2020 Trade Deadline

[harmony]

That’s because “rebuilding” is ownerspeak for “saving money”. The chances of a rebuild putting together anything but a bad team even long term are historically very high...

Seattle's "reimagining" rebuild after an 89-win season in 2018 was about long-term prospects, not about "saving money."

 

The strategy may fall flat for the cursed franchise but some early returns are encouraging.

[notin]

Seattle's "reimagining" rebuild after an 89-win season in 2018 was about long-term prospects, not about "saving money."

 

The strategy may fall flat for the cursed franchise but some early returns are encouraging.

 

The baseball aspect might fall flat, but the team is definitely saving money.

 

Jack Z. tried to rebuild in a baseball sense when he stripped down the old team and brought in a new roster focusing largely on defense. But the notion that hording prospects in hopes of building a winning team in 2-3 years does seem like hoping against normal attrition rates for prospects...

[harmony]

The baseball aspect might fall flat, but the team is definitely saving money.

 

Jack Z. tried to rebuild in a baseball sense when he stripped down the old team and brought in a new roster focusing largely on defense. But the notion that hording prospects in hopes of building a winning team in 2-3 years does seem like hoping against normal attrition rates for prospects...

A team cannot depend on more than half of highly ranked prospects to produce in the long run. That's why it's better to have 10 highly ranked propects than only two.

 

With low expectations this year, the Mariners have the luxury of auditioning a six-man rotation of pitchers under age 30, four of whom with multiple years of team control beyond 2020. Pitching prospects Logan Gilbert, George Kirby and Emerson Hancock may have the highest ceilings.

 

A trio of 25-year-old hitters -- Kyle Lewis, J.P. Crawford and Shed Long -- are off to solid starts while Baseball Prospectus ranks outfielders Jarred Kelenic and Julio Rodriguez among the Top 10 prospects in baseball.

 

Seattle baseball fans are no strangers to disappointment but maintain a glimmer of optimism.

Edited August 14, 2020 by harmony

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

A team cannot depend on more than half of highly ranked prospects to produce in the long run. That's why it's better to have 10 highly ranked propects than only two.

 

With low expectations this year, the Mariners have the luxury of auditioning a six-man rotation of pitchers under age 30, all but one with multiple years of team control beyond 2020 (the sixth remains under team control through 2021). Pitching prospects Logan Gilbert, George Kirby and Emerson Hancock may have the highest ceilings.

 

A trio of 25-year-old hitters -- Kyle Lewis, J.P. Crawford and Shed Long -- are off to solid starts while Baseball Prospectus ranks outfielders Jarred Kelenic and Julio Rodriguez among the Top 10 prospects in baseball.

 

Seattle baseball fans are no strangers to disappointment but maintain a glimmer of optimism.

 

Best-case scenario: late-80s Braves, who just said why-not and threw youngsters like Glavine and Smoltz into the rotation. They came in last three seasons in a row... then finished first for 14 consecutive years. They also signed the best free agent pitcher in history: Greg Maddux, who won four straight Cy Youngs.

[Tedballgame]

My guess is that it doesn't.

 

NL will definitely keep the DH.

[moonslav59]

After 4 IP Barnes is toast?

 

Barnes saw his K/9 go up three straight seasons (along with his BB/9) and is still a good relief pitcher with control left.

 

With the possible exception of Workman, Barnes is more tradable than anyone else mentioned.

 

JD and JBJ are more tradeable, with some cash throw in.

 

Hembree is cheaper and is certainly tradeable, right now.

 

Pillar, Perez and Moreland have very little trade value.

 

Barnes may have some value, but he may need to prove something, first.

[Swiharts Ghost]

What would Evoldi and JD fetch ? That’s my trade ..Who’s system do we look at ? Whiitesox ? Pads ? Back to the Dodgers for Graterol ? Plus ?

[Noles_1335]

Let’s just say for the sake of this post... Devers is on the market, who are some of the names that would be looked at to get our rotation or farm back to relevance?

[Swiharts Ghost]

Let’s just say for the sake of this post... Devers is on the market, who are some of the names that would be looked at to get our rotation or farm back to relevance?

 

Devers huh ? I’m needing a bonafide Ace young controllable one .Clevinger maybe Bieber ?Rotation of Clevinger ,Erod ,Sale ,Evoldi ,Groome might be worthy ? Love Devers great kid but he’s a 1b DH isn’t he ? Can’t we find a 1b DH in the system ? I’m asking ? This is uncomfortable talk the kids my favorite Redsox since Papi .I would get physically ill.I can’t do it man .Kids untouchable.I would imagine that’s what the front office goes through every time he’s brougt up lol let’s trade JD first ok

Edited August 4, 2020 by Swiharts Ghost

[Tedballgame]

Let’s just say for the sake of this post... Devers is on the market, who are some of the names that would be looked at to get our rotation or farm back to relevance?

 

That is a "what if the sky fell" trade. Not happening. He is untouchable. That is a guy you try to lock up for 10 years.

[Larry Cook]

The first thing we need to do is figure out the core that we keep and build around.

 

Second, never trade home grown players.

 

Third, unload anybody else that is on an expiring contract or we can get value in return for,

[mvp 78]

The first thing we need to do is figure out the core that we keep and build around.

 

Second, never trade home grown players.

 

Third, unload anybody else that is on an expiring contract or we can get value in return for,

 

Not a philosophy that Bloom subscribes to.

[mvp 78]

What would Evoldi and JD fetch ? That’s my trade ..Who’s system do we look at ? Whiitesox ? Pads ? Back to the Dodgers for Graterol ? Plus ?

 

Dodgers don't need Eovaldi. Padres are in a constant rebuild and I don't think Eovaldi puts them over the top. White Sox are a year or two away. I don't think they want Eovaldi right now.

[jad]

I realize I do not always understand the subtleties of business, but I do not understand the theory: "let's improve. And let's begin that process by getting rid of our most productive employees." This seems to me no more comprehensible that the 80s mantra which a number of us suffered through when bosses and administrators hit us with the koan-like principle: Less is more! (justifying increased work loads, lower salaries, and fewer jobs).

[mvp 78]

I realize I do not always understand the subtleties of business, but I do not understand the theory: "let's improve. And let's begin that process by getting rid of our most productive employees." This seems to me no more comprehensible that the 80s mantra which a number of us suffered through when bosses and administrators hit us with the koan-like principle: Less is more! (justifying increased work loads, lower salaries, and fewer jobs).

 

The theory is to get rid of the expensive contracts before their value goes under water. Plus, if you can move someone at the height of their trade value, you may be able to derive more future value from another team (controllable assets). The first part is money. The second part is managing your prospect pipeline.

[Bellhorn04]

I realize I do not always understand the subtleties of business, but I do not understand the theory: "let's improve. And let's begin that process by getting rid of our most productive employees."

 

Personally I feel like puking sometimes when I hear people talking about trading Devers or JD or Eovaldi.

 

Some folks just have this 'out with the old, in with the new' mentality.

[jacksonianmarch]

Equating standard business ops and baseball is apples and oranges. In business, the business men and women gain experience and are at their earning potential and experience peak late 40s into their 60s. In baseball, the peak is about 5-7 years long from about 26-27 and ends around 32-33. Also, in business, beyond a brain injury, there’s little that could keep someone from being useful. In baseball, a single soft tissue injury can end a career.

[Bellhorn04]

Equating standard business ops and baseball is apples and oranges. In business, the business men and women gain experience and are at their earning potential and experience peak late 40s into their 60s. In baseball, the peak is about 5-7 years long from about 26-27 and ends around 32-33. Also, in business, beyond a brain injury, there’s little that could keep someone from being useful. In baseball, a single soft tissue injury can end a career.

 

That's right, and it illustrates the insane risk involved in any long term contract for a player. Nonetheless I'm sure you're not upset about the Cole signing right now.

[jacksonianmarch]

Personally I feel like puking sometimes when I hear people talking about trading Devers or JD or Eovaldi.

 

Some folks just have this 'out with the old, in with the new' mentality.

 

It’s all about contractual control and cheap talent. When the talent becomes expensive, you have less to spend elsewhere. Also, when your team is horrendous, sometimes it’s best to have your core come up together in synchrony. Blowing it up isn’t a bad option for these Sox. The Sox pitching staff is in shambles. 2021 will be a wash regardless as ERod has no timetable. Sale wasn’t even a lock before TJS to be any good but now post TJS he won’t reach his new peak until later in the season assuming good health. Eovaldi is a mixed bag. If the Sox go out and sign Bauer or Stroman, good luck. You still have a rotation of one holdover in Eo, Bauer or Stroman, a stiff, and maybe ERod and maybe Sale with literally nothing behind it. Then, to make matters even better, ERod is a Fa after 21, you’ve got Beni and Vaz through 22 and Devers through 23. Your good core is going to get real expensive, which wouldn’t be a problem if the team was great right now. Prop open the window, stay good for as long as you can. But your team sucks right now and your core has 2-3 more years left before it either leaves or gets pricey

[mvp 78]

Personally I feel like puking sometimes when I hear people talking about trading Devers or JD or Eovaldi.

 

Some folks just have this 'out with the old, in with the new' mentality.

 

It's better than trading John Henry for Peter Angelos.

[notin]

JD and JBJ are more tradeable, with some cash throw in.

 

Hembree is cheaper and is certainly tradeable, right now.

 

Pillar, Perez and Moreland have very little trade value.

 

Barnes may have some value, but he may need to prove something, first.

 

Barnes has pitched four innings this year!!. I can promise you not a single GM is out there thinking. “I liked Barnes as a pitcher. Up until those last 4 innings.”

 

And Barnes would fetch much more than Bradley and JD because 1) he is a relief pitcher 2) he makes comparatively little money and 3) he is under team control for 2021.

[notin]

What would Evoldi and JD fetch ? That’s my trade ..Who’s system do we look at ? Whiitesox ? Pads ? Back to the Dodgers for Graterol ? Plus ?

 

Eovaldi has 2 years $34million left on his deal after this season. That’s an awful lot for an injury-prone pitcher who has only thrown 189 IP since 2016. Eovaldi has very little trade value left, if any...

[jacksonianmarch]

Barnes has value, but last year he was exposed as someone who cannot close and also struggles on back to back assignments. This will limit his market to a degree

[notin]

Not a philosophy that Bloom subscribes to.

 

And not a philosophy anyone should.

 

Chavis, for example, should be traded if anyone wants him. The guy has some skills, but not so much that the Sox would miss him...

[jacksonianmarch]

Eovaldi has 2 years $34million left on his deal after this season. That’s an awful lot for an injury-prone pitcher who has only thrown 189 IP since 2016. Eovaldi has very little trade value left, if any...

 

If Eo throws like he has in his first two starts for the rest of this month, someone will go for him. With 16 of the 30 teams making the POs, there will be VERY few teams calling it quits. Also, Eo is known as a guy who can find it for a month and look like Roger Clemens. This actually might be the best chance you've had since you signed him to dump him

[notin]

Barnes has value, but last year he was exposed as someone who cannot close and also struggles on back to back assignments. This will limit his market to a degree

 

But how much? 3/4 of the relief pitchers in the league fit that description.

 

The whole “not closing” thing would help him as a midseason piece, as it has kept his salary down . And most contending teams have the closer role occupied anyway...

[notin]

If Eo throws like he has in his first two starts for the rest of this month, someone will go for him. With 16 of the 30 teams making the POs, there will be VERY few teams calling it quits. Also, Eo is known as a guy who can find it for a month and look like Roger Clemens. This actually might be the best chance you've had since you signed him to dump him

 

With 2 years $34mill left?

 

The Sox should take any offer.

 

And while 26 teams are scheduled to make the postseason, don’t you think many will be wary that there is no postseason at all?

[mvp 78]

Barnes has value, but last year he was exposed as someone who cannot close and also struggles on back to back assignments. This will limit his market to a degree

 

I agree about the back to back thing, but not closing. 37% of his runs came in games where he pitched the day before. Yuck.

 

In save situations vs non save situations, his ERA/WHIP/K9 were all in the same strata. His k/bb rate was actually higher in save situations at 3.33 vs 2.5. The biggest difference was HR's, where he gave up 7 in save situations and 1 in non save situations. That seems like an aberration since all of the other numbers line up.

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

I agree about the back to back thing, but not closing. 37% of his runs came in games where he pitched the day before. Yuck.

 

In save situations vs non save situations, his ERA/WHIP/K9 were all in the same strata. His k/bb rate was actually higher in save situations at 3.33 vs 2.5. The biggest difference was HR's, where he gave up 7 in save situations and 1 in non save situations. That seems like an aberration since all of the other numbers line up.

 

For those who believe in clutch, that would be a chokerration.

[mvp 78]

For those who believe in clutch, that would be a chokerration.

 

Even though there was no corresponding spike in ERA or WHIP?