The 2021-2022 Offseason Thread

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

If he can't stay healthy at 22-26, what will he be like at 30-36?

 

Not as good as Mookie? Then again, we all knew that Boston would eventually spend big on someone not as good as Betts.

 

A question for the board: if not Correa, then who -- including any player in the majors, even those under contract -- is worth it? Would anyone prefer Lindor or Seager instead? If your answer is Soto or Franco, just remember, everyone will be available someday, either as a free agent or because his team can no longer afford to keep him... Is Trout already too old and already damaged goods to commit another decade of gold?

[Bellhorn04]

Not as good as Mookie? Then again, we all knew that Boston would eventually spend big on someone not as good as Betts.

 

A question for the board: if not Correa, then who -- including any player in the majors, even those under contract -- is worth it? Would anyone prefer Lindor or Seager instead? If your answer is Soto or Franco, just remember, everyone will be available someday, either as a free agent or because his team can no longer afford to keep him... Is Trout already too old and already damaged goods to commit another decade of gold?

 

Devers.

[moonslav59]

Not as good as Mookie? Then again, we all knew that Boston would eventually spend big on someone not as good as Betts.

 

A question for the board: if not Correa, then who -- including any player in the majors, even those under contract -- is worth it? Would anyone prefer Lindor or Seager instead? If your answer is Soto or Franco, just remember, everyone will be available someday, either as a free agent or because his team can no longer afford to keep him... Is Trout already too old and already damaged goods to commit another decade of gold?

 

I liked Baez, but he was not a $25M+ guy. He did get $140M/6, so it was close.

 

I'd say the next guy we sign large and long is Devers.

[mvp 78]

At some point, the Sox are going to have to spend, and spend heavily on a player. Correa may or may not be the guy, but it’s not like Bogaerts is going to “settle” for a $20mill AAV again.

 

I'm fine with 300M contracts, but not for Correa.

[mvp 78]

Devers.

 

^^^

[mvp 78]

Luis Robert

[moonslav59]

I'm fine with 300M contracts, but not for Correa.

 

Makes me think, if we couldn't or wouldn't offer Betts $300M, who is a better profile?

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Makes me think, if we couldn't or wouldn't offer Betts $300M, who is a better profile?

 

Marketing may dig Blaze Jordan: great name, 500-foot dingers... artists should already be busy designing iconic posters for bedroom doors all over New England.

 

But imagine the buzz if Nick Yorke comes up and delivers a big hit to beat the Yankees. Can you hear the Fenway organ playing the Sinatra walk-up song (with lyrics flashing on the scoreboard): Start spreading the blues... it's up to you, Nick Yorke, NICK... YORKE!!!

[Bellhorn04]

Makes me think, if we couldn't or wouldn't offer Betts $300M, who is a better profile?

 

??? We did offer Betts $300M.

[Old Red]

??? We did offer Betts $300M.

 

They did offer Betts $300M, but they already knew he wasn’t going to take it, so not really a legit offer.

[Bellhorn04]

They did offer Betts $300M, but they already knew he wasn’t going to take it, so not really a legit offer.

 

That's just speculation. If it's true that he countered with $420M, maybe that was the real problem.

[oldtimer]

That's just speculation. If it's true that he countered with $420M, maybe that was the real problem.

 

From what I read, Betts numbers are already falling off, perhaps due to his hip injury. I doubt he proves worth the kind of investment the Dodgers made ( $365 mil) let alone the trade value they gave up plus eating half of Price's contract. At $30 mil per year for 10 years, our offer was already more than generous.

[moonslav59]

??? We did offer Betts $300M.

 

It was a pretend offer.

[mvp 78]

Makes me think, if we couldn't or wouldn't offer Betts $300M, who is a better profile?

 

I can't speak for Sox ownership. I think Mookie was worth 300M. Not many in the league better than he was at the time he signed.

[mvp 78]

That's just speculation. If it's true that he countered with $420M, maybe that was the real problem.

 

And yet, he signed for somewhere in the middle. Like that's how negotiations work.

[mvp 78]

From what I read, Betts numbers are already falling off, perhaps due to his hip injury. I doubt he proves worth the kind of investment the Dodgers made ( $365 mil) let alone the trade value they gave up plus eating half of Price's contract. At $30 mil per year for 10 years, our offer was already more than generous.

 

He was injured last season. Guys don't typically drop off at 28. Maybe the rest of his career is marred by injury, maybe this was just a blip?

 

Even for falling off, he had a 3.9 fWAR season.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

From what I read, Betts numbers are already falling off, perhaps due to his hip injury. I doubt he proves worth the kind of investment the Dodgers made ( $365 mil) let alone the trade value they gave up plus eating half of Price's contract. At $30 mil per year for 10 years, our offer was already more than generous.

 

The question persists: who will be a better investment? Harper? Machado? (neither were better all-around players than Betts at the time of signing...)

 

Some of us might not be around another decade from now to find out. In the meantime, the Sox will most likely spend big on someone else... as they have since the first days of free agency and Soup Campbell.

[mvp 78]

Betts 2021:

 

131 WRC+

6th in RF fWAR

 

If he gets his speed back next season, he'll put up numbers like he used to (2018 may be that "career year" though).

 

He would have been top 3 for the Sox and was more valuable than Verdugo and Renfore combined.

[moonslav59]

The question persists: who will be a better investment? Harper? Machado? (neither were better all-around players than Betts at the time of signing...)

 

Some of us might not be around another decade from now to find out. In the meantime, the Sox will most likely spend big on someone else... as they have since the first days of free agency and Soup Campbell.

 

Who will be FAs, next winter?

 

I think Judge is, but any other big names? DeGrom and Bogey have opt outs.

 

How about 2024?

[mvp 78]

The question persists: who will be a better investment? Harper? Machado? (neither were better all-around players than Betts at the time of signing...)

 

Some of us might not be around another decade from now to find out. In the meantime, the Sox will most likely spend big on someone else... as they have since the first days of free agency and Soup Campbell.

 

I think Harper is a little overrated due to his 2015 season at age 22. Since then, his only great season was last year at 6.6 fWAR. His in a tier below Betts IMO. Manny is probably in the Harper tier if not a tier below that.

 

Guys who would be in the Mookie tier:

Trout

Vlad Jr

Soto

Jose Ramirez

Tatis

Judge if he stays healthy

Ohtani

Acuna

 

Guys that could get there:

Bo Bichette

Wander

[mvp 78]

Who will be FAs, next winter?

 

I think Judge is, but any other big names? DeGrom and Bogey have opt outs.

 

How about 2024?

 

They could also go the trade route to get a big name rather than relying on FA's.

 

Pedro

Schilling

Beckett

AGon

Sale

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

Who will be FAs, next winter?

 

I think Judge is, but any other big names? DeGrom and Bogey have opt outs.

 

How about 2024?

 

Maybe Judge will look at Boston as a "can't-beat-em, join-em" scenario. But not judging by the Judge Cam that follows him around on every nationally-broadcast game; I've never seen so many sour scowls than on the Judge Cam in the '21 Wild Card game.

[Bellhorn04]

It was a pretend offer.

 

Pure speculation based on nothing.

 

We already know that Mookie came close to accepting a previous offer for a lower amount, so there's nothing to suggest the Sox weren't bargaining in good faith.

[Bellhorn04]

And yet, he signed for somewhere in the middle. Like that's how negotiations work.

 

That horse is dead.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I think Harper is a little overrated due to his 2015 season at age 22. Since then, his only great season was last year at 6.6 fWAR. His in a tier below Betts IMO. Manny is probably in the Harper tier if not a tier below that.

 

Guys who would be in the Mookie tier:

Trout

Vlad Jr

Soto

Jose Ramirez

Tatis

Judge if he stays healthy

Ohtani

Acuna

 

Guys that could get there:

Bo Bichette

Wander

 

Staying healthy is what will determine everything. So best bets may be the youngest with body type most suitable longterm (not too slight, not too wide): Soto... Acuna and Tatis have already been injured. Ohtani also has the physique, but not for double duty...

[notin]

Pure speculation based on nothing.

 

We already know that Mookie came close to accepting a previous offer for a lower amount, so there's nothing to suggest the Sox weren't bargaining in good faith.

 

 

I agree. $300 million is a pretty steep offer to float out there if you don’t mean it…

[mvp 78]

Maybe Judge will look at Boston as a "can't-beat-em, join-em" scenario. But not judging by the Judge Cam that follows him around on every nationally-broadcast game; I've never seen so many sour scowls than on the Judge Cam in the '21 Wild Card game.

 

And there is a very famous picture of him wearing a Sox tshirt in high school.

[mvp 78]

That horse is dead.

 

Yes, it would have been nicer if the conversation didn't head in that direction AGAIN.

[mvp 78]

Staying healthy is what will determine everything. So best bets may be the youngest with body type most suitable longterm (not too slight, not too wide): Soto... Acuna and Tatis have already been injured. Ohtani also has the physique, but not for double duty...

 

I think expecting ZERO injuries is foolhardy. You just don't want the injuries to become chronic.

[Old Red]

That's just speculation. If it's true that he countered with $420M, maybe that was the real problem.

 

The Red Sox knew he wouldn’t sign for $300M, and Mookie knew the Sox weren’t going any higher, so call it what you want, but either way Mookie was getting out of Boston, and did,