Mookie Betts and David Price have been traded to Dodgers

[Hugh2]

The Mookie who stuff was always stupid and I’m hoping a joke/troll. But I did see a few arguments that the Red Sox will end up winning the Mookie trade because Verdugo had a good month.

 

It’s still hard to fathom that a team who consistently has one of the highest pay rolls decided to trade a generational hall of fame talent, only three years after he literally won a World Series on the team and was the leagues MVP. But the Red Sox did that.

 

You can play as much devils advocate or make as many arguments as you want. The trade sucked then, and it’s sucks now.

 

Saying you don't want a guy traded doesn't have to be mutually exclusive from properly evaluating the trade.

 

It can still suck that he was traded either way.

[Jasonbay44]

Wow. I’m actually bummed out. Bloom dealt Betts on a down year and got 5 years of a good OFer. I can’t wait to hear the rest

 

My favorite part of this thread was Jacko’s down year comment.

 

Mookie was 26 and slashed .295/.391/.424, won a gold glove, silver slugger and finished top 10 in MVP. That was a down year apparently.

[Hugh2]

If we judge a trade by a players stats AFTER he signs an extension past his control years then the following would be true.

 

The cost trade for 1 year of an ACE would be roughly the same as 3 years.

 

This is not the case. WIth every single pro scouting department in ALL OF BASEBALL.

 

Adjust your opinions accordingly.

[mvp 78]

If we judge a trade by a players stats AFTER he signs an extension past his control years then the following would be true.

 

The cost trade for 1 year of an ACE would be roughly the same as 3 years.

 

This is not the case. WIth every single pro scouting department in ALL OF BASEBALL.

 

Adjust your opinions accordingly.

 

The trade was ok, but they shouldn't have traded him.

[Jasonbay44]

At least with the saved money, maybe they can acquire back Kike Hernandez and Corey Kluber… or they could just donate that money to Mookies charity, it would probably be better off .

[Jasonbay44]

The trade was ok, but they shouldn't have traded him.

 

Exactly. This 100%

[Hugh2]

The trade was ok, but they shouldn't have traded him.

 

Agreed.

 

Hopefully John Henry learned his lesson, you have to either extend these guys when they're younger and you can get them for cheaper, or be willing to set the market with them.

[redsoxrules]

Devers has all the tools to become a generational offensive talent, but he hasn't put it all together yet. I think that's why they gave him the extension more than anything else.

 

How so? He goes up to the plate and swings for 500 foot homeruns. He's been the same and it doesn't look like its going to change. You also don't give out a massive contract to a player who only hits. Unless he hits to a tune of 950+ OPS year in and year out and he's not that guy. He's no David Ortiz at the plate. This was a massive overpay and will come back to bit them.

 

 

If he took an approach like Casas he would be a beast at the plate but that's not hit style.

He should be walking around 100 times a year instead of swinging at garbage pitches to launch them 500 feet.

[Old Red]

Agreed.

 

Hopefully John Henry learned his lesson, you have to either extend these guys when they're younger and you can get them for cheaper, or be willing to set the market with them.

Like I keep saying the JH of today is not the JH of 10-15 years ago. What he would have done back then like resigning Betts he wouldn’t do today, so I don’t think there is any lesson to be learned from his stand point.

[Hugh2]

Like I keep saying the JH of today is not the JH of 10-15 years ago. What he would have done back then like resigning Betts he wouldn’t do today, so I don’t think there is any lesson to be learned from his stand point.

 

John Henry went through pennie-pinching years back then too in between his gluttony, why do people have any reason to believe differently his time around?

 

What is different?

 

Sox are going to spend big this offseason, and I'd be willing to bet heavily on that.

[Old Red]

John Henry went through pennie-pinching years back then too in between his gluttony, why do people have any reason to believe differently his time around?

 

What is different?

 

Sox are going to spend big this offseason, and I'd be willing to bet heavily on that.

 

I hope you are right, but I’ll believe it when I see it.

[Hugh2]

I hope you are right, but I’ll believe it when I see it.

 

That's fair, and by recent trends I don't blame people. I like to look at the long term horizon and what's happening isn't rare or even unprecedented. I'll fully toot my horn and Sox nation will rejoice when the Sox open up the purse for a TOTRS this offseason.

 

And keep Casas, Bello, Mayer too.

[mvp 78]

How so? He goes up to the plate and swings for 500 foot homeruns. He's been the same and it doesn't look like its going to change. You also don't give out a massive contract to a player who only hits. Unless he hits to a tune of 950+ OPS year in and year out and he's not that guy. He's no David Ortiz at the plate. This was a massive overpay and will come back to bit them.

 

 

If he took an approach like Casas he would be a beast at the plate but that's not hit style.

He should be walking around 100 times a year instead of swinging at garbage pitches to launch them 500 feet.

 

Casas has 55 BB's, Devers has 42. Only 5 batters are on pace for 100 BB's: Soto, Schwarber, Olson, Happ, Ohtani.

 

Right now, Devers is who he is. He's not going to change.

[mvp 78]

John Henry went through pennie-pinching years back then too in between his gluttony, why do people have any reason to believe differently his time around?

 

What is different?

 

Sox are going to spend big this offseason, and I'd be willing to bet heavily on that.

 

That's what people said last offseason.

[Dipre]

Casas has 55 BB's, Devers has 42. Only 5 batters are on pace for 100 BB's: Soto, Schwarber, Olson, Happ, Ohtani.

 

Right now, Devers is who he is. He's not going to change.

 

And who he is is a guy with excellent batted ball profiles who needs to improve just a bit on pitch selection and swing decisions to become an absolute monster. The power is there.

[mvp 78]

And who he is is a guy with excellent batted ball profiles who needs to improve just a bit on pitch selection and swing decisions to become an absolute monster. The power is there.

 

If they don't like his swing decisions, wait until Rafaela shows up.

[redsoxrules]

Casas has 55 BB's, Devers has 42. Only 5 batters are on pace for 100 BB's: Soto, Schwarber, Olson, Happ, Ohtani.

 

Right now, Devers is who he is. He's not going to change.

 

If Casas played like he currently has in the 2 months he would have 100BB in a year . Remember he had a slow start to the year

[5GoldGlovesOF,75]

John Henry went through pennie-pinching years back then too in between his gluttony, why do people have any reason to believe differently his time around?

 

What is different?

 

Sox are going to spend big this offseason, and I'd be willing to bet heavily on that.

 

Yep -- and my girlfriend who left to be with European soccer players and race car drivers is going to come back to me... because she used to really like me.

[moonslav59]

If Casas played like he currently has in the 2 months he would have 100BB in a year . Remember he had a slow start to the year

 

You assume Casas won't hit like April in September.

[moonslav59]

And who he is is a guy with excellent batted ball profiles who needs to improve just a bit on pitch selection and swing decisions to become an absolute monster. The power is there.

 

Indeed, and other GMs see this, too.

[jad]

Yep -- and my girlfriend who left to be with European soccer players and race car drivers is going to come back to me... because she used to really like me.

 

No no no! She's going to hook up with me. I just KNOW it. It's in her interest and she'll realize that ... well, maybe not today ... but soon ... maybe in another year or ... well ... at some point ...

[dgalehouse]

There are not enough excuses, not enough spin and not enough b.s. in the world to justify trading Mookie Betts. It was a colossal blunder by Bloom , Henry or both. Nothing we can do about it now.

[mvp 78]

If Casas played like he currently has in the 2 months he would have 100BB in a year . Remember he had a slow start to the year

 

BB%

3/30 -6/14: 15.6%

6/15 - 8/17: 11.4%

 

His BB rate decreased the last two months.

[moonslav59]

There are not enough excuses, not enough spin and not enough b.s. in the world to justify trading Mookie Betts. It was a colossal blunder by Bloom , Henry or both. Nothing we can do about it now.

 

So, once they decided not to sign Betts, they should have just gotten a comp pick, because there is no "justification" for trading him?

 

The "justification" point should be made about the choice not to sign him.

 

The trade had to be done, once they made the wrong choice not to extend him. (Also, it was also up to betts to agree to an extension.)

[dgalehouse]

So, once they decided not to sign Betts, they should have just gotten a comp pick, because there is no "justification" for trading him?

 

The "justification" point should be made about the choice not to sign him.

 

The trade had to be done, once they made the wrong choice not to extend him. (Also, it was also up to betts to agree to an extension.)

 

He was still under contract for 2020. Still had time to sign him. Even as a free agent. There was no urgency to trade him. If you want to be a big time team, you want to be a big time owner, spend what it takes to be that.

[moonslav59]

He was still under contract for 2020. Still had time to sign him. Even as a free agent. There was no urgency to trade him. If you want to be a big time team, you want to be a big time owner, spend what it takes to be that.

 

Exactly. It was about choosing not to sign him.

 

That was the choice to be debated.

 

The choice was made not to do it, perhaps because Betts was saying no number would get him to sign, but that's not the point, either.

 

Once it was decided he was not going to be signed, there is a ton of justification to trade him. That's the point.

[Bellhorn04]

Exactly. It was about choosing not to sign him.

 

That was the choice to be debated.

 

The choice was made not to do it, perhaps because Betts was saying no number would get him to sign, but that's not the point, either.

 

Once it was decided he was not going to be signed, there is a ton of justification to trade him. That's the point.

 

Right. Because Henry had clearly given up on keeping him.

[moonslav59]

Right. Because Henry had clearly given up on keeping him.

 

This is the issue that "justification" can be argued for or against, and not saying the trade cannot be justified. The trade was 100% justifiable, once the decision was made not to sign him.

 

[dgalehouse]

This is the issue that "justification" can be argued for or against, and not saying the trade cannot be justified. The trade was 100% justifiable, once the decision was made not to sign him.

 

 

When the trade was made, some fans ( not sure if you were one of them ) were saying that the Sox would still sign Mookie the following off season.

[moonslav59]

When the trade was made, some fans ( not sure if you were one of them ) were saying that the Sox would still sign Mookie the following off season.

 

What does that have to do with the point you made about there being no justification for trading him?

 

Some fans did think we could trade him and then sign him, the following winter, but as long as the fact remained that we were not going to pay him, there was always justification for trading him. One could argue it was mandatory we do.