyo DH

 

SP: Sale, Whitlock, Bello, Urquidy, Pivetta (Paxton, Crawford, Winckowski, Seabold. Walter)

RP: Jansen, Martin, Houck, Schreiber, Barnes, Joely, Taylor, Brasier (Kelly, German, Mata, Murphy)

 

 

Or, trade Mayer, Dalbec & Walter to KC for Brady Singer & Michael Taylor

[Bellhorn04]

Would this highly unlikely change of events call off the fire bloom brigade?

 

Sign Carlos Correa

 

Trade Dugo for Urquidy

 

Trade Mayer, Wong, Duran and Dalbec for Sean Murphy and Ramon Laureano

 

1. Yoshida LF

2. Story 2B

3. Devers 3B

4. Correa SS

5. Murphy C

6. Casas 1B

7. Kike CF

8. Laureano RF

9. Hosmer/Refsnyder/Arroyo DH

 

SP: Sale, Whitlock, Bello, Urquidy, Pivetta (Paxton, Crawford, Winckowski, Seabold. Walter)

RP: Jansen, Martin, Houck, Schreiber, Barnes, Joely, Taylor, Brasier (Kelly, German, Mata, Murphy)

 

 

 

 

Nothing wrong with a little dreaming in life.

[Tedballgame]

would this highly unlikely change of events call off the fire bloom brigade?

 

Sign carlos correa

 

trade dugo for urquidy

 

trade mayer, wong, duran and dalbec for sean murphy and ramon laureano

 

1. Yoshida lf

2. Story 2b

3. Devers 3b

4. Correa ss

5. Murphy c

6. Casas 1b

7. Kike cf

8. Laureano rf

9. Hosmer/refsnyder/arroyo dh

 

sp: Sale, whitlock, bello, urquidy, pivetta (paxton, crawford, winckowski, seabold. Walter)

rp: Jansen, martin, houck, schreiber, barnes, joely, taylor, brasier (kelly, german, mata, murphy)

 

 

 

 

do not trade marcello mayer!!!!!!!!

[a700hitter]

Nothing wrong with a little dreaming in life.

I am lost trying to figure out Bloom’s strategy. I think that he is still reeling from having lost out on his #1 target Abreu. He seems to be aimless.

[moonslav59]

Nothing wrong with a little dreaming in life.

 

It's likely something DD would do (and also trade away Bleis, Rafaela & Mata), but in a few years from now, we'd be right back where we are, now.

 

Dream, now: nightmare, later.

[moonslav59]

do not trade marcello mayer!!!!!!!!

 

I'm with you (and Bloom.) I'm for sustainable winning and not building just windows.

 

That takes time and patience.

[moonslav59]

I am lost trying to figure out Bloom’s strategy. I think that he is still reeling from having lost out on his #1 target Abreu. He seems to be aimless.

 

It seems very obvious to me.

 

Don't confuse not understanding long term planning with not liking it.

[Old Red]

Bloom The Rapper!

 

My name is Chaim, and I have no shame in Botching up the game.

My last names Bloom, and I bring Gloom, and Doom.

Some say it’s all not so much funny

But don’t blame me I’m just Henry’s Dummy.

[a700hitter]

It seems very obvious to me.

 

Don't confuse not understanding long term planning with not liking it.

Explain it to me. Does he have a plan to add any starting pitching… and who are the likely targets?

 

Is he going to sign one of the shortstops or go with Story at SS and move Kike to 2B.

 

Is he going to add any bats? I think he needs 2. He needs 1 OF — 2 if Kike moves to 2B.

 

Are we set at catcher?

[notin]

do not trade marcello mayer!!!!!!!!

 

Unless they do something surprising like sign Correa, Mayer is not going anywhere this off-season. Although next possession, when he’s closer to MLB, and if Mikey Romero stays the course and continues to impress, maybe then…

[Bellhorn04]

It seems very obvious to me.

 

Don't confuse not understanding long term planning with not liking it.

 

That's fine, but they also said the aim was to compete every year.

[a700hitter]

Bloom The Rapper!

 

My name is Chaim, and I have no shame in Botching up the game.

My last names Bloom, and I bring Gloom, and Doom.

Some say it’s all not so much funny

But don’t blame me I’m just Henry’s Dummy.

He would have more success as a rapper. He could corner the Orthodox Jewish rapper market— he’d have weddings and Bar Mitzvahs booked for the next decade.

[Old Red]

That's fine, but they also said the aim was to compete every year.

 

After the Bogey spin, and grin is anyone going to believe anything they say anymore?

[notin]

Explain it to me. Does he have a plan to add any starting pitching… and who are the likely targets?

 

Is he going to sign one of the shortstops or go with Story at SS and move Kike to 2B.

 

Is he going to add any bats? I think he needs 2. He needs 1 OF — 2 if Kike moves to 2B.

 

Are we set at catcher?

 

I’m sure they will add starting pitching. (Or bullpen and push someone into the rotation.) It’s only December 11. That’s lots of time and options left. I don’t think they ever had a chance at deGrom or Verlander. We’ll see what is on the agenda, but I suspect more short term deals.

 

Catcher? Occasional rumors persist. Nothing too believable. Also DH IMO could use some oomph…

[notin]

After the Bogey spin, and grin is anyone going to believe anything they say anymore?

 

Does it really make a difference to you? You’ve already made up tor mind on what you’re going to believe and what you’re not anyway…

[Old Red]

Does it really make a difference to you? You’ve already made up tor mind on what you’re going to believe and what you’re not anyway…

 

At least I didn’t believe like you did that the Bogey camp should have countered the Red Sox generous offer last offseason. It was laughable then, and if possible even more laughable now. I suppose the Red Sox should have countered the last San Diego offer too. Wow!

[moonslav59]

Explain it to me. Does he have a plan to add any starting pitching… and who are the likely targets?

 

Is he going to sign one of the shortstops or go with Story at SS and move Kike to 2B.

 

Is he going to add any bats? I think he needs 2. He needs 1 OF — 2 if Kike moves to 2B.

 

Are we set at catcher?

 

His plan is to build up a foundation to support and extended and consistently winning team, and that may not happen soon enough for you and many fans. I'm not happy watching us lose, either, but I see a very clear and obvious plan that does not involve getting studs at every position at the expense of the long term- like DD did.

 

I get it. You and many hate this plan. Bloom could, if JH allowed it, trade away Mayer, Bleis, Yorke, Mata, Rafaela, and fill all those major need areas you just mentioned and create a team you and all of us would be very excited about, but we'd be where we are no in 3-5 years, once again.

 

Again, you may not like the plan, but to me, it is very clear and understandable.

 

To answer your specific questions, here is my take:

 

SS: we sign someone like Andrus or Segura (Story to SS for one year) as a bridge to Mayer. Totally fits into the clear plan.

 

C: we add a non splash catcher (Vaz or via trade) of go with McGuire and Wong and see if one plays into our longer term plans (Hickey might be long term solution)

 

Big bat: I agree, Yoshida is not enough, even for an apparent "bridge season." Maybe we sign Conforto and Gallo and pray. Both will likely get one year deals, so this, too, plays into the "plan."

 

Last, but most importantly, IMO, is SP. We have $40M, but who is left? Rodon, Bassitt, Nate and Kluber + Wacha. I don't think any fit into what I see is the "plan," but maybe this is the one area we just bite the bullet and hope whoever we add is still productive in 2024 and beyond.

 

I'm not happy that it looks like we are punting to 2024. I have said and thought this winter was the time we can make the push, "Bloom's legacy moment," and I'm not happy, overall, with what has happened, so far, but there is still $40M to spend, and we could choose to reset, next year.

 

A Devers extension and solid pitcher addition would get me closer to thinking we have taken another step forward towards the plan of sustainable and long term winning based on constant farm infusions and targeted FA signings, when needed.

 

On paper, it's a good plan, but it might take more time than any of us wanted to see it come true. It may never come true, as well.

 

Notice hos the best prospects Bloom has traded in 3 years are Aldo Ramirez and Jay Groome. Compare them to who we have added and the ones we kept, like Houck, Casas, Bello, Mata, Walter, Rafaela, Perales and Paulino to what DD did, and you can see a major shift in philosophy and "plans." Again, you might not like this plan, but I think it's clear the farm became the top priority, and not as a mechanism to trade for studs.

 

 

 

[moonslav59]

That's fine, but they also said the aim was to compete every year.

 

I don't think that was a lie, but I don't think it meant compete for a ring every year, either.

 

We were competitive in 2021, and IMO, Bloom made more moves for the good than bad before 2022, and more importantly we were better positioned for improvement after 2022 than after 2021- based mostly on having a bigger budget and having way more prospects becoming ML 5eady than 1-2 years ago.

 

They thought they were on a steady path towards longer term success while also building up the foundation of the current team to expect continued success. How many posters projected we'd miss the playoffs, this year, let alone finish last? We we liars, too? They and we said what we believed. Not many foresaw a significant decline by 90% of the returning vets that did not spend long times on the IL, nor did we foresee so many players being on the IL for long periods of time, except for maybe Sale & Paxton.

 

Bottom line: we failed in 2022. We can explain some reasons why, but I truly think the Sox top brass and most of us, thought we'd compete for the playoffs and maybe advance a round or two.

 

Maybe 2021 was a fluke or outlier, and we were never that good. Maybe they and we were fooled by their success, but I do think the depth of our 40 man roster has continually improved since 2020, and the amount of ML ready and near ML ready decent to very good prospects has grown to a level I have not seen in a very long time- maybe more in quantity than quality, but we do have a lot of promising young players, right now.

 

There was reason to be optimistic and make statements reflecting that optimism. Quite a few posters saw it differently, and the 2022 results only fed their frenzy. Maybe in the long run, they will end up being right. I hope not, but certainly much of the on paper success of Bloom's tenure may never materialize or won't to a level large enough to keep us competitive for an extended period of time.

 

I do think that has been the plan, all along, and that it was not a lie to say they wanted to try and be competitive along the way.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I'm ready for Segura, and let's add Brantley, too, for DH/LF (wherever Yoshida doesn't play that day). I don't care if he's a lefty -- why not just focus on changing the culture of big whiffers with affordable bat-to-ball hitters.

 

There just aren't many righty power bats available... and do we necessarily have to replace the 3-4 righty batters from a last place team? We have to assume the MLB will again use the mushballs -- except for its flagship franchise with kajillionaire figurehead in the Bronx.

 

And anyway, a lefty-laden lineup might benefit in no-shift 2023.

[moonslav59]

Does it really make a difference to you? You’ve already made up tor mind on what you’re going to believe and what you’re not anyway…

 

The funny thing is, it seemed Old Red used management quotes to support what he felt their ideas were than anyone here, so I can understand why he's more shaken than almost everyone else.

 

GMs lie or fudge more than just about anyone else in baseball.

 

How would saying, "We don't think Bogey is worth as much as other GMs and many fans think he is" going to work out?

 

They say what they think needs to be said, and many times it is disingenuous. Should we really be this surprised?

 

[moonslav59]

I'm ready for Segura, and let's add Brantley, too, for DH/LF (wherever Yoshida doesn't play that day). I don't care if he's a lefty -- why not just focus on changing the culture of big whiffers with affordable bat-to-ball hitters.

 

There just aren't many righty power bats available... and do we necessarily have to replace the 3-4 righty batters from a last place team? We have to assume the MLB will again use the mushballs -- except for its flagship franchise with kajillionaire figurehead in the Bronx.

 

And anyway, a lefty-laden lineup might benefit in no-shift 2023.

 

There are enough solid RH'd bats available via trade to help the line-up.

 

I do think our biggest two needs are a 1/2 SP'er and a 3-4-5 RH'd solid bat, preferably with HR power.

 

FAs is not the only way to spend $40M.

[notin]

I'm ready for Segura, and let's add Brantley, too, for DH/LF (wherever Yoshida doesn't play that day). I don't care if he's a lefty -- why not just focus on changing the culture of big whiffers with affordable bat-to-ball hitters.

 

There just aren't many righty power bats available... and do we necessarily have to replace the 3-4 righty batters from a last place team? We have to assume the MLB will again use the mushballs -- except for its flagship franchise with kajillionaire figurehead in the Bronx.

 

And anyway, a lefty-laden lineup might benefit in no-shift 2023.

 

Most of the best hitters in franchise history were lefties.

 

The thing is, the past few years there were so many strategies solely focused on getting lefties out. Have acsidesrming LHP in the bullpen who throws maybe 25 IP all year. Re-arrange the infield. All that is gone now. If teams suddenly exploit it, I’m all for it…

[Tedballgame]

Bloom needs to beat the bushes and find a Roy Hobbs.

[Tedballgame]

And Ricky Vaughn.

[notin]

And Ricky Vaughn.

 

He had a rough year in the California Penal League.

 

Nuke LaLoosh is the better bet. Or Steve Nebraska…

[Tedballgame]

He had a rough year in the California Penal League.

 

Nuke LaLoosh is the better bet. Or Steve Nebraska…

 

Steve Nebraska was better than Ohtani

[notin]

Kluber says he’s in.

 

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10016948-corey-kluber-eyes-red-sox-in-2022-mlb-free-agency-theyre-well-aware-of-how-i-feel

 

 

Of course he says that to Boston every year…

[notin]

Steve Nebraska was better than Ohtani

 

 

But LaLoosh was in the much, much better movie. And let’s not forget John “Blackout” Gatling, both inspired by and played by Brad “the Animal” Lesley…