Fire Bloom .

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Blooms huge mistake was not trading Bogaerts, J.D., Nate and Wacha at the deadline. He could have got something for all of those guys. He listened to the fans who wanted the Sox to go for the playoffs. As a very smart coach once said, "If you listen to the fans, pretty soon you will be up there with them."

 

Bloom wouldn't survive in the stands surrounded by fans.

 

On second thought, the crowd won't be big enough anymore to hurt him, and they can't afford enough overpriced beer or franks to do damage.

[moonslav59]

They were only 3 games out, so I understand why.

 

IMHO the real problem now is crystal clear - it's Johnny Lowball and Tommy Tightwad.

 

I can't agree, except on the lowball part of the big picture.

 

2023 expenditures:

 

$90M/5 Yoshida

$32M/2 Jansen

$17.5M/2 Martin

$10M/1 Kike

$2M/1 Joely

 

That's $152M and $53.5 AAV. That's Bogey + Nimmo AAV money. We just spent it differently.

 

[Tedballgame]

And lets not forget one of Bloom's biggest mistakes, he let Schwarber walk. The NL home run champion. He could have dumped J.D. last off season and signed Schwarber. And then there is the Hunter Renfroe/JBJ trade. What a joke that was.

[Tedballgame]

At least Bloom didn't get suckered into signing Nimmo. The guy has only played more than 100 games twice in his career. Mets are idiots.

[moonslav59]

I think JH has lost it, I really do.

 

Didn't he say something about learning from the mistakes they made with Lester?

 

What a joke that turns out to be.

 

Many owners and GM make more than 2 or 3 big mistakes. The fact that all of them have been within 3 years with a Devers calamity pending, I get your point.

 

Many of us saw tough times coming. JH did, too. That's one reason he hired Bloom and set building up the farm and 40 man depth/foundation as the goal (IMO).

 

In that context, none of this should be shocking. Upsetting, maybe, if you don't share the view or think they are overplaying that priority, but JH is still spending big. Since the CC and AGon deals, only Price was mega large and mega long, and that one bit him (and us) in the ass after 2018.

 

On paper, the farm looks much better. It's fair to say "what good is on paper," if we don't use it to win, but I think they are sticking to the long game plan, and in theory, it seems to be the best plan, IMO. Most of the consistently winning teams have strong and deep farms. We have just gotten to or close to that point, and this was supposed to be the winter we could maybe break out and move towards acquiring top quality vs decent quantity. I was all for at least some shift towards that idea. The Story and Yoshida signings kinda fit that shift, and getting two more than decent RP'ers was a must.

 

I'm feeling down, too, but I have not lost hope in "the plan," even if they won't articulate the exact plan to the fanbase. We have $43M to spend- maybe $40M and keep a buffer for the deadline.

 

We need 2-3 key additions and one could be by trade. All is not lost, just yet.

[moonslav59]

And lets not forget one of Bloom's biggest mistakes, he let Schwarber walk. The NL home run champion. He could have dumped J.D. last off season and signed Schwarber. And then there is the Hunter Renfroe/JBJ trade. What a joke that was.

 

He "let him walk?" Schwarber chose to leave.

 

Oh, and he also traded scraps to get Schwarber, too. Was that a "mistake?"

 

It's so easy to just pick out mistakes. Maybe we sign Schwarber and not Wacha, Hill and Strahm.

[moonslav59]

At least Bloom didn't get suckered into signing Nimmo. The guy has only played more than 100 games twice in his career. Mets are idiots.

 

It looks like 6-7 idiot teams are showing off.

[Old Red]

Bloom wouldn't survive in the stands surrounded by fans.

 

On second thought, the crowd won't be big enough anymore to hurt him, and they can't afford enough overpriced beer or franks to do damage.

 

If the Red Sox really wanted Bogey then the negotiations were BOTCHED from last offseason with that slap in the face offer. Yes we all know Henry writes the checks, but it was Bloom that made that ridiculous offer that some on here that it warranted a counter offer. What a joke on all points. On the other if the Red Sox were all spin, and grin, which I believe they were from the Mouth Kennedy, and Bloom they were downright liars. Like Kennedy said at last years year end they were all failures, and that sums it up the best, and that includes now. FAILURES, and Bogey deserved better from the Red Sox, and has done more for Boston in his time there than Bloom will ever do, or imagine.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

 

I'm feeling down, too, but I have not lost hope in "the plan," even if they won't articulate the exact plan to the fanbase. We have $43M to spend- maybe $40M and keep a buffer for the deadline.

 

We need 2-3 key additions and one could be by trade. All is not lost, just yet.

 

Ok, but no one can ignore the Devers in the room. What do you forsee as a solution? His situation needs to be clear one way or the other by Opening Day or he's a lame Raffy.

[Old Red]

I think JH has lost it, I really do.

 

Didn't he say something about learning from the mistakes they made with Lester?

 

What a joke that turns out to be.

At least he met Lester out in the parking lot to say goodbye.

[moonslav59]

If the Red Sox really wanted Bogey then the negotiations were BOTCHED from last offseason with that slap in the face offer. Yes we all know Henry writes the checks, but it was Bloom that made that ridiculous offer that some on here that it warranted a counter offer. What a joke on all points. On the other if the Red Sox were all spin, and grin, which I believe they were from the Mouth Kennedy, and Bloom they were downright liars. Like Kennedy said at last years year end they were all failures, and that sums it up the best, and that includes now. FAILURES, and Bogey deserved better from the Red Sox, and has done more for Boston in his time there than Bloom will ever do, or imagine.

 

Is it a lie to think they "wanted Bogey," but only at their price?

 

Again, I'm not defending the Sox top brass. I agree with you on them not ever wanting to pay Bogey what they knew he'd get, but that is technically not the same as not "wanting him."

 

Yes, they played games with the media and fans. They did not fool anybody- same with Lester, although I think their final and late offer fooled some fans into thinking they made an effort (not me.)

 

I think the picture is becoming clearer: Bloom is not "in over his head," the marionette strings are above his head. He has done a fine job shielding upper management from criticism, until now.

[moonslav59]

Ok, but no one can ignore the Devers in the room. What do you forsee as a solution? His situation needs to be clear one way or the other by Opening Day or he's a lame Raffy.

 

I'm all in on Devers Forevers, but if they are going to let him walk, trade him, this winter. They may be waiting to extend him, so the tax hit starts, next season. I'm thinking they have to know the public relations hit they'd take by losing him, even by trade. I really have to think they know another big hit could be very damaging to their bank account success.

 

I think they extend him, but my hopes are lessening.

Edited December 9, 2022 by moonslav59

[Old Red]

BLOOM THE BOTCHER. Enough said.

[moonslav59]

BLOOM THE BOTCHER. Enough said.

 

So, you think he talked JH & Co. out of extending Bogey?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

So, you think he talked JH & Co. out of extending Bogey?

 

It's just hard to imagine JH last spring, sitting on his yacht, thinking, "Screw Boras -- offer X one more year" ...

 

... and the front office agreeing, when everyone had to know the ramifications.

 

It would be as unbelievable as a president refusing to use the national guard to protect the government during a calamity, and everyone in the Pentagon nodding their heads.

[moonslav59]

It's just hard to imagine JH last spring, sitting on his yacht, thinking, "Screw Boras -- offer X one more year" ...

 

... and the front office agreeing, when everyone had to know the ramifications.

 

It would be as unbelievable as a president refusing to use the national guard to protect the government during a calamity, and everyone in the Pentagon nodding their heads.

 

LOL.

 

People can blame Bloom all they want on Bogey, but this was what JH & Co. wanted, or else he's still a Red Sox.

[sk7326]

LOL.

 

People can blame Bloom all they want on Bogey, but this was what JH & Co. wanted, or else he's still a Red Sox.

 

This. When you get to a certain $$ level, those are ownership calls. Extending Sale, letting Bogaerts walk - those are ownership calls.

[moonslav59]

This. When you get to a certain $$ level, those are ownership calls. Extending Sale, letting Bogaerts walk - those are ownership calls.

 

Now, I will say, I'm sure discussions took place that involved Bloom, and if it was a close call and Bloom was adamant about not extending him, then he would deserve some criticism, if you think Bogey was worth signing at about $160M/6, a year ago.

 

We will probably never know, but we do know Bloom did not have the final say on this, the Betts deal and the Story signing, too.

 

Hell, they may have even had to okay the Jansen and martin deals.

[Old Red]

It's just hard to imagine JH last spring, sitting on his yacht, thinking, "Screw Boras -- offer X one more year" ...

 

... and the front office agreeing, when everyone had to know the ramifications.

 

It would be as unbelievable as a president refusing to use the national guard to protect the government during a calamity, and everyone in the Pentagon nodding their heads.

 

Bloom, and Henry are both to blame. Failures the both of them. Bloom made the 1 yr offer. I repeat Bloom made the 1 year offer, and how incompetent did he look making it, and if that wasn’t bad enough he carried that charade right to the end with that dumb, dumbfounded look on his face at the airport in San Diego. What a piece of work he is.

[Tedballgame]

He "let him walk?" Schwarber chose to leave.

 

Oh, and he also traded scraps to get Schwarber, too. Was that a "mistake?"

 

It's so easy to just pick out mistakes. Maybe we sign Schwarber and not Wacha, Hill and Strahm.

 

I would much rather have had Schwarber than Wacha, Hill and Strahm.

[vjcsmoke]

Bloom, and Henry are both to blame. Failures the both of them. Bloom made the 1 yr offer. I repeat Bloom made the 1 year offer, and how incompetent did he look making it, and if that wasn’t bad enough he carried that charade right to the end with that dumb, dumbfounded look on his face at the airport in San Diego. What a piece of work he is.

 

A 1 year offer to one of your TOP players? That's just stupid and insulting. Any GM worth his salt would KNOW that offer would be rejected out of hand.

[vjcsmoke]

And lets not forget one of Bloom's biggest mistakes, he let Schwarber walk. The NL home run champion. He could have dumped J.D. last off season and signed Schwarber. And then there is the Hunter Renfroe/JBJ trade. What a joke that was.

 

Those moves certainly led to us having a JOKE of an outfield last season. These moves now are attempts to retcon those mistakes. But the damage is already done. We can only hope this team can be good enough going forward.

 

The last shoe is still to drop which is to see if the Red Sox management is STUPID enough to also let Devers walk.

[moonslav59]

Bloom, and Henry are both to blame. Failures the both of them. Bloom made the 1 yr offer. I repeat Bloom made the 1 year offer, and how incompetent did he look making it, and if that wasn’t bad enough he carried that charade right to the end with that dumb, dumbfounded look on his face at the airport in San Diego. What a piece of work he is.

 

I repeat, Bloom was told to make the one year offer.

[moonslav59]

I would much rather have had Schwarber than Wacha, Hill and Strahm.

 

Fair enough, but we don't do any better, this year with that swap, and the money total was still more for Schwarbs.

[notin]

And lets not forget one of Bloom's biggest mistakes, he let Schwarber walk. The NL home run champion. He could have dumped J.D. last off season and signed Schwarber. And then there is the Hunter Renfroe/JBJ trade. What a joke that was.

 

 

I don’t think he could have dumped JD Martinez so easily last off-season. $21mill was still a big AAV back then and teams rarely go that high for a DH because it’s not the toughest position to fill.

 

I wanted Schwarber back. But if - and I don’t really know this - the goal was to improve the defense, Schwarber is not a good outfielder, we saw he’s really not a good 1b (but credit him for the effort at a new position), and Martinez wasn’t going anywhere unless he chose to. Which he didn’t…

[moonslav59]

I don’t think he could have dumped JD Martinez so easily last off-season. $21mill was still a big AAV back then and teams rarely go that high for a DH because it’s not the toughest position to fill.

 

I wanted Schwarber back. But if - and I don’t really know this - the goal was to improve the defense, Schwarber is not a good outfielder, we saw he’s really not a good 1b (but credit him for the effort at a new position), and Martinez wasn’t going anywhere unless he chose to. Which he didn’t…

 

I think the idea was to trade JD and cash, but still, if we paid $12M of his deal, then add that to what Schwarber got.

[dgalehouse]

John Henry is Paul Winchell. Chaim Bloom is Knucklehead Smiff. Winchell has total control of everything Knucklehead says and does. So, don't blame Knucklehead . He is just a dummy.

[Tedballgame]

Fair enough, but we don't do any better, this year with that swap, and the money total was still more for Schwarbs.

 

But you can't find guys who can hit 40+ homers who are also good in the clubhouse and help other hitters by teaching them the strike zone. They don't grow on trees. The Sox could still have Schwarber to DH for 3 more years. They could have ate some of JD's money and sacrificed some defense for one year. Schwarber wouldn't have been worse than Franchy at first base.

[Tedballgame]

Xander Bogaerts wanted to re-sign with the Red Sox. But they made it impossible.

 

The Red Sox’ final reported offer to Bogaerts was a six-year deal worth roughly $160 million — well short of the Padres’ 11-year, $280 million deal.

 

Per WEEI. Ownership wouldn't spend the money. Depending on who else they spend it on and Marcelo Mayer, we will see how smart that was. I don't think Xander is going to be elite during the last 6 years of the deal. Padres will probably regret the deal but it certainly hurts the Sox in the short term and it hurts the brand. The Sox need to go back to being big spenders if they want to keep the fans engaged. I saw a lot of fans disguised as empty seats at Fenway all year.

[Tedballgame]

Devers=9 years/300 million